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I've heard a lot of people saying you should take multi-vitamins. How good are they really? I'm only 19, and I'm not sure if my body really needs it. Is it not true that my body might get used to the Multi-Vits and depend on them for the vitamins that it gets from them? Also, what Multi-Vits are good to take. I know Centrum is very popular, but don't know if it's mostly for older people. What do you guys take?
Thnx
Terinox
i take generic multivitamin from rite aid. as long as it has the daily RDA of the important nutrients, don't waste your money on something expense
I am on a restricive diet. I know that there are things that I miss out oon so I take the very high potency stuff and supllement that with extra b complex, c , and zinc.
If you have a good balanced diet you probably don't need extra, but with b complex and c what your body doesn't need it doesnt use, so u ca't OD on it.
If you know you have a food deficiency somehere, then compensate. Not eating eonough fruit tale C, carrots, take beta carotine (it convert to A), otehr veggies (b complex), milk, take D.
I doubt that the brand make much difference, look at the potency and remember that they come up eiyh the dosages based on an assumed 150 lb body weight. I'll bet you weigh a tad more, eh?
Your body need the vitamins really bad, especially when you push yourself at the gym. I was talking to a profesor(he studies all this crap and things for bodybuilding, I don't know what this field is called) and he said that vitamins is the first thing you should think about, even before protein. And my friend is just becomming a pro boxer, he doesn't take any supp.,no protein. He just eats like 3000 cal per day and takes multivitamins. He's been doing that for last 4 years. He's 5'5 146 3%BF.
I like the multivitamins from GNC, they are a little bit pricey.
K Thnx Guys
I'd definitly agree. The less your body is missing in any vitamin, mineral or anything you need, the more it will go towards secondary things to your body like muscle mass. And vitamins and minerals are a big thing that you don't wanna miss out on.
Don't mean to sound picky, but ask this professor you talk to. It is not physically possible to have 3% bodyfat. Just the internal organs contain enough fat to make a person's bodyfat measure 3%. As for vitamins, your body is most likely deficient in some, especially if you follow a bodybuilder's diet. They are a good idea.Quote:
Originally posted by GenuinePL
Your body need the vitamins really bad, especially when you push yourself at the gym. I was talking to a profesor(he studies all this crap and things for bodybuilding, I don't know what this field is called) and he said that vitamins is the first thing you should think about, even before protein. And my friend is just becomming a pro boxer, he doesn't take any supp.,no protein. He just eats like 3000 cal per day and takes multivitamins. He's been doing that for last 4 years. He's 5'5 146 3%BF.
I like the multivitamins from GNC, they are a little bit pricey.
I can't ask him because my semester is over and first of all we are talking about outside BF not your internal organs.
Bodyfat is bodyfat, whether it is internal or under you skin. Any bodyfat calculation takes that into the equation. When you do hydrostatic weighing, it gives you a measure of total bodyfat, not just that which is visible.
I have an exam today, so I don't have time to fight about this.
But if you want to be that specific then power to you.
If you don't believe that my friend is 3% then you could fly to CT and check ti out. His skin is so thight on his body that he gets small stretch marks because muscule has no place to go anymore. And if you try to pinch him, then good luck because I couldn't grab anyskin. You might get just a little grab in the abs area, like I said a little one.
I'm not saying he isn't lean, just not 3%. Post the question and see what the response is.
superbeast: I know more than you do!
GenuinePL: Nooo, I know more!
superbeast: Shutup!
GenuinePL: No you shutup!
superbeast: My dad's gonna beat you up!
GenuinePL: My dad's bigger than your dad!
:shoot: I'm gonna kick your ass too Excess! j/k! This is a place to learn things. We should use it for that. Not to argue. If I'm blatantly wrong about something, (which never happens) somebody please tell me. I don't want to sound like a jackass quoting something that isn't true. Just because it says junior member under my name, doesn't mean anything. There are probably very few on here that know more about nutrition and physiology than I do. Not trying to attack you GenuinePL! Sorry if you took it that way.
I have to side with Superbeast on this. GPL...no disrespect bro, but pro bodybuilders compete at 3-4% and many almost die from taking diuretics to get to those levels. At 3% you are a very, very unhealthy person...that's why BB's time it so they are that lean for HOURS only. I'm not doubting he's lean, but if he says he's 3% he's a little dillusional....do some research on BF%, I'm sure you will see that there is a discrepency in his claim.
:) Thanks Pete.
The USRDA is the standard for us here in the states but here are a couple points to review.
1. The rda is determined for MINIMAL health not optimal.
2. New studies suggest that even the minimum is not enough for some nutrients.
3. The fact that farmers are only required to put back into the soil a fraction of the nutrients taken out from most crops suggest that much of our grown food is not as high in nutrients as many years ago.
4. Can you truly say you eat enough and the correct amounts of each nutrient daily?
Take a V/M supplement. Your body will thank you.
superbeast, you are pretty cocky,and I am sure there are more than a few people who know a little more about nutriition, and physiology than you. Three years ago there was a research done on how much body fat the top marathon runners in the world had. Most were around 4%, and a few were 2%. So in defense for GenguinePL it is possible, but I would have to agree it is not to healthy.
Don't mean to be cocky, just honest. 2% bodyfat isn't called unhealthy, it is called DEAD! It isn't physiologically possible. Where is this study anyway?
To get back to subject here:
Ya have to look at Vitamins and supplements as an Insurance policy. Simply to insure that your body which you are working extremely hard at the gym has at least the minimums to get by!
Lets face it BB is stressful on you especially the nervous system. And by getting the proper nutrition & above all sleep...You keep your body strong and if fed correctly in a position to get stronger & Bigger!
MJ
Hi there,
Just to add to this debate, I would like to know if there are any particualr vit/min which the body requires in particular for bodybuilders?? (as opposed to the average couch potato)
What I have been told is:
1. Multivitamin - to get the basic neccessities
2. Vit. C 1-3g for immune system + recovery
3. 500-1500iu vit E for fatigue + recovery + antioxidant (especially if on a low fat diet for some reason)
4. B-Complex for digestion and energy
5. optionally - extra calcium, magnezium, zinc, vit. D - if you experience cramping or easy injury, otherwise not too essential.
Any other things which might be considered ESSENTIAL if training hard??
Thanks!
The only problem with taking things like vitamins is that I've been told since I'm 19, I don't need to take the pills. And if I do take the pills, then I'm fucking up my bodies natural production (just like AAS) and see's i'm taking MultiVitamins and gets used to them, and the body starts creating/absorbing less of the normal/natural vitamins I get from food.
So...that's why I don't know whether to take MultiV's or not :(
Terinox
Teronox,
I don't think that you are right. With many vitamins your body only uses what it needs and dicards what it does not. This is particularly tre with B complex and C, something you are probably burning a lot of given the way you obviously work out. Also you body doesn't retain these so timed released are better.
Some vitamins like vitamin A and D you can actually OD, so you dont want to exceed the recommendsed amounts. For vitmin A you can replace it with beta carotine and your body will convert it to vitamin A if it needs it and otherwise discard it.
Its also a good idea to take vitamins on a full stomach at the end of you meals. It aids your body's ability to absorb them.
For me a multi is needed as I don't eat veggies or fruit so I wouldn't get close to my daily rec. doses.
Hey superbeast not to get all tied up in this bodyfat thing but FLEX Wheeler showed up to a show at 0% bodyfat. There is a record of this but I have to find it so 2% is not dead. He was the only man to ever do this at a show
Alright, sounds like a plan.
So basically, the main Vit's I really need are Vit B and C ???
Could you tell me the recommened dose for each?
Thnx
Terinox
Hi there.
Vit B: get a vit b complex, high potency, they usually have enough in them. just make sure they have b1, 2, 6, 12. here's a link to a page of the b-complex I take, so you have an idea of the actual amounts:
http://www.berocca.co.za/what/index.html
one of those daily should suffice nicely.
vit. C : depending on your fruit/veg intake. if its low, then take about 2g/day (normally split up into 500mg or 1g dosages, depending on the strength of the supplement). for example, take one 500mg cap after a meal, 4 times a day.
Hope it helps!
PS. Try out vitamin E too - very important, especially if you are on a medium to low fat diet routine. Try 400-1000iu/day.
Quote:
Originally posted by Tom
Hey superbeast not to get all tied up in this bodyfat thing but FLEX Wheeler showed up to a show at 0% bodyfat. There is a record of this but I have to find it so 2% is not dead. He was the only man to ever do this at a show
Hey Tom, sell crazy somewhere else, 'cause we're all stocked up here!
That is the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard. You can't have zero bodyfat. Like I said before, you can't even have 2%. Go do your research and stop talking out your a$$. This isn't my opinion, it is scientific fact!
Fat cells shrink in size, they don't disappear completely. That is why it isn't possible and a person has to have fat surrounding their organs! Like I said, go do some serious reading and then if you have something to say, say it!
Bro thanks for sticking up for my point but 0%, that's a little bit pushing. I never heard of anything below 3.
Hey superbeast, I was talking to my friend and yes he's 3%, they measured heim few weeks ago for pro boxing becasue the want him to fight in mohegan sun casino.
by the way some people need to realize what taking these potent vitamins can do. any fat soluble vitamins can be very toxic to your body so you shouldnt take them in high amounts whith a normal diet you have enough and if you have doubts buy a program called food works u can put in all your food for the week and it wil average out and show u exactly every vitamin u had it will also break down your food into fat% carb% and even into sat fat% mono unsaturated% and everyother food u can have it is very informative and a hell of alot easier than trying to figure it all out on paper
and by the wayyou can have 3% body fat the lowest body fat on a football player at Ohio State last year was 3.4 on b.j. barre so u can have 3%
and if u dont believe that i can argue with u all day since i am in nutrition classes at OSU i will find stats
if u eat right u dont need to take vitamins. vitamin e and c r n all kinds of shit. one of my friends is a trainer and he doesnt believe n taking anything. he says if u eat right then u dont need supps, or anything. and u dont want to talk to him about AS. he gets pissed
mishon
y does he get pissed about AS?
probably because he wants and likes the idea of being all natural, and fucking with your natural test levels aren't good? aren't Gods way? probably the reason :D
i will give B-Complex a shot, and see how it works out, i remember taking it a long time ago, i think it was B-3 i was taking, and my body, especially joints, would go red and blood would rush to those areas, I would feel hot and itchy!!!
is that normal?
I have to vote for using multivitamins.
Vitamins are so essential to so many processes in the body; if you stress your body working out hard, odds are your vitamin needs will increase. To what level? Who knows--so take a good multivitamin tio make sure that you get everything you need.
Conversely, lack of vitamins can be a weak link in the chain. What's the use of injecting steroids and downiong a lot of protien if you don't have sufficient vitamins in your system to support the muscle growth/protien metabolization etc.?
What happens if you take vitamins and don't need them? Well most (except oil-based vitamins, A and E) will just go out in a stream of brightly colored piss. Think of it as insurance that your body has all it needs for maximum performance.
BTW: The US 'RDA' is based upon studies to determine what amounts of vitamins the AVERAGE person requires NOT TO GET VITAMIN DEFICIENCY DISEASES! So 100% of the US RDA of vitamin C is enough to stave off Scurvy in an average person...
Hell, we are bigger and a lot more active than the average person. And the RDA does not even take into account what levels are required for optimum performance...
It's cheap insurance that I choose to buy into...
i use centrum
You make a good point Ajax, i'll look into it :)
Multiple vitamin-mineral (MVM) supplements contain a variable number of essential and/or non-essential nutrients. Their primary purpose is to provide a convenient way to take a variety of supplemental nutrients from a single product, in order to prevent vitamin or mineral deficiencies, as well as to achieve higher intakes of nutrients believed to be of benefit above typical dietary levels.
Many MVMs contain at least 100% of the Daily Value (DV) or the U.S. Recommended Dietary Allowance (USRDA) of all vitamins that have been assigned these recommended values. Mineral levels may be lower, or in the case of high potency MVMs, most or all mineral levels may also be at 100% of DV or USRDA. Micronutrients that should be included in a complete MVM are vitamin A, vitamin B-complex (thiamine, riboflavin, niacin and/or niacinamide, vitamin B6, folate, vitamin B12, pantothenic acid, and biotin), vitamin C, vitamin D, vitamin E, and vitamin K, and the minerals calcium, magnesium, zinc, iodine, selenium, copper, manganese, chromium, molybdenum, and possibly iron. Phosphorus is another essential dietary mineral, but it is so abundant in the human diet that deficiencies are virtually unknown, and it does not need to be included in an MVM formula.
Potassium is an unusual case, as adequate amounts of potassium cannot, by law, be sold in nonprescription products. Thus potassium, when included in an MVM formula, represents only a trivial amount. MVMs may contain iron, but these should be taken only by people who have been diagnosed as having, or being at high risk of, iron deficiency, or who have a history of frequent iron deficiencies.
Some nutrients may be beneficial at levels above what is possible to obtain from diet alone, and an MVM formula can provide these levels as well. Nutrients that may be useful to most people in larger amounts include vitamin C, folic acid, and calcium. Vitamin E has long been thought to protect against heart disease beginning at 100 IU per day, but a recent study has suggested that amounts of vitamin E available in MVM formulas may not be effective (see Atherosclerosis). Large amounts of vitamin B1, vitamin B2, vitamin B3, and pantothenic acid are often included in MVM formulas. Some people claim to experience improvements in mood, energy, and/or overall well-being when taking higher-than-RDA amounts of B vitamins. However, there is little scientific research to support those observations.
The common inclusion of the non-essential nutrient beta-carotene in MVMs remains speculative. The synthetic beta-carotene found in most MVMs clearly does not prevent cancer and may increase the risk of lung cancer in smokers. Therefore, the inclusion of synthetic beta-carotene in MVM formulas is of questionable value, and it should be avoided by smokers. This concern is validated by the results of a large study which found that male smokers who use multivitamins had a higher death rate from cancer than male smokers who did not use a multivitamin, presumably due to the synthetic beta-carotene content.1 On the other hand, because beta-carotene can be converted to vitamin A without causing vitamin A toxicity, some manufacturers use beta-carotene as a source of vitamin A. However, natural beta-carotene and several other carotenoids may be helpful in preventing certain diseases, including some cancers.2 3 4 Increasingly, natural beta-carotene and several other carotenoids are found in higher quality MVMs.
Another class of non-essential nutrients is the flavonoids, which have antioxidant and other properties and have been reported by some,5 though not all,6 researchers to be linked with a reduced risk of heart disease. MVM supplements also frequently include other nutrients of uncertain benefit in the small amounts supplied, such as choline, inositol, and various amino acids.
Preliminary7 and double-blind8 trials have shown that women who use an MVM containing folic acid beginning three months before becoming pregnant and continuing through the first three months of pregnancy, have a significantly lower risk of having babies with neural tube defects (e.g., spina bifida) and other congenital defects.
In one double-blind trial, schoolchildren received, for three months, a daily low-dose vitamin-mineral tablet containing 50% of the USRDA for most essential vitamins and the minerals, iron, zinc, chromium, manganese, molybdenum, selenium, and copper.9 The subjects were “working class,” primarily Hispanic, children, aged 6 to 12 years. Dramatic gains in certain measures of IQ were observed in about 20% of the supplemented children. These gains may have been due to the correction of specific nutrient deficiencies (for example, iron) found in these children. However, it was not possible in this study to identify which nutrients caused the increases in IQ.
Use of a multivitamin has been associated with reduced death rates from cardiovascular disease.