Testosteron / 191aa

[Tomxrocket]

I am 37 year old male and I have been feeling exhausted for about 8-10 years now. I play hockey 4 times a week and I have Hypothroid. I take Tirosint for this every morning. In a effort to try and find out why I have been tired and in a haze for some time I went to an Endocrinologist. She was definitely helpful. We did the "works" for blood work and a few things stood out to me immediately. Let me explain.


Testosterone (% Free) results were 1.7 and the normal range for me is 1.6-2.9

Testosterone (ng/dL) results were 405 and normal is 241-827

Groth Hormone .results were .05 and normal is .06-5.00


I asked my doc about these results and she told me that my T was in normal range. But I feel it is not in optimal range. Do you guys think this Low T should be addressed???


And my Growth Hormone is below normal. She said it fluctuates. I'm not sure if I asked her about repla***ent hormones for this. But I know if this is low it can caus you to be tired, recover slower from workouts etc...I started my own cycle of 191aa in an effort to bring my GH up. I am not just a guinea pig, my buddy has done a cycle of this stuff and said he feels amazing. So, I figured I'd give it a shot.


My questions for you guys is,

Do you think the Low T is low enough for it to need to be addressed??

What should I do, I feel like I'm not getting the help I want. Should I just bring it up to her and say hey, I started 191aa how do you feel about that or should I look for a new Doctor?

[bass]

welcome Tom! your dr. doesn't know shit! you need to see a specialist/endo or a good clinic, your levels are at the bottom but you need to do a complete blood work to see whats going on before you get on TRT!

[fit2bOld]

Hey TomX, Welcome you said you did the works when you did the Blood work. Post everything you got so we can give you better answers.
Definitely on the low of normal, sounds like the DOC just gave you lip service.

[Tomxrocket]

Ok, I can post the entire blood work tomorrow (its at work). Thanks for your answers...

[Tomxrocket]

Actually, I was able to copy and paste of the Patient Website.... Here is "everything"......

IgA 296
Reference Range: <3 years: 8-220 mg/dl 3-13 [8] SEE NOTES 10/11/2011
TTG Ab, IgA 0.7
Reference Range:< 10.3 U/ml SEE NOTES 10/11/2011
Endomysial Ab, IgA Negative Negative 10/11/2011
ANA (qual) None Detected
TEST INFORMATION: Anti-Nuclear Ab (ANA), [9] None Detected 10/07/2011
Albumin 4.60 g/dL 3.5-4.8 10/04/2011
TPO Ab 79 (#)
Performing site ML: UMassMemorial [1] IU/mL < 35 10/04/2011
FSH 4.70
Performing site ML: UMassMemorial Laboratories [2] mIU/mL 1.27-19.60 10/04/2011
LH 4.60
Performing site ML: UMassMemorial Laboratories [3] mIU/mL 1.24-8.62 10/04/2011
Prolactin 7.70
Performing site ML: UMassMemorial Laboratories [4] ng/mL 2.64-13.30 10/04/2011
Testosterone (ng/dL) 405 ng/dL 241-827 10/04/2011
IGF-1 (Somatomedin C) 198
Tanner Stage Median Central 95% Range (ng/mL) ------------ [5] ng/mL 109-284 10/04/2011
Growth Hormone < 0.05 (#)
Performing site ML: UMassMemorial [6] ng/mL 0.06-5.00 10/04/2011
ACTH (Corticotropin) 10.4
Performing site ML: UMassMemorial Laboratories [7] pg/mL < 46 10/04/2011
PTH, Intact (pg/mL) 40 pg/mL 12-65 10/04/2011
Testosterone (% Free) 1.7
Performing site ML: UMassMemorial Laboratories [12] % 1.6-2.9 10/04/2011
Sodium 140 mEq/L 136-145 10/03/2011
Potassium 4.0 mEq/L 3.5-5.3 10/03/2011
Chloride 104 mEq/L 98-107 10/03/2011
Carbon Dioxide 29 mEq/L 20-31 10/03/2011
ALT (SGPT) (U/L) 19 U/L 0-40 10/03/2011
AST (SGOT) 18 U/L 0-33 10/03/2011
Alk Phos 58 U/L 0-130 10/03/2011
Bilirubin (Total) 0.6 mg/dL 0.3-1.2 10/03/2011
Total Protein 6.6 g/dL 6.4-8.3 10/03/2011
Iron 98 mg/dL 35-175 10/03/2011
TIBC 301 ug/dL 250-450 10/03/2011
Ferritin 110 ng/mL 28-365 10/03/2011
Vitamin B12 381 pg/mL >200 10/03/2011
Folate 13.8 ng/mL >3.4 10/03/2011
BUN 22 (#) mg/dL 6-20 10/03/2011
Calcium 9.2 mg/dL 8.4-10.2 10/03/2011
Creatinine 1.1 mg/dL 0.9-1.3 10/03/2011
Glucose 86 mg/dL 70-99 10/03/2011
TSH 2.49 uIU/mL 0.40-4.00 10/03/2011
T4 8.1 ug/dL 4.5-12.5 10/03/2011
FT4 Index 2.53 1.40-3.40 10/03/2011
T3 (ng/dL) 134 ng/dL 84-172 10/03/2011
WBC 3.5 (#) k/uL 3.9-11.0 10/03/2011
HCT 43.6 % 40.0-51.0 10/03/2011
Hgb 14.9 g/dL 13.0-17.0 10/03/2011
RBC 4.87 M/uL 4.40-6.00 10/03/2011
PLT 213 K/uL 142-424 10/03/2011
MCV 90 fL 80-100 10/03/2011
MCH 31 pg 27-33 10/03/2011
MCHC 34 g/dL 31-36 10/03/2011
Neutrophils (auto) 57 % 48-75 10/03/2011
Lymphs (auto) 30 % 15-50 10/03/2011
Monos (auto) 11 (#) % 0-10 10/03/2011
Eos (auto) 2 % 0-7 10/03/2011
Basos (auto) 1 % 0-2 10/03/2011
Neutrophil # (auto) 2.0 K/uL 2.0-6.9 10/03/2011
Lymph# (auto) 1.1 K/uL 0.6-3.4 10/03/2011
Mono# (auto) 0.4 K/uL 0.0-0.9 10/03/2011
Eos# (auto) 0.1 K/uL 0.0-0.7 10/03/2011
Baso# (auto) 0.0 K/uL 0.0-0.2 10/03/2011
Vitamin D (25 OH) 30
ng/mL 30-100 10/03/2011
Anion Gap 7 4-14 10/03/2011
Hgb A1C 5.1
Well-Controlled or Non Diabetic: <6.0% Diabetic [10] % 0.0-5.9 10/03/2011
FT4 1.4 ng/dL 0.8-2.2 10/03/2011
T3 Uptake 31 %TU 24-35 10/03/2011
Lyme Ab(s) 0.48
Negative <0.90 Equivocal [11] <0.90 10/03/2011
Bilirubin (Direct) 0.1 mg/dL 0.0-0.2 09/19/2011
Cholesterol 159 mg/dL <200 05/02/2011
HDL Cholesterol 54 mg/dL >40 05/02/2011
LDL Chol (Direct) 93 mg/dL 62-130 05/02/2011

[bass]

well, it looks like you are a candidate for TRT, few things are on the low side, your total T, %free, wbc, growth hormone , vitamin D, bun on the high side. i didn't see PSA, but its important to check your prostate if you are considering TRT. i'll let the more experienced guys chime in...

[zaggahamma]

I am 37 year old male and I have been feeling exhausted for about 8-10 years now. I play hockey 4 times a week and I have Hypothroid. I take Tirosint for this every morning. In a effort to try and find out why I have been tired and in a haze for some time I went to an Endocrinologist. She was definitely helpful. We did the "works" for blood work and a few things stood out to me immediately. Let me explain.


Testosterone (% Free) results were 1.7 and the normal range for me is 1.6-2.9

Testosterone (ng/dL) results were 405 and normal is 241-827

Groth Hormone .results were .05 and normal is .06-5.00


I asked my doc about these results and she told me that my T was in normal range. But I feel it is not in optimal range. Do you guys think this Low T should be addressed???


And my Growth Hormone is below normal. She said it fluctuates. I'm not sure if I asked her about repla***ent hormones for this. But I know if this is low it can caus you to be tired, recover slower from workouts etc...I started my own cycle of 191aa in an effort to bring my GH up. I am not just a guinea pig, my buddy has done a cycle of this stuff and said he feels amazing. So, I figured I'd give it a shot.


My questions for you guys is,

Do you think the Low T is low enough for it to need to be addressed??

What should I do, I feel like I'm not getting the help I want. Should I just bring it up to her and say hey, I started 191aa how do you feel about that or should I look for a new Doctor?

agree with bass

total t is not super low but down there and coupled with low free t and some symptoms...

maybe the psa wasnt on there due to the gov saying they were unneccessary a short while back?

any other symptoms? hows sleep?

[flatscat]

didn't see E2 or shbg (unless my old eyes missed it) something is taking up your free - it should be higher - find that what, correct and you may be good to go.

BTW guys - never forget that one could and should be diagnosed as hypo-gonadal based on low free numbers - it is not just total that can determine this condition.

[kelkel]

didn't see E2 or shbg (unless my old eyes missed it) something is taking up your free - it should be higher - find that what, correct and you may be good to go.

BTW guys - never forget that one could and should be diagnosed as hypo-gonadal based on low free numbers - it is not just total that can determine this condition.

Well said Flats!

[Tomxrocket]

This is good. I feel like I'm getting somewhere now. Thank you guys.....

Ok, so I'm gonna go to my Doc (She is a Endo Specialist) and have some more specific test done. I'm also looking into a second opinion.

Like,

PSA

E2

shbg

Is there anything else I should have her test while in there?


Also, what's your take on my self administering the 191aa? I have read conflicting accounts about it being good/bad. And some of the bad stuff I read was BAD,BAD. But then I think of all the athletes and stuff that have taken it with no issues (Lance Armstrong, Rodger Clemens... etc.)


My sleep is ok I guess. It could be better but I always blamed my mattress because I toss and turn. I even had a sleep study done a while back and of course it came back as I slept great..... Idk.


No sure about a hypo-gonadal condition but I definitely have very strong sperm. I have a 10 month old not and the wife is prego again (not planned). I will read up more on this.

Again, thanks guys, I really appreciate your helping me find out why I am in a walking coma....

[flatscat]

I would forget about the 191aa for now. Worry about your free t number and finding a physician who will find out what is taking your available t and can treat it. Also what are your stats?

Free/available t is king - not total.

[zaggahamma]

thought i mentioned free T was low?

[Tomxrocket]

You dont think my GH level being low is an issue? I can stop the 191aa....
Stats are,
5'10"
192 lbs.
Not sure of my body fat but I have plenty around the mid section.
Like I said, I play hockey alot and I get a good amount of exercise. I have a guy membership and I use to go religiously for years 3-4 times a week but I cant drag myself there anymore. This sucks.

[zaggahamma]

agree though that e2 should have been checked

i havent heard much of 191aa but if its quality hg gh i would be running it

my .02

[zaggahamma]

You dont think my GH level being low is an issue? I can stop the 191aa....
Stats are,
5'10"
192 lbs.
Not sure of my body fat but I have plenty around the mid section.
Like I said, I play hockey alot and I get a good amount of exercise. I have a guy membership and I use to go religiously for years 3-4 times a week but I cant drag myself there anymore. This sucks.

hope thats a hockey term

[spywizard]

guy or gym...

[flatscat]

I have never run 191aa - and I didn't see that you were already running it. So I will leave that for others now.

[Tomxrocket]

Gym, sorry. My spelling is terrible today.
I just started 191aa. I'm on day 4 and I actually do feel stronger.......

[Brohim]

I would keep the HGH! Your IGF-1 numbers are low and IMO you will feel better on it. 191 Amino's are the good ones.

[zaggahamma]

I would keep the HGH! Your IGF-1 numbers are low and IMO you will feel better on it. 191 Amino's are the good ones.

guess i could research but eh

aminos-similar/same as gh? talk to me

[bass]

guess i could research but eh

aminos-similar/same as gh? talk to me

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Growth_hormone

[zaggahamma]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Growth_hormone

wow first sentence

duhhhhhhh....lol

well....if i could afford quality pharm grade gh..at my age...i would supplement

[Tomxrocket]

I would keep the HGH! Your IGF-1 numbers are low and IMO you will feel better on it. 191 Amino's are the good ones.

How can you tell my levels are low? I was going by
Groth Hormone .results were .05 and normal is .06-5.00

"IGF -1 (Somatomedin C) 198"<--------- I dont see a normal level for this

I made a follow up appointment with my doc for Tues Dec 6th. I told her I started my own cycle of 191aa. All she said in her e-mail reply was, "come in". So we will see what the labs have to say and I will continue with the HGH for now (becuase I am feeling like I am starting to have more energy and I feel a bit stronger). But I would like to type up all the questions I have for her. I want to get this shit straight!

[Brohim]

"come in" LOL sounds like you might be in trouble.

I hope you don't think she will say "great, glad you got on HGH yourself".

The range for IGF-1 for labcorp are 117-329. So you aren't below normal but my level at age 30 is 354.

IF I were you I would take 2-3 iu's per day and stay on for 3 month's then re-test level. HGH can take up to 6months to a year to feel full effect's.

[Tomxrocket]

Haha, yeah, I expect to get a lashing from her. And thats ok. I am pretty well educated on this stuff now. The only thing I am skeptical about is where my stuff comes from. Thats the part I'm not cool with. Although it is all legit and profesionaly wrapped sealed etc.... I said to her, I would much rather be supervised by a doctor. I think that got her attention.

I am at 2ui's per day. I can go to 3 if I wanted but I'll just stick to the 2 for now.

[Brohim]

good point. If you can get it from a legit pharm it will be 2 or 3x more expensive but no worries of quality

do me a favor. Run the hgh for 2 iu's per day for a few month's and get the IFG-1 test done again. Would like to see how much it increases your level's. You should shoot for 350 or so. Good luck

Other benefit's you should notice in the next few weeks are better looking skin and better sleep.