Fascinated by gays?

**einstein1905** · 07-08-2004, 03:43 PM

This is what it'll always boil down to.....whether or not it is inherent or not. Clearly, in nature there are all sorts of examples of homosexuality. I'd say most animals are far inferior in terms of psychological compelxities, so I'd give less creedance to the idea of a "psychological disfunction" being the underlying cause.
As with most everything, you can find statistics to support almost any claim. Even though I haven't seen anything to support increased abuse rates correlating with homosexuality, I'll grant that there probably are some, but there certainly are stats that show no correlation too, so that's a wash. it's something that'll never be agreed upon, similar to two different religions battling, each with no intention of giving up their beliefs.

As for it being a psychological disorder, I can't agree. Most people with any psychological problem will at least recognize that there is in fact a problem, even if not initially. I don't know of more than a handfull of homosexuals (Donahue is off the air now though) that would ever concede that what they feel is a psychological problem

Is it wrong though? No. Wrong implies that there are more negative consequences than positive. I'd say one going against one's own desires would lead to a much more torturous life than if they were to actually follow their "hearts" and put up with with the juvenile verbal abuse that they'll likely experience.

Originally Posted by CYCLEON

i would comment that the media in general does not speak about abuse as a cause of homosexuality - I doubt I have ever heard that in the mainstream press at all - but thats what statistics say for those who will bother to look, and I must say that is confirmed in my own experience of those whom I know as well.

again, these are not reasons to hate people or to discriminate against them - but there is also no reason to classify a disfunctional behavior that needs assistance as an inherent trait that cannot be changed...most especially when it has the likely hood of propagating to others via learned behavior

**bubbathegut** · 07-08-2004, 04:12 PM

Originally Posted by Warrior

... and another fine post by bubbathegut

cool thanks man....

**Quake** · 07-08-2004, 04:15 PM

Originally Posted by einstein1905

As for it being a psychological disorder, I can't agree. Most people with any psychological problem will at least recognize that there is in fact a problem, even if not initially.

Not true, it is the lucky ones who reach a point or have an experience that leads to their realisation that they have/ are experiencing a psychological problem. Now with medicine and therapy, treatment etc far more advanced the numbers of people who suffer mental illness realising this are growing/have grown, but the long term/life long mentally ill are still more plentiful than you would imagine.

**Quake** · 07-08-2004, 04:17 PM

Here's another great link, but one that is relevant to the current topic. You gays/lesbians are gonna love this one, it's a prime example of just the thing that you have been talking about!

http://www.strangeland.com/asp/show....rchfor=&FType=

***Cycleon*** · 07-08-2004, 04:25 PM

Originally Posted by einstein1905

Is it wrong though? No. Wrong implies that there are more negative consequences than positive. I'd say one going against one's own desires would lead to a much more torturous life than if they were to actually follow their "hearts" and put up with with the juvenile verbal abuse that they'll likely experience.

Sorry I cant go along with the "just do what feels good" argument - another classic humanist argument albiet - I feel like bashing that little guys head in, I feel like taking that porsche from that preening person with it in front of me - but would that be right? no - again, that little idea of "sin" - big concept for 3 letters

**einstein1905** · 07-08-2004, 04:28 PM

Originally Posted by Bouncer272001

Here's another great link, but one that is relevant to the current topic. You gays/lesbians are gonna love this one, it's a prime example of just the thing that you have been talking about!

http://www.strangeland.com/asp/show....rchfor=&FType=

I know you're from the UK, but just to speak up on behalf of Americans, that in no way is representative of us.
If there should be any type of cultural cleansing done, it should be getting rid of the type of people in that link

**einstein1905** · 07-08-2004, 04:30 PM

Originally Posted by CYCLEON

Sorry I cant go along with the "just do what feels good" argument - another classic humanist argument albiet - I feel like bashing that little guys head in, I feel like taking that porsche from that preening person with it in front of me - but would that be right? no - again, that little idea of "sin" - big concept for 3 letters

I know what you're saying, but the examples you give have negative ramifications for others. homosexuality is between consenting adults. There is no comparison in my book.

***Cycleon*** · 07-08-2004, 04:37 PM

and if 2 14 year olds want to have sex? or for that matter, what is the point of marriage anyway anyone should have as much sex as they feel like right?

**Quake** · 07-09-2004, 05:47 AM

Originally Posted by einstein1905

I know you're from the UK, but just to speak up on behalf of Americans, that in no way is representative of us.
If there should be any type of cultural cleansing done, it should be getting rid of the type of people in that link

When I posted the link I forgot to mention that I, personally, do not agree with or condone such behaviour. Practical jokes are one thing (many of which I am personally responsible, but don't tell them that), but something along this lines does nothing for progression, I am an advocate of functionalism, not conflict.

**Carlos_E** · 07-09-2004, 07:19 AM

Originally Posted by Bouncer272001

When I posted the link I forgot to mention that I, personally, do not agree with or condone such behaviour. Practical jokes are one thing (many of which I am personally responsible, but don't tell them that), but something along this lines does nothing for progression, I am an advocate of functionalism, not conflict.

I can't believe that you posted a link to a crank call from a porn site to support your view.

That's pretty amusing. I seriously doubt the 2 people met to fight. It's a crank call, as in a joke. Nothing about it is real. Regarding the call. We should me more worried about their educational level vs who on either end of the phone is gay.

"Don't forget to kick off the cow **** before you come down here."

Hicks, you gotta love em.

**Mart651** · 07-09-2004, 07:32 AM

Originally Posted by Carlos_E

"Don't forget to kick off the cow **** before you come down here."

Hicks, you gotta love em.

Why do people that don't see things your way have to be hicks. Do you consider me a hick. Is it because where I am from? How I was raised? How about what color i am? I feel it is no different coming from your mouth as me saying spick. I guess this is just part of your understanding and excepting of different cultures.

**Carlos_E** · 07-09-2004, 08:06 AM

Originally Posted by Martha

Why do people that don't see things your way have to be hicks. Do you consider me a hick. Is it because where I am from? How I was raised? How about what color i am? I feel it is no different coming from your mouth as me saying spick. I guess this is just part of your understanding and excepting of different cultures.

What are you talking about? I did not call anyone who disagreed with me a hick. You seem a little sensitive today. Ligthen up.

"Don't forget to kick off the cow **** before you come down here."

It's a line from the crank call. Apparently you didn't listen to it did you. But thanks for the spic comment.

**mass junkie** · 07-09-2004, 08:08 AM

Originally Posted by Carlos_E

What are you talking about? I did not call anyone who disagreed with me a hick. You seem a little sensitive today. Ligthen up.

"Don't forget to kick off the cow **** before you come down here."

It's a line from the crank call. Apparently you didn't listen to it did you. But thanks for the spic comment.

haha martha got owned

**Carlos_E** · 07-09-2004, 08:10 AM

Originally Posted by mass junkie

haha martha got owned

..and people call me sensitive. Geez!

**Mart651** · 07-09-2004, 08:15 AM

Originally Posted by Carlos_E

What are you talking about? I did not call anyone who disagreed with me a hick. You seem a little sensitive today. Ligthen up.

"Don't forget to kick off the cow **** before you come down here."

It's a line from the crank call. Apparently you didn't listen to it did you. But thanks for the spic comment.

I was talking about the hick part and you know it but anyways maybe your right. maybe I am a little sensitive today. All this BS flying arounf lately is under my skin. I bet you were no more offended by my spick comment than I was your hick comment but you have used yours more than I have mine.

**Mart651** · 07-09-2004, 08:19 AM

Originally Posted by Carlos_E

..and people call me sensitive. Geez!

How did that happen? Who turned the tables? Now I'm the sensetive majority or minority or what ever I am.

**Quake** · 07-09-2004, 08:33 AM

Originally Posted by Carlos_E

I can't believe that you posted a link to a crank call from a porn site to support your view.

That's pretty amusing. I seriously doubt the 2 people met to fight. It's a crank call, as in a joke. Nothing about it is real. Regarding the call. We should me more worried about their educational level vs who on either end of the phone is gay.

"Don't forget to kick off the cow **** before you come down here."

Hicks, you gotta love em.

LOL!!!! I wasn't supporting a view, if there was support being offered, it was for your side of the argument not mine. LOL

Wow you're really not understanding my perspective at all. I should have guessed that from your antagonist approach to my comments on another thread of the same topic. I'm no "idiot" mate, you I'm not so sure about though. You didn't really think that was meant to support my view? That was for you to laugh at.

**Quake** · 07-09-2004, 08:35 AM

Just to play devils advocate, I'm of Russian blood! Now who's got a problem with that?

**Mart651** · 07-09-2004, 08:37 AM

Originally Posted by Bouncer272001

Just to play devils advocate, I'm of Russian blood! Now who's got a problem with that?

Si hui nipsi hui.

Is that right?

**Quake** · 07-09-2004, 08:40 AM

I wouldn't have a clue, haven't been there since I was 3, and my parents only speak english seeing as we live in the uk.

I know "Eine biere mitte"

but that's German

**Carlos_E** · 07-09-2004, 09:07 AM

Originally Posted by Bouncer272001

LOL!!!! I wasn't supporting a view, if there was support being offered, it was for your side of the argument not mine. LOL

Wow you're really not understanding my perspective at all. I should have guessed that from your antagonist approach to my comments on another thread of the same topic. I'm no "idiot" mate, you I'm not so sure about though. You didn't really think that was meant to support my view? That was for you to laugh at.

Originally Posted by Bouncer272001

When I posted the link I forgot to mention that I, personally, do not agree with or condone such behaviour. Practical jokes are one thing (many of which I am personally responsible, but don't tell them that), but something along this lines does nothing for progression, I am an advocate of functionalism, not conflict.

That sounds to me like you took the conflict recorded in the call seriously.

**Quake** · 07-09-2004, 09:19 AM

Originally Posted by Carlos_E

That sounds to me like you took the conflict recorded in the call seriously.

Sorry mate, It was purely as a source of amusement (although I did think it might upset some people). By saying that I don't agree with it I was merely putting forward my standpoint that I have previously stated, i.e. I am not a homophobe!