DC training

**HOLLYWOOD** · 12-15-2004, 10:19 PM

ok i have question about the doggcrapp training, im looking at this as 3 seperate sets by themselves! ok the first set of the 3 is in the range of 8-10 now does this first serve as the hypertrophy set per say, and do the lower rep range sets serve as strength sets to improve strength is this how it works! i know that your skeletal muscle system and CNS doesnt know weight but the stress that it has to deal with!!! so i would like to know how these 3 sets serve as if you were to disect them into individual sets according the rep ranges given by dante!

**In-Human** · 12-16-2004, 09:00 AM

Why do you need to overanalyze this so much, these sets are for strength and size, that is the idea here, to go to positive and negative total momentary muscle failure, this with mass amounts of protein and rest will make you grow, and grow fast, plain and simple, no need to bring science in, just lift and lift hard...

**SwoleCat** · 12-16-2004, 10:23 AM

Dang bro, people can't even ask questions?

~SC~

**HOLLYWOOD** · 12-16-2004, 01:03 PM

im not trying to overanalyze this im trying to get a deep understanding of this program is this too much to ask??? in order to understand something you need to know the mechanics behind it!

SWOLECAT can you answer this question i have, i know you dont know much about DC training but just take the rest/puase try to analyse this part of it, ill give you a run down! ok you take a weight you can push for 8reps rest 15-20sec, 3-4reps rest for 15-20 sec,1-2reps .... now i want to know is do the last 2 set in this giant set act as strength sets because of the low rep range or does this not count because of the quick breaks, or does it count as strength sets because it's only a 15sec break??? this is what i want to know! i want to know why it makes you stronger i believe this type of training does however i dont know the mechanics of why it makes you stronger! because the first set is based on higher reps then there's the lower reps come into play after the first set but can these account for the strength increase??? or like i said or is the 15sec breaks just gonna make you more cardio vascular fit because you're not using optimum strength you could be starting fresh in a set!! see what i meen???

**SwoleCat** · 12-16-2004, 03:50 PM

I'd say go to the source of the info, as I've no idea and don't speculate.

~SC~

**HOLLYWOOD** · 12-16-2004, 05:02 PM

ok thanks anyway!

**In-Human** · 12-16-2004, 06:01 PM

Originally Posted by SwoleCat

Dang bro, people can't even ask questions?

~SC~

Did you not have a thread where you complained about people asking over and over again the same **** and questioning you, I am on 20 boards a day helping others with this program so it gets a bit tedious when its over ananlyzed to death, the program works, either you do it or not, no need for a microscope here, its not brain surgery...

**SwoleCat** · 12-16-2004, 06:20 PM

CAPS......

Originally Posted by In-Human

Did you not have a thread where you complained about people asking over and over again the same **** and questioning you,

NO, I DIDN'T. NO ONE WAS EVER QUESTIONING ME, I HAD PEOPLE OUTRIGHT FLAMING AN OFFERING, BUT THAT IS TOTALLY DIFFERENT AS THOSE WERE "HATERS" COMING OUT TO PLAY FOR THE FUN OF IT. THIS ON THE OTHER HAND, WAS A PERSON ASKING VALID QUESTIONS ABOUT A PROGRAM. IF I WOULD HAVE RECEIVED VALID QUESTIONS, I'D HAVE ANSWERED THEM. HUGE DIFFERENCE THERE.

AS WELL, I MERELY ASKED A QUESTION ABOVE, NO NEED TO GET ALL AGITATED/HOSTILE. IF YOU CAN'T ANSWER, OR DON'T HAVE TIME, THEN YOU SHOULD EXPLAIN YOURSELF, IT'S BETTER THAT WAY.

I am on 20 boards a day helping others with this program so it gets a bit tedious when its over ananlyzed to death,

THEN PERHAPS YOU SHOULD CUT BACK YOUR INTERNET TIME, OR GET PAID FOR ASSISTING DC. UNLESS YOU ARE DC HIMSELF?

WHATEVER THE CASE, WHAT GOOD IS IT TO "HELP" OTHERS IF YOU CAN'T HELP EQUALLY EVERYWHERE? WITH A POPULAR METHOD, PEOPLE ARE GOING TO ASK QUESTIONS, SO YOU HAVE TO BE PREPARED TO ANSWER THEM, THAT IS, IF YOU CARE TO DO SO. IF NOT, THEN SO BE IT, IT WAS JUST AN OBSERVATION.

the program works, either you do it or not, no need for a microscope here, its not brain surgery...

WELL, NOT EVERYONE UNDERSTANDS IT AND THEY WILL ASK QUESTIONS. I'VE SEEN MANY THREADS WITH PEOPLE CONFUSED ABOUT THIS STYLE OF TRAINING, AND THEY DO THE COMMON SENSE THING WHICH IS TO ASK. ALL THE GUY DID WAS ASK A FEW QUESTIONS. HE WASN'T CHALLENGING ANYTHING ABOUT THE STYLE/PROGRAM/ETC., AS WAS THE CASE W/MY THREAD A WEEK OR SO BACK, BUT HE WAS MERELY INQUISITIVE. THERE'S A BIG DIFFERENCE.

Relax, you are getting worked up over nada. All I was doing was trying to get this guy a little help.
~SC~

**HOLLYWOOD** · 12-16-2004, 09:39 PM

Originally Posted by In-Human

Did you not have a thread where you complained about people asking over and over again the same **** and questioning you, I am on 20 boards a day helping others with this program so it gets a bit tedious when its over ananlyzed to death, the program works, either you do it or not, no need for a microscope here, its not brain surgery...

ya know what homie, are you that ignorant to just do something because someone says it works! well im sorry im not that ignorant and if im reading about doing something i want to know how it works, and yes i want to look at it under a "microscope" because i try my best to succeed in everything i do no matter what it is and if i can get a deep understanding on something to help me apply it better than i will! you dont wanna help then fine DON'T! but this raises some curiousity, is the reason why you're not answering me and flamin on me because you're just an ***hole or is it because you just don't know the answer and you're embarrassed because you're dante's "right hand man"???
and second i thought this was a question board where people go for help on issues they are not clear on???

**In-Human** · 12-16-2004, 10:14 PM

Originally Posted by crosby7117

ya know what homie, are you that ignorant to just do something because someone says it works! well im sorry im not that ignorant and if im reading about doing something i want to know how it works, and yes i want to look at it under a "microscope" because i try my best to succeed in everything i do no matter what it is and if i can get a deep understanding on something to help me apply it better than i will! you dont wanna help then fine DON'T! but this raises some curiousity, is the reason why you're not answering me and flamin on me because you're just an ***hole or is it because you just don't know the answer and you're embarrassed because you're dante's "right hand man"???
and second i thought this was a question board where people go for help on issues they are not clear on???

I am not DC's right hand man, and who the hell has helped you more than anyone with this program, yea I wonder, good luck with your training...

Swellin · 12-16-2004, 10:47 PM

Geez! I missed out on the flaming part of this. I certainly didn't see IH's comment to be as negative as it was taken.

Crosby, I have witnessed your questions on this, so I know the history. Why not go over to IntenseMuscle and ask these exact same questions in the forum dedicated to DC training, and headed up by Dante himself?

As SC said, if you don't like the answers you are getting...go to the source.

Good luck with your training.

**HOLLYWOOD** · 12-16-2004, 10:54 PM

Originally Posted by In-Human

I am not DC's right hand man, and who the hell has helped you more than anyone with this program, yea I wonder, good luck with your training...

dude you didnt even try to help with the question! all you told me was it works so do it! ok can i ask you this question again now we got all of this out in the open, do you know the answer to my question?? if you have any info regarding this topic it would be greatly appriciated! thanks

**HOLLYWOOD** · 12-16-2004, 10:57 PM

Originally Posted by In-Human

I am not DC's right hand man, and who the hell has helped you more than anyone with this program, yea I wonder, good luck with your training...

ya i has been greatly appriciated and thats y i dont understand the response i got from you regarding my question!

**IronReload04** · 12-20-2004, 08:06 PM

bump, interesting question

**HOLLYWOOD** · 12-20-2004, 08:31 PM

Originally Posted by IronReload04

bump, interesting question

agreed! thank you sir! an answer would be greatly appreciated!

**Hypertrophy** · 12-21-2004, 02:51 PM

Originally Posted by crosby7117

im not trying to overanalyze this im trying to get a deep understanding of this program is this too much to ask??? in order to understand something you need to know the mechanics behind it!

SWOLECAT can you answer this question i have, i know you dont know much about DC training but just take the rest/puase try to analyse this part of it, ill give you a run down! ok you take a weight you can push for 8reps rest 15-20sec, 3-4reps rest for 15-20 sec,1-2reps .... now i want to know is do the last 2 set in this giant set act as strength sets because of the low rep range or does this not count because of the quick breaks, or does it count as strength sets because it's only a 15sec break??? this is what i want to know! i want to know why it makes you stronger i believe this type of training does however i dont know the mechanics of why it makes you stronger! because the first set is based on higher reps then there's the lower reps come into play after the first set but can these account for the strength increase??? or like i said or is the 15sec breaks just gonna make you more cardio vascular fit because you're not using optimum strength you could be starting fresh in a set!! see what i meen???

I'll explain what I know from a physiological standpoint since you keep questioning. I would say that the rest pause sets do NOT act as strength sets. The reason being is that your CNS is fried and you are totally depleted of ATP-PC, therefore force production is going to dramatically suffer. This is why you are only getting 1-4 reps after you just completed 8-10 reps, it is simply fatigue. One way to get stronger is fiber recruitment. Since your CNS is fried, the motor neuron is NOT going to send a maximal signal to the muscle fibers to activate all of them. Also, the energy to perfrom the contraction (ATP-PC) is not recovered either. I believe the reason you get stronger is the most simplistic principle of exercise. Overload: For a training adaptation to occur, a physiological system must be exercised at a level beyond that to which it is presently accustomed. The rest pause sets are a new and unaccustomed stimulus. Therefore, you are overloading your system by doing this. Because you are not fully recovered from your working set, when performing the rest pause sets, this philosphy of not letting your ATP-PC stores fully recovered leads directly to hypertrophy. We know that as the cross sectional area of the muscle increases, force production increases. That is where I think the strength increase comes from. Hope this might help you, and if this is totally incorrect, maybe the originator of the program can clarify~

**IronReload04** · 12-21-2004, 05:25 PM

quality answer bro. seems logical enough

**HOLLYWOOD** · 12-21-2004, 09:31 PM

Originally Posted by Hypertrophy

I'll explain what I know from a physiological standpoint since you keep questioning. I would say that the rest pause sets do NOT act as strength sets. The reason being is that your CNS is fried and you are totally depleted of ATP-PC, therefore force production is going to dramatically suffer. This is why you are only getting 1-4 reps after you just completed 8-10 reps, it is simply fatigue. One way to get stronger is fiber recruitment. Since your CNS is fried, the motor neuron is NOT going to send a maximal signal to the muscle fibers to activate all of them. Also, the energy to perfrom the contraction (ATP-PC) is not recovered either. I believe the reason you get stronger is the most simplistic principle of exercise. Overload: For a training adaptation to occur, a physiological system must be exercised at a level beyond that to which it is presently accustomed. The rest pause sets are a new and unaccustomed stimulus. Therefore, you are overloading your system by doing this. Because you are not fully recovered from your working set, when performing the rest pause sets, this philosphy of not letting your ATP-PC stores fully recovered leads directly to hypertrophy. We know that as the cross sectional area of the muscle increases, force production increases. That is where I think the strength increase comes from. Hope this might help you, and if this is totally incorrect, maybe the originator of the program can clarify~

great info bro thanks! do you believe that rest - pause sets is the best way to develope hypertrophy?

**Hypertrophy** · 12-22-2004, 03:50 PM

Originally Posted by crosby7117

great info bro thanks! do you believe that rest - pause sets is the best way to develope hypertrophy?

There is no "best way." It is the accumulative affect of effective training.

**HOLLYWOOD** · 12-22-2004, 04:27 PM

Originally Posted by Hypertrophy

There is no "best way." It is the accumulative affect of effective training.

ok very true! allow me to refrase the question is this specific way of training effective?

**lionel** · 12-22-2004, 10:19 PM

Originally Posted by crosby7117

ok very true! allow me to refrase the question is this specific way of training effective?

It is effective for me as several of dc's trainees will vouch for, but at the same time there are those who trash it. Cuts both ways. You have people with opinions both sides. The only way is to try it to a T and see for yourself.

**HOLLYWOOD** · 12-22-2004, 11:07 PM

are static holds a must when training with this program?

**lionel** · 12-23-2004, 05:59 AM

No. They are not a must. And i quote DC:"Honestly guys the static means very little in the grand scheme of things (dont sweat the small stuff here)

Alot of people do it different ways I notice and i really dont correct them on it to much--time under tension--some exercises i wait and breathe and some exercises i do the statics right after the last rep---your not doing anything progressive on the static--its not like you can log it and try to beat it.....now if we are talking about the logbook--thats something you got to worry about--because thats your arch enemy"

**JdFlex** · 12-23-2004, 07:39 AM

I don't do the static holds.

Swellin · 12-23-2004, 02:49 PM

I do statics, because the RP's don't fully get me what I want. I was considering increasing the frequency of training to 4 days a week M/T/TH/F, but IH talked me out of it. He talked me into doing statics, and it really helped me. No need to increase frequency, just the intensity (by adding statics).

The way you can compete against your previous lift on statics is by trying to go for a longer time before failure. I write down the duration on stitcs in my logbook, and force myself to beat the previous time (unless I have increased the weight for my RP's, as i use the same weight for statics as RP's).

**In-Human** · 12-23-2004, 05:15 PM

You can also take less breaths in between the RP workset and the static, this will make that much harder...

**mitch911** · 12-24-2004, 05:31 PM

sorry to hijack but for the rest pause would u pick a weight that u can do 15 reps with and do the rest pause thing or do u choose a weight that you can do 8 and then do the rest pause and sqeeze in more reps?

**HOLLYWOOD** · 12-24-2004, 10:42 PM

Originally Posted by mitch911

sorry to hijack but for the rest pause would u pick a weight that u can do 15 reps with and do the rest pause thing or do u choose a weight that you can do 8 and then do the rest pause and sqeeze in more reps?

8-3-1 for example for a total of 12

**In-Human** · 12-25-2004, 12:19 AM

Originally Posted by mitch911

sorry to hijack but for the rest pause would u pick a weight that u can do 15 reps with and do the rest pause thing or do u choose a weight that you can do 8 and then do the rest pause and sqeeze in more reps?

The main idea here is to be able to use the heaviest weight you can with perfect form to concentrate on the negative portion of the movement, explosive positive and a controlled negative, so you will have to find the weight to use for each exercise the first two rotations, this is a drop your ego and pick a weight you can concentrate on that form, most RP worksets will be 11-15 reps and a few 15-20 unless you are going very high with 15-30 for the total number of reps. Just try to get the desired reps in the worksets, each RP workset numbers will vary from person to person...

**mitch911** · 12-25-2004, 10:33 AM

so if i take bench press for example...i can do 8 sets with 200 then i rest for 20 sec ...throw on more weight which will allow me to lift 3 reps and then rest for 20 sec..and then add more weight to do 1 rep?

**In-Human** · 12-25-2004, 12:55 PM

Originally Posted by mitch911

so if i take bench press for example...i can do 8 sets with 200 then i rest for 20 sec ...throw on more weight which will allow me to lift 3 reps and then rest for 20 sec..and then add more weight to do 1 rep?

Yes since you are trying to lift as heavy as possible with constant progression then you would take say Bench Press with 200x7x3x2 RP, so that means you took 200 and you did explosive positive and a controlled negative like 2-4 seconds for 7 reps, then when you fail on the last positive rep, you will slowly lower that bar as slow as possible in 5-8 seconds, rack it, take 5-15 deep breaths, grab that weight again and get as many more reps as possible in the same fashion, say you get 3, finish on the negative, rack it, take 5-15 deep breaths, grab that weight one more time and do it again, say you get 1 or 2 reps, finish on the negative, now your RP workset is completed, if you do a static rep after 5-15 deep breaths then grab that same weight and hold it at the strongest point of that movement for 30 seconds, then rack it, done. As long as you are getting the rep scheme done for that particular exercise is what matters, for Chest its 11-15 reps total...

Swellin · 12-25-2004, 01:47 PM

Just to clarify...you do not change the weight. Use whatever iweight it takes to get into the desired total rep range. As IH said, this will take you a couple of rotations to figure out how much weight to use. I suggest spending your fiurst month soing straight sets and getting a feel for the program. During that month, slowly add in RP sets to get a better feel for it. This way you will have a much better handle on what you are doing before you try and go all out with RP's and statics.