how much assistance does a smith machine give?

[clockworks]

see subject line. i wanna start doing squats on a smith machine so i can go closer to failure without the fear of being crushed and people laughing at me...=)

-- clocky baby

[GetPsycho]

the smith takes your stabalizers out of the question. you can take advantage of this by doing smith squats dead last on a leg day.

the barbell is more effective in my opinion, but the smith is much safer. also, the smith is been argued by some to teach bad from since it doesnt allow for natural motion, its movement is straight up and straight down, there is no give

i would start on the smith but transition to the cage

[chicamahomico]

I remain unconvinced, for years actually, that a Smith machine is any safer than a barbell in a rack. I think people say it's safer cause it lessens the chance of a falling or 'dropping the weight' injury but I think that is way to large a price to pay for a machine that I believe fucks up your joints in the long run. Goofiest goddamn machine anyway, I can't see why anyone would want to use it.

[chicamahomico]

i wanna start doing squats on a smith machine so i can go closer to failure without the fear of being crushed and people laughing at me

Haha sorry about my first post, went off on a tangent when you got me thinking about Smith machines. To answer you original question: You can't tell how much difference their is, machines will vary with the assistance they provide. That and you are sort of sliding the weight along a track rather than pushing straight up. Set the pins in the squat rack would be an even safer way to go, since you can't get crushed that way.

[bigol'legs]

I like using the smith machine for squats every now and then. Just make sure you put your feet pretty far out front. And most state the weight on it. I think the cybex one in my gym is 15 lbs.

[GetPsycho]

the smith in my gym is 15.

[xxxl83]

Getpyscho pretty much summed it all up.

The smith machine is a waste of time, it won't help you strengthen your stablizing muscles which is the cause as to why most people are injury prone when doing barbell squats.
Second it WILL ruin your form because it's a fixed range of motion and limits bar travel.

As for is it safer? Depends on how you look at it. If you look at it from my point of view No it's not safer at all because, by not training your stablizers you're not giving your body the chance to grow and get stronger evenly and proportionately. Which will lead to problems down the line.

If you're worried about saftey use the squat rack with the pins set at the proper depth, and use the correct weight. Don't try to over do it.

Just my .02

xxxl83

[Diesel]

I would use a power rack in place of the smith machine for failure. (Providing your gym has one)
Set the bars up properly and when you fail, just let it drop off behind you.

D

[Juggernaut]

The Smith we have in our gym is kind of angled so you move in a somewhat more natural form. I like using it when I don't have a spotter and because I can step more forward and isolate the quads for a change of pace.

I would for sure agree a cage is a lot more beneficial but when all you have is a Smith why not use it once you get to a weight that's just too heavy to lift alone.

[Special "K"]

What about hitting the stabilizers too? I get on the adductor/inflexor machines (yeah, they aren't very manly, but you gotta do what you gotta do) for 3 sets apiece. This, in addition to the Smith squats and leg press seem to hit it all pretty good.

[talon]

Fifteen pounds for Nautilus, Eagle Claw, Cybex, Hammer Strength, and Med-ex smith machines. I hope this helps.