Thread: Why do Satanists...
09-16-2005, 11:19 AM #1
Why do Satanists...
Why do Satanists claim there is no God yet worships, has rituals and ceremonies for Satan?
09-16-2005, 11:27 AM #2Originally Posted by Mesomorphyl
09-16-2005, 11:29 AM #3Originally Posted by BeerBaron
09-16-2005, 11:35 AM #4Originally Posted by Mesomorphyl
In Satanism, Satan is an archetype, a representation of certain qualities that the Satanist embodies including rational self-interest, avoidance of oppressive mentalities, the questioning of all, and a perseverance towards success and human potential. The Satanic Bible encapsulates this iconography in The Nine Satanic Statements, which are thus:
1) Satan represents indulgence, instead of abstinence!
2) Satan represents vital existence, instead of spiritual pipe dreams!
3) Satan represents undefiled wisdom, instead of hypocritical self-deceit!
4) Satan represents kindness to those who deserve it, instead of love wasted on ingrates!
5) Satan represents vengeance, instead of turning the other cheek!
6) Satan represents responsibility to the responsible, instead of concern for psychic vampires!
7) Satan represents man as just another animal, sometimes better, more often worse than those that walk on all-fours, who, because of his divine spiritual and intellectual development, has become the most vicious animal of all!
8) Satan represents all of the so-called sins, as they all lead to physical, mental, or emotional gratification!
9) Satan has been the best friend the church has ever had, as he has kept it in business all these years! Inherently, the Satanic archetype is far more diverse than the limited Christian interpretation -- the name/word is notably pre-Christian: from the Hebrew, meaning "adversary", "opposer" or "one who questions" (and the Jewish 'Satan' differs sharply from the Christian one in many ways). Even its etymology is traced back through sources previous to its Hebrew version, from Shaitan (Persian) all the way back to Set (Egyptian). Satanism, to one degree or another, embraces additional cultural and religious ideas, concepts and imagery such as those of ancient Rome and ancient Greece, Zoroasterism, Asatru, Aztec, Hindu and a multitude of others. We also find the Satanic persona emanating from some or all of the literary works of Milton, Nietzsche, Mencken, Maugham, Twain, Rand, Jung, and many more.
What is the difference between Satanism and devil worship?
Satanism and devil worship are two distinctly different animals. Devil worship is what it is: the worship of an external deity (in this case, a "devil"), much as it could be labeled inverse Christianity -- that is, confining yourself to the Christian religion and overall model, but merely choosing the "bad guy" in their Bible instead of the purportedly central character. The Satan in Satanism is an archetype, one many know by name and is relative to the culture. Some Satanists choose different aspects of this archetype, depending on geography or just plain aesthetics, but the same characteristics still hold true. It would make little sense for us to claim to embody the archetypal qualities of Satan (rebellion, rational self-interest, carnality, etc.) on one hand, and then attempt to worship an anthropomorphic Satan on the other. In laymen's terms, it's hardly rebellious to worship a figure that represents rebellion. The Satanist finds unproductive and one-sided idol worship to be draining and useless (not to mention hypocritical). Much of this is aptly mentioned in The Satanic Bible and the other books listed in the Satanism section of this website.
If you don't believe in an actual Satan, then why do you say 'Hail Satan' in texts and rituals?
In addition to what is stated before considering how we contextualize Satan, this is my take on this fairly common question:
1) "Hail Satan!" (the exclamation point is optional, though preferred) is often another way of saying "Hail Me!" Since we Satanists embody the qualities of the archetype of Satan, it stands to reason that the phrase is both apropos and analogous. You very well could say "Hail Me!" instead, but keep in mind this... 2) "Hail Satan!" is also a salute to our achievements (both collective and, more importantly, individual), ethics, and heritage. It is a statement of pride in defiance of a polyglot, egalitarian, and ignorant way of life represented by the nauseating Christ ethos and its followers. If we have signed any pact with Satan, it is this.
09-16-2005, 11:37 AM #5
09-16-2005, 11:47 AM #6Originally Posted by chino777
Why not just be an atheist or are satanist atheists?
09-16-2005, 12:05 PM #7Originally Posted by Mesomorphyl
09-16-2005, 12:05 PM #8
.. thats exactly what i asked myself as i read their theory. It is complety illogical to call their ritual places church and their kind of belief "satan" if they are just atheists.
Some time ago i talk to a satanist and he told me that the word "satan" it is just a symbol that is grown out of the antipathy to christian religion.
And as IronFreak said, there is a difference between satanism and devil worship ...
09-16-2005, 12:11 PM #9Originally Posted by chino777
09-16-2005, 12:14 PM #10Originally Posted by godkilla
09-16-2005, 12:27 PM #11Originally Posted by Mesomorphyl
The concept of Satan has evolved over the centuries, as has Satanism.
Originally in Judeo-Christian traditions, Satan was seen as a part of creation, embodying the principle that one could choose contrary to Gods wishes, and thus empowering the potential for freewill and defiance. (In this context an ancient Jewish commentary notes that only when the potential to contravene Gods will arose, could creation become "very good" as opposed to merely "good"). Over the centuries this concept of Satan came to embody all that was evil and against God, a change attributable to two main influences:
* The view that everything had its opposite, and that God, all-good, must have His opposing deity too (many preceding multiple deity religions also had their evil gods as well as good gods, Set of the Ancient Egyptians being one example),
* The spreading of Christianity, followed by Islam, both religions which gained a wide number of adherents, which placed a high premium on salvation and the afterlife, and within which Satan grew as an embodiment of all that was trying to undermine God in this theological world-view.
complete source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satanism
09-16-2005, 01:51 PM #12Originally Posted by IronFreakX
Your a weird mutha fuka when you start talking about this stuff.
09-16-2005, 02:02 PM #13Banned
Originally Posted by roidattack
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09-16-2005, 02:17 PM #14
.. why should it be bad to talk/discuss/know about other religions?
You never know enough and to that belongs the knowledge of what other religions are about.
09-16-2005, 02:29 PM #15Originally Posted by chino777
09-16-2005, 03:03 PM #16Originally Posted by chino777
btw if there was a hell, we would all be going there anyways.
"in hell i burn, my faith is sustained." G.B.
09-16-2005, 04:40 PM #17Banned
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btw if there was a hell, we would all be going there anyways.
Not a chance bro. I make mistakes- but I still believe in the Lord Jesus Christ.
I have seen people healed and exorcised of demons. Satan is very real. Don't kid yourselves.
09-16-2005, 04:43 PM #18Banned
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The greatest way to deceive your enemy is to make him think you do not exist.
09-16-2005, 04:50 PM #19
09-16-2005, 07:43 PM #20Originally Posted by 3Vandoo
09-17-2005, 02:04 AM #21
i find most (if not all) of the "9 rules" ridiculous and illogical because they assume that people cant change.
example: Satan represents kindness to those who deserve it, instead of love wasted on ingrates!
Ive personally seen where my kindness has affected those who "may not deserve it" and made them more "deserving" then a lot of other kind people that satanist would believe worthy. im sure others have too. the thing is, satanist are egotistical and only interrested in what makes them happy. you can see by their rules. anyone who would want to live a life according to this truly must have had a bad childhood (imo) and are trying to latch on to the one thing they think they can trust...themselves, governed by the devil (i know you say satan isnt a part of satanism, but hes still behind it). its sad.
09-17-2005, 03:11 AM #22
... well, everbody acts egoistical and everybody is only interessted in what makes him happy, even if you help someone who can't get it alone you are acting egoistical because you think its right and it makes you fell better/good.
No one is doing anything without a reason ...
As i take it satanism wants you to be responsible for all what you are doing and for your destiny. They say everything is up to you and not up to someone else (god included).
That is a point of view several religions include (taoism for example ...), that's why these thoughts are not new, LaVey only used them in a new way (perhabs to show his antipathy to christianity ... i don't know ).
09-17-2005, 03:54 AM #23
i disagree chino. whether you are meaning to or not, i believe you are twisting reasoning into how you believe. just because something may or may not have good side effects doesnt mean thats the reason for doing the main effect. I dont do good for someone just because it makes me feel good and a lot of times i do someone good, help with something, etc because they are a friend and i totally do not enjoy doing the actual job and get no satisfaction out of it in the end. example...i hate moving. my friend moved and he asked me to help. i didnt like doing the job. and after it was all done, i didnt get a good tingly feeling because i helped him. i still hated it. yet i did it because hes a friend.
09-17-2005, 04:37 AM #24Originally Posted by Mesomorphyl
I think you bring up a good point.
09-17-2005, 04:41 AM #25Originally Posted by chino777
-Satanism is self centered. ie. 666 of man for man by man
-Satanism does not ask you to be responsible "do what thou wilt"
09-17-2005, 04:44 AM #26Originally Posted by godkilla
I respect you Killa but disagee harshly with your statement.
09-17-2005, 04:51 AM #27
Have you ever wondered why the apostles did not go the easy way out IE. Christ said He would spiritualy rise from the dead. Instead, they went the hard way claiming a physical ressurection. All that was needed to disprove christianity was the body. Liberal scholars have attempted to come up with solutions, unfortunatly all have been unviersally rejected. Think about it. It would have made life much easier for the apostles.
09-17-2005, 07:47 AM #28
@ max2extreme: I know what you want to say, perhabs it is just hairsplitting.
(imo) helping other people based on your own religious convictions is egoistica too cause you do it because of thinking that its right to do so ..
Beeing egoistic don't excludes beeing helpfull and nice it depends on what your goals are. If i help other people it makes me feel good inside even if i help someone moving ( i hate that too ).
I'm not a satanist and i'm not a chrisitian either but i respect all kind of religion cause i belief every religion has its own reasons why people are willing to belief in it.
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