6 months with no weight gain but muscle increase pretty weird pics.

**TTTT** · 01-29-2003, 05:57 PM

Bro, personally, I think you good the way you are, maybe add a little more mass....... but if your goal is to get huge, then, what the other bros are telling you is correct! eat! eat! eat! and then, eat some more! Personally, I will never ever go on a bulking cycle, cause I cannot stand the fat gains! I find I get alot more of the girls at the gym than the big guys do, cause they like the long lean cut up look. Whick I did not have while bulking....... just my thoughts.... but your goals are your goals, and therfore, I respect that, so just eat brother! hight carbs, high protein! You'll make it! I have faith in you!

**Endurance** · 01-30-2003, 11:57 AM

Thank you so much guys. I really do appreciate the positive encouragement. Im going to take some pictures today and post them up here and then weekly for the next 4 weeks i will continue to do so. Im getting the Weight Gainer tomorrow. Cause ya'll know about that first 7 days at GNC thing. No Cardio! Is there a web site where i can find out how many calories are contained in foods. I wouldn't know about a piece of pizza or chicken sandwich off the top of my head. TTTT my goal is to bulk for 3 months and then hitting some cutting for summer. Ultimatley im looking at going from 145lbs @ 7% Bf which is what i am to 175-180 with 7%BF this or course is my final destination and i don't expect to achieve this soon. Thanks guys and the inspiration really comes from ya'll. I'll have those pics up tonight.

**FedSki** · 01-30-2003, 05:38 PM

There's loads of sites giving you food info. Use google to search for 'nutritional values in food' or something similar. The anabolic review main site has a food info. section that is very useful. Go to http://www.anabolicreview.com/foodprof.htm to view.

I think you have all the info. you need now to start to grow. Eat well, train hard (but not for too long or too many sessions), sleep well and grow. Don't forget to weigh yourself each week (I suggest first thing in the morning after you've been to the loo) and keep us posted.

FedSki out!

**Endurance** · 01-31-2003, 04:26 PM

alright this morning i ate a bowl of total and a nutri grain
10am i had a smoothie with metrx soy protein in it
Lunch: Grilled chicken sand with American cheese and and plate of fries (not try to cut)
Snack:2 nutri grains (mom sends them to me)
Dinner:Saffron rice, shrimp, baked potato, piece of pizza, salad w/pita bread
Night: 3 tacos w/ baked lays chips
About how many cal is this?
Starting next week it will be all this and 3 scoops of weight gainer

**FedSki** · 01-31-2003, 07:03 PM

Not sure how many calories - work it out, shouldn't be too hard - use the nutrition guides and info. on the snack packets. Here's my typical day diet: -

breakfast - four eggs, bowl of porridge, carb shake with creatine
mid morning - tuna with mayo
lunch chicken breast with mashed potatoe or pasta
afternoon - meal replacement shake
dinner - steak, steamed veg. potatoe
late evening chicken, tuna or eggs followed by rice pudding
just before bed - meal replacement shake

It took a long time to get used to eating so much but I'm happy with it now.

**Iron horse** · 02-01-2003, 06:43 AM

I dont think you should do cardio! and limit your workout days to 3-4 times a week IMO, whats what i did when i was 142!!!!!!!!! now Im way way heavier, but a lot of weight was from natural work. But of course now I still consider myself small just like i did then!

this has been repeated im sure!

but when i was your weight..

I'd have a 1000 calories weight gainer in the morning and at night.
and after workouts I'd have a big ass protien shake and an hour late a big glass of milk. Add creatine as well IMO, and bring a litre of milk to school if you can, I add that to my breakfest as well. ALTHOUGH some have problems with milk.. I can drink a gallon and not get gassy or stomach problems.

Go heavy on the main lifts, dont use bigger weights for 4 reps, but do 8-12 reps (IMO!!!) make sure perfect form is in place and another thing I made sure on when I was lighter, that i was out of the gym in 45 minutes.

always eat before bed!

good luck

**Endurance** · 02-12-2003, 06:05 PM

Well heres an update. I started the weight gainer 2 weeks ago when i was at 142lbs. I am now at 148lbs. I'm doing the split that i posted. I get sore on Mondays but i really don't don't feel any soreness or even a good pump on my bi's tri's and shoulders. Its kinda frustrating but im going to stick with it.

**CPARAM** · 02-13-2003, 01:07 AM

6 lbs in 2 weeks, thats good man.

**mike35** · 02-13-2003, 01:55 AM

I went from 138 to 220 at my heaviest (natural). I think you're doing way to many exercises. To gain weight, try heavy squatting...deep, deadlifts, bench, and weighted pull-ups...few others are ok but focus on the basics.

**FedSki** · 02-13-2003, 03:29 AM

Originally posted by mike35
I went from 138 to 220 at my heaviest (natural). I think you're doing way to many exercises. To gain weight, try heavy squatting...deep, deadlifts, bench, and weighted pull-ups...few others are ok but focus on the basics.

mike35, that's already been discussed in detail. read the thread from the start.

Endurance - that's great news buddy. I'm really pleased for yer.

Keep us update.

**Endurance** · 02-14-2003, 05:30 PM

thanks fedski yeah mike35 i changed my workout from what i was doing to the hardgainer plan. It consists of the main movements you are talking about deadlifts leg presses dips etc. cparam i think the 6lbs is form the weight gainer which is good but im still concerned about not getting the pump i want. SOmetimes the workout calls for 2 working sets and i have to add one more to get a burn but i am still sticking with the 3 days a week thing. Im getting ready to hit the gym now so i will post my weight whenever i get back.

**peam** · 02-15-2003, 06:28 PM

Well.... you asked for replies and considering I had to scroll down for like two minutes before I got to this little reply box I'd say you got some. You look better now though!

**russell368** · 02-15-2003, 10:36 PM

Quit the cardio, your just burning all those calories you take in, your metabolism is all ready jacked up enough, thats the last thing a hardgainer needs is cardio. Get some weight gain powder and at least 4000 calories a day total , prolab n2lrg works good for me, keep protien at least 1.5gmxbody weight

**Endurance** · 02-16-2003, 01:32 AM

i dont do any cardio now. I am taking weight gainer 2200 gold. I weighed myself this morning i was back at 144. i guess i didn't eat enough yesterday. ill still trying to get those pictures

**FedSki** · 02-16-2003, 04:43 PM

Originally posted by Endurance
SOmetimes the workout calls for 2 working sets and i have to add one more to get a burn but i am still sticking with the 3 days a week thing. Im getting ready to hit the gym now so i will post my weight whenever i get back.

you don't have to get a burn to stress the muscle. three times a week is probably too much. stick to twice a week and never ever do more than three working sets!

**GeaR and SauCe** · 02-17-2003, 07:00 PM

You guys need to stop telling these guys not to do AAS. AAS isn't for everyone but sometimes its the only choice. My family is genetically skinny and tall. My cousins are the same way as I was, tall and skinny. The only way we each worked around it was with the SAFE use of AAS. Moderation is key. Let the guy experiment, hes old enough. If yuo tell him to eat more and train more your just gonna wear him out because its never gonna happen in the right time frame. You guys might not understand because you were never skinny. If you stay natural you might hit your desired weight but its not gonna be in time, it takes seriously years of training to put on natural size and if your a hard gainer its nearly impossible. No one has time to eat 8 meals a day, there are so much other things when your young that its impossible to be fully focused. Of course eating good and trainging right are a must but it will never be the absolute center of someones life because that would be financially and socially impossible. Let get realistic here, I've been there and I've known close family that has also. The thing to do is research, train hard, eat good but research for the next 6months-a year and lean everything you can. When you are mentally ready, make it happen. Take every precaution. It seems to me you understand most of the key principles of body building. Learn more and do a lot more AAS research. Comming to this board is a great way to learn as there are many others out there just like it. When you are ready, go through with it but make sure you know what you are doing. Please guys, I can see the flames comming back already but eating and training are never gonna get you the results your looking for in the right time frame. If it was ment to happen you would have already seen some decent results. I've been there and done it and there is nothing that will change my mind on this matter.

**FedSki** · 02-18-2003, 03:20 AM

Originally posted by GeaR and SauCe
If it was ment to happen you would have already seen some decent results. I've been there and done it and there is nothing that will change my mind on this matter.

Have you actually read this thread from the start? If you really are a hardgainer (like me) then you'd know this guy was overtraining and not eating enough.

It makes so much more sense to get your diet and training regime sorted out and gain as much as you can, naturally, before you start gear. Too many people use gear because they see it as being the answer to all their problems or a shortcut to success. If you are not eating or training right then gear probably won't help.

You tell him to wait and learn what he can. Hell bro, don't you think we've already suggested that (in a round about way).

**GeaR and SauCe** · 02-18-2003, 09:03 PM

I know what your saying but I also think that you understand what I am trying to say. Its hard for me to articulate how I feel about it BUT, I'm going to try. Im not reccomending anyone to use AAS. Its not my decision to tell people how they should use their bodies. What I am basically saying is that through my experience, there was no way for me to gain serious mass without juice. You can't tell me I didn't know how to eat or how to train. Some people just aren't going to get big naturally. People throw around suggestions to much. They say EAT MORE EAT MORE. First off, how do you know that the guy isn't eating enough? What if he is eating 4000 calories a day and 300gs of protien? You don't know he isn't. I know thats what I was eating and I still wasn't gaining mass. All I would hear is that I wasn't eating enough. I was eating so much that I was just about getting sick. It was almost like an eating disorder where if I didn't feel nasious, then I hadn't eaten enough. But people told me I wasn't eating enough. The only thing that ever helped me was gear. You guys need to learn that some people just can't gain real weight naturally. I'd say that, naturally, genetics determines 90% of your success and your ethic only determines the other 10%.

**HBK** · 02-18-2003, 09:42 PM

It's gonna take several years of hard training and consisteant diet before you are ready for gear.Take it one step at a time and you will get there.Holla! if you hear me!

**FedSki** · 02-19-2003, 03:59 AM

Originally posted by GeaR and SauCe
What if he is eating 4000 calories a day and 300gs of protien? You don't know he isn't.

I know he wasn't, because he told me.

I know thats what I was eating and I still wasn't gaining mass.

Maybe your training regime was wrong. Anyway you have to look at diet and training before you hit the gear.

You guys need to learn that some people just can't gain real weight naturally. I'd say that, naturally, genetics determines 90% of your success and your ethic only determines the other 10%.

I disagree with your ratio. Genetics do make a difference, as we all know. But ethic (I take this to mean strategy, planning and commitment) means just as much if not more. You can break through genetic barriers with the right diet and training regime. And if you come to a brick wall, after trying all the options and doing all the right things, then maybe it's time to consider juicing.

**Endurance** · 02-19-2003, 05:32 PM

Thanks guys for the concern. G&S i do hear what your saying as well as i understand what Fedski is saying. I am getting alot of calories now but 1000 of it is coming from weight gainer. The thing with me is that i've been lifting for 5 years now and i haven't seen much improvement. The most dramatic results i got was from when i was doing 9 sets per bodypart, but lately ive been questioning that because i haven't been gaining much so that is why i have chosen to follow fedski's advice. I am at 149 when i was at 142 but i believe that is from the weight gainer because i missed two days of taking it last week because it was my birthday and i was out then when i weighed myself i was at 144. On the other hand i am hearing G&S loud and clear too. If im trying to get to 200lbs @ 7%bf there is no way i am ever going to get there in any close amount of time. Also this is the age and time when your body is a main concern to you. When im 27-28 perhaps my priorities will have changed and i won't be so avid about this but right now it is important. All G&S made a good point with bringing up time. Yes I FUCKING LOVE LIFTING!!!!!!!! however i am a student with a job and a long distance girlfriend and a life.......well you get the picture. I have maybe the time i spend researching on here and the time i spend at the gym and thats it. I don't have time to sit down and make a chart out of how much i eat and all this stuff. Biochemistry, Physics II, Microbiology and American lit is a pretty hefty load and i am looking for the best route. I am not afraid to put forth effort or work hard but i don't want to climb any mountains i could walk around

**FedSki** · 02-19-2003, 06:44 PM

Enduarance buddy, did you see my earlier posting?

I think you are, perhaps, still over training. Try two sessions a week - and never do more than 3 sets of 8 per exercise. I think you are still burning too many calories. And give it time bro. Eventually your body begins to store the nutrients you don't use, ready to be used when you train. This will result in weight gain.

**Endurance** · 02-20-2003, 03:18 PM

Next week im going to go to just twice a week. Probably follow the upper/lower body plan that you posted fedski. im still hanging around 147-148lbs. We'll see what happens though in the next couple of weeks with some progression.

**wayne c** · 02-21-2003, 07:45 AM

i would nt waste my money on protien of any quality unless u on the juice with the calories u are taking in you are getting enough aldready u got a very high matabolism and with the lean muscle u are really burning some serious calories ,take a high quality weight gainer in addition to what u are already taking in for three months you will gain at least 20 or more pounds ,and when lifting keep your reps low and lift heavy and drink a lot of water to flush the system

**Endurance** · 02-21-2003, 11:37 AM

Yeah like i posted im not taking a protein supp. Just the weight gainer. Its got enough protein in it plus with what im eating i think im doing alright. i'll see if i can get those pictures up again of now. I found a guy thats got a web cam so im going to try tonight.

**FedSki** · 02-21-2003, 04:06 PM

it's funny, people keep commenting and offering advice, which is nice, but many have obviously not read the earlier postings. endurance, stick to the program buddy, i'm sure you'll start to grow!

**Endurance** · 03-22-2003, 09:14 PM

Ok guys im back thanks to fedski's PM. Progress not much really. Sad i guess. Some people just can't grow. Thats me. So ive decided to go ahead and cycle. Im going to do this.
QV test cyp 400mg/w
QV EQ 400mg/w
LR d-bol 25mg/ed

We'll see how it goes. Thanks guys for all the great encouragment and support. I will let ya'll know how it goes.

**thetank** · 03-23-2003, 03:47 PM

what the hell? dont take the easy route man, put some effort into what your doing, all you have too do is EAT! SWEET JESUS, EAT! i dont understand it, its so easy too do! if you have too force feed yourself then do it, dont start a cycle now your waisting your time. just looking at your pics i can tell you can put on the size if you want too its not like your skin and bone youve made some gains, put on a good 20 lbs AT LEAST before considering the darkside you wont regret the decision. pm me if you have any questions at all, alright?
peace.

**keithq1122** · 04-01-2003, 11:08 AM

dude u dont need ass to gain anything im a natural skinny person i was 6'6 190 in high school and now at 22 im at 270 10 % bf with just eating alot but very clean. this summer ill be at 255-260 at 7% bf . so all i can say is try and hold off on the ASS.

if u want to gain try this diet

meals
1. 4-6 whole eggs, 50-100g oatmeal
2. weight gain shake with peice of fruit
3. 8 oz chicken or fish with frozen vegtables and 1 piece fruit
4. 8 oz. nonfat yougart (5-10 min before workout)
5. 1/2 weight gainer drink (immediatly post workout)
6. any type of dinner u want
7. protien shake before bed with 2 tblsp natural peanut butter

even if u do get on ASS u need to eat this much to gain.
this diet will get u 20 lbs in 6 months or less. and it doesnt require alot of time.

**Endurance** · 04-06-2003, 09:28 PM

thanks man for the time and message. I have to decided to hold off and i went and bought a george foreman grill and a shit load of groceries with the money and all i have ate the last week is Grilled chicken and pork and fish with rice pilaf, baked potatos, vegetable meadley. Damn i love food

**FedSki** · 04-08-2003, 06:57 AM

Yes eat my friend, but don't go over training!!

**dtdionne** · 04-18-2003, 10:33 AM

PUT AWAY THAT P*SSY ASS WEIGHT GAINER and every other rediculous over the counter processed supplement!!!! and get some friggin steak!!! no get a TON of steak.

k, sorry got that out of my system, just finished the whole thread and had to say that.

Who was it on this forum? Youngunz i think had a moto that was something like "put down that shake and pick up a steak". exactly right, especially for people with high metabo's. steak has creatine, protein and fat, and it dont get no better then that! and yes if you read his thread you will see that he juiced at a young age but you will also see that he has mastered nutrition.

You have a fantastic foundation and will be able to bulk while staying lean if you do it right. stay away from aas until you have mastered nutrition cause aas without nutrtion is like jetfuel on the runway...tons of potential gone to waist cause of a missing piece.

Also try to stay away from protein supps in favor of real food, only use them for a snack when you dont have something like beef jerky or your in a hurry and not more then one a day.

the dietary "day in the life of..." you posted at the beginning of the second page was NOT ANYWHERE CLOSE to what you need to be eating.

i think it takes a while for endurance athleats to adjust to weight trainning from a metabo standpoint. i played hockey in college and we were on the ice for 3 hrs a day min and i had a damn hard time putting on weight in the offseason when i wasnt skating that much and couldnt figure out why. i also didnt know a tenth of what i know now. lookin back, i ate about 4500-5000 cals a day mostly from carbs and WEIGHT GAINNERS hehe. after my hockey carreer was over it took about 9 mon to a year before i could gain cause my metabo was still in high gear. but if i would have eatin right i think i could have started gainning in about 3 to 4 months.

you need to fall in love with steak, eggs, salad, uncooked veggies, black walnuts, whole peanutbutter, olive oil, olive oil, flaxseed oil, real oatmeal, brown rice, tuna and chicken for starters. And fall out of love with everything you can that is processed.

seriously put down some steak, i think its one of the slowest burnning proteins there is, meaning, if you get 100g's of protein from a steak in one sitting you will get damn near 100g's of protein absorbtion which isnt the case for protein supps where if you drank 100g's of whey you would get....30-40 gs and the toilet will get 60-70 gs.

anyway, no flame intended and im really excited for you. good luck and keep posting.