Thread: A New World (no more USA)
12-29-2005, 11:29 AM #1
A New World (no more USA)
This is addressed to people against the USA's military actions abroad... or think we are "terrorist" acting unfairly and too aggressive with other nations...
What if there was no USA? Is it possibly the strongest, most influencial country in the World right now (an American passport can probably get you more places in the World than any other counrty's travel documents) - so what if there was no longer any involvement by the USA?
Lets say nukes fell - the American super power was at the mercy of foreign invaders. They lost their stronghold. Terrorists won, basically. Or foreign Army's dismanteled our military and we had no protection or could offer no further involvement...
What then? Would there be order in the World? Would everyone just get along?
Times change, "empires" change - what is after the American influence if we allowed terrorist to manipulate our security and break or borders? Who would be the new major policy maker or big brother?
IMO - this would be a scary new World...
12-29-2005, 12:17 PM #2
the US military doctrine is mutual destruction that comes from the cold world, the US fell, the nukes will fly accross the world.
same NATO doctrine if the third world rise against the west, nuke to take them out
12-29-2005, 12:18 PM #3Originally Posted by Warrior
12-29-2005, 12:54 PM #4
That will be damn horrible! I can't imagine Japan or China as the sole superpower in the world!
If we go back to the history, we'll find that the world was never as stable as now.
12-29-2005, 01:34 PM #5Originally Posted by Warrior
thats what the ROMANS thought too ................. there is always another great empire waiting to take the role , USA isnt the only genious society ever born , history is repetitive and so will this era move on and a new begining will arise !
12-29-2005, 01:58 PM #6
I'm interested to hear Causasians view on this issue...
Personally, I'd be perfectly content to keep our noses out of everyone elses business, and focus our resources on our own citizens. Im all for looking out for the best interests of our own people before looking out for anyone else. What I think is most interesting about American society is that a majority of the people have no grasp on politics or world issues, or really give a shit either. We are pretty much consumed with our own lives within the USA, and are pretty ignorant to any goings on outside of it. We dont realize the fragile line that our country is always sitting on, and that nothing lasts forever. I made a post similar to this recently, citing the fall of Rome as one of the biggest indictators that the USA's reign will not be eternal.
There are really only a few instances when I think we should risk our own peoples lives in order to help anyone else. Most noteably is genocide. I know at one point we vowed to never let it happen again, however we have let it go on in Rawanda since the 1990s, and have yet to interevene. It's sad because they are slaughtering people over there, but they offer no return on an investment to help them, they're not an industrialized nation, and they dont have oil, so basically they're ****ed.
When, not IF, the USA falls, I forsee at LEAST a few hundred years of absolute chaos. All the third world nations looking to achieve their personal agendas will jump at the opportunity of the USA falling. If China is still in tact, Im sure they will be the first one to start making major moves. Honestly, if the USA does fall while Im still alive, or any of my children, I pray to god that they launch their entire nuclear arsenal and end the world, because a world run by China or a 3rd world nation, is a world Id rather see covered in a clowd of nuclear waste for 3 years straight.
12-29-2005, 03:07 PM #7Originally Posted by thegodfather
12-29-2005, 03:10 PM #8
well, if that happened.. and i survived the 1st and 2nd wave.. we would be on my wife's family farm..
us and 4 other families.. the house is protected, with outbuildings, with fields and a long road...easily defended..
long distance shooting with 300 weatherby mag rifles
and claymore mines up close..
if we run out of food... we'll take your's.. just the way it is..The answer to your every question
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12-29-2005, 03:29 PM #9Originally Posted by spywizard
12-29-2005, 03:34 PM #10
And who is the only one to ever use nukes to kill civilians......
and who contributed the greatest to an arms race........
and who destabilized Russia to give US nuke security issues......
12-29-2005, 03:37 PM #11
First we were paranoid about the communists.......now we are scared of Islam
US hates the oppressed.....people with nothing have nothing to lose......
therefore the US can not control these people.......they have no house to lose.....no DirectTV....no fancy cars........no airplane......
No possessions=no control
That's why a capitalist is so fearful of people who have no regard for money.
12-29-2005, 03:37 PM #12Originally Posted by Badgerman
We just so happend to be the first ones to develop our nuclear technology and use it, if we hadn't done it, someone else would have.
12-29-2005, 03:43 PM #13Originally Posted by Badgerman
12-29-2005, 03:47 PM #14
i do think that if the US fell, a huge chaos will occur all over the world, specially in the middle east region. the existance of the US in the middle east is like the safety valve.
plus lots of countries will suffer real sharp economical decline since they depend on the US AID to balance their national economy.
12-29-2005, 03:49 PM #15Originally Posted by Badgerman
u r way off bro. these ppl got enough money to raise a whole new country out of nothing.
12-29-2005, 03:50 PM #16Originally Posted by Warrior
the Saudi Royal Family sits on Trillions of $'s
12-29-2005, 03:55 PM #17
at my school i've been seeing some students giving hand outs about some one called La Rouche, and they were saying something like this:
the NWO's are pushing for a 3rd world war to break down in the middle east where Jesus is going to come back and......etc and then Chrisitans will go to heaven.
i've been hearing these students talking alot about that, does anyone know wt's up with that?
12-29-2005, 04:07 PM #18Originally Posted by Warrior
12-29-2005, 04:14 PM #19Originally Posted by Badgerman
12-29-2005, 04:21 PM #20
Interesting question... because if you think about it the USA is the new kid on the block. I'd have to guess that 90% of the other countries have been around longer than the USA, so how did they get along before we showed up... and more importantly how would they get along after we are gone considering the impact our technology has had on the world and it's cultures?
12-29-2005, 04:42 PM #21Originally Posted by Badgerman
12-29-2005, 06:17 PM #22New Member
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forget about crazy nuke scenarios..if America continues it's fanatical policy of occupying iraq and militarism-she will go bankrupt and then the American economy will fail when millions of workers are thrown off there defense industry/military jobs and the economy goes into a downward spiral..then the central government in WDC will be resented and useless to the point of political collapse..then states will start doing there own thing and the USA will be gone like the Soviet Union becoming the irrelivant "CIS"
12-29-2005, 08:09 PM #23Originally Posted by jajabinks
The biggest fear of our government is a rebellion of the working class......
when the 30-50 year old males tell the government to take a hike......
no one to fuel ol' Georges 747.......
12-29-2005, 08:47 PM #24
confusedOriginally Posted by Badgerman
12-29-2005, 09:19 PM #25
The US wont fall all of a sudden in a day, it will be gradual. It will be like Britian of today, who were the world superpower, but is now a major player, but not a superpower.
12-29-2005, 09:20 PM #26Originally Posted by thegodfather
12-29-2005, 09:47 PM #27Originally Posted by Logan13
the anti-government gun toters are very much RIGHT wing......
and hate to see the fiscal disaster the supposed conservative Bush has created.......
Disaster STRENGTHENS the economy by stimulating jobs.......assuming the dollars aren't siphoned by the greedy.
Fraud by companies such as Halliburton suck the life out of the American taxpayer
12-29-2005, 11:56 PM #28Originally Posted by CAUSASIAN
12-30-2005, 12:54 AM #29Originally Posted by Badgerman
But the poor Muslims can get easily suckered into milita groups by offering them money and a generally richer lifestyle in the name of Allah (recruiting a desperate man in a mosk is not unheard of)... at first to run a few documents, then they find themselves behind a rifle. But desperate people act the same - regardless of race or religion...
12-30-2005, 01:44 AM #30New Member
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the IMF has stated that the american economy is strong but dependant on 'unprecidented' borrowing from foreign sources..most of the foreign aid money the US govt sends abroad actually goes to US companies via ngo's-they provide american product/services to thses countries, and the govt is lobbied by these interests..the money the US govt borrows is used to fund the military & defense contractors-it's very labor intensive..coming off this system is difficult.
Originally Posted by Logan13
12-30-2005, 01:57 AM #31Retired Vet
Originally Posted by AIZ
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But if I can use the former Yugoslavia as an example of America standing by when it should have intervened at a very early stage.
America spents BILLIONS of dollars on its military in central Europe with the justification that it was going to fight WWIII in the Rhine. It had the resourses on Yugoslavia's door step to totally annililate that country but sat by and let it rip itself apart, because it didn't suit America's needs. Shamefull.
If it wants to be the worlds policeman, so be it. But don't sit around eating donuts when your 'on call'.
But I'll also give credit where its due. Somalia!. I credit America and the UN with bringing famine there to an end. Its just a pity you had a president and a country which hadn't the belly for a good fight to really turn that country around.
12-30-2005, 02:58 AM #32
The problem is the American military is only so big - if you keep spreading yourself thin by going abroad... it leaves you too vulnerable at home. Being a World's 911 force "on call" has to be kept within reason...
There a re A LOT of reservists going to Iraq and various commands in the AOR. American forces can be on call - but ioften they need to be regrouping back home. The sh!t costs money... and I don't understand where we are gettnig it from...
It would be nice if NATO and the American forces could better integrate/consolidate their troops, equipment and manpower - but there are simply too many language, cultural and political barriers... and too many politicians to please...
The state the World is in now will eventually come to an end... hopefully all the people in the World could hold it together... but technology is a double-edged sword. The faster it develops the more uncertain our futures become. Like the possibilities molecular nanotechnology could introduce - were basic laws of physics becomes the only barrier to what could be created....
12-30-2005, 04:27 AM #33Retired Vet
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Warrior, honest do you think America needs to bring in the draft to win the war in Iraq?.
12-30-2005, 04:48 AM #34Originally Posted by BOUNCER
And its my opinion that the heavy use of reservist in Iraq has more than doubled our combat-ready military. Reservist used to be guys, "just wanting some money for college," but today - I doubt any of them believe a recruiter that says, "you'll never go to War in the reserves!". Reservist are playing a huge part today - and now we have a huge reserve component that is combat experienced - a much diffferent situation prior to all this. Add that to our experienced active duty and we are still good to go. If someone else, like North Korea or China want to play ball - well, then its probably heading that direction. I remember several years back, a lot of analyst were predicting problems with those two countries because of overlapping stressors that make them desperate enough for war... as well as the known nukes and espionage...
12-30-2005, 05:33 AM #35Originally Posted by ripped4fsu
12-30-2005, 05:37 AM #36Originally Posted by thegodfather
Sooner or later chinas people will demand a change to the way that country is run so I dont think a world run by china would be horrible. Maby for a while but not for ever.
Not quite sure what you mean with run though. Its not like china has any resonable chanse to defeate both russia and europe by any stretch of imagination and if they just pic of some poor asian countries they wont run anything but its neighboors.
12-30-2005, 05:41 AM #37
I dont think any big nation in the world today is crazy enough to start a major war. No matter if the usa is here or not.
There is just no point in conquest today, not when the existance of a country can be erased by the push of a few buttons.
I dont think the world will ever se a traditional war like ww1 or ww2 again.
If it ever escalates into a conflict betwen the major players the war will be over within a few days.
12-30-2005, 10:38 AM #38Originally Posted by johan
12-30-2005, 11:07 AM #39Originally Posted by thegodfather
Chinease have been probing us for a long time (all theway into the CIA!)... now they have one of the fastest growing economies in the World - and have yet to float their currency. Isn't it funny how you rarely chat with a China man on these boards? And the only expat Chinease people I have seen in the Gulf area are flippin' hookers... I just don't trust 'em... not racist, just careful...
12-30-2005, 11:14 AM #40Retired Vet
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ok Warrior, I'll rephrase that. Can American win the battle in Iraq and withdraw with honour?. If you pulled out now (and I think you shouldn't) do you think it would be seen as another defeat?.
Does the American public have the stomach for a war with higher casualties, or the draft?.
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