12.9 IU Daily for 2-3 years.

[Sheen]

Hey guys,

I am GH deficient and my doctor has me on 12.9 IU (or 4.3 mg) daily. I am probably going to be on this dose for at least another 2-3 years and I then may taper down if necessary. When it comes to HGH, there are a lot of things the bodybuilding community talks about that are never discussed by medical companies. For example, bodybuilders say you could get diabetes from eating after taking HGH, yet no growth hormone company warns of such a thing in any prescribing information. As well, the bodybuilding community sometimes contends that HGH can totally shut down one's natural GH production, leaving them screwed after stopping treatment, however there is no research on such a thing. I don't know what side to take on such issues, but because there is the chance that the bodybuilding community could have some wisdom that the HGH companies don't talk about, I would like to ask here if I am facing any significant side effects that the HGH company does not put in their prescribing information with my 12.9IU dose daily, over the next 2-3 years. Thanks for any info in advance.

[redz]

How tall are you? There are many dangers that could arise from this at your age, main concerns would be unusual bone growth or deformities.

[Sheen]

How tall are you? There are many dangers that could arise from this at your age, main concerns would be unusual bone growth or deformities.

5' 7".

[Ffm]

Hey Shane can you please give me some info about hgh treatment. Did your doctor tell you something's like how long it will take for you to see a difference in height and how old are you? And what's the most amount of inches you can gain off of the treatment

[Sgt. Hartman]

Hey guys,

I am GH deficient and my doctor has me on 12.9 IU (or 4.3 mg) daily. I am probably going to be on this dose for at least another 2-3 years and I then may taper down if necessary. When it comes to HGH, there are a lot of things the bodybuilding community talks about that are never discussed by medical companies. For example, bodybuilders say you could get diabetes from eating after taking HGH, yet no growth hormone company warns of such a thing in any prescribing information. As well, the bodybuilding community sometimes contends that HGH can totally shut down one's natural GH production, leaving them screwed after stopping treatment, however there is no research on such a thing. I don't know what side to take on such issues, but because there is the chance that the bodybuilding community could have some wisdom that the HGH companies don't talk about, I would like to ask here if I am facing any significant side effects that the HGH company does not put in their prescribing information with my 12.9IU dose daily, over the next 2-3 years. Thanks for any info in advance.

^^Both are untrue.

GH does cause insulin resistance especially directly after pinning, but not necessarily diabetes. There are many studies on this.

Supplementing GH does cause endogenous GH production to be shut down, there are many supporting studies on this as well.

[gixxerboy1]

dude your taller then me and your stressing and using gh to get taller?

[Sheen]

Hey Shane can you please give me some info about hgh treatment. Did your doctor tell you something's like how long it will take for you to see a difference in height and how old are you? And what's the most amount of inches you can gain off of the treatment

My plates are still open. Had I not started taking an aromatase inhibitor they probably would be long closed by now. There is no telling how an individual will respond to HGH. However, if you are naturally GH deficient, you have the best chance at seeing good results. When I started treatment, I was on a smaller dose for 3 months and gained close to an inch in height and 20 lbs of muscle (not working out at all, just naturally gained that much). We'll see how things go now that I am restarting HGH after waiting for a good 3 or 4 months, since insurance has finally decided to pick up the tab.

dude your taller then me and your stressing and using gh to get taller?

Haha actually I was stressing and trying to use GH to get taller originally. I got a GH stimulation test to prove to the insurance company that I produce enough HGH on my own so that I could be labelled ISS, but in a turn of events, my peak levels came severely below normal, so I actually turned out to be really GH deficient. If it helps me get taller, excellent. If not, at least it will keep me at normal HGH levels.

[Ffm]

Sorry to keep questioning you Shane but theirs a lack of info on hgh and it's affect on height on this forum and I was curious if by any chance you rememberd your dosage with the aromatase inhibitor like how many times a week did you take it? And are you still doing so ? What was the amount you took if so ?

[ScotchGuard02]

When I read clinical studies on HGH studies they are normally very specific about their finding. I read one about trying to transport HGH through a dermal patch. The finding was that it was possible but not optimal (very paraphrased). They didn't talk about natural pulses or diabetes. In other words, the studies, unless they're specifically targeting the affect of HGH on diabetes, will say nothing about diabetes. The bodybuilding community has a much more holistic approach to gear. They look at overall health of the athlete. That's why the vets are constantly telling young BB to not cycle. Nice muscles, injured HPTA. Safety and health of the athlete is paramount so all aspects of the physiology is addressed in the BB'ing community. My .02

[Sheen]

Sorry to keep questioning you Shane but theirs a lack of info on hgh and it's affect on height on this forum and I was curious if by any chance you rememberd your dosage with the aromatase inhibitor like how many times a week did you take it? And are you still doing so ? What was the amount you took if so ?

I've been taking 2.5mg letrozole daily for about half a year now. As for HGH and height, it really depends upon the situation whether you can get extra height from it or not. If you think you are young enough that you have a chance, the first thing to do is to get a bone age x-ray. If your plates aren't entirely sealed, you may be able to get a little extra height with HGH. If you are already making plenty growth hormone on your own, though, the HGH won't help you. In fact, if you have high normal levels of GH and you also take HGH, that's when the problems start.

[gonzo6183]

I've been taking 2.5mg letrozole daily for about half a year now. As for HGH and height, it really depends upon the situation whether you can get extra height from it or not. If you think you are young enough that you have a chance, the first thing to do is to get a bone age x-ray. If your plates aren't entirely sealed, you may be able to get a little extra height with HGH. If you are already making plenty growth hormone on your own, though, the HGH won't help you. In fact, if you have high normal levels of GH and you also take HGH, that's when the problems start.

umm, did you plan on ever getting an erection again in your life?

And 13iu a day? are you sure? im no GH expert but that sounds crazy, I got prescribed 1iu daily...

[Sheen]

umm, did you plan on ever getting an erection again in your life?

And 13iu a day? are you sure? im no GH expert but that sounds crazy, I got prescribed 1iu daily...

From my experience, I can confirm that letrozole does kill sex drive, but it has not caused me ED and it shouldn't. The effects of the letrozole can be stopped at any time simply by stopping the medicine. I've never heard of any case of permanent ED developed due to letrozole usage but, if there is such a thing, please point it out to me and I will not ignore it for the sake of my own health. As for the dosage, I think I am 13 IU because my body still has growth potential remaining and so it will take a lot to get my body to respond. The older you get, the less resistant your body gets to HGH, so with older age usually comes a lower dosage. You may not be GHD, I don't know about your situation, but if you don't need it at all that may be why you have a lower dose. Your Dr. also may be planing on gradually increasing the dose as your body adjusts.

[Razor]

Interesting thread...couple questions ..why are u taking letro and what side effects do u notice at 13iu ed and how old are u?

[Sheen]

Interesting thread...couple questions ..why are u taking letro and what side effects do u notice at 13iu ed and how old are u?

I am on letrozole to keep what little space I have left in my growth plates. Also to see if it could help with gynecomastia , which it hasn't so far. At 13 IU ed, I haven't noticed any side effects so far. I only really feel better and have began to gain muscle mass weekly doing pretty much nothing. I am younger and so my body is more willing to accept that much GH, and I also have a lot more room for that GH compared to normal people since I am GH deficient.

[Razor]

I am on letrozole to keep what little space I have left in my growth plates. Also to see if it could help with gynecomastia, which it hasn't so far. At 13 IU ed, I haven't noticed any side effects so far. I only really feel better and have began to gain muscle mass weekly doing pretty much nothing. I am younger and so my body is more willing to accept that much GH, and I also have a lot more room for that GH compared to normal people since I am GH deficient.

Well ur at about double the dose it takes to cause hyperplasia so that's why ur gaining muscle mass....so that's bad ass ...are u getting lean as well and could u give me a specific age..just curious..how tall are u and how much have u grown? Grtting gyno at a young age must be genetic or hormonal I'm guessing. Has the doctor said what is causing it...how does the letro help ur growth plates open..very interesting

[Igifuno]

This also makes me interested in testing my GH levels. I've never done it, and I believe you have to give 3-4 blood samples. OP, can you she'd some light on this? How does your doc test your levels?

[Razor]

I got my igf tested with one blood pull??

[Sheen]

Well ur at about double the dose it takes to cause hyperplasia so that's why ur gaining muscle mass....so that's bad ass ...are u getting lean as well and could u give me a specific age..just curious..how tall are u and how much have u grown? Grtting gyno at a young age must be genetic or hormonal I'm guessing. Has the doctor said what is causing it...how does the letro help ur growth plates open..very interesting

HGH does cause breakdown of abdominal fat so it does lean you out, while increasing your appetite as well. A main symptom of GH deficiency especially in younger people is actually excess abdominal fat. As for age, I am younger than most members, and I still have some plate space. When I started HGH for the first time, before my insurance was covering me, I was on a 3 month free trial with the company Humatrope and I gained roughly an inch in height in that 3 months. Now that I am restarting HGH and plan to be on it for at least 2 years, I should theoretically be able to make it to 5' 10" - 6'. That's theoretically because I still have open plate space which means the length of my bones can increase (albeit at a very slow rate) and the letrozole is bringing my estrogen levels down to near zero. Estrogen is what causes growth plates to shut off (hence women ending up much shorter than men, and they also use estrogen therapy to keep giants from getting taller) so taking the strongest aromatase inhibitor can theoretically let you grow longer than normal people (at the cost of some bone density and the risk of vertebral deformities).

This also makes me interested in testing my GH levels. I've never done it, and I believe you have to give 3-4 blood samples. OP, can you she'd some light on this? How does your doc test your levels?

GH releases in pulses randomly so getting one blood sample is not accurate. To find out if you are GH deficient or not you have to lay down for a 3-4 hour long blood test. You must fast about 12 hours beforehand and you are not to have any physical activity (since this can increase GH). Then, you get an IV in your arm and about 15 2 teaspoon blood samples are taken over the course of the time. The first part is just normal, monitoring. Then, they introduce arginine into the system through the IV, and take more samples and monitor. This is supposed to induce GH production Then, they shoot you up with a large amount of insulin and induce a hypogly***ic attack. This stage is pretty much a stimulated near-death experience, where your blood sugar goes extremely low and you are tortured for what feels like hours as you squirm around in your own pool of sweat wishing that you could pass out but you can't. That was my test at least. I think the test can be done with just arginine. Anyway, the results that come in show your peak GH levels. While the baseline was 10, my result came back as 4.9 and so I was obviously deficient.

As for IGF, when I got that measured before I was at the low end of normal, so if you are there as well and you are showing other symptoms and are willing to withstand the stim test, a stim test might uncover GH deficiency you never knew about.

[Razor]

Man I have learned a lot..very cool changes you are going through...you must be thrilled. I hope u make it to six 1 !!

[wmaousley]

Impressive read

[Razor]

I wonder if running letro on young males would help them grow taller even if they dont have a gh deficiency.

[jasc]

Do you feel many side effects from the letro/low estrogen? like sore joints, lethargy, always tired?

I've accidently crushed my estrogen before, for just a couple days, but I felt like complete shit. Couldn't train for days n slept like 18hrs a day.

Best of luck with the GH.. keep us updated

[Razor]

Do you feel many side effects from the letro/low estrogen? like sore joints, lethargy, always tired?

I've accidently crushed my estrogen before, for just a couple days, but I felt like complete shit. Couldn't train for days n slept like 18hrs a day.

Best of luck with the GH.. keep us updated

Considering gh and letro make u tired I wonder how u stay awake! The gh probably cancels out the sore joints from the letro.
Sounds like he in not on hat high of a dose

[jasc]

Considering gh and letro make u tired I wonder how u stay awake! The gh probably cancels out the sore joints from the letro.
Sounds like he in not on hat high of a dose

That's what I was wondering.. If the gh countered the sore joints

He's on 2.5mg/day of letro

[Razor]

That's what I was wondering.. If the gh countered the sore joints

He's on 2.5mg/day of letro

Pretty high dose then..good thing he's on am equally high dose of gh.

What brand of gh u running? Nova Disk?

[Igifuno]

Pretty interesting. The GH testing sounds like hell man. Good luck with everything and thx for all the details.

[wmaousley]

Where are all the GH experts on this forum. I want to hear from them. This is a very Interesting topic here.

[Sheen]

Man I have learned a lot..very cool changes you are going through...you must be thrilled. I hope u make it to six 1 !!

Thanks man. Realistically I am expecting 5' 8". There are a lot of variables and outliers that could cause growth plates to shut down. For example, a rare side effect of thyroid meds is early plate closure, and I'm taking T4 daily now due to Hashimoto's Thyroiditis (possibly the main reason I haven't grown too well my whole life). Also, the prescribing info of growth hormone talks about how there is an effect on the pituitary-hypothalamic axis and an improper dose could possibly close the growth plates. I've also seen my wrist growth plates that seemed to be in the process of closing but not my knee or femur. Aside from all of this, however, if the applications of letrozole and GH work in theory the exact same way they work in practice, then I should be able to grow indefinitely (likely at a slow rate).

I wonder if running letro on young males would help them grow taller even if they dont have a gh deficiency.

http://pediatrics.aappublications.or...15/2/e245.full
Check out that article. Basically letrozole can help anyone grow taller as long as their plates are still open as it extends the time it takes for your plates to close and also increases IGF-1 levels.

Do you feel many side effects from the letro/low estrogen? like sore joints, lethargy, always tired?

I've accidently crushed my estrogen before, for just a couple days, but I felt like complete shit. Couldn't train for days n slept like 18hrs a day.

Best of luck with the GH.. keep us updated

I've been taking estrogen for at least half a year now and I am used to GH so it is hard for me to pinpoint side effects. I can tell you that, after I stopped GH suddenly when my 3 month trial was over, I felt like crap. Gradually, I began to get piercing headaches. It got to the point that I would have a headache every day. And these headaches were absolutely insane, they made me want to drive my head through a wall to stop the pain. Hard painkillers couldn't even touch them.
With letrozole, and especially at the dose I am on, I'd say the most noticeable side effect is no sex drive. It doesn't give you ED, but you simply will lose all sexual desires. In my case I don't mind since I've got a lot of work to do
With HGH, side effects I notice most include a huge increase in appetite (that stays with you) and great change in sleep. After the 3 months of HGH, I had permanently taken on an appetite much greater than what I had before. After all, I did gain about approx. 15 lbs of muscle mass those 3 months. Since I have restarted HGH (almost a month now) I have gained 5 - 10 lbs more muscle mass. As for sleep, when on HGH, my sleep is much deeper (a.k.a. REM sleep). I have many more vivid dreams and I can sleep much longer (and much easier) than before. I usually stay up too frequently so this helps me out a lot. I've also got to pull many all-nighters cause I've got work to do, and my body handles 2 days w/o sleep like a pro.
Note that I am younger so I am less likely to see side effects on a large dose of HGH. Also, the only painful side effect I've gotten (which I can probably attribute to growth) is back pain. I've gotten severe back pain twice so far while on HGH. I have scoliosis. A minor lumbar curve and a moderate rib cage twist. Letrozole carries the risk of vertebral deformities and HGH carries the risk of advancing your scoliosis (if you still can grow) so while I am putting myself in a really bad position by taking both of these meds while having scoliosis, the pain is reassuring me that I can still grow (since it is possibly making my scoliosis worse).
Oh and now that I read back over your post, you mentioned lethargy. I think being on HGH psychologically is a big boost and tends to make you look on the brighter side of things. I think it also medically affects your mood. HGH is linked with overall well-being after all.
As for your request of updates, I believe I have grown at least a quarter of an inch and gained 5 lbs since re-starting HGH at 12.9IU ED 3 weeks ago.

Considering gh and letro make u tired I wonder how u stay awake! The gh probably cancels out the sore joints from the letro.
Sounds like he in not on hat high of a dose

Recently, I've been getting heavy eyes after eating a big lunch and falling asleep for 4-5 hours. I believe this would be termed reactive hypogly***ia due to my relatively high dose of GH. As for letro, I don't think it has a correlation to drowsiness.
At some point I was on letro for a while before starting HGH for the first time, and I think this is when I got jumper's knee. Since then my left knee has been swollen and I'm going into physical therapy soon to see what I can accomplish. I am expecting HGH to monumentally speed up the healing however. I haven't done any cardio in almost a year since I went from running nothing to running 8 miles and stress fractured both of my legs, so I am pretty used to being a cripple when it comes to cardio.

Pretty high dose then..good thing he's on am equally high dose of gh.

What brand of gh u running? Nova Disk?

Norditropin 30 mg pens by Novo Nordisk.

Pretty interesting. The GH testing sounds like hell man. Good luck with everything and thx for all the details.

Much appreciated, bro.

[Razor]

You have given me hope..I am going to run 6iu ed without gear and see what I can gain. Thanks for your continued reports..keep em coming.
Your doctor definitely has you set up with letro..t4 and gh at high dose..I continue to be impressed. If you can grow indefinitely go till 6'1. Seems to be the perfect height
How many iu you on right now and how much muscle mass have you gained. The nova disk pens are 30iu each right? So your going through 1 every 2 days? How much are you injecting at once?

[Sheen]

You have given me hope..I am going to run 6iu ed without gear and see what I can gain. Thanks for your continued reports..keep em coming.
Your doctor definitely has you set up with letro..t4 and gh at high dose..I continue to be impressed. If you can grow indefinitely go till 6'1. Seems to be the perfect height
How many iu you on right now and how much muscle mass have you gained. The nova disk pens are 30iu each right? So your going through 1 every 2 days? How much are you injecting at once?

Taking 12.9 IU ED, injecting at night before bed. The pens are 30 mg each, and 3 IU = 1 mg, so there is 90 IU in each pen. I get 4 pens a month. Muscle mass gained was about 15 lbs in the first three months of usage, and about 10 lbs since re-starting about a month ago.

[Razor]

I'm at 5iu till Monday then going up to 7.5iu ed.. I just started back on this week..gh is so calorie dependent it's crazy..how many calories you think your taking in on average. I can already tell I'm going to be eating a lot. Ill hold 7.5iu ed for 8 months

[SuperLift]

Ive never heard of a doctor prescribing that much. wow guess you are just lucky.

[Razor]

Lucky for that and that he's got insurance to cover it. Shit if I was him I would run a cycle with all that gh

[Sheen]

Lucky for that and that he's got insurance to cover it. Shit if I was him I would run a cycle with all that gh

0.067 mg/kg/day is what my dosage is based upon. It's meant for catch-up growth in a shorter amount of time if you start GH later than you are supposed to when you are deficient, so it is actually a legit dosage suggested by the GH company I am on. Insurance is really strict when it comes to GH so unless you have plenty proof that you are GH deficient there is no hope of getting coverage. Oh and no need for me to run a cycle, I do barely any physical activity (just some occasional pull-ups) and I gain plenty muscle. I don't want to become the hulk or anything

[Razor]

Nice man..how were you and your doctor able to prove you had a deficiency

[Sheen]

Nice man..how were you and your doctor able to prove you had a deficiency

I have a medical history of poor growth, no growth velocity at all without HGH (I should still have a little), low IGF serum test results across the board, behind on secondary sexual development, below average height and weight, and the biggest factor: failure of two HGH stimulation tests, the first being Arginine and the second Insulin .

[Razor]

Well I'm glad to see that the gh is literally changing your life for the better.

[Sheen]

Well I'm glad to see that the gh is literally changing your life for the better.

Thanks, man. It really is.

[Razor]

bump for a friend

[wmaousley]

Razr, why the thread abandonment from all the known GH users?