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Thread: All you need to know about GYNO.

  1. #721
    Alecdznutz is offline New Member
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    gyno

    I read your article, I've been off AAS for about a year now and I developed some gyno right when I got off AAS and kinda slacked on getting rid of it I was running letro at the time.. I still have lumps behind my nipple on both, I wanna do another cycle I have sust 250,deca 300, and winstrol My question is Have I waited way to long with my gyno that i now have to do surgery? or is there a chance of me running this cycle and somehow reversing the gyno while being on the cycle? Or should i take a chance before i do this cycle and try to get rid of the gyno before I get on the sauce.. any information will help thank u..

  2. #722
    Bert33 is offline New Member
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    Natural Gyno HELP!

    I've read a LOT about gyno and how to reverse it. I'm 23 in good health, training right now. dunno my bf but probably 10% or less.. Never used steroids ! Its natural gyno appearred during adolescence at my left pec, almost nothing at my right. I want to try Letro and finish with nolva but there's 2 things that bothers me... the sex drive issue--maybe it would sound crazy but i was wondering if after taking letro it would be good for test/oestrogen balance to take oestrogen pills while takin nolva ? like just a few days to diminish the time for libido to get back. i consider maybe takin proviron with letro. I saw on another forum a guy said he took arimidex for a natural gyno instead of letro :

    I am 33 I have had natural gyno (fat deposite not glandular) since I was 13. Basically just puffy nipples. I am 3 weeks into .5 mg a day of L-Dex from researchology and the fat deposite around my nipples is down 60% measured by my fat calipers. and my pipples are very close to flat (cant wait to put on a wife beater!)
    -D


    What you think about that?

    Another thing..no one seems to agree about the dosage of letro... i personally think i will try to start couple day at only .25 and adding slowly .25 gradually till it start to go away or until i reach 2.5mg. Many guys start right away with 2.5 but this product it so strong and it could work a smaller dose but i want to do the best pattern possible with the less side effects possible.

    Im takin L-Arginine right now and would consider takin animal flex if i get joint pain with the use of letro. So if you can give me another solution for sex drive or you have mixed some of these products and you haave some advices would be appreciated

  3. #723
    Newgu123 is offline New Member
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    Hey guys! Great post! very helpful. I am 2 weeks in to my 500mg sus a week +25mg proviron ED and I've noticed my left nipple was sensitive. Not sore or painful just sensitive, I have a small lump but I have always had it and its not solid. I am not fat, 5' 7" 146lbs with 9% BF. Just wondering if I will 100% know that I have gyno before it is too late? I really don't want to start hitting the Nolva just because my head is messing with me (it definitely does lol). Sorry any help with this would be a big help!

  4. #724
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    definitely going to hold on to this for my first cycle. Quick question tho, I'm 23, I've been cleaning up my diet and lifting for the last year (and will continue doing so until about 25-26 for my first cycle), anywho - I've heard it's good to take anti-e's for 2 weeks before a cycle, just wanted to get your opinion on that; and if it is good, specifically what I should be taking? (since it'll be my first cycle I want to do a test enth only cycle at 500mg a week)

    Cheers bro

  5. #725
    codeyota is offline New Member
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    C Bino I need to get in touch with you but do not know how to PM you... Its very important that has to do with gyno...

  6. #726
    snowrider640 is offline New Member
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    any body have a good source were to buy letrozole and nolva? i plan on running letro (plan #3) nd then use nolva for estro- rebound. sound ok? i just dont believe all these online pharmacies are legit.

  7. #727
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    Ar-r banner up top

  8. #728
    broken7 is offline New Member
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    Has anyone done blood work while on this protocol? I would like to know how bad cholesterol values were affected.

  9. #729
    Tartaros is offline New Member
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    Hello there,
    First of all i would to thanks bino for this topic,i was in panic and accidentaly through google i found this topic ! this topic was the reason that i register to this forum aswell, and i notice that you can find tones of info in this forum ! anyway , here is my problem now that i need an answer please asap cause still i m in panic

    I m currently on my 8th week of my bulking cycle, 800mg test400 & 600mg Deca per week,5iu gh and winstrol for the last weeks
    I was taking 10mg of tamoxifen and like a fool i was believing that tamo is an AI
    Last 2-3 weeks i notice my nipples getting puffy and darker . My source find me some letrozole pills 2.5mg and i started the therapy.
    I chop the pill in 4 pieces,first day i took the 1/4 of the pill,second day 2/4,today 3/4 etc...
    I started notice that my gyno became worst and i m wondering why?
    For how long i should keep the therapy ?

    Sorry in advance for my poor english
    And thanks for reading and for any replies
    Last edited by Tartaros; 06-06-2012 at 09:27 PM.

  10. #730
    chris1982. is offline New Member
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    Can anyone tell me what the best AI is to use. Im currenyly taking 1ml a week of m/tiger sust250 & 1ml of deca250. This is my 2nd week... Its funny cos when purchased to stuff I didnt get told anything about this. So if anyone could help it would be much appreciated, oh and I relise the dangers and respect the fact im new to this. ??????

  11. #731
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    Aromasin 12.5mg EOD adjust accordingly... You sound like you need to educate yourself

  12. #732
    jcevans7 is offline Junior Member
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    OUT F*C*N* STANDING POST! To many people over complicate a PCT. I'm about to do my first cycle and I feel more confident than before. Thanks.

  13. #733
    jcevans7 is offline Junior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by chris1982. View Post
    Can anyone tell me what the best AI is to use. Im currenyly taking 1ml a week of m/tiger sust250 & 1ml of deca250. This is my 2nd week... Its funny cos when purchased to stuff I didnt get told anything about this. So if anyone could help it would be much appreciated, oh and I relise the dangers and respect the fact im new to this. ??????
    Some people just don't learn, and questions why we have to put a safety on a gun. Just cause you have it doesn't mean you should take it. Knowledge is power.

  14. #734
    bob87's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jcevans7

    Some people just don't learn, and questions why we have to put a safety on a gun. Just cause you have it doesn't mean you should take it. Knowledge is power.
    I think you need to settle down newb..... A lot of people are misinformed on the how to's of cycling I myself was one of them. But it's because of this board my friends now turn to me for cycle advice.

  15. #735
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    thanks a lot. now the big question is, i have puffy nips and the areola is enlarged and the area around is swollen is it because of projesterone gyno note: there are no lumps as such.

  16. #736
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    The post was awsome. Im really trying to learn all I can before I start a cycle and this post was great for that reason. I understood about SERMs but AIs like Letro were something new to me.

  17. #737
    bobsyouruncle is offline New Member
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    Learnt alot thanks for the info

  18. #738
    Agustin is offline New Member
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    Hi, I'm from Argentina... I've just run a cycle with Tprop (600 mg/week) and Dianabol (30 mg/day)... by the 3th week I started to feel my both nipples swelling and it started to grow a sort of little "ball" under them... I must say I took anastrozole to prevent gyno during cycle, but I made a mistake: a friend of mine told me 0.5 mg of anastrozole would be enough... It seems it wasn't enough...
    So, I have to questions:
    1-Do I start with letrozole ?
    2-How can I take such a minimal dose as 0.25 mg or 0.5 mg of letrozol? (As far as I know, oral letrozol comes in 2.5 mg tablets. Is it possible to divide the tablet in EIGHT without pulverizeing it?)
    I will really apreciate your help since I'm very concerned about the mess I've made...
    I apologize for my poor english.
    Thank you again!

  19. #739
    Theo4 is offline New Member
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    I really appreciate the detail in this thread. I have a couple of questions that I want to clarify before starting anything...
    1) I am looking for Tamoxifen to prevent the rebound effect after letro and see Tamoxifen Citrate. Is this the same as what we refer to as Tamoxifen (Nolvadex ) or is this a salt form of the same active ingredient? If so is there a conversion that needs to be used or are the 2 interchangable?
    2) I couldnt help but notice this thread was started back in 06. Is this still considered the best option for gyno after 6 years or is there a new non-surgical option?
    3) What exactly is the mechanism of the estro rebound? Is it due to increased overall androgen production or an increase in aromatase production?

    Any help would be greatly appreciated.

  20. #740
    jtoups1214 is offline New Member
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    I read this post a few months back and I've been on Letro for a while now.

    So my question is, how long is it safe to stay on this stuff? I want to start using the Tamoxifen (Nolvadex ) and taper off. The letro at 1mg has been pretty much controlling the gyno, but the gyno is much better in the morning compared to evening (not sure why?) Obviously the letro is never going to fully subside it, so I'm wondering if I taper off will the side effects stay at a stand still? I'm just tired of spending the money on letro each month.

    Also, is it ever safe to get on a cycle again (with a pct)?

    I hear Anavar is a good option for someone who is prone to gyno, or has had gyno. (maybe take Anavar & letro?)

    Thanks for the help!
    Last edited by jtoups1214; 07-18-2012 at 03:15 PM.

  21. #741
    andrewg10 is offline New Member
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    hey man this may sound stupid but i just ordered some liquifem and not sure how to take it. do i inject it, if so where is the best place to inject it? sorry if it sounds stupid Im just clueless at this but want my gyno gone thank man

  22. #742
    Razor is offline Banned
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    Thanks C, I just started letro today

  23. #743
    Caedus is offline New Member
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    Come off cycle and noticed that my chest is quite puffy looking. I've had gyno since I was a teenager but it's not really noticable. Both of my nipples look okay - not abnormal, but my chest seems a little bit more rounded and puffy. Will this subside? I'm currently on Clomid and the puffyness has subsided slightly. I also have Letro on order, should be here in 5-6 days. Will the puffyness disappear soon after PCT or am I stuck with it?

  24. #744
    Judah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by C_Bino
    I am posting this thread to help answer all of the questions regarding gyno prevention and reversal, the use of letrozole and other anti-e's. I will go over everything in very simple easy to understand language. Also we are talking about estrogen gyno here, not progesterone (but using letro will stop progesterone related problems as well since it inhibits all estrogen anyways). Progesterone gyno will be enlargement of your nipple area, the actual aereola, not a lump under it.

    Let me make this first point very clear, as I state in my signature this is from my personal experience, so whether you agree with it or not is your own issue. I have helped many people with gyno and it has worked just fine for them as well.

    To first understand why you are doing what you are doing I am going to go over a few things and a few definitions:

    SERM - Selective estrogen receptor modulator. These drugs work by binding to the estrogen receptors and flooding them in a sense, making it difficult (but not impossible by any means) for estrogen to bind to the receptors and thus prevent the onset of estrogen related side effects.
    Most common forms: Tamoxifen (Nolvadex ), Clomiphene (Clomid)
    AI - Aromatise Inhibitor. These drugs work by inhibiting the aromatization of estrogen. This means that in effect AI's prevent androgens from converting to estrogen, again, making it difficult (but not impossible) for estrogen to reach receptor sites.
    Most common forms: Anastrozole (l-dex, a-dex), Exemestane (aromasin ), Femera (letrozole). For our purpose of reversing gyno we are interested in Letro.

    Letro and your sex drive:
    Letrozole will suppress your sex drive. This is another reason why it is so important to act on preventing gyno as soon as possible. Since we all know that Test should be run in every cycle this will cancel out the effect of sex drive suppression.

    Running letro to prevent gyno:
    If you decide to run estrogen protection while on cycle (and I suggest you do unless you are aware that you do not require it), you can run either a SERM or an AI. Letro will be the most powerful AI you can use, it will inhibit 98+% of estrogen using a dose as low as .25mg and even lower. This is why I suggest you do not use a dose higher than .50mg while on cycle just trying to prevent estrogen related side effects.

    You will want to start running the letro approximately 2 weeks before you begin your cycle to allow it to fully stabilize in your blood. I have often heard the argument that letro takes up to 60 days to stabilize, I don't know if I buy into this for the reason that I have reversed gyno after using letro for only 1 week. Still to be safe I recommend starting it before your cycle as stated above.

    If you do decide to run letro there is absolutely no need to run another AI or SERM. Do not make the mistake of thinking more is better. Think of it this way; if letro is preventing the conversion of androgens to estrogen than there is no estrogen, what would the purpose of a SERM be when there is no estrogen to bind to the receptors? Nolva will only take away from the effectiveness of letro.

    This brings me to my next point. Do not listen to anyone who tells you to bump up your nolvadex to 60+mg ED if you get gyno. I have no idea where this idea started but I have seen it suggest far too many times recently. Nolvadex will do nothing to reverse your gyno...let me make that clear IT WILL DO NOTHING FOR GYNO. If you are running nolva as your anti-e and start to develop gyno than sure you can bump the dosage a small amount to try to prevent it from progressing further, but letrozole must begin ASAP.

    It is very important that you begin taking letrozole immediately, the longer your wait the more risk you take in not being able to reverse it.

    How do I know if I have gyno?
    If you have developed gyno you will have a lump behind your nipple. It will be fairly hard, and it will be tender to touch.

    Running letro to reverse gyno:
    I am going to go over the three different scenarios which people could fit into. Remember regardless of what scenario you are in it is important that you begin taking the letro ASAP.

    1. Already using an anti-e aside from letro.
    2. Already using letro @ a dose of .25mg or .50mg ED.
    3. Not running any estrogen protection.

    1.
    Day 1: .25mg Letro + anti-e*
    Day 2: .50mg Letro
    Day 3: 1.0mg Letro
    Day 4: 1.5mg Letro
    Day 5: 2.0mg Letro
    Day 6: 2.5mg Letro **

    2.
    Day 1: .50mg Letro
    Day 2: 1.0mg Letro
    Day 3: 1.5mg Letro
    Day 4: 2.0mg Letro
    Day 5: 2.5mg Letro **

    3.
    Day 1: .50mg Letro
    Day 2: 1.0mg Letro
    Day 3: 1.5mg Letro
    Day 4: 2.0mg Letro
    Day 5: 2.5mg Letro **

    *Regardless of the anti-e you are using it is important to still use it for the first day you begin letro as the letro will not have taken any effect and you by no means want your body to be without any protection when gyno is already prevalent.

    ** You will remain at this dose until gyno symptoms subside. Once you believe your gyno is gone it is important to stay at this dose for another 4-7 days to ensure all traces are gone. I recommend people with a bf% over 15 stay on for a week as it may be harder to judge completely whether the lump is completely gone. Once this period is over it will be important to taper letro down slowly rather than coming off it completely. Regardless of which manner you tapered up your dose you will all taper down in the same fashion.

    Day 1: 2.0mg
    Day 2: 1.5mg
    Day 3: 1.0mg
    Day 4: .50mg***
    Day 5: .25mg
    ***You can remain at this dose or go down further to .25mg. It is really up to you at this point. They are both very common maintenance doses as an anti-e while on cycle. Personally I have stayed with .25mg and never had a problem.

    Letro and the estrogen rebound:
    With your estrogen being completely inhibited there is a definite estrogen rebound as your body tries to re-stabilize the testosterone :estrogen balance. We can prevent this rebound effect by supplementing further with another AI or SERM. So, I suggest that when you are coming to the end of your cycle you will more than likely be using Nolva in your PCT so just make sure that you begin taking nolva the last day you are going to take your letro and then continue on as you would with regular PCT.

    This now leads us into the question of reversing gyno while not on cycle. There are a few things to remember here. You have already waited longer than you should have, and your sex drive will be shot. You can use tribulus or another natural test booster to help you in this scenario but I can't guarantee the effectiveness. Just follow gyno reversal protocols 2 or 3. When coming off again you must taper and begin using nolvadex to prevent any rebound effect that may occur.

    How much nolvadex should you use if you are not going into PCT and running this off cycle? I suggest starting at 20mg ED for a week and then lowering it to 10mg for another week and then coming off completely.

    I hope this covers most of the issues, still feel free to PM me if you have questions. But make sure you read the entire post first.

    I will ignore PM's that have an answer covered in this post already.
    I'm helping my buddy out with his PCT after he did a cycle of Sust for 12 weeks at 500mg a week.

    Currently He's 42 years old has done about 10 cycles his whole life. He's 185 pounds 5'11 with 8% body fat.

    He has never done any AI's during a cycle or any PCT ever. He's just one of these lucky guys who never has sides. The only side he has ever experienced is a little gyno behind the nipple and every time he ends a cycle it always goes away on its own after a month or 2.

    Now that he's in his 40s, he's going to start running PCT when he cycles. Here's my question:

    He wants to run PCT. I gave him nolva and clomid to run for pct. He also has Letro. He's experiencing a tiny bit of gyno under one nipple. He's ready to start his pct, how should I advice him to run it based on the circumstances and the compounds he has?

  25. #745
    noon's Avatar
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    Good article
    glad to read these

  26. #746
    kylef23 is offline New Member
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    Great info thanks!

  27. #747
    DannyboyMJ is offline New Member
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    Thankyou for such posts, they will really help newbs like myself!

  28. #748
    c118358a is offline New Member
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    Question about lump

    Will you always get lump behind the nipple? I am seeing some signs especially when I flex, but I have never felt a lump that was sore. Some itching, but there is what I thought an ingrown hair on lower part of areola, not behind nipple. Any thoughts would help.

  29. #749
    Phased is offline Banned
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    Here is a less harsh way

    Ok here is what your gonna do

    Letro dosing, i'll break it down for you:
    1ml = 2.5mg
    0.9ml = 2.25mg
    0.8ml = 2mg
    0.7ml = 1.75mg
    0.6ml = 1.5mg
    0.5ml = 1.25mg
    0.4ml = 1mg
    0.3ml = 0.75mg
    0.2ml = 0.5mg
    0.1ml = 0.25mg

    Weeks 1-2
    Letro .25mg EOD, so draw .1ml the plunger, letro is sweet so taste is ok. Take before bed.


    Weeks 2-6
    Nolvadex 40/40/40/20mg
    Clomid 70/70/35/35mg

    Nolvadex tastes really bad, mix it with water put it in a shot glass and throw it back.
    I would do the same with the clomid.

    Take the nolva in the morning, clomid at night.

    This should reverse the Gyno .

    I would get labs to.
    Privatemdlabs.com
    Estradiol sensitive (e2)


    Supplements
    Zinc 150mg Ed
    Copper 2mg Ed
    Vitamin d3 5000mg ED

  30. #750
    BigPapi09 is offline New Member
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    Bino,
    Hope u can help. I'm week 2 into my anadrol 50 mg per day use. First cycle ever, I read about all side effects and thought it was worth a shot. But never read that I should be taking letro or even Nolva at end of cycles. Stupid and ignorant on my part. I may be just paranoid , but last 3 days I had some pain under my chest which was relieved after burping or sitting up. My nipples feel a little sensitive. Don't feel any lumps behind them though. What should I do, and where is a good place to get it. Any help would be much appreciated doc mc titty

  31. #751
    BigPapi09 is offline New Member
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    Also to any1 else who reads this too please give me some tips. But, what I'm taking exactly is anadrol oxymetholone. 50 mg a day. I weigh 195 . 6 ft. After 15 days in I felt the pain in my chest and it has persisted for 2 days . Does anadrol cause gyno and should I be using Nolva or letro and where to get them again. Thanks for any1 reading this again.

  32. #752
    max toms is offline New Member
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    Hey Guys!

    What kind of dosage of arimidex should I be looking at from the beginning of my cycle of deca (400mgs per week) and test E (500mgs per week) as a preventative measure to gyno and or deca dick?

  33. #753
    tommytank is offline New Member
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    Lovin the thread. Exactly the sort of info i signed up for!

  34. #754
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    Great post

  35. #755
    bilgee is offline New Member
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    Amazing thread Gyno tnx alot... Can u make thread about acne? I am sure a lot of us would like to hear what u have in mind. Cause i run couple begginers cycle 2 years ago amazing results!! Horrific bad bad acne breakout all over my shoulders and back!! Now i am just so affraid. Tnx again

  36. #756
    bilgee is offline New Member
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    I mean to say thank you to Bino

  37. #757
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    Epic thread and very informative... thank you for sharing bro.

  38. #758
    bilgee is offline New Member
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    Excellent info Bino thank you! I would like to hear your saying on acne problems? I ran couple of begginner type cycle about year and half ago ( test,anavar ! cyp e.t.c) had amazing result but really bad acne breakout all over my shoulders and back! It was still happening long after pct. Now i got bad scars and also chickened out to do cycle again. I am 5'7, 35 years old 175lb, 12%-15% bf, have been working out about 10 years solid. Just could not find a lot about acne sides! Please feel free any advice thank you guys

  39. #759
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    Try accutane also known as isotretinoin it's an acne med I run it as a precaution towards the end of my cycle through pct and even after to be safe it has some nasty sides so do your research

  40. #760
    bilgee is offline New Member
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    Thanks Bob i will

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