New Flex picx

[Kärnfysikern]

Loking good for beeing this far out of mr.o

[Kärnfysikern]

[Kärnfysikern]

[Kärnfysikern]

[Japan man]

still looks full, as soon as he fills his delts with oil again he is pretty close to how he was. flex is my fav!

[Kärnfysikern]

I hope he stays away from the oil.

[retired]

Now that Flex and Shawn Ray have found God, maybe they will compete as naturals?

LMAO

[Adam185]

Originally posted by Japan man
still looks full, as soon as he fills his delts with oil again he is pretty close to how he was. flex is my fav!

ya he's got his calfs filled, look at the pic with his back to the camera, they look oily, especially the one on the right.

[Japan man]

Originally posted by Adam185


ya he's got his calfs filled, look at the pic with his back to the camera, they look oily, especially the one on the right.

his calves on the otherhans are implants (fact)

[palme]

WTF!?
Implants? Like Pamela´s tits?

[MIKE_XXL]

Say what you want, Flex is the man...deffinitely my favorite...i think he looks very good this far out, he's guest posing in my area soon, i am going for sure......and show me one pro who hasn't done oil and placed in top 10..............................hmmmm....no body there..................XXL

[BIG R]

I'm with XXL. Flex has been in the Sport for over a decade and still looks good. I definately think that he will be top 10. I don't think anyone should be haten' on him especially on this web site. I met him in LA right after the 99 Olympia at LAX airport. We were waithing for a taxi and he and his wife were next to us. He was a nice fella.
................Oh well, I suppose there will always be trash talkers talking down on people that they wish they could be more like.

Peace,
Big R

[Kärnfysikern]

Flex is the man

[Japan man]

Originally posted by BIG R
I'm with XXL. Flex has been in the Sport for over a decade and still looks good. I definately think that he will be top 10. I don't think anyone should be haten' on him especially on this web site. I met him in LA right after the 99 Olympia at LAX airport. We were waithing for a taxi and he and his wife were next to us. He was a nice fella.
................Oh well, I suppose there will always be trash talkers talking down on people that they wish they could be more like.

Peace,
Big R

if you read my post you can see that i stated "flex is my fav" i have been following his career for some time now. when he got his calf implants, i was severely dissapointed, the clean cut spit calf edges turned smooth. also his use with oil inj. but in now way am i "hating" i take offence to the fact that you said that, i just stated the truth. Flex has the best body in the ifbb, no doubt about it. But dont for even one second think im "trashtalking" and NO, i would never want to look like him.

Flex; keep !!

[The French Curler]

He still looks great.

[Capital X]

Can someone put up a comparable picure from his pre-retirement?

Capital X

[retired]

Flex was at his all-time best at the 1993 Arnold Classic, and he was never able to recapture that form. Part of it may have to do with diuretic testing, he's always had water troubles and has had to take very extreme measures to compensate. I hope that he can recapture that form before he retires again.

[vielbistdu]

Yeah, Flex did mention earlier in the year he plans to come to the show with more quality. If he comes to the Olympia in his 93 shape, that would be very interesting to watch.

[vector]

Originally posted by vielbistdu
Yeah, Flex did mention earlier in the year he plans to come to the show with more quality. If he comes to the Olympia in his 93 shape, that would be very interesting to watch.

To be precise, he was not at his best at the 93 olympia but at the 93 arnold.
If this is only a diuretic problem, then I wish he could use them again.

I thought pros were still using diuretics but undetectable ones. Are they less effective than the old ones?

[retired]

You are absolutely right Vector, it was the Arnold and not the Olympia where Flex showed his best form. He was probably 2-3 % off at the Olympia, not surprising since he won his first four(?) pro shows in the earlier part of the season.

Personally, I would be happy to see Flex win with a streamlined and balanced physique. As much as I respect Coleman and love the mass freaks, the guts have gotten out of control and that message has to be conveyed to the competitors. Actually marking guys down for protruding bellies and rewarding the small-waisted look would be a good place to start...

[RoNNy THe BuLL]

Just a stupid fact, they found a genetic mutation in cows that allows them to carry an inordinate amount of muscle and they found out Flex Wheeler and Arnold Schwarzennegar along with a few others have this mutation in their DNA. Crazy eh? It's the reason why these ecto's have the ability to gain some serious muscle. Why couldn't the iron gods give me that mutation *haha*

[vector]

Originally posted by gordero
You are absolutely right Vector, it was the Arnold and not the Olympia where Flex showed his best form. He was probably 2-3 % off at the Olympia, not surprising since he won his first four(?) pro shows in the earlier part of the season.

Personally, I would be happy to see Flex win with a streamlined and balanced physique. As much as I respect Coleman and love the mass freaks, the guts have gotten out of control and that message has to be conveyed to the competitors. Actually marking guys down for protruding bellies and rewarding the small-waisted look would be a good place to start...

He won at least 3 shows in a row in 93, the ironman (great condition here too), the arnold (best shape ever),the france grand prix (was there ).

And I agree with you, small waist should be a must. There is no magic in bodybuilding with the pregnant look.

[MIKE_XXL]

Originally posted by RoNNy THe BuLL
Just a stupid fact, they found a genetic mutation in cows that allows them to carry an inordinate amount of muscle and they found out Flex Wheeler and Arnold Schwarzennegar along with a few others have this mutation in their DNA. Crazy eh? It's the reason why these ecto's have the ability to gain some serious muscle. Why couldn't the iron gods give me that mutation *haha*

It's a Myostatin Gene, it's responsible for preventing the body from getting to big, as it would be very difficult to sustain life in a very large muscular body...it's million years old gene that's fucking up all of our hard work...they have been working with animals, and through genetic manipulation turning the gene off, and creating animals (cows. mice & pigs mostly) that are extremely muscular, and they don't even requier extra feed to get bigger...XXL

[RageControl]

Where can i get some !

[NiceGuy]

Originally posted by RoNNy THe BuLL
Just a stupid fact, they found a genetic mutation in cows that allows them to carry an inordinate amount of muscle and they found out Flex Wheeler and Arnold Schwarzennegar along with a few others have this mutation in their DNA. Crazy eh? It's the reason why these ecto's have the ability to gain some serious muscle. Why couldn't the iron gods give me that mutation *haha*

are u serious bro?

[cube]

i asked a colleague for a couple of references:

a mutation in the myostatin gene was determined to cause excessive muscle in cattle, specifically the 'double muscled' belgian blue (Kambadur 1997).

the study that got everyone interested in myostatin for bb'ers was Ferrel (sp?) 1999.

here's an article (v. short) about flex and myostatin http://www.musclephotos.com/myogene.html

good starting point for anyone interested in this stuff http://www.pitt.edu/~edugene/resource/index2.html


the first two refs are refeered journals so the articles are probably fair (though not infallible). the third is from "mr. zma" victor conte at balco labs so not sure how reliable that source is.....

all the supplement companies coming out with myostatin inhibitors sounds like a big crapshoot to me. hope some of this helps, i can't vouch for its validity, my area of expertise is not genetics, but a genetics colleague thought the references were reasonable.


cube



Ferrell, R. E., Conte, V., Lawrence, E. C., Roth, S. M., Hagberg, J. M., Hurley, B. F, (1999). Frequent sequence variation in the human myostatin (GDF8) gene as a marker for analysis of muscle-related phenotypes. Genomics 62 (2); 203-207

(Kambadur, R, Sharma M, Smith, T. P. L., Bass, J. J. (1997). Mutations in myostatin (GDF-8) in double muscled Belgian Blue and Piedmontese cattle. Genome Res. 7. 910-916.)

[retired]

this sounds like a bunch of complete nonsense...what does a genetic mutation have to do with site injection oil? If Flex had never used half of the crap that he was taking in his prime, he would never step onstage in shape at more than 215-220lbs. How does that qualify as "a genetic mutation?"

Flex is a SHAPE freak, and you don't need a mutation for that- just the right parents and God-given luck.

It's true that genetics play a role in how much muscle a person can carry, and they also play a role in how well one responds to chemical enhancement. As for mutations- it sounds like a very weak attempt at diverting attention away from the drug problem in bodybuilding.

[MIKE_XXL]

Originally posted by gordero
this sounds like a bunch of complete nonsense...what does a genetic mutation have to do with site injection oil? If Flex had never used half of the crap that he was taking in his prime, he would never step onstage in shape at more than 215-220lbs. How does that qualify as "a genetic mutation?"

Flex is a SHAPE freak, and you don't need a mutation for that- just the right parents and God-given luck.

It's true that genetics play a role in how much muscle a person can carry, and they also play a role in how well one responds to chemical enhancement. As for mutations- it sounds like a very weak attempt at diverting attention away from the drug problem in bodybuilding.

NO body here is saying that the Top end pro bodybuilders don't use excesive amounts of drugs, however only a few people in the world can carry that kind of muscle even with the drug use of the champs there are people out there that couldn't get that big no matter what and how much they took...i will never look like Ronnie Colman, even if my boat load shipment of HGH clears the customes and actually gets to my house...and that is where the Genetic Mutation comes in, if the one gene that is limiting me from getting that big is mutated in another person, they have no problem getting big because of the luck of the limiting factor of the myostatin gene..............enough said....XXL

[retired]

It's one thing to say that Coleman has some kind of genetic mutation- he weighs 320(?) in the offseason- and another to say that Flex- who is MUCH smaller- has it. Either way, it is pure nonsense. Do genetics play a role in how much mass a person can carry? Yes. Is it due to some kind of mutation? No.

I am making a distinction between a genetic component and a genetic mutation. Nobody is claiming that Maurice Green has a genetic mutation that allows him to run faster than anyone else; however, he has great genetics for speed.

[MIKE_XXL]

Flex used to get up to 300 lbs in his of season when he was in his prime, wow now that's only 20lbs less then Coleman, and if you have a mutated gene, it can not perform it's function in the body, there for making it inactive, so inturn if the gene is sepouse to regulate the amount of muscle a human body can hold and it is not working and doing it's job (limiting muscl growth), you could get and be bigger then you would be otherwise if the gene was properly functioning..................but whatever man, i am done here............XXL

[RoNNy THe BuLL]

QUOTING GORDERO:
"this sounds like a bunch of complete nonsense...what does a genetic mutation have to do with site injection oil? If Flex had never used half of the crap that he was taking in his prime, he would never step onstage in shape at more than 215-220lbs. How does that qualify as "a genetic mutation? Flex is a SHAPE freak, and you don't need a mutation for that- just the right parents and God-given luck."

The "genetic mutation" DOES play a role in muscle development! Myostatin shuts off in the body so you have mobility in your body. You need it to shut off so your muscle doesn't keep on growing to the point where it's too tough for you to move your body. This mutation basically changes that and turns it back on, so it's not just the size of the cells growing, but new cells are being generated. With more cells being generated, they'll have BIGGER muscles and more developed muscles. It is a mutation!*no flame intended!*

Mike XXL - You're damn right when you say:
NO body here is saying that the Top end pro bodybuilders don't use excesive amounts of drugs, however only a few people in the world can carry that kind of muscle even with the drug use of the champs there are people out there that couldn't get that big no matter what and how much they took...i will never look like Ronnie Colman, even if my boat load shipment of HGH clears the customes and actually gets to my house...and that is where the Genetic Mutation comes in, if the one gene that is limiting me from getting that big is mutated in another person, they have no problem getting big because of the luck of the limiting factor of the myostatin gene..............enough said....XXL

[retired]

I doubt that Flex ever went 300 in the offseason- a VERY fat 270 maybe, but not 300. Anyways, I'd like to see some real scientific data to support the "Mutation" theory. In fact, I have my own counter-theory: maybe Flex was using Muscletech supplements

Flex magazine ran a report a few years back on mice that had been genetically engineered so as not to have the myostatin gene, and they grew to be much larger (though not necessarily stronger) than their non-engineered brothers and sisters. Was Flex genetically manipulated while in his momma's womb? I don't think so. Maybe one day such theories will become reality, but for now they belong on the Sci Fi channel...

[BIG R]

Gordo, Gordo. Gordo,

Let me put what Mike XXL is so eloquently saying in VERY BASIC terms for you.

senario #1: A ectomorphic male wants to be as big as Ronnie Coleman. He uses as much AS as Ronnie, eats as much as Ronnie and works out with Ronnie at Metroflex......but never get even half as big. In fact he hits a point that no matter how much he eats or how much AS he administers, he is stuck........end of story.

senario #2: A different ectomorphic male administers the same amount of AS and gets spectacular results. He speeds past the ecto#1 about 20lbs. Why? They are both ectomorphs. only one had less limitations in developing muscle than the other. Fact: They are both ectomorphs and are both using the same amount of AS.

Explaniations: Genetics, do play a role in the scheme of things. But they do have their limitations. When pushed beyond the natural......with AS where is the limit? The human body DOES administer limitations on matters that might interfere with the very survival of its own exsitance as fail-safe limitations. The Myostatin gene. The body will stop muscle unatural muscle growth if it percieves it as life threatening. Self preservation in the form of Negative-feedback systems in the body are seen countless times in the body in several different systems..............Why cant you accept that there might be one involved in the muscular system. And if there was one could it not have genetic problems as do all systems in certian cases. There are thousands of genetic mutations that exist in the human population. Most are non-life threatening and never get expressed in our lifetime. Is this too complex an explanation for you to grasp? I believe that there ARE several factors controling how far we can go as individuals in personal muscle growth. YOU ARE SAYING THAT GENETICS AND AAS ARE THE ONLY FACTORS-END OF STORY! I do not believe that they are the only factors. It becomes much more complex than that if you know the advanced physiology of the human body and how diverse the human genome can vary from person to person. Protien synthesis in the ribosomes around the ER can have genetic flaws limiting the assimilation of protien to our rebuild our anabolically muscle. Gigantism-mutationas in the production of Gh in the hypothalamus continue to be produced because the gene that halts production is mutated. The mutated myostatin gene will never show its presance unless a person explores how far that they can develope muscle mass. I have seen people with my own eyes take a truck load of AAS and not get past where others have gotten with half of the stack. It is a proven scientific fact that the Myostatin will retard muscle growth with Catabolic reactions via enzymes that are usually involved. The biochemical reactions in our body are set in motion by thousands of enzymes, chemical precursers, hormones, any one of which can be affected by some sort of alteration genetic or otherwise. I am a lifter, succesful competitor, and have Human A&P as my minor. I am open minded to several explanations as to why people respond differently to same senarios in their use of AS. Mike XXL has a valid argument here, and for you to simply say, an absolute, finalized, with out a doubt, "No", I find ignorant in the big picture of things. Saying it is "Complete Nonsence" is going falling into the realm of insulting to people with actual education in the vast complexities that the human body operates on. We, are on this site to hear everyone not to shut them down with negative remarks.

In conclusion I believe, IT IS NOT "PURE NONSENCE" to say that the Myostatin Gene might have different individuals set to different levels of maximum muscle growth or may simply be inert (switched off).... enableing certian people to basically room for much more muscle growth....I find it very interesting.

Your lack of accepting different views will limit you in the future. Keep an open mind on things and you may grow as a person.

R

[MIKE_XXL]

BIG R, very, very well said..................XXL

[fliprock]

Sure he can have a such a mutation!
If black parents can give birth to a white child and vice versa, then why the hell couldn't someone have this mutation?
Did you ever go to school!?

[palme]

Mike and Big R are one the penny with this one.

Big R did i thank you for the pictures or did i forget? If i did thanks, you looked great.

[ArnoldAnabo]

For me, Arnold Schwarzenegger and Flex Wheeler are the best Bodybuilders ever. When Flex is going to be in his top shape this year, big Ronnie is going to have a big Problem. Next year you are also going to see Schwarzenegger damn huge again, because he's training like a fool for Terminator and for 30 Million Dollars you can be sure that he's going to take a lot of HG.

[BIG R]

Thanks Palme! I appreciate that. I'm setting schedual for my next show.

R

[palme]

Keep me posted bro!

[retired]

Thank you gentlemen for helping me with my intellectual and emotional evolution. Now that you have stated the case in simpler terms, I see that my initial resistance to your hypothesis had more to do with my own fears in the face of new ideas and nothing to do with the scientific merits of the case. Just because there is absolutely no legitimate scientific evidence to support your mutation theory is no excuse for dismissing it out of hand; rather, I must set aside my childish preoccupation with hard facts and the scientific method and allow myself to grow as a person and as a bodybuilder...

Ok, now let's get real. Big R, I recognize that many different factors can be grouped together under the "genetics" rubric. Ectomorph "A" may have longer muscle-bellies than ectomorph "B" and so will be able to gain more muscle via training and AS. On the other hand, NO ectomorph will ever look like Ronnie Coleman, who was a large, strong man before he ever touched a weight.

By the way, this thread and the "mutation theory" began in relation to Flex Wheeler, who is one of the smaller men in bodybuilding. I say again: given that Flex would not weigh more than 220lbs without the site injections etc, what evidence are you trying to account for with the mutated myostatin theory?

That's how the scientific method works: You make observations, you propose a theory to account for your observations, and then you seek to validate or repudiate the proposed theory via careful, methodical testing. Once again, what evidence are you trying to account for with the genetic mutation theory? The fact that some professional bodybuilders are bigger than others? The fact that the pros have continued to get larger over time? I say that these things can be more plausibly explained with the existing facts, i.e. normal genetic discrepancies between individuals and increasing amounts of more and more powerful drugs. The genetic mutation theory is entirely unecessary.