Is it possible to develop a great body without lifting heavy

[yannick32]

Hey everyone i am asking this cause i just got back from a recent lower back injury, i still have a bit of pain but i can manage and train just fine.

I cant squat nor deadlifts right now either.

I train 3 times a week following a bit of what Dan Duchaine said in the book BodyOpus

Training is Saturday with Delts and arms

Seated db press 4 sets 10-8-6-6
Seated lateral raise 3 sets of 8-10
Reverse peck deck machine 3 sets of 12

Dips 4 sets ( max)
pushdown 3 sets of 12

Db seated curls hammer 4 sets of 8
smith ez bar curls 3 sets of 10


Sunday is legs

Leg press one leg each 4 sets of 10-8-6-6
leg extension 4 sets of 10-12
standing leg curl 4 sets of 10-12

abs


Monday and Tuesday OFF

Wedesday chest and back

T bar rows seated 4 sets 10-8-66
one arm db rows 4 sets of 10-8-6-6
chin ups 3 sets of max

db press incline 4 sets 10-8-6-6
incline press 4 sets 10-8-6-6
bench press 4 sets of 10-8-6-6

Thusday and Friday are OFF then repeat.

I am currently experimenting with various weight to see how my back response to them, right now and pray to god that it last everything is going quit fine.

Diet is has followed most days.

Wake up is 5g of creatine and wait 30 minutes then its 30g of whey protein in water with flax oil and Light force greens supplement.

post workout drink is the same 5g of creatine in grape juice then 30 minutes after whey protein shake this time 50g of protein no flax oil to benefit the insuline spike.

snake is 2 eggs with chicken breast

Lunch time is a tuna sandwish with whole wheat bread.


After noon snake is again one whey protein shake 30g in water


Supper is a chicken sandwish or anything related to chicken LOL


before bed another whey protein shake with flax oil.


I cannot do cardio right now physio orders and i got some re-education posture exercice to do too.

Does that sound good, i lift slow and concentrate on the muscle worked, i try not to involve other muscles and specially the lower back.

I will try to up the intensity too a bit, i am sure that i am not overtraining cause i got plenty of rest and am a computer techicien so my job is not physically demending.

Thank you everyone and if there is something wrong with my diet or training i wont mind some suggestions.

Have a great weekend.

[bluethunder]

Yes ,you can..

[kboxer]

More food protein rather than shakes. Also cut breaks to 30 sec to make your lifting get your heart rate up

[Anhydro78]

What do you mean by great body????

[yannick32]

Building quality mass, no fat gains. I dont mind taking more time to do it.

[Pork Chop]

You simply can't grow if you don't stress the muscle.
You can exhaust it by doing high volume low intensity, but you will bever trigger growth.

[Anhydro78]

I would look into the diet forum for help with that goal. There is a formula to lean muscle gains. But I myself have never been intrested in the concept. I have made myself extremely large and wouldnt have done it any other way. As for your workout, I would cut the machines out all together. That is something that should be supplemented into a workout. But everything I can think of that you would need a machine for can be done with a smith machine. Example your pushdowns and smith machine ez curls. Training with free weights places more stress on the muscle. It also helps with overall bulk appearance. And for the back injury. I myself earlier this year hurt my back. I have allways been into powerlifting. Well I had to start out low like 225lbs with deadlifts and squats and have built my back up to doing 500+lbs for reps on both again. I use to be able to lift alot more but I dont think that is that bad of a come back for it not even being a years time yet. At about 550lbs it seems to place to much stress on my back.

[bluethunder]

Yes of course it can be done but what kind of body is your goal? Quality mass means increasing your intensity ,moderate to heavy free weights. I agree with Anhydro 110% skip the machines except smith & cable. If you are a beginner then machine circuit training is good for getting you conditioned. However, you can still have a great body by doing high volume where strength can be increase and some muscle definition. In conjunction with a proper diet you can get the model look not really huge. Most women prefer muscular men but not too much. Also know if you are trying to get alot of mass you are going to increase fat too . Since you say you do not mind taking a long time then heavy intensity is not required (although I recommend mixing it) and having less calories then the fat % increase will be less too. What works for one may not work for another you need to see what works for you as I am a strong advocate of INSTINCTIVE TRAINING which only comes from time & experimentation. Good luck.

[Pork Chop]

Honest questions:

How do you measure mass quality? Does it range from low to high?

How can you stimulate muscle growth without heavy weights/low intensity?

[yannick32]

What i mean by that is i was 231 pounds with 40 inch waiste, i manage to get down to 180 pounds last month and am now back up to around 187 pounds.

I am gonna eventually get back to heavy lifting, but for now i have to go at it gradually, my incline db press is very good at 70 pounds db for 8 reps so its not light training has you can see, and since i am using creatine right now i can push myself a little bit.

Now if you ask about squats, deadlifts and standing press i just cant do that anymore cause my back is still weak and i dont wanna go true nearly 3 years off training.

I know that if i bench press 40 pounds only the bar i will never build an amazing chest even worst if i shoot for 15 reps.

I am doing the 10-8-6-6 scheme right now.

[The Baron]

You can modify form and get the same stress on the muscle with less weight and less stress on bone and joints. For instance, with BP, don't go all the way up to lockout. When you lock out, you are at a point of skeletal support, and the driving muscles aren't doing anything but resting. So with a rest between each rep, you are capable of lifting more weight. Cutting that rest point out of the exercise means you must use less weight. Ditto any posture that leaves a weight dangling. For instance, doing T-bar rows and letting the arms go all the way down. Keep the elbows back and slightly bent, the upper arm slanted to the rear, and you will always have stress on the targeted muscle. Always avoid points of skeletal support! No dangling, no lockout. Use a slower negative. With flys, keep arms nearly straight. Some guys do them the way I do dumbbell BP! Speaking of, most guys do DB BP with the weights over the chest. NO! The weight and the forearm should be balanced directly over the elbows! If you clack the dummies together at the top, you are doing it wrong, and using more weight than you need. Think form! Forget about how much you can lift... it is all about how much you can stress the targeted muscle in a 45 second set, keeping to your target rep range. You say you can't do squats... try loading up a pair of 100 lb dumbbells and squatting with them but don't go all the way up. When you are almost up, start back down and go almost to where your ass rests on your calves. Try holding for a second, halfway up. Just a measly 200 lbs and I bet you hate me before the set is finished! Form can be manipulated to give a far bigger bang for far less weight.

[jmillerdls]

You can modify form and get the same stress on the muscle with less weight and less stress on bone and joints. For instance, with BP, don't go all the way up to lockout. When you lock out, you are at a point of skeletal support, and the driving muscles aren't doing anything but resting. So with a rest between each rep, you are capable of lifting more weight. Cutting that rest point out of the exercise means you must use less weight. Ditto any posture that leaves a weight dangling. For instance, doing T-bar rows and letting the arms go all the way down. Keep the elbows back and slightly bent, the upper arm slanted to the rear, and you will always have stress on the targeted muscle. Always avoid points of skeletal support! No dangling, no lockout. Use a slower negative. With flys, keep arms nearly straight. Some guys do them the way I do dumbbell BP! Speaking of, most guys do DB BP with the weights over the chest. NO! The weight and the forearm should be balanced directly over the elbows! If you clack the dummies together at the top, you are doing it wrong, and using more weight than you need. Think form! Forget about how much you can lift... it is all about how much you can stress the targeted muscle in a 45 second set, keeping to your target rep range. You say you can't do squats... try loading up a pair of 100 lb dumbbells and squatting with them but don't go all the way up. When you are almost up, start back down and go almost to where your ass rests on your calves. Try holding for a second, halfway up. Just a measly 200 lbs and I bet you hate me before the set is finished! Form can be manipulated to give a far bigger bang for far less weight.

i assumed everyone here was already doing this...I thought manipulating form is when you lockout every rep to give your body a rest...wouldnt think people so concerned with bodybuilding would be doing it this way...

[The Baron]

i assumed everyone here was already doing this...I thought manipulating form is when you lockout every rep to give your body a rest...wouldnt think people so concerned with bodybuilding would be doing it this way...

This guy wants to train but with reduced weight. Cutting out the dangles and lockouts, pausing in the movement and taking a slow negative are ways to do this.

[jmillerdls]

This guy wants to train but with reduced weight. Cutting out the dangles and lockouts, pausing in the movement and taking a slow negative are ways to do this.

no, i understand...i was just saying that i assumed he, along with everyone else here (people that are putting a priority on bodybuilding), would already be doing this, that's all

[The Baron]

no, i understand...i was just saying that i assumed he, along with everyone else here (people that are putting a priority on bodybuilding), would already be doing this, that's all

Most guys I see in gyms are all wound up about the numbers. They would rather do half squats with 8 plates than use 4 plates and a bit more with tight form to get the same result. It is an ego thing I guess... or man's natural urge to compete. I have done lateral raises with 20lb dumbbells and gotten stares from guys built about like me who heave 45lbers up, pausing between reps with arms a-dangle at their sides, tossing the weight up with a full body bounce, bending the elbows a LOT, while I trash my delts using the little pipsqueak weights and entirely different form. Even a lot of guys who have suffered chronic joint injuries still worry too much about the numbers on the plates. So, I never assume that someone is training with tight form. The numbers are addictive!

Ever watch the "benchpress boys" in your local gym? You know who I'm talking about. The guys who think pecs and biceps are the only muscles in the body, and that training them 3 times a week is a recipe for a great physique. This is an extreme example of what I am talking about. Watch how they do BP... the guy spotting is actually doing barbell rows! And they are lifting pretty impressive weights, using that team effort LOL! Pausing at lockout for a good long while, even bouncing the bar off the chest wiggling their asses and trying to throw the weight up with an upper body heave and a twitch of the delts. Watch them scribble in their little notebooks and then talk about the "genetic freaks" who "somehow" manage to build impressive chests pressing 1.25x bodyweight and "hardly ever" train chest! The lie that pounds lifted = muscle gains is very widespread, and sneaks into nearly everyone's training at some time or another.

[ImaBldr]

I've had a few injuries that set me back after years of training hard & regular. In coming back I found that concentrating on form with lighter weights had led to bigger and better things than before the injuries. Some of the lifts were so light I was embarrassed...(good thing I work out @ home!) but for the most part now I'm bigger, stronger and the muscles are better developed. When I do go to a gym w/a buddy I love to jump in w/the "bench boys" and show them how an old man can drop 365 for reps in a nice, slow, & controlled motion. Best of luck & keep working!

[CarvedFromStone]

do a search on DC's (dogcrap) training style, in the short, if u wanna get big u gotta lift big..

[arthurb999]

You need to work calves in there...

[Juggernaut]

do a search on DC's (dogcrap) training style, in the short, if u wanna get big u gotta lift big..

Not starting anything CFS but if you're statement is correct you'll see more gains from lifting 600 pounds on squats for a single rep more than I will by lifting 300 pounds for 10 reps?

[bigbodysa24]

Not starting anything CFS but if you're statement is correct you'll see more gains from lifting 600 pounds on squats for a single rep more than I will by lifting 300 pounds for 10 reps?

well technically you would get better gains in one rep strength with 600 lbs than you would 300 and probably overall muscle mass.....but if we are talking bbing then you will see better lean muscle gains with 300

[MrMondodondo]

Legs I suggest 20 reps a set.

[Juggernaut]

well technically you would get better gains in one rep strength with 600 lbs than you would 300 and probably overall muscle mass.....but if we are talking bbing then you will see better lean muscle gains with 300

Ahhh but there's the rub...which are you after? Strength or mass? My powerlifting days are long gone, due to age and wear of this body so a bodybuilder style of training is more of what I'm looking for.

[Juggernaut]

Legs I suggest 20 reps a set.

how many sets? Usually when using a 20 rep squat it would be a single set however the weight lifted should be in a range you would normally only get ten reps with. For myself, I can lift around 315-355 pounds for ten reps (last working set for my routine) lifting that poundage for 20 FULL reps I can assure you I can only do once. We are talking about the 20 reps that once you start you do not stop or rack the weight until all 20 reps are completed correct?

[goodtobeapimp]

I grew a hell of a lot more when I was more into powerlifting and eating a ton of calories then I ever have eating adequate calories and training for QUALITY size.

Since you are restricted to certain training methods right now. Honestly, I'd prolly try to lower my bf% and tighten everything up,then when things are a little more user friendly i'd plan on bulking and lifting heavier. It would give you a chance to heal and get your body back into condition...I realize you can't do cardio but that doesn't mean you can't diet or train accordingly...Good luck and decide what's best for you...Everyone is different.