02-24-2005, 11:59 AM #1
I was wondering where people stand on Predestination vs. Free Will. This is an issue to debate and not divide as Christians.
Note: If any one wants to expand there knowledge on phliosophy and theology, then check out Dr. Ravi Zacharias. He is incredible. WWW.RZIM.COM goto radio archives. He has been a blessing for me.
02-24-2005, 12:07 PM #2
Muslims believe in Al-Qadar, which is Divine Predestination, but this belief in Divine Predestination does not mean that human beings do not have freewill. Rather, Muslims believe that God has given human beings freewill. This means that they can choose right or wrong and that they are responsible for their choices.
The belief in Divine Predestination includes belief in four things: 1) God knows everything. He knows what has happened and what will happen. 2) God has recorded all that has happened and all that will happen. 3) Whatever God wills to happen happens, and whatever He wills not to happen does not happen. 4) God is the Creator of everything.
02-24-2005, 12:11 PM #3Originally Posted by CAUSASIAN
02-24-2005, 12:13 PM #4
Wouldnt that exclude free will.
02-24-2005, 12:31 PM #5
I believe we have free will, but God can intervene.
02-24-2005, 04:12 PM #6
I believe free will and predesdination coexist.
02-24-2005, 04:28 PM #7
whats your definition of predestination? Because it can SEEM we are predestined....in fact, somewhere in the bible it says that we were chosen before we were born to be in heaven or hell..BUT is it really a predestination, or is it the fact that God is all-knowing and because of this, he knows before we are born that we will be his follower or not, thus he could write your name down before creation as you will be in heaven, but that is not a predestination, more than all-knowing.
02-24-2005, 05:35 PM #8
God ''predestined us to be adopted as his sons through Jesus Christ, in accordance with his pleasure with his pleasure and free will.'' Also, ''he made known to us the mystery of his will according to his good pleasure, which he purposed in Christ....'' Again, ''In him we were also chosen, haveing been predestined according to the plan of him who works out every thing in conformity with purpose of his will..."
02-24-2005, 06:01 PM #9
predestination could become a long topic, which I dont mind. And I know of this verse, not exactly where it was, but I knew the bible made this point. I dont know that it means what we see it says in english though. It may. But something i want to study and talk about, here and to my pastor and such. My thoughts on predestination. Its no secret that God wants that all to become followers and all to be with Him in heaven. If it is true that God wants us all to be with him, Why would he predestine some of us to be born to go to hell without choice? If we are predestined for heaven or hell, in the true sense of predestination, then yes we have free will, but uncapable of exercising that free will to the fullest and actually decide to follow God or not.
02-24-2005, 07:10 PM #10
Im not a calvinist. I was just throwing that out there.
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