11-05-2005, 10:20 PM #1
Noah's Ark found in Mt. Ararat / Turkey
This is old news, but I would like to know what you all think of this. Does this make you believe more or less. The Turkish military won't let anyone within 30 miles of the vicinity, and they blocked off the places where you could use a telescope to see it from 30 miles away. Just curious on opinions because I am very confused with Christianity and don't know to be a believer or not. All opinions are open.
11-05-2005, 11:20 PM #2
I would like to see that if really prooved that it has more than 6000 years then I
think I owuld change my mind over religious thoughts. I would also like to see
"something" from all the military men who died in the Red Sea when Moses passed
thru it with all those people to the promised land, I would like to see those kind of
material proof so I would believe more in what is written in the Holy Bible.
11-06-2005, 04:46 AM #3
I have learned from religious men to take stories in the old and new testament as symbolic. This doesn't take away from the belief in G-d or great men. Symbolism can actually help us understand things that might otherwise be beyond our comprehension. As a Jew, I do not believe that Moses parted the sea with his cane. Rather, it is a act of written symbolism to help us understand G-d's great power in aiding the Hebrews out of Egypt. As for Noah's Ark...again symbolism. The story of a great global and catastrophic flood has roots that go futher back than the Torah. Who knows? It could be about helping man understand the importance of nature. All of this doesn't matter. It, in no way, takes away from the belief in G-d...no matter who you pray to.
11-06-2005, 05:41 AM #4
so aiz, since this is what you believe, what happens if the arc is uncovered? or evidence leads to the fact that the red sea was parted? would your beliefs change about the bible "stories" or would you blow off the evidence and stick to your beliefs you have now?
11-06-2005, 05:56 AM #5Originally Posted by max2extreme
11-06-2005, 09:21 AM #6
Christians should be glad they arent allowed yo examine the alleged arc. The story is so impossible, finding the actual arc would disprove the story beyond the shadow of a doubt.
11-06-2005, 02:10 PM #7Originally Posted by BeerBaron
11-06-2005, 03:12 PM #8Originally Posted by inspector_injector
What did I post that doesn't make sense, I'd be happy to clarify it for you. your remarks really come off as juvenile to me.... i mean, "are you afraid of people knowing who you are".... grow the fvck up and get real. I said I believe your thread asking poeple about their personal standings will only serve to further kill objectivity in this forum. we have a few extremists on here who already hold grudges and apply personal bias based on things like religion, race, sexual preference, ect. You are trying to get poeple to label them selves a definite position, when no one should bind them selves to such a dangerous thing. I believe in logic and reason, not predetermined positions. How's that for open minded.
11-06-2005, 03:27 PM #9
Very interesting topics, thanks inspector_injector.
I have found this article and thought it is worth to read.
Noah's Ark Found? Turkey Expedition Planned for Summer
for National Geographic News
April 27, 2004
Satellite pictures taken last summer of Mount Ararat in Turkey may reveal the final resting place of Noah's ark, according to Daniel McGivern, the businessman and Christian activist behind a planned summer 2004 expedition to investigate the site.
"We're telling people we're 98 percent sure," said McGivern, a member of the Hawaii Christian Coalition. "In one image we saw the beams, saw the wood. I'm convinced that the excavation of the object and the results of tests run on any collected samples will prove that it is Noah's ark. "
McGivern wrote a list in his Bible more than 20 years ago of ten great projects. Finding Noah's ark was at the top of his list.
McGivern began his quest in earnest in 1995, when the publication of a book on the topic moved him to arrange for satellite images to be taken of Mount Ararat.
Attempts to take satellite images in previous years had been foiled by clouds, unavailability of imaging equipment, and lack of image resolution. But the attempts had helped pinpoint the location. In the summer of 2003, everything came together.
"Last year was the hottest summer in Europe since 1500; more than 21,000 people died of the heat wave," McGivern said. "The summer melt was far more extensive than it has been in years."
DigitalGlobe, a commercial satellite-imagery company, confirmed that they took the images that McGivern is using.
An international team of archaeologists, forensic scientists, geologists, glaciologists, and others is being recruited to investigate the site sometime between July 15 and August 15.
Ahmet Arslan, a professor in Turkey who has climbed the mountain 50 times in 40 years, will lead the expedition. Arslan reported an eyewitness sighting of the ark and took a photograph in 1989 from about 220 yards (200 meters) away. However, he couldn't get any closer, and the picture is not definitive.
"We hope to assemble what we're calling the Dream Team," Arslan said. "The slopes are very, very harsh and dangerous on the northern face—it is extremely challenging, mentally and physically."
The story of Noah's ark is told in the Book of Genesis. It says God saw how corrupt the Earth had become and decided to "bring floodwaters on the Earth to destroy all life under the heavens." God is said to have told Noah, an honorable man, to build an ark 450 feet (137 meters) long, 75 feet (23 meters) wide, and 45 feet (14 meters) high, and fill it with two of every species on the Earth. It reportedly rained for 40 days and 40 nights. After about seven months, the waters receded, and the ark came to rest, according to the Bible.
Three major world religions—Christianity, Judaism, and Islam—believe in Noah and his ark. Reports of ark sightings have been numerous. Witnesses often describe an old wooden structure sticking out of the snow and ice near the summit of Mount Ararat.
Despite the numerous sightings and rumors—of pictures taken by the CIA and locked in vaults, of lost photographs taken by a Russian expedition at the behest of Tsar Nicholas Alexander in 1918—no scientific evidence of the ark has emerged.
"On the one hand, I'm hopeful. On the other hand, I'm very skeptical" of the validity of the satellite images, said Rex Geissler, president of ArcImaging (Archaeological Imaging Research Consortium). "There is no publicly available picture that readily shows a man-made object that has any clarity whatsoever … Some of the photos are outright misrepresentations, non-scientific, and do not prove anything.
"We think that with the hundreds of explorers who have visited the region, if the ark was jutting out of the ice, it would be obvious."
ArcImaging was the first organization to receive permission from the Turkish government to survey the mountain since 1981. The archaeological research organization conducted a preliminary investigation of the icecap using ground-penetrating radar in 2001.
The Search Continues
The Bible states that Noah landed in the region of the ancient kingdom Urartu. Mount Ararat (its name probably a corrupted version of Urartu) has been the focus of those seeking the ark because it—at 17,000 feet (5,165 meters)—is the highest point in the area.
A volcanic mountain, Ararat is covered by an icecap from 14,000 feet (4,300 meters) to 17,000 feet (5,200 meters). The icecap is about 17 square miles (44 square kilometers) in size and is as deep as 300 feet (90 meters).
Known to locals as Agri Dagi—Turkish for "mountain of pain"— Ararat is not easy to access. Located in eastern Turkey—close to the borders of Armenia and Iran, and only 150 miles (240 kilometers) from Iraq—the region is politically volatile and often dangerous. Much of the region is part of a military zone, and getting permission to explore it is extremely difficult.
The ArcImaging team hopes to visit the region to continue their mapping of the icecap this summer.
McGivern is optimistic his group will also be on the face of the mountain this summer. He and Arslan met last week with the Turkish ambassador to the U.S. Arslan, who at one time worked in the Turkish prime minister's office, plans to meet with the prime minister next week.
"The ark is broken into a minimum of three pieces, up to six, from a huge earthquake that occurred in 1840. But it's been miraculously preserved. The satellite imagery shows vertical beams, and one horizontal beam," McGivern said.
11-06-2005, 03:59 PM #10
Very Good post Alex. I found that very interesting. My dad was telling me that the Turksih Military and government are not letting people investigate it for one reason...
"It will change the world once it is openly shown to the public." A lot would change and the world wouldn't be ready for such a change.
11-06-2005, 04:04 PM #11Originally Posted by BeerBaron
Second, by not telling your status, you are a nobody, a nothing and a worthless creature to life.
My dad was telling me a story one time, when he was in Turkey he watched a man get pulled over by the police. The police asked him "Are you on our side or are you with the terrorists?" The man said... "I'm on neither side, I'm with no one." The police beat the sh*t out of him. Reason being, you have to be something, if you weren't, you simply wouldn't exist or would cease to exist. Let's try not to flame eachother anymore. But I doubt it would cause more trouble if we openly knew the people who we are talking to. I also wanted to say thank you to the people who did post their political status. It truly shows that they have nothing to hide. Not that I'm saying you are beerbaron, but I'm confused as to why not tell us?
11-06-2005, 04:38 PM #12Originally Posted by inspector_injector
11-06-2005, 08:31 PM #13Originally Posted by BeerBaron
11-06-2005, 08:42 PM #14Originally Posted by inspector_injector
Second, by not telling your status, you are a nobody, a nothing and a worthless creature to life.
11-06-2005, 10:28 PM #15
I believe the genesis story of the flood to be literal. I dont believe we have any hard evidence that the ark is still in existence today. There is not enough evidence (today) to build a good inductive arguement (the premises show the conclusion to be more probable than other competing arguements) for the arc.
11-07-2005, 07:51 PM #16
So then what do you think it is books??? They showed on tv that they used equipment to measure it and it equates to the measurements that is was to be built in the bible? I personally have read most of the bible and have never seen actually hard copy specs for what the measurements of the arc should be. But I remember everyone saying it's in there?
11-07-2005, 08:18 PM #17Originally Posted by inspector_injector
11-08-2005, 04:17 PM #18Originally Posted by inspector_injector
It could be, the problem is lack of hard evidence. The evidence we have would not hold up in court. I find it interesting, but not yet compelling.
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