PICS programs

[SayHelotomylilFriend]

Hi all I need to choose a new program.
I would like you to comment these two option I have.

I've been overtraining for 1 month and half so I decided to change it.
Here are two programs I am interrested in, but I don't know which one to choose. Help me. You may also suggest new setup if you think It'd be better.


My Specs as of April 2005
Sex: Male
Age: 20
weight: 160 pounds - 72.6 kg
height: 1.83 meters
Current Bodybuilding objective: Gain Mass

Routine: 3 days ON, 1 days OFF

(You may comment my routine also)



Which one is best? :

Workout#1: seperated in 3 days (about 45min to 1h00 per workout)


Workout #2: seperated in 4 days (about 45min per workout)



Are my rep/series good ? Are my exercices good and in good order ? Are my trained body part fit good togetter in a day ? Am I overtraining, under-training? is My routine of 3 days ON, 1 day Off good ? etc..


I personnaly prefer my Workout #1 as I can do both Pec,Biceps,Triceps in days one.. but I'm not sure if this is a good thing.

[Prime]

way to many exercises especially id you are doing a 3 on one off. id do maybe a third of that. You dont need to do 5+ exercises for your shoulders!
i really dont like either at all.

[SayHelotomylilFriend]

so you mean that you do only 2 exercices per muscle group ?

[SayHelotomylilFriend]

We don't anybody help me ??

I did a super-cute program on photoshop and printed + scanned it for you to get good advices but it seems that no one (except Prime, thanks Prime) will help me

what do you need more ??? a video of me training ? please guyz take a minute to comment my training

[Hypertrophy]

Do workout #2, which is a 4-day split and arrange it like this:
Back/Bi's
Chest/Tri's
Off
Legs
Shoulders/Forearms

[SwoleCat]

We don't anybody help me ??

I did a super-cute program on photoshop and printed + scanned it for you to get good advices but it seems that no one (except Prime, thanks Prime) will help me

what do you need more ??? a video of me training ? please guyz take a minute to comment my training

May wanna wait more than 3 hours to lose all hope.

Rome wasn't even built in one day.

~SC~

[SayHelotomylilFriend]

Hypertrophy said:
Do workout #2, which is a 4-day split and arrange it like this:
Back/Bi's
Chest/Tri's
Off
Legs
Shoulders/Forearms

Thanks Hypertrophy!
If im right, you suggest me to go with a 2 ON, 1 OFF routine ?
I like it, but I'm scared to take it, for fear of under-training.. Isn't it ?
I need to get MASS, lots and lots of mass. At the moment I'm natural but I will start my first cycle soon.
Here's the program you suggest me.
Thanks!

Hypertrophy program:

[SayHelotomylilFriend]

I am so uncertain of what is OverTraining and Undertraning ! I Can't figure out how to choose a program that won't be either over or undertraining!

[SayHelotomylilFriend]

Should I do a routine of 2 Days on, 1 day OFF ??
Because I splitted my program in 4 days, and that I do only 2 muscle group per workout, would'nt a routine of 3 ON, 1 Off be better ?
I ask because I don't want to be "under-training" ... Nor I want to be "Over-training" neither.

help me

[Hypertrophy]

Thanks Hypertrophy!
If im right, you suggest me to go with a 2 ON, 1 OFF routine ?
I like it, but I'm scared to take it, for fear of under-training.. Isn't it ?
I need to get MASS, lots and lots of mass. At the moment I'm natural but I will start my first cycle soon.
Here's the program you suggest me.
Thanks!

Hypertrophy program:
[IMG][/IMG]

Yes, that program looks perfect as far as the split goes. Limit some of your exercises. I would suggest 2-3 compound pressing movements and finish with 1 assistance or single joint movement. Put your compound movements first, then assistance exercises, like flyes, extensions, etc. You need to refine your ordering of exercises and exercise selection. A good back would go something like this:
Bar Bent Rows/Deads
Chins/Bent Rows
Deads/Bar Bent Rows
Lat Pulls/Seated Rows
. . . something of that sort.
Then limit the bicep and tricep work. You will be pre-exhausted, so 9 sets would be more then plenty. Do three exercise, three sets.
Bicep after back day "may" look like this:
D-bell Curls
Preacher Curl
Hammers
Tri's:
Close-Grip Bench
Skull Crushers
Dip/Pressdowns
On shoulder day do traps before forearms for gripping purposes. An upper limit for large muscle groups is approximately 16-20 sets. Small ones are 6-12 sets, these number vary. I've done 20 sets before, 16, 40+ sets (yes in one workout). Make those adjustments and post it again, and somebody will critique. . .

[apexed37]

way to many exercises especially id you are doing a 3 on one off. id do maybe a third of that. You dont need to do 5+ exercises for your shoulders!
i really dont like either at all.

no offense bro but you couldnt be more wrong about the shoulders. there is 3 parts of your shoulder and i do about 2 exercises for each part. total of about 6 sets. no body is the same, shoulders are my main weakness so i blast them, and to say a 3rd of his workout in workout #2?? if your natural, like me, you work your ass off, you dont do about 3 sets for each muscle and call it a day

[Prime]

no offense bro but you couldnt be more wrong about the shoulders. there is 3 parts of your shoulder and i do about 2 exercises for each part. total of about 6 sets. no body is the same, shoulders are my main weakness so i blast them, and to say a 3rd of his workout in workout #2?? if your natural, like me, you work your ass off, you dont do about 3 sets for each muscle and call it a day

I actually do between 2-4 sets per muscle. I see no reason to do 30+ sets training shoulders. Thats simply overtraining. The deltoid muscle is divided into three heads, posterior, anterior and medial but at the end of the day its still a small musclegroup and i see no reason to lay waste to it with a ridiculous amount of work. End of teh day you grow when out of the gym. ALl you need to do in the gym is to provide a bit of stimulus. I am natural, and i do train Hard. But theres a difference between training hard and training long.

[SayHelotomylilFriend]

I actually do between 2-4 sets per muscle. I see no reason to do 30+ sets training shoulders. Thats simply overtraining. The deltoid muscle is divided into three heads, posterior, anterior and medial but at the end of the day its still a small musclegroup and i see no reason to lay waste to it with a ridiculous amount of work. End of teh day you grow when out of the gym. ALl you need to do in the gym is to provide a bit of stimulus. I am natural, and i do train Hard. But theres a difference between training hard and training long.

Training hard and long is what I do...

But I don't do 30+ sets for my shoulders. Here's what I do:
Shoulders Shoulder Dumbell Press 3 x 10
Shoulders Shoulder Front Raise with cable 1 arm 3 x 10
Shoulders Shoulder Lateral Raise with cable 1 arm 3 x 10
Shoulders Military Press 2 x 8
Shoulders lateral bent oiseau (sur le bout d'un banc) 3 x 8
Shoulders Seated Rear Jug Lateral (pichet) 3 x 8

6 exercises
total sets: 17

Main Shoulder muscle:
-Shoulder Dumbell Press
-Military Press
-Seated Rear Jug Lateral

lateral Shoulder Muscle:
-Shoulder Lateral Raise with cable 1 arm

Front Shoulder Muscle:
-Front Shoulder Lateral Raise with cable 1 arm

Back Shoulder Muscle:
-lateral bent

And by the way ... I though that Overtraining could only be possible when we were training to Often a muscle in a week... Not to much in a workout.

Please clarify on that, I would like to be sure that i'm not overtraining my Shoulders.

[SwoleCat]

D*mn, and all I do is 3-4 sets of side lateral raises after heavy inclines.



~SC~

[SayHelotomylilFriend]

D*mn, and all I do is 3-4 sets of side lateral raises after heavy inclines.



~SC~

What is the exercises you mean by incline ?

[SayHelotomylilFriend]

And by the way ... I though that Overtraining could only be possible when we were training to Often a muscle in a week... Not to much in a workout.

Please clarify on that, I would like to be sure that i'm not overtraining my Shoulders.

[SwoleCat]

You can over-train a bodypart in one workout, yes, people do it all the time.

They usually also over-train numerous bodyparts on consecutive days, and fry the h*ll out of their respective central nervous systems.

~SC~

[SayHelotomylilFriend]

You can over-train a bodypart in one workout, yes, people do it all the time.

They usually also over-train numerous bodyparts on consecutive days, and fry the h*ll out of their respective central nervous systems.

~SC~

Oh really ?!.. I did not think that you could overtrain a muscle in one workout.. and that even when having a 2-3 days rest for that muscle..

Could you please tell me "how" can I OverTrain a muscle in One Workout ?

for exemple look at my current workout and tell me if i'm overtraining or undertraining... my routine is 3 days ON, 1 days OFF