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  1. #1
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    Get ready Iran, here come the stars and stripes

    While the U.S. has always refused to take the military option off the table in de****g with Iran, the German press is reporting new developments that indicate the U.S. has gone from acknowledging the possibility of action against Tehran's suspected clandestine nuclear weapons program to preparing its allies for a strike.

    According to Der Spiegel, the German daily, reports of a pending strike escalated following Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad's recent statements that Israel should be wiped off the face of the map and his calls for Israelis to be relocated to Europe.

    On Dec. 23, a journalist for the German news agency DDP, who is also an intelligence expert, cited "western security sources" in a report claiming CIA Director Porter Goss asked Turkish Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan to provide full intelligence cooperation and exchange for a possible air strike on Iran's nuclear and military facilities.

    Goss reportedly provided Turkey with three dossiers at the Dec. 12 meeting containing evidence Tehran is cooperating with the Islamic terror network al-Qaida, as well as information about the current status of Iran's weapons program. German security sources, it is reported, say Goss assured Erdogan Turkey would be alerted to any air strikes, should they occur, a few hours before they were launched. Goss also gave the Turkish government the "green light" to strike the separatist Kurdistan Workers' Party (PKK) in Iran if the U.S. proceeds.

    The governments of Saudi Arabia, Jordan, Oman and Pakistan were also informed in recent weeks that air strikes are a "possible option," but no timeline was provided

    Ahmadinejad's anti-Semitic speeches and claim the Holocaust is a "myth," it is speculated, have cemented the view in Washington that Iran would not back down in a nuclear showdown and Tehran is simply trying to buy time by continuing its talks with the Europeans.

    "I would be very surprised if the Americans, in the mid-term, didn't take advantage of the opportunity delivered by Tehran," said a high-ranking German military official. "The Americans have to attack Iran before the country can develop nuclear weapons. After that would be too late."

    In the January 2005 New Yorker, journalist Seymour Hersh reported that clandestine American commando groups were already on the ground in Iran, marking likely targets – a report the Bush administration attempted to play down as containing inaccurate statements but did not dispute.

    In recent weeks, the number of visits to Ankara by American and NATO security officials has increased significantly. The head of the FBI, NATO General Secretary Jaap De Hoop Scheffer and U.S. Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice have made stops in the Turkish capital.

    Joining the speculation in the German press, the lef********alist Turkish newspaper Cumhuriyet, though unable to discover the substance of their talks, noted the unusually long meeting Goss and Erdogan held with, "Now it's Iran's turn."

    As reported by WorldNetDaily, Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon has ordered his defense forces to plan for a pre-emptive strike on Iran's nuclear weapons facilities by the end of March – the time intelligence sources say Tehran will be able to begin producing nuclear weapons.

  2. #2
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    Good, its about time those terrorist supporting fvckers get what they deserve

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kale
    Good, its about time those terrorist supporting fvckers get what they deserve
    Strange to say this (coming from a Zionist) but most Iranians are not terrorist supporters. In fact, they hate the current regime more than most. However, I do agree...their facilities must be taken out...I don't care who does it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by AIZ
    Strange to say this (coming from a Zionist) but most Iranians are not terrorist supporters. In fact, they hate the current regime more than most. However, I do agree...their facilities must be taken out...I don't care who does it.
    I guess I meant the government, not the people, they are always the meat in the sandwich. I dont understand why the Israelis dont just strike at the nuclear facilities like they did many years ago, I cant remember if it was in Iraq or Iran, but one air strike fixed the problem instantly with few civilian casualties.

  5. #5
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    I understand a lunatic is at the wheel of a potential nuclear enemy at the same time I feel this is a job for someone else. We can't always be the cop, someone else needs to step up.

  6. #6
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    I dont find it plausible that the US can afford, (I say afford in all its senses Financially, Politically, Diplomatically Militarily, etc) a full scale war and even less so invasion. Not to mention Russia and China will not be pleased. Also it will make US vulnerable, I expect airstrikes yet an invasion would surprise me.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kale
    I guess I meant the government, not the people, they are always the meat in the sandwich. I dont understand why the Israelis dont just strike at the nuclear facilities like they did many years ago, I cant remember if it was in Iraq or Iran, but one air strike fixed the problem instantly with few civilian casualties.
    Times have changed since '81. The strike was against Iraq at Osirak. It was a great mission but Iran is far more complicated.

    It is important to remember that Israeli intelligence has been keeping a very close eye on Iran since '79. Before that, we had good relations with the Shah. I would assume that Israel has been keeping a close watch over decades on Iranian nuclear development. So, knowing for the most part where the facilities are is not necessarily the issues. The problem is that, while the IDF is strong, it doesn't have the fire power that can handle a huge job like the U.S. can. We simply don't have enough weapons to hit the entire country. And rest assured that the facilities are located throughout that large country.

    Also, its a possibility that Israel could get hit in return by Iranian missiles. We actually hold a deep respect for every soldier that fights and therefore, even one loss is unacceptable. Civilians are out of the question!!!! If one civilian dies there will be a great deal of trouble for Iran.

    Moreover, there's the international community to deal with. We will get grilled hard in public and patted on the back (behind closed doors).

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prada
    I dont find it plausible that the US can afford, (I say afford in all its senses Financially, Politically, Diplomatically Militarily, etc) a full scale war and even less so invasion. Not to mention Russia and China will not be pleased. Also it will make US vulnerable, I expect airstrikes yet an invasion would surprise me.
    I agree..airstrikes are the highest probability...and least dangerous

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    true

    Quote Originally Posted by AIZ
    Strange to say this (coming from a Zionist) but most Iranians are not terrorist supporters. In fact, they hate the current regime more than most. However, I do agree...their facilities must be taken out...I don't care who does it.
    Very true statement. I believe that we would get more help from the population of Iran than we have/would from Iraq in taking back their country.
    Problem is, I firmly believe that becuase of the Left playing politics, we will not do anything about this regiem....But I bet the Israeli's will

  10. #10
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    I think it'd be much easier on the public relations end, if we could stage an "accident" at their nuclear development plants, where they accidently detonate a nuclear device. This eliminates their facilities, and makes it appear as if they just didnt know what the hell they were doing and blew themselves up. I dont think thats beyond Americas capabilities. In an ideal situation, thats what I'd like to see happen. I believe the international community has the right to decide what nations are responsible enough to have nuclear capabilities, or should I say, who we trust enough. I dont believe a country like Iran, and their fanatical leader, is someone we trust to have this kind of power. With Pakistan and India, the concern was not as great, as they dont have the kind of terrorist links that Iran does.

  11. #11
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    reading the political scene in Iraq ,the situation of the USA army, the situation of Bush administration plus taking into consideration the opinion of the USA people wich is important in this equation , I dont think there will be a military actions against Iran.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by MilitiaGuy
    reading the political scene in Iraq ,the situation of the USA army, the situation of Bush administration plus taking into consideration the opinion of the USA people wich is important in this equation , I dont think there will be a military actions against Iran.
    There could very easily be air attacks with no possibility of foot soldiers. Iran WILL NOT strike the U.S. They might try to initiate something with Israel instead, which would be a mistake. Israel would "win" so to speak but both sides would lose a lot.

  13. #13
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    All Arabic-speaking nations should be fully aware that the US level of Arabic intel has undergone a complete revolution since the hunt for weapons of mass construction... we used to have a severe shortage for translating Arabic documents, audio and video - but that has changed with the employment of the "heritage speakers," American and foreign nationals who speak many Arabic dialects (some requiring other language skills, like French) and have passed an FBI investigation. This is common info, reported by the FBI/CIA in the Economist earlier in 2005.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by AIZ
    There could very easily be air attacks with no possibility of foot soldiers. Iran WILL NOT strike the U.S. They might try to initiate something with Israel instead, which would be a mistake. Israel would "win" so to speak but both sides would lose a lot.
    u didnt understand me I was not talking about who would win in usa-iran conflict or the type of military action, I was hinting that if USA make a mistake with Iran by attacking it with any form of attack the shiaa in Iraq will revolt against the americans and the attacks on americans will quadriply if not more, Hamas also will increase its attacks inside "israel" and so on, and I am building my analysis supposing that the USA administration is wise but if they want to act stupid everyhing might happen.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MilitiaGuy
    u didnt understand me I was not talking about who would win in usa-iran conflict or the type of military action, I was hinting that if USA make a mistake with Iran by attacking it with any form of attack the shiaa in Iraq will revolt against the americans and the attacks on americans will quadriply if not more, Hamas also will increase its attacks inside "israel" and so on, and I am building my analysis supposing that the USA administration is wise but if they want to act stupid everyhing might happen.
    I have no doubt you are correct, but the consequences af doing nothing and having nuclear weapons in the hands of those loonies in Iran far outweighs the consequences of an escalation by Hamas or a Shiaa revolt IMO.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by MilitiaGuy
    u didnt understand me I was not talking about who would win in usa-iran conflict or the type of military action, I was hinting that if USA make a mistake with Iran by attacking it with any form of attack the shiaa in Iraq will revolt against the americans and the attacks on americans will quadriply if not more, Hamas also will increase its attacks inside "israel" and so on, and I am building my analysis supposing that the USA administration is wise but if they want to act stupid everyhing might happen.
    I actually agree with you that Hamas would step up attacks, as well as Hezbollah in the north...nothing we can't handle. I also agree that Shiites (not all) will step up attacks against the U.S. in Iraq (again...nothing that the U.S. cannot eventually handle). In the end, while all sides will suffer losses, Iran will ultimately be the main loser.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by MilitiaGuy
    u didnt understand me I was not talking about who would win in usa-iran conflict or the type of military action, I was hinting that if USA make a mistake with Iran by attacking it with any form of attack the shiaa in Iraq will revolt against the americans and the attacks on americans will quadriply if not more, Hamas also will increase its attacks inside "israel" and so on, and I am building my analysis supposing that the USA administration is wise but if they want to act stupid everyhing might happen.
    They will have to present a good case versus Iran, attributing quality intel, and preset it to other nations to build support and allies. And the real key would be to have the Americans fight with an Arabic nation as an ally. To show other Arabic nations that the US is not racist and that it's okay to be Arabic and support Western maneuvers.

    If the US finds an attack on Iran as necessary - she'll need allies and support from the Arabic communities. And strategic bombing to decapetate Irans ability to fight. The funny thing is - just recently - we raised a lot of money to help with their earthquake relief... it would be a shame to go destroy what was just rebuilt...

  18. #18
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    "We're gonna get them over there, we're gonna go over there and we're gonna bomb them."

    To quote a US soldier at the time of the Iraq war.

    Even though I'm english, let's go over there and let's DO IT!!!

  19. #19
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    The only fool here is you for throwing out personal insults. if you want to stick around on this dont repeat that.

    - Johan
    Last edited by Kärnfysikern; 01-02-2006 at 04:07 PM.

  20. #20
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    Its not going to happen, Iran has to much power from Lebanon to Afghanistan at the present time. There wont be military strikes on Iran. If it happens I will be very very very suprised.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by AIZ
    Strange to say this (coming from a Zionist) but most Iranians are not terrorist supporters. In fact, they hate the current regime more than most. However, I do agree...their facilities must be taken out...I don't care who does it.
    The Iranian people are proud of their nations nuclear power capabilities, and support it. But even if the Iranians hate the leadership, they will stick by the leadership and fight for their country, because Iranians are very nationalistic.

    Then again most nations in the world dont like their leadership.

    If Iranians saw the protests in the US or Britian, they would be thinking that their leadership is hated also? No?

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    Quote Originally Posted by CAUSASIAN
    If Iranians saw the protests in the US or Britian, they would be thinking that their leadership is hated also? No?
    They do see the protests. Tehran is full of satellite TV and Internet Cafes...even though the regime has tried to shut those cafes down countless times. Student protests, students numbering in the thousands, have stated over and over that they want democracy and to be rid of the Islamic Theocracy. I've stated before that the students carry signs that have said, "Stop talking to us about the Palestinians. Talk to us ABOUT us!" They want their freedom. They are tired of being politically oppressed. I have met many persians, both Jewish and non-Jewish, who all say that the regime is hated by more people than we'll ever know

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by AIZ
    They do see the protests. Tehran is full of satellite TV and Internet Cafes...even though the regime has tried to shut those cafes down countless times. Student protests, students numbering in the thousands, have stated over and over that they want democracy and to be rid of the Islamic Theocracy. I've stated before that the students carry signs that have said, "Stop talking to us about the Palestinians. Talk to us ABOUT us!" They want their freedom. They are tired of being politically oppressed. I have met many persians, both Jewish and non-Jewish, who all say that the regime is hated by more people than we'll ever know
    I saw protests in the US where there were tens of thousands of Anarchrists and Communists protesting against the US and the government. Does that mean the whole population wants Communism and Anarchy? No.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by CAUSASIAN
    I saw protests in the US where there were tens of thousands of Anarchrists and Communists protesting against the US and the government. Does that mean the whole population wants Communism and Anarchy? No.


    Of course not but I think that's an unequal comparison. Look, I know you are a religious Muslim and I am not trying to offend you by saying that Iranians want a change. However, the youth do not want the life that the Mullahs are offering. A revolution in that country is bound to occur. The regime cannot keep oppressing their people by forcing an oppressive style of rule over them. Have you seen what happens when those students protest? Its horrible

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    Quote Originally Posted by AIZ
    Of course not but I think that's an unequal comparison. Look, I know you are a religious Muslim and I am not trying to offend you by saying that Iranians want a change. However, the youth do not want the life that the Mullahs are offering. A revolution in that country is bound to occur. The regime cannot keep oppressing their people by forcing an oppressive style of rule over them. Have you seen what happens when those students protest? Its horrible
    If I was a leader of Iran, I wouldnt run it like the way its being run now. Even Ayatollah Khomeni's sons who are themselves Ayatollah's are against how Iran is being run. Most of the reformists are Mullahs as you call them. The biggest opposition group with the biggest support is a group called Mujahadeen Khalaq which is also an Islamic group. I dont agree with how Iran is being run, but its not the way the West makes it seem.

    The protests in Iran and the US is the same thing. Difference is when it happens in Iran, people are like see they dont want that leadership. But when it happens in the US, these types of protests are "natural". There are protests all over the world, similiar to this.

    If a revolution will happen let it happen, but it wont, I am sure. Although people want to instigate one.

    I have seen protests in Western Countries that ends in death, so there are horrible protests everywhere.

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by CAUSASIAN
    If a revolution will happen let it happen, but it wont, I am sure. Although people want to instigate one.
    Disagree and disagree. I believe a revolution is inevitable somewhere down the road. I also disagree that people are trying to instigate a revolution. Maybe a better statement would be: "many are attempting to aid and/or support what seems to be an inevitable revolution".

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by AIZ
    Disagree and disagree. I believe a revolution is inevitable somewhere down the road. I also disagree that people are trying to instigate a revolution. Maybe a better statement would be: "many are attempting to aid and/or support what seems to be an inevitable revolution".
    Oh please.

    You dont care about the Iranian people or their freedom, you arent trying to aid them. You just care about your security and threats against your country, and play it off under the guise of "caring" about the Iranian people.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CAUSASIAN
    Oh please.

    You dont care about the Iranian people or their freedom, you arent trying to aid them. You just care about your security and threats against your country, and play it off under the guise of "caring" about the Iranian people.
    You are correct, I do not know about AIZ, but I could not give a shit about the Iranians. I would support a compaign to bomb the hell out of their nuclear facilities, even if it were just a "rumor".

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Logan13
    You are correct, I do not know about AIZ, but I could not give a shit about the Iranians. I would support a compaign to bomb the hell out of their nuclear facilities, even if it were just a "rumor".
    Would you support it with just your word or action? Enlist, and fight Iran.

  30. #30
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    ok

    Quote Originally Posted by CAUSASIAN
    Would you support it with just your word or action? Enlist, and fight Iran.
    I spent 12 years in already, special forces for 3. I will send you a copy of my book. Would you fight the possible bombing of Iran with your action or just through this forum? You could enlist in their military as well, but they would not take you...a belief in Allah is not enough. I respect your opinion, but please remember that 20 years on this earth is not enough time to establish a worldview.

    -Logan13
    Last edited by Logan13; 01-02-2006 at 09:47 PM. Reason: add

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    Quote Originally Posted by Logan13
    I spent 12 years in already, special forces for 3. I will send you a copy of my book. Would you fight the possible bombing of Iran with your action or just through this forum? You could enlist in their military as well, but they would not take you...a belief in Allah is not enough. I respect your opinion, but please remember that 20 years on this earth is not enough time to establish a worldview.

    -Logan13
    Good, atleast your arent all talk then.

    Iranians can take care of themselves. We need as many Chechen bodies alive as possible.

    Iran will take anybody.

    http://www.iranfocus.com/modules/new...p?storyid=4455

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    Quote Originally Posted by CAUSASIAN
    Good, atleast your arent all talk then.

    Iranians can take care of themselves. We need as many Chechen bodies alive as possible.

    Iran will take anybody.

    http://www.iranfocus.com/modules/new...p?storyid=4455
    You can't believe everything you hear....remember Iraqi press saying that the USA was being beat back, "we are killing them like dogs"....... did you believe that too? Iran will not be as easy as Iraq, but they do not concern me. I must admit, living in Chechnya could not have been easy. Were you born there?
    -Logan13

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Logan13
    You can't believe everything you hear....remember Iraqi press saying that the USA was being beat back, "we are killing them like dogs"....... did you believe that too? Iran will not be as easy as Iraq, but they do not concern me. I must admit, living in Chechnya could not have been easy. Were you born there?
    -Logan13
    I knew the Iraqi military will loose very fast. But I dont think a military attack on Iran is plausible, they have too much power from Lebanon to Afghanistan, dont take my word watch and see. It will be intense diplomatic and economic pressure, and thats about it.

    I was born in Chechnya (Russia), but after about 15, I have been living in foreign countries.

  34. #34
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    middle east

    Quote Originally Posted by CAUSASIAN
    I knew the Iraqi military will loose very fast. But I dont think a military attack on Iran is plausible, they have too much power from Lebanon to Afghanistan, dont take my word watch and see. It will be intense diplomatic and economic pressure, and thats about it.

    I was born in Chechnya (Russia), but after about 15, I have been living in foreign countries.
    Lebanon I can believe, but Afghanistan? I would really like to see peace in the middle east through diplomacy, but I do not believe that this can happen any time soon. If there is another attack on US soil, this country will go ape shit and the middle east will be a war zone for decades to come. What is the problem, in your opinion, with the middle east and the rest of the world?

    -Logan13

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Benches505
    I understand a lunatic is at the wheel of a potential nuclear enemy at the same time I feel this is a job for someone else. We can't always be the cop, someone else needs to step up.
    Noone will just "Step up" They wll "Join in" We are the lone superpower on this earth and they will gladly "Follow" us to battle.

    No other country is will to make a premptive strike dedicating their most of their military to a campiagn. This is why we are so feared. We have the capabilties, great military leadership, and best tools known to man.

    Viva La America!!!

  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Logan13
    Lebanon I can believe, but Afghanistan? I would really like to see peace in the middle east through diplomacy, but I do not believe that this can happen any time soon. If there is another attack on US soil, this country will go ape shit and the middle east will be a war zone for decades to come. What is the problem, in your opinion, with the middle east and the rest of the world?

    -Logan13
    Afghanistan because the best militia in Afghanistan is Hezb-i-Islami, led by famed Afghan warlord Gulbuddin Hekmatyar, his group is the most organized resistance force in Afghanistan. Hekmatyar is Iranian backed, and was in Iran in exile but has gone back to Afghanistan.

    And the Northern Alliance was totally funded by Iran to fight the Taliban who were Iran's big enemy, they almost got into a war a couple of times.

    The biggest problems is no Palestinian state and foreign troops in Saudi Arabia. If those are resolved in my opinion tensions will stop about 90% in the Middle East. But there will still be people that want Israel totally gone etc etc. But most of the problems in the Middle East will be gone with those two issues resolved.

  37. #37
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    And Wahhabism's influence must be stopped, it flourishes in regions with war and people looking for hope. I grew up in a environment of Wahhabism, and some aspects of it rubbed off on me. Wahhabis are crazy, most of them.

  38. #38
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    .........

    Quote Originally Posted by CAUSASIAN
    Afghanistan because the best militia in Afghanistan is Hezb-i-Islami, led by famed Afghan warlord Gulbuddin Hekmatyar, his group is the most organized resistance force in Afghanistan. Hekmatyar is Iranian backed, and was in Iran in exile but has gone back to Afghanistan.

    And the Northern Alliance was totally funded by Iran to fight the Taliban who were Iran's big enemy, they almost got into a war a couple of times.

    The biggest problems is no Palestinian state and foreign troops in Saudi Arabia. If those are resolved in my opinion tensions will stop about 90% in the Middle East. But there will still be people that want Israel totally gone etc etc. But most of the problems in the Middle East will be gone with those two issues resolved.
    I remember hearing a few opinions on removing US troops from Saudi, but as I recall the Royal family wanted them to stay. There have been at least 2 chances to form a Palestinian state, If the Palestinian leadership is waiting for Israel to move/fall, then I say that there is nothing else that can be done until the leadership changes.

  39. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Logan13
    What is the problem, in your opinion, with the middle east and the rest of the world?

    -Logan13
    From my eyes - I see a huge religous conflict of interest (even between Gulf and nonGulf Arabs) and large financial means to make radical advances. The Gulf area is still sporting the thobes and abiyas (traditional garmets) and many other very old traditions while the rest of the world evolves around them. Arabic women (including those in the royal families) are standing up demanding more equality. And it is common to see them take their abiyas off once they get away from the family - and often sporting a sexy Arabic woman! I know a few Western guys dating Arabic woman from royal familes - its a dangerous thing though... with the likes of "honor killings" and the strong need for a woman to remain a virgin for her husband... and other relgious Muslim issues...

    There are a lot of changes happening in the Gulf - and now is the time really... they currently have plenty of financial backing to support radical changes and industry. But the oil craze will not last forever - new forms of energy will evolve and the Middle East will then see a new overlapping stressor on the region - poverty. The horible work ethics (if working at all) will bring them down - no more hand outs.

    The big problems with the Middle East: conflict in religous practices between nonMuslim and nonGulf Muslim, horrible work ethic from hand outs, equal rights movements vs traditionalist, things like "honor killings" still occuring, a lot of extra financial backing and... worry about a future without a need for oil...

    Things are cyclical - times repeat themselves... it would be interesting if India (who are many of the hard working, including white-collar, workers in the Gulf) became a new back bone to the Middle Eastern commerce... India was once a commerce giant...

  40. #40
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    AIZ
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    Quote Originally Posted by CAUSASIAN
    Oh please.

    You dont care about the Iranian people or their freedom, you arent trying to aid them. You just care about your security and threats against your country, and play it off under the guise of "caring" about the Iranian people.

    I do care

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