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For the past 6 months or so, I have lost a lot of bicep size because it seems like I cant hit the muscle anymore. Ive tried every variation of grip and wrist position, different bars, different techniques, reps, weight, and I just cant seem to hit it anymore. It feels like I am working my forearm no matter what I do... anybody have this problem?
Suggestions?
thanks
how thick are the grips on your weight?? I know if they are to thick itll work your forearms harder and not your biceps.. also try hanging a arm over a seated bench to really concetrate on your bicep.Quote:
Originally Posted by Icarus
What does your routine look like now? What exercises do you usually hit?
Yeah i get this, i always do close grips and squeeze the bicep on the way up.... but concentrations rip`
the bar width is pretty standard, around an inch diameter....
ive tried the bench thing and no luck....
my routine looks like this:
Monday:
Squats, 3x8
Leg Extensions, 3x8
Ham Curls, 3x8
Calve Raises
Tuesday:
Flat Bench, 3x8
Dumbbell Shoulder Press, 3x8
Flies, 3x8
Lateral Raises, 3x8
Bent Over Tricep Extension, 3x8
Tricep Pushdown, 3x8
Wednesday
Cardio 45 minutes
Thursday
Pullups, 25
Front Pulldowns, 3x8
Deadlifts, 3x8
Barbell Curls, 3x8 <------currently doing this, seems to be most (but not much) effective
Machine Preacher Curls, 3x8
Upright Rows, 3x8
Friday
Off
Saturday
Cardio, 45 Minutes
Kneeling Crunches, 4x12
Leg Raises, as many as I can
Sunday
Off
I was planning on overhaulling my routine, and Id love for your advice, I was going to make another thread about it as I really need to get my biceps pumping. thanks
Quote:
Originally Posted by nusiot
is that working for you?
I dont know what happened, I used to be able to do curls and kill my biceps, but now its like Im working nothing, or just my forearms.
If you only feel it in your forearms, you may want to look at your wrists during the movement, they should not move at all.
IMO biceps are a triky part to train. Its not the weight or the sort of exercise you do, but its the form. Whatevere you are doing make sure your form is spot on ok, even if you have to lift "light" look like weights make sure your form is correct. Once you have your form righ then you can figure out how heavy to go and not to go.
gear, that's funny that you posted about making sure you're strict in doing biceps, i go to the opposite end of the spectrum, i find that with myself, my bi's only grow when i do cheat curls, but boy, do they respond! read about this in arnold's encyclopedia, put a weight on the bar you can handle for two or three strict reps, then keep going, doing as little cheating as necessary to keep the set going, i usually aim for 8 reps, i think arnold said at one point he was doing sets with 275lbs!
As far as I know bro, having the right form and strictness in training is very important. If you want to start lifting 275lbs dumbells and start pulling your shoulder out of place, or start getting elbow pains and twisting your arm coz your form and strictness is totally wrong, then go ahead. Is this all worth doing just for growth? Or you can just go with the lower weight, and do it strict and get good results without the risks of injuries. And bro, dont go with what every1 says ok. Maybe Arnold liked to cheat a bit coz thats what his body responded well to, but that doesnt nesserely mean its like that for every1 else. As far as I know, these days and all through the bodybuilding years, most professional bodybuilders if not all have trained all their life with great form and strictness. Dont you ever read muscle magazines? Nearly every single issue in all sort of muscle magz, have always mentioned about most important things in training like diet, training strict, having the proper form, and all other sorts of hints n tips. These things are always metioned in muscle magz. This is the 1st time I have heard that non-strictness and inproper form works. But heym if it works for you bro, then go ahead. I wasted my 1st year of bodybuilding for no reason simply coz I had no idea on how to train. But I think thats just a newbie thing. Like i said, if it works for you then use it.
-Gear
No doubt that every now and then we all cheat sometimes by not having the right from, and the correct strictness. I am sure that even pro bodybuilders do that sometimes. But not having the right form, and no strictness all the time is something I totally disagree on.
IMHO, bicep workouts should contain barbell curls and hammer curls. maybe work on your width and the rest will be behind it.
Like it has already been mentioned - WATCH YOUR FORM. Sometimes in the persuit of progressive pounds, some lose sight of proper form that got them to their current development.
Grab an Olympic Bar without any weight on it. Put a couple 5lbs plates between your elbows and torso and begin curling - if you move your elbows the weights will smash your toes... a good way to focus on form and less on the weight (well... the weight on the bar rather than the plates threatening your toes!).
Now start adding resistance but focusing on that same perfect form. In all your working sets you should be able to pause at anytime during the positve or negative range and be able to hold it for a count. If you can't, then momentum is most likely being used - which takes the load off the muscle. You want to use constant tension - keep pumping up the muscle without allowing the load to be taken off the muscle group by stopping at the end of each rep or pulling back with your lower back to rest it on your bone structure.
A few things for you to consider...
thanks Warrior,
should I keep my elbow strictly pinned to my side, or allow them to move back and forwards a bit (in control) at the begining and halfway through the curl?
Keep them pinned to your side...Quote:
Originally Posted by Icarus
I was just discussing form today to someone at the gym... the analogy I came up with went like this...
When your body is put through extreme stress it wants to find the best way to cope. If I were to set you on fire, your first instinct would not be to run to the water fountain and throw dribbles of water onto your body. You would panic and roll on the floor - or whatever way you could employ to immediatly end the threat to your body.
Basically, the same thing happens during resistance training. Your body starts to panic... it shakes, quivers - trys to recruit larger and/or supporting muscle groups to make the movement easier. Curling a Barbell using just your Biceps requires a lot of focus when your body natually wants to find the best path to get the bar from point A to point B... but your goal is to get the bar from one point to the other isolating one muscle group... in this case, the Biceps. You have to fight that primal instinct to try and make the exercise easier. This mind-muscle connection is something that also strengthens in time... so long as you keep making proper form a priority in your training...
One thing I always do - and advocate to others is to not only begin with very light warm ups to warm the joints and localize blood flow - but to set the stage for proper form. The form used with a very light resistance should mirror the form used on the working sets.
geez, didn't expect a tirade about being a newbie! j/k I'm a newbie on this board but i've been training for 10 years, and have tried a lot of different things, not because someone said to do them, but through trial and error have found what works best for me, that is all is what i was saying, i also realize that when someone reccomends an unorthodox training method, like doing cheat curls, certain people, who are hopelessly locked into their mindset will tell you that you must be a stupid new person, so many bros are so quick to jump on others and rip their ideas, which is why for a long time i didn't want to post here, all i said was cheating worked really well for me on a certain movement, and it was something he may want to consider, i used the arnold reference to give it some creedence
For me biceps are like anything else.. They only grow when i go heavy with very strict form. I like my work sets between 3-7 reps for any exercise.
i like to keep my rep range for upper body around 5-6, if i start getting 7 reps i move up in weight, i only use cheating techniques on bb curls, upright rows, and bent over row, if it didn't work, i wouldn't use it, i'm not saying it would work for everyone, but i have noticed that after 6 weeks of "cheating" i can go back to strict movements and am noticably stronger on those movements without cheating
Bro no flames ok, I wasnt thinking of you as a newbie. And I wasnt calling you a "stupid new person" lol. All I was doing is giving you my advice from my opinions that suit me best when I train. And in most cases suit most of other people best also. I didnt say you were wrong, I just said that I did not agree with cheating, inproper form etc etc. Didnt you see what I wrote. I said... "Like i said, if it works for you then use it". I never said NO YOUR WRONG, YOUR A STUPID NEW PERSON, DO WHAT I TELL YOU COZ I KNOW BEST. I was just telling you what my opinion was, and basically also said whatever works for you best, you do that. Peace out :)
-Gear
The only reason i don't like the idea of cheating is that it's really a good way to get injured..
so I tried all your suggestions with not too much luck, I used very light weight and still felt nothing..... I think I have these problems.
-Im seeming to use my shoulders for the curling in almost a semi-shrug type manner.
-I have carpal tunnel syndrome from computer use
-Its difficult to keep my wrists straight, although I did today
im still lifting with my forearms on barbell curls.... any help guys?
thanks again
guys-
ive watched numerous workout videos and none of the pros use that strict of form. They all say they do in the mags yeah, so would I, but when it comes down to it, they cheat just like the rest of us when it comes down to those last two reps.
You can't possibly be curling it all the way up with your forearms. It would be impossible, you've got to use your bicep at some point. I think your problem is weak forearms.. you're really overusing them in the motion, they're just weak, so they get sore. some day far away from bicep or back day in your workout scheme, do forearm exercises.
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisAdams
i wish you were right, but I think the problem is my forearms are TOO strong and tend to think they need to be doing the curling. my forearms are very big and strong..... i need a way to get them out of it
just my opinion but why not try bi's and tri's together? i mean you are doing 5days on , and if your doing them after back you bi's might be so burnt out that when its time for them your forearms go into play, try out using cable movements in your routine..good luck
IMO - take some time off... get plenty of good food and sleepfor a few days and then start again... part of this may be due to overtraining on either a physical or psycological level... very common. Begin with a load that is easy enough to finish a targeted rep range... like 60% of your 1 RM for 10 reps. And then start progressively adding weight again in small incriments. If you started the first workout day with 70 pounds for 10 reps, 4 sets... the next session do 75 pounds for 10 reps, 4 sets... then 80 for 10... so on and so forth. This can hopefully help you reconnect some of the loss in the mind-muscle connection by starting back from a baseline. The first few weeks wouldn't really be going to all out failure... but after about 4-5 weeks you should be back on a gaining phase again.
Also... pull ups put a very heavy load on the biceps. You might want to consider using a grip with your palms facing away from you for your back work... and/or working Biceps sperate from back...
Finally... some people prefer the grip on a cambered bar for Barbell Curls...
thanks warrior
one thing you can try is concentrate on your biceps through the entire movement, when i cheat, it's a little buck with my hips/ lower back, but in my mind i'm squeezing the hell out of my bi's, another thing is on the top, hold for a second and squeeze your bi's even harder, that should get your mind right
sorry about the tirade, gear, not getting much sleep lately
Form, quality not quantity, yeah sometimes you cheat on some sets but not all the time. Try supinating as you curl with db's. It works wonders. When I plateau on bi's I go back to the ol Larry Scott routine. Preachers and run the rack with db's.
Warrior ur a fukn genius what u say makes so much sense, now i cant waite to do bies to try ur tips. legend