Thread: Whats the best Anti E's???
05-12-2002, 07:56 AM #1New Member
- Join Date
- May 2002
Whats the best Anti E's???
im pretty new to the whole pro hormones thing and i was wonderin if some bros out there could help me out. What are the best Anti E's to take after a cycle of of andro. I know clomid is good. I was wondering if there were some others that maybe i could get at a local GNC. Sorry if thats a stupid question, but i really dont have much knowledge on it. Thanx guys
05-12-2002, 01:12 PM #2
There are no over-the counter anti-e's, they are by prescription only.
I think you have mixed up things here a bit, while Clomid does have an anti-estrogen effect, it is a weak blocker of estrogen. It is mainly used to restore natural testosterone levels after a cycle.
This info from a FAQ I am working on might help you some:
Q: What is gyno (gynecomastia) / bitch tits? What are the symptoms of gyno?
A: Gynecomastia (commonly referred to as “gyno” or “bitch tits”) is the enlargement of the breast tissue in males. It can occur naturally in puberty or old age and results from an imbalance in estrogen action relative to androgen action at the breast tissue level.
Steroid can increase the level of estrogen in the body which causes gyno.
The symptoms of gyno are: swelling and tenderness of the nipples and breast tissue or itchiness of the nipples. If you experience these symptoms, treat them immediately! Once breast tissue forms, it is permanent! See the note on Nolvadex below.
For pictures and more information on gyno, see gynecomastia.org.
Q: What is Nolvadex / Arimidex / Liquidex / Proviron? How do I prevent gyno / bitch tits?
A: Nolvadex (tamoxifen citrate), Arimidex / Liquidex (anastrozole) and Proviron (mesterlone) all act as anti-estrogens (sometimes called anti-e’s).
Estrogen is naturally found in the male body in small amounts, however, when taking certain steroids , an excess of estrogen can be created through a process called aromitization. This abnormally large concentration of estrogen can cause some undesirable side effects, such as enlargement of the breasts (commonly referred to as “gyno” or “bitch tits”), female pattern fat distribution and water retention.
Not all people who use steroids experience any estrogen related problems. Many people have taken many cycles at high dosages without using any anti-estrogens and have reported that they experienced no symptoms of gyno. Other people can take a small dose of steroids for one cycle and develop noticeable enlargement of the breast.
Estrogen can be blocked in two ways: you can block it from aromatizing, or you can block it from binding to the estrogen receptors in the body.
Nolvadex prevents estrogen from binding to the estrogen receptors in the body. Nolvadex is generally taken if and when symptoms of gyno first appear. The typical dosage is 80mg the first day, 40mg every day until the symptoms subside and 20mg a day through the end of Clomid therapy.
Arimidex, Liquidex and Proviron all function as aromatase inhibitors and work by blocking estrogen from forming. Most body builders prefer to block the estrogen from forming, because in addition to preventing gyno, it also decreases water retention and keeps the body looking harder. Typical dosages for Arimidex are 0.25 mg a day to 0.5mg a day, with 0.25mg a day being average. Proviron is typically taken at a dosage of 50mg a day.
ALWAYS have an anti-estrogen on hand when you take steroids! Tits look great--but not on men! Even if you take an aromatase inhibitor like Arimidex or Proviron, you should keep some Nolvadex on hand just in case the dose you are taking is too low and you start to see symptoms of gyno appear.
Q: Are there any non-prescription anti-estrogens?
Q: I already have gyno, what can I do to make it go away?
A: If breasts tissue has already formed, the only treatment is surgical; anti-estrogens will have no effect in reducing the size.
Q: Can steroids cause hair loss?
A: They can cause hair loss. It seems to affect men who already have a pre-disposition to male pattern baldness. See this post here for more information on steroids & hair loss.
Q: Will I lose my gains when I stop taking steroids? How can I keep the gains I made on anabolic steroids?
A: One particular problem with steroids is that they temporarily shut down the body’s natural testosterone production, so once the steroid cycle is completed, the body is not producing any testosterone. Without your natural testosterone, you feel tired, you have no libido and muscle atrophy (loss of muscle) can occur.
Most bodybuilders use Clomid post-cycle to restore their natural testosterone production.
On top of that, good diet and a good exercise regiment will help you keep most, if not all of your gains.
Q: What percentage of my gains should I expect to keep?
A: Nobody can tell you that. It depends on a lot of very individual factors. Some people keep most if not all their gains, other people (who ignore all the good advice here) have lost everything is a matter of months.
Q: What is Clomid? How do I take Clomid?
A: Clomid (clomiphene citrate) helps the male testes to restore natural testosterone production. Clomid is taken on the following schedule: 300mg the first day, 100mg a day for the next ten days and 50mg a day for another 10 days.
Click here for an excellent FAQ on Clomid.
Q: When do I start Clomid after my cycle?
A: When the LAST of the steroids are out of your system. Here is a chart that illustrates how long it takes specific steroids to get out of your system:
Anadrol : 8 - 12 hours after last administration
Deca : 3 weeks after last injection and clomid for 4 weeks
Dianabol : 4 – 8 hours after last administration
Equipoise : 17 – 21 days after last injection
Fina: 3 days after last injection
Primobolan depot: 10 – 14 days after last injection
Sustanon : 3 weeks after last injection
Testosterone Cypionate : 2 weeks after last injection
Testosterone Enanthate : 2 weeks after last injection
Testosterone Propionate : 3 days after last injection
Testosterone Suspension : 4 – 8 hours after last administration
Winstrol : 8 – 12 hours after last administration
Wait until ALL the steroids you have taken have been metabolized! For example, if you stop taking testosterone enathate (2 weeks) and Winstrol (12 hours) at the same time, wait 2 weeks!
05-12-2002, 02:59 PM #3Member
- Join Date
- Jan 2002
Ajax.. lots of great info and advice for him.. however I disagree with some of the gyno stuff.. there are OTC anti-e's (viratase by molecular nutrition and "M' by Biotest... btw I would use viratase over M anyday..).. no they aren't as good as real perscrip anti-e's but they are out there...
Also, if fibrous gyno tissue is formed, anti-e's have been shown to help reduce them especially if the tissue is only a few months old and the person uses them for a couple of weeks during a good cutting period (diet diet diet... read read read) and along with an ECA/NYC... not that if you get golf ball size gyno and then pop 100mg of nolva it will fix it.. rather proper diet and estrogen manipulation (yohimburn can be added as well) with anti-e's CAN OFTEN help reduce the size of the fibrous tissue... and as I stated before, it is even more effective when the gyno is still "young" so to speak.
02-09-2003, 07:10 PM #4
What is ECA/NYC?
02-09-2003, 07:31 PM #5
ECA like hydroxy cut, exederine etc..
02-10-2003, 05:50 AM #6
NYC contains norephedrine, caffeine, and yohimbine hcl. Some people like it better than ECA, some don't. I have never tried NYC so I can't give an opinion. I have never seen it OTC, think you need to find it on the net.
02-10-2003, 02:48 PM #7
Chrysin is supposed to be an anti-e, at least that's what I heard.
03-08-2003, 12:32 AM #8
03-08-2003, 04:55 PM #9
ECA stack by nutrasport works very well.
03-09-2003, 09:09 AM #10
Ergopharm's 6-OXO is a legitimate OTC anti-e. There have been many reports on its efficacy in restoring test levels post-cycle from happy users.
03-18-2003, 05:54 PM #11Anabolic Member
- Join Date
- May 2002
bump for me to find later.
03-18-2003, 06:14 PM #12Associate Member
- Join Date
- Apr 2002
- Detroit, MI
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