12-22-2004, 03:27 AM #1
FBI Agents Complained of Prisoner Abuse
FBI Agents Complained of Prisoner Abuse, Records Say
Tue Dec 21, 7:55 AM ET Top Stories - Los Angeles Times
By Richard A. Serrano Times Staff Writer
WASHINGTON — FBI (news - web sites) agents have lodged repeated complaints of physical and mental mistreatment of prisoners held in Iraq (news - web sites) and Cuba, saying in reports that military officials have placed lighted cigarettes in detainees' ears and humiliated Arab captives by wrapping Israeli flags around them, according to new documents released Monday.
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The FBI records, which are among the latest set of documents obtained by the ACLU in its lawsuit against the federal government, also include instances in which bureau officials said they were disgusted by military interrogators who pretended to be FBI agents as a "ruse" to glean intelligence from prisoners.
The FBI complained that military interrogators had gone beyond the restrictions of the Geneva Convention that prohibit torture; the agents cited Bush administration guidelines that permit the use of dogs and other techniques to harass prisoners.
The records disclosed Monday are the second set in which FBI officials objected to military detention practices, and are notable because some instances occurred after revelations this year of prisoner abuses at the U.S.-run Abu Ghraib prison in Iraq.
Earlier this month, the ACLU released records in which FBI agents complained about prisoner abuse in 2002. The new records show FBI complaints have continued through 2004. In each case, the names of the agents were removed before the records were released.
FBI officials participate in interrogations at military prisons and lockups as part of the bureau's counterterrorism duties. FBI agents have been stationed at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, and in Iraq.
"We know what's permissible for FBI agents but are less sure what is permissible for military interrogators," the FBI's "on-scene commander-Baghdad" complained to his bureau colleagues in May. "We cannot have our [FBI] personnel embedded with military units abroad, which regularly use these interrogation techniques."
Another unidentified FBI agent told his superiors in July that he had witnessed military interrogators and government contract employees at the U.S. naval base at Guantanamo Bay using "aggressive treatment and improper interview techniques" on prisoners.
"I did observe treatment that was not only aggressive, but personally very upsetting," he said.
At the Pentagon (news - web sites), Air Force Maj. Michael Shavers, a military spokesman, said the Defense Department would have no comment about the FBI records or the administration guidelines that were the subject of complaints by agents.
The FBI agents referred to what they described as a new executive order on prisoner treatment by President Bush (news - web sites). They described the order as allowing interrogation tactics that were forbidden for FBI agents. The records did not include a copy of the Bush order, or make clear exactly when it was signed. Pentagon officials would not comment on whether there was any new order.
According to FBI officials, the Bush order approved interrogation tactics that included "sleep deprivation and stress positions," as well as "loud music, interrogators yelling at subjects and prisoners with hoods on their heads."
Earlier this year, White House documents and legal memos outlined the administration's legal view that enemy combatants were not strictly prisoners of war, and that therefore the Geneva Convention might not always apply in the post-Sept. 11 war against terrorism. Iraqi detainees always have been considered POWs.
Nevertheless Jameel Jaffer, a staff attorney for the American Civil Liberties Union (news - web sites) in New York, maintained that "the methods that the Defense Department had adopted were illegal, immoral and counterproductive."
He added that the ACLU, which has been obtaining detention records under a lawsuit it filed against the federal government, finds it "astonishing that these methods appear to have been adopted as a matter of policy by the highest levels of government."
In many of the records released Monday, FBI officials expressed repulsion upon learning that military interrogators posed as FBI agents in their interviews with prisoners.
They said they had learned the "ruse" was approved by Defense Secretary Donald H. Rumsfeld, and that it had an adverse effect on obtaining "cooperation" from prisoners.
In one instance, an FBI official told his superiors in a December 2003 e-mail that impersonation "tactics have produced no intelligence." The official added that these techniques actually "have destroyed any chance of prosecuting this detainee."
The FBI official added: "If this detainee is ever released or his story made public in any way, [Defense Department] interrogators will not be held accountable because these torture techniques were done [by] the 'FBI' interrogators. The FBI will be left holding the bag before the public."
Another FBI official, who worked in the bureau's counterterrorism division and was assigned to Guantanamo Bay, wrote in a July 2003 memo that military interrogators often interrupted efforts underway by FBI agents.
"Every time the FBI established a rapport with a detainee, the military would step in and the detainee would stop being cooperative," the FBI official wrote. "The military did not stop the interviews while they were in progress but routinely took control of the detainee when the interview was completed.
"The next time that detainee was interviewed, his level of cooperation was diminished," the official said.
Many agents assigned to Iraq and Cuba reported witnessing incidents of abuse by military units or civilian contractors.
In a June "urgent report" to the FBI director from the Sacramento field office, for example, a supervising special agent described abuses such as "strangulation, beatings, placement of lighted cigarettes into the detainees' ear openings and unauthorized interrogations."
The supervisor added that some military officials "were engaged in a cover-up of these abuses."
In other instances, a female prisoner "indicated she was hit with a stick," according to a memo from May 2003.
In July, Army criminal investigators were reviewing "the alleged rape of a juvenile male detainee at Abu Ghraib prison." It was not clear whether the incident was related to a previous report of a boy who was raped by a contractor.
Other agents gave more details of alleged abuses.
In a June instance, an agent from the Washington field office reported that an Abu Ghraib detainee complained he was cuffed and placed into an uncomfortable physical position that the military called "the Scorpion" hold. Then, the prisoner told the FBI, he was doused with cold water, dropped onto barbed wire, dragged by his feet and punched in the stomach.
An FBI official in a July 30 e-mail message described an incident at Guantanamo Bay that he found bothersome: "I saw a detainee sitting on the floor of the interview room with an Israeli flag draped around him, loud music being played and a strobe flashing."
He said the captive was in the custody of military officials at the time.
"Such techniques were not allowed nor approved by FBI policy," the agent wrote.
One FBI report said a Guantanamo Bay detainee in May 2002 was spat upon and then beaten when he tried to protect himself. At one point, soldiers apparently were "beating him and grabbed his head and beat it into the cell floor," knocking him unconscious, the report said.
Another agent reported in August that while in Cuba he often saw detainees chained hand and foot in a fetal position on the floor, "with no chair, food or water."
"Most times they had urinated or defecated on themselves, and had been left for 18 to 24 hours or more," the agent wrote.
Sometimes, he reported, the room was chilled to where a "barefooted detainee was shaking with cold."
Other times, he said, the air-conditioning was turned off and the temperature in the unventilated room rose to well over 100 degrees.
He said one detainee "was almost unconscious on the floor, with a pile of hair next to him. He had apparently been literally pulling his own hair out throughout the night."
The FBI documents also included a report of a prisoner in Cuba whose legs were injured and who said he had lied about being a terrorist out of fear that the U.S. military would otherwise have his legs amputated.
"He indicated he was injured severely and in a lot of pain," the FBI documents said, yet the prisoner constantly was being asked whether he had attended a terrorist camp in Afghanistan (news - web sites). The agent wrote that the prisoner "stated he wanted to receive decent medical treatment, and felt the only way to get it was to tell the Americans what they wanted to hear."
Last edited by RockSolid; 12-22-2004 at 03:32 AM.
12-22-2004, 03:29 AM #2
now before you complain about this, I would like to say this is not the message we want to send to people in the world or in Iraq that our armed forces represent.
and doing stuff like wrapping Israeli flags around the captures heads, will be such a beautiful recruitment tool for more terrorists and put MORE troops in danger. Totally totally bad move morally and strategically.
Imagine seeing this on Arab news channels, wrapping Israeli flags, wow.
12-22-2004, 05:07 AM #3
I will add a recent propaganda letter that has fueled fire in many rebels, and this letter is being blamed for the recent attack on the abu gharib prison cell this letter is so false yet the rebels belive it, this reinforces my point of the iraqi war going no where if ONE MADE UP LETTER can cause rebellion, we are going to be in Iraq forever.
In the name of God, the Merciful, the Mercy-giving. “Say He is God the One; God the Source [of everything]; Not has He fathered, nor has He been fathered; nor is anything comparable to Him.” [Qur’an, Surat 112 “al-Ikhlas”]
I chose this noble Surah from the Book of God because it has the greatest impact on me and on all of you and it strikes a particular kind of awe in the hearts of Believers.
My brother Mujahideen in the path of God! What can I say to you? I say to you: our wombs have been filled with the children of fornication by those sons of apes and pigs who raped us. Or I could tell you that they have defaced our bodies, spit in our faces, and tore up the little copies of the Qur’an that hung around our necks? God is greatest! Can you not comprehend our situation? Is it true that you do not know what is happening to us? We are your sisters. God will be calling you to account [about this] tomorrow.
By God, we have not passed one night since we have been in prison without one of the apes and pigs jumping down upon us to rip our bodies apart with his overweening lust. And we are the ones who had guarded our virginity out of fear of God. Fear God! Kill us along with them! Destroy us along with them! Don’t leave us here to let them get pleasure from raping us! It will be an act to ennoble the Throne of Almighty God. Fear God regarding us! Leave their tanks and aircraft outside. Come at us here in the prison of Abu Ghurayb.
I am your sister in God (Fatimah). They raped me on one day more than nine times. Can you comprehend? Imagine one of your sisters being raped. Why can’t you all imagine it, as I am your sister. With me are 13 girls, all unmarried. All have been raped before the eyes and ears of everyone.
They won’t let us pray. They took our clothes and won’t let us get dressed. As I write this letter one of the girls has committed suicide. She was savagely raped. A soldier hit her on her chest and thigh after raping her. He subjected her to unbelievable torture. She beat her head against the wall of the cell until she died, for she couldn’t take any more, even though suicide is forbidden in Islam. But I excuse that girl. I have hope that God will forgive her, because He is the Most Merciful of all.
Brothers, I tell you again, fear God! Kill us with them so that we might be at peace. Help! Help! Help! [Wa Mu'atasima!]
12-22-2004, 06:46 AM #4
Inna Lillah-e-wa Inna Ilaihay Rajioun !
12-22-2004, 07:36 AM #5
Terrorists do not come under the rules of the Geneva Convention. I have nothing to say good or bad Re: Their treatment.
The thing that those morons don't understand is every time something happens there will be more and more retaliation By the U.S. Armed forces. Fu*k with the bull you get the horns.
If you think for one minute that we will be pressured to leave by cowardice suicide bombings etc... you are wrong. We are the machine, we will not be deterred.
12-22-2004, 10:00 AM #6Originally Posted by 1victor
12-22-2004, 10:25 AM #7Originally Posted by 1victor
12-22-2004, 03:57 PM #8Originally Posted by Badgerman
12-22-2004, 03:58 PM #9Originally Posted by 1victor
ok so are you saying no rules apply to terrorists? so.. can we just torture them? how about kill them? drag them through the streets? is that ok if there are no rules?
12-22-2004, 04:46 PM #10
Rules to not apply to terrorists . PERIOD.
12-22-2004, 04:56 PM #11
Badger, see my avatar ? Know what that is? Know what The Four Horsemen Represent? I'm number 4. If I'm gonna play with the pigs I gotta git in the sh*T, no more mr nice guy on this crap.
Last edited by 1victor; 12-22-2004 at 04:59 PM.
12-22-2004, 05:04 PM #12Originally Posted by 1victor
Jesus' sayings are hard.......that's why so FEW will enter the kingdom
12-22-2004, 05:37 PM #13Originally Posted by Badgerman
12-23-2004, 07:47 AM #14
Badger , I think it's hilarious that you sit and pass judgement daily on people and preach to me on swine! You think you have earned your way in? ( you haven't) it's not earned. It is a gift from God. I doubt at all that you are a Christian, I doubt at all that you attend any services on a regular basis.
I honestly feel that you don't get it. It says in the Bible servants obey your masters. Deal with it. Bush is your master. Take the 60s crap and shove it. I took down Jesus because you and many others aren't capable of comprehending it's meaning and twist it to fit your purpose like all libs do. I am not a doormat and we as Christians are not compelled to be doormats. What faith are you, what denomination?
12-23-2004, 07:54 AM #15
BTW Zaab, you're a Muslim why are you approving Jesus as the Saviour?
12-23-2004, 08:34 AM #16Originally Posted by 1victor
12-23-2004, 08:37 AM #17
take take take from all the religions you want, beg, borrow and steal= The Muslim Religion. WHATEVER!
12-23-2004, 08:41 AM #18Originally Posted by 1victor
12-23-2004, 08:43 AM #19Originally Posted by 1victor
12-23-2004, 08:45 AM #20
Not jealousy .........pity. The crucifying of Christ was prophesied, they completed it. I don't hate them they are more our brothers than Muslims ever will be. And no you don't share the same respect and belief as a Christian, do not allign yourself with Christianity.
12-23-2004, 08:46 AM #21
That's a laugh, and a lie. In the end there will be 2 groups , evil ones Muslims will be one of the 2.
12-23-2004, 08:46 AM #22Originally Posted by 1victor
ally with anyone u want specially ones who dont share the same beliefs as u , but the fact of life is there are always 2 Liars allied against 1 true speaker !
12-23-2004, 08:48 AM #23
I'm solid , no worries. Take what you want from all the religions of the world you will not enter except thorugh the Savior Jesus.
12-23-2004, 08:50 AM #24
I have been tolerant to this point . I won't sit here and watch you convert disillusioned Catholic tell lies about your religion.
12-23-2004, 08:50 AM #25
nuff said this is done for me.
12-23-2004, 10:29 AM #26
Let's see......the fruits of the Spirit......love joy PEACE patience kindness, goodness,gentleness, self-control, etc..........
works of the flesh......can you name them??
12-23-2004, 10:31 AM #27
Badger, practice what you preach brother.
12-23-2004, 10:42 AM #28
Badger.......... perplexed? Spit it out!
12-23-2004, 10:43 AM #29Originally Posted by 1victor
"Many will say to to me Lord Lord........."
The true message of Jesus scares you doesn't it??.......that's ok......everything will work out according to God's purpose.....
My personal belief is that GW is not a Christian.......he loves money and power more than God.....and uses his supposed beliefs to advance his career........he can take our money but he can't take our souls.
And when he asks you to kill for him......that goes against God's law to love your neighbor as yourself......
So go ahead and be GW's tool for destruction......you'd make a good ROMAN catholic
12-24-2004, 05:33 AM #30Originally Posted by 1victor
12-24-2004, 05:36 AM #31Originally Posted by 1victor
Who are polytheists beliving in the trinity, and idol worshippers who pray to idols
Unitarian christians got the right idea, they rest of you, have made a deep left from the straight path.
12-24-2004, 05:37 AM #32Originally Posted by 1victor
12-24-2004, 05:40 AM #33Originally Posted by Badgerman
I see some true Christian preachers today, who spread the message of Jesus a good preacher is the preacher from a large texas church, Joel Osteen he has the right idea. The rest are wannabe Christians that claim to be christian but do the work of evil.
12-24-2004, 05:48 AM #34Originally Posted by RockSolid
12-24-2004, 05:53 AM #35Originally Posted by ZOAIB
the tough guy ones are more politicalically motivated than religiously. Like extremist muslims, they use religion to futher many of their bad causes.
and it is the zionist that speaks in their ears telling them to be harsh against muslims because "that is the only language they (muslims) understand)
12-24-2004, 08:33 AM #36
ZOOBOY- Labels...............born again Muslim jackass. No I'm tired or you guys talking smack about my country, my President, our brave military and my religion.
God needs warriors too , defenders of the faith. I believe in the entire Bible not pieces of it. The old and New Testament. So you Muslims can find somewhere else to talk sh*t. Badger, you don't even workout, you're here strictly to cause trouble.
12-24-2004, 08:42 AM #37
Now you are Jew Bashing too? Rock who don't you hate and find hyprocitical?
12-24-2004, 01:15 PM #38Originally Posted by 1victor
12-24-2004, 01:47 PM #39Originally Posted by 1victor
12-25-2004, 05:05 PM #40
That's complete bullsh*t and you know it. You post anti-American threads all the time get the f*uck out of the country. Leave!!!!! Go........ you will not be missed. I was tolerant and have been tolerant but I said F*uck it you can't deal with animals on a humane level. Two faced back stabbers probably have American friends and "play" like you love this country. I 'm sick of it. I am not Jesus nor did I say I was I tried to be an Ambassador for my religion and failed because of typical terorist tactics on your part.
You guys lull me, or anyone else into a stuper and then spit out your banter as you please. As stated above I believe in my religion there are two books the Old and New testament. So if you think I or every other Christian has to take crap to prove we are Christians you are wrong, YOU people always try to use that against us. See my avatar it represents another aspect of my religion. I'm done trying to kiss butt to make you understand. You don't, you won't..........so I will no longer try. I am a Warrior For my God and I serve Jesus Christ.
Are you saying all the American Christian soldiers that have lived and died are in hell? Hypocrits? Are you saying our brave Christian women and men over in the middleast now are liars and hypocrits? I don't like your types, I am not perfect. Never claimed to be. I am not Jesus , never said I was. I am a person of conviction which is more than I can say for your lot. Backstabbing liars. Can you actually read and understand Arabic ? Or are you one of those Muslims that talks the talk but doesn't walk the walk?
Do you drink alcohol? Have you commited adultery or other sins? What is your repentance, what was your payment? NOTHING! Because you are an American that want's to be a Middleastern Muslim.
As far as a midlife crisis I just turned 39 asshole. That happens in the 50s. As far as born again I was raised in church left and came back. The fact that I am Passionate and defendant of my religion in your mind is ludicrus. At least I don't believe in terrorism or killing innocent people, which you condone. If you say you don't you are a liar.
I have a new Avatar it represents the Four Horsemen, part of my faith. I have chosen to align myself with the fourth at least as far as you are concerned. Read up on it.
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