Handguns for play, and personal protection.

[Elysium]

DISCLAIMER: My comments are in no way designed to attack any of you, if you feel offended by them i apologise. Please don't shoot me.

[Red Ketchup]

What im getting at is your crime rate is lower simply because your country is almost entirely English. In America you have so many nationalities and races clashing...

Hmmm I'm not going to get into the gun debate here, but bro you've obviously not been to London have you?

Taking a walk thru London is EXACTLY like taking a walk thru New York... it's the united nations there and in many neigbourhoods white-anglos are a minority. It's the same on both sides of the big pond.

And the US doesn't have the monopoly on rough neigbourhoods, I've seen areas of Liverpool that will match the worse getthos of Detroit or Chicago.

Oh and to keep this on topic, my favorite target pistol is a nice little Ruger Mark II 22 cal. It's fun to shoot, cheap and since 22 ammo is almost given away, you can shoot all day with it and not break the bank. If the gun laws here weren't so prohibitive, I'd have one for plinking.

Red

[Sierra_Breeze]

yeah you're right I'm lying in wait for an intruder, at night I set behind the bushes of my home in my camo watching, waiting ,praying for someone to step foot on my porch just so I can see how big a hole I can put in em.

Gimme a break kid, I have a husband and two kids half the time I dunno whether to wind my ass or scratch my watch much less set around waiting for an attack, however if someone should make that mistake then I, won't be crying afterwards about how if I'd only had a gun I could have protected myself and my family.

But that's beside the point I'm not a violent person, I'm not trigger happy and I don't seek out or hope for trouble, my guns are kept in a locked safe, to ensure the saftey of our kids, and visitors. I would be very hesitant to pull my gun untill I felt that it was them or me, then you betcha sweet lil arse I'd use it. And I do get what you're saying however I doubt seriously that America will ever do away with weapons. Nor is it something I wish to see happen, but don't gimme sh!t because I excercise my right to bare arms, and act like I'm some kind of gang banger looking for a fight, as I assure this is not the case.

[Elysium]

Sorry SB, please dont shoot me.

I dont think there is anything i can say to convince you guys that you "heritage" your "society" is built on violence, even admitted by yourselvs the gun is something that your country considers as a symbol.

Well you won't last long, you will all get nuked. Best of the luck with that

[H-BOL]

just shut up UK....

[FRANK WHITE]

Lol one part made me think.

The gun is part of your identity, the countrys heritage. Thats exactly why your country will not last, the fact that your society, heritage and identity is built around violence proves this.

Your correct, our country will not last forever, at least not in its present form, history has proven that over and over. Hopefully though, we will last for a long time. All civilizations, empires, etc., eventually fall or change form, but they have all been built by the use of weapons, including your country. How many times has England been in wars with France, Scotland, Germany, America, etc. Without weapons would you still be around? As you stated earlier, London has as much crime as any american city, right. Well imagine about 20 Londons in America and you understand why our crime rate is so high. Our laws do everything possible to keep firearms out of the hands of criminals. Law abiding citizens who own guns are not the problem, its the criminals. If there was a way of getting all the guns out of the criminals hands short of forming a police state, we'd all be better off. But as it is, the fact that law abiding citizens own guns and the criminals know this, helps act as a deterrent.

[Elysium]

Your correct, our country will not last forever, at least not in its present form, history has proven that over and over. Hopefully though, we will last for a long time. All civilizations, empires, etc., eventually fall or change form, but they have all been built by the use of weapons, including your country. How many times has England been in wars with France, Scotland, Germany, America, etc. Without weapons would you still be around? As you stated earlier, London has as much crime as any american city, right. Well imagine about 20 Londons in America and you understand why our crime rate is so high. Our laws do everything possible to keep firearms out of the hands of criminals. Law abiding citizens who own guns are not the problem, its the criminals. If there was a way of getting all the guns out of the criminals hands short of forming a police state, we'd all be better off. But as it is, the fact that law abiding citizens own guns and the criminals know this, helps act as a deterrent.

I think your not seeing something, where you say compare London, multiply it by 20 times and dot them around america. Its all reletive, London and other cities in the UK are in proportion to the size of the country. Take away the guns and your country is no more likely to have more deaths reletive to your size than mine.

See the thing is, anyone in your country can get a gun, you will reply and say people with a crim record etc will not get a gun, right ok.

You are only a criminal, you are only a murderer, you are only someone out of control and a risk AFTER, you bought the gun, AFTER you got your license.

[Elysium]

just shut up UK....

Dont have anything constructive to say? Go play with a gun

[Sierra_Breeze]

Sorry SB, please dont shoot me.

I dont think there is anything i can say to convince you guys that you "heritage" your "society" is built on violence, even admitted by yourselvs the gun is something that your country considers as a symbol.

Well you won't last long, you will all get nuked. Best of the luck with that

Don't be such an @$$ Now good day to ya

[FRANK WHITE]

Ok UK, I won't argue with you on the fact that guns make it a lot easier to kill somebody, if you are so inclined. Yes, we could probably save lives which are taken by people who have no criminal record, but for whatever reason, lose control and decide to purchase a gun and kill someone. I concede these points to you. On the other hand, the arguement could be made that if everyone was armed, crime would go down. How many criminals would attempt to rob or rape or whatever to a person they knew was armed? Its an interesting arguement, don't you think. You didn't reply to my statement about England relying on weapons in countless wars to preserve their exisence. You have no choice. Sometimes you must match fire with fire or you get killed. Do you think the IRA is happy or sad that English citizens, even police I believe, are prevented from carrying firearms

[Elysium]

I will reply to the war thing. To use guns in a war is ok, as both side are using them for the intention of causing harm.

You logic is flawed mate. Please just take England as an example, we have proven that by getting rid of guns that there is more peace, less death, less killings.

[FRANK WHITE]

I will reply to the war thing. To use guns in a war is ok, as both side are using them for the intention of causing harm.

You logic is flawed mate. Please just take England as an example, we have proven that by getting rid of guns that there is more peace, less death, less killings.

If I had to choose between having everyone not associated with law enforcement armed or disarmed I would choose disarmed, however, I don't feel that will ever happen here. I don't feel having everyone armed is the answer, just an interesting idea to throw out there. I'm glad crime is lower in England and the gun laws are working there. In our country, the combination of the gun being part of our heritage and the gun being big business is why I don't think we will ever make guns illegal. There is no easy answer to this question, unfortunately. Only time will tell what the future holds. I don't believe guns will cause the downfall of our country however. If anything does that I believe it will be related to economics. Peace.

[juicehoe]

UK i love people like yourself who say "lets make it so people who follow the law cant get guns and the people who would buy it from the back of an ice cream truck in miami can still get them.". Great idea . The fact of the matter is bad guys will get guns from arms dealers. You think u can just pick up a full auto mac10 at a gun store. Plus the US has to large borders with other countrys plus all of our ports, make it not to hard to import weapons. If everyone had a gun u better believe that someone would think twice before trying something. Ever notice how u never hear of a gun store being held up or a shooting range? Why because every employee there has a gun on their hip plus the people coming and going have a gun.

I will reply to the war thing. To use guns in a war is ok, as both side are using them for the intention of causing harm.

You logic is flawed mate. Please just take England as an example, we have proven that by getting rid of guns that there is more peace, less death, less killings.

[Doc M]

Hey..He's 20 years old..He knows the ways of the world and has everything figured out..Why is anyone arguing with him?? He won't get it through his thick skull that outlawing guns in the US, is highly unlikely..And I have been to your country many times, and I'm still trying to figure out why you are riding a high horse..Your country is going to last forever and ours is going to self-destruct..Is that your final words of wisdom?

Doc M

[Elysium]

Hey..He's 20 years old..He knows the ways of the world and has everything figured out..Why is anyone arguing with him?? He won't get it through his thick skull that outlawing guns in the US, is highly unlikely..And I have been to your country many times, and I'm still trying to figure out why you are riding a high horse..Your country is going to last forever and ours is going to self-destruct..Is that your final words of wisdom?

Doc M

Can we all say "exaggerate"

[Philliagorillia]

Well, i dont have much to say on this subject other than the ban of handguns in america will never happen. As for the UK, well i dont really understand why they have a ban on all firearms in private homes. And all i have to say about london is that even at 3am, walking the streets of london, even the ****tiest parts is a walk in the park compaired to walking thru North St.Louis...

[Swellin]

Hey..He's 20 years old..He knows the ways of the world and has everything figured out..Why is anyone arguing with him?? He won't get it through his thick skull that outlawing guns in the US, is highly unlikely..And I have been to your country many times, and I'm still trying to figure out why you are riding a high horse..Your country is going to last forever and ours is going to self-destruct..Is that your final words of wisdom?

Doc M

Thanks Doc. You are right on the money. Leave the guy alone folks...let him whine about our situation and point his finger and laugh. Who gives a sh!t what he thingks? He can't vote on it, so his opinion is useless. His gov't in its infinite wisdom does not trust him enough on this issue to give him a choice.

So blast away smart ass. Nobody should be listening.

[decadbal]

UK, once again in the future when your great country runs off at the mouth, and starts gettin its ass beat, who will it turn to, the US... who saved your ass before and will again... if the US is so horrible, why are we one of the best countries in the world, u dont see ppl flocking to england to live or work.. or tryin to sneak in illegally by the thousands....

[Elysium]

UK, once again in the future when your great country runs off at the mouth, and starts gettin its ass beat, who will it turn to, the US... who saved your ass before and will again... if the US is so horrible, why are we one of the best countries in the world, u dont see ppl flocking to england to live or work.. or tryin to sneak in illegally by the thousands....

Err maybe you should do some research on people coming to the UK for work etc. Oh and didnt you guys look to the UK for back up in Iraq? You rjust getting petty coz you know im right. Take away the guns and you will see a dramatic reduction in deaths within crime.

[animal-inside]

UK, I do agree with you that owning handguns is not a nessceity and therefore owning them shoudl be illegal.

Being Candian its realy hard to own anyhting but a hunting rifle/shotgun. I like it that way.

But if someoen wants to kill someone no gun law will stop them..

[Red Ketchup]

UK, I do agree with you that owning handguns is not a nessceity and therefore owning them shoudl be illegal.

I don't really agree here... yes they are not a necessity, but they should not be illegal in the US... it's part of their culture wether we like it or not and thats not going to change.

What I think on the other hand is that acquisition and ownership should be controlled a bit more strictly. But of course thats only my opinion.

Red

[Big Rush]

Ive looked at glocks, but not sure about the quality....

coldstone, glocks are some of the highest quality pistols available today....i believe something like 70-80% of all US law enforcement uses glocks...i have a glock 19 (9mm) with a built in laser site (lasermax)....i paid around $900 for everything brand new...i love it....i gotta recommend a glock bro

[Big Rush]

woe, should have known this thread would turn into a f*cking gun debate......here is what i say: if they outlawed guns in the US, criminals, who are using guns ANYWAY, would still obtain/use them like they currently do. Law abiding citizens would not be able to defend themselves. How can you argue with this? Gun will never be outlawed in the US because we have something called a Constitution. Thank God for that.

[animal-inside]

woe, should have known this thread would turn into a f*cking gun debate......here is what i say: if they outlawed guns in the US, criminals, who are using guns ANYWAY, would still obtain/use them like they currently do. Law abiding citizens would not be able to defend themselves. How can you argue with this? Gun will never be outlawed in the US because we have something called a Constitution. Thank God for that.

if guns were outlawed today then yes the murder rate by gun shot will not go down right away.. but it WILL go down eventually....

but yes if some one REALLY wants to get a gun and shoot someoen they will.. but out lawing hand guns and guns that are only intended for killing humans efficiently would deter/prevent alot of deaths...

I doubt anyone could ever say they if hand guns were outlawed that the rate of death by gun shot would stay the same..

Yes its part of the USA culture. Its part of their past. So is killing people for land, slavery, etc... 150- years ago if soemone started a argument in a bar you could stab them to death them and walk away. Just because its part of culture dosen't mean it should stay with us.

I am really not trying to say guns kill people (people kill people).. I am just saying how can you justify owning a assult rifle or something like that? My family and extended family all own guns.. they all hunt.. nothing wrong with owning hunting guns.

I know alot of you say "**** that, I am just defending myself and my family" ...... I can't blame you or say your not allowed too.

[Swellin]

Animal-inside, while we couldn't disagree more on items of this issue, I can respect and accept your input because you present it in a respectful, well thought manner.


As for assault rifles and the like, yes I own some. I also own some silencers...legally. They are very difficult to acquire, as Bdtr and I mentioned earlier. Why do I own this stuff? Quite frankly...because I can. Think about that for a second...it is not a smart ass remark, simply the truth.

That psycho, Ted Nugent said, "If guns kill people, all of mine are deffective." I guess mine are too. I certauinlyu hope they stay that way forever.
However, I forced my wife to get a CCP and carry a pistol. She works in a very high crime area, and is a very attractive young lady. Twice, brandishing her weapon (quite ready to use it) has saved her from a certain mugging and raping. The assailant did not have a firearm either time...but she did. Is killing someone to prevent a rape a viable alternative...hell yes it is!

[ColdSore]

Coldstone, I'd say if you want a gun for playing around, an auto would do just fine, however if you are looking for one for self protection I'd highly recomend that you get a revolver.

I don't mean to step on anyones toes or diss any firearm but, I have seen too many autos jam up while just shooting for the heck of it, in a real life situation where your life depends on the weapon firing without jamming up, by the time you rectify the situation you will already be dead. Just giving you something to think about.

I love to play around with the hubbies .45 auto but when my life is at steak I'll stick to my lil .357 revolver.

thats a very valid point...it would be for fun too...but i guess all in all it would make alot of sense to have its main priority as saftey for me and the others that reside in my house.

[ColdSore]

Animal-inside, while we couldn't disagree more on items of this issue, I can respect and accept your input because you present it in a respectful, well thought manner.


As for assault rifles and the like, yes I own some. I also own some silencers...legally. They are very difficult to acquire, as Bdtr and I mentioned earlier. Why do I own this stuff? Quite frankly...because I can. Think about that for a second...it is not a smart ass remark, simply the truth.

That psycho, Ted Nugent said, "If guns kill people, all of mine are deffective." I guess mine are too. I certauinlyu hope they stay that way forever.
However, I forced my wife to get a CCP and carry a pistol. She works in a very high crime area, and is a very attractive young lady. Twice, brandishing her weapon (quite ready to use it) has saved her from a certain mugging and raping. The assailant did not have a firearm either time...but she did. Is killing someone to prevent a rape a viable alternative...hell yes it is!

that ladies and gentlemen is why i want to look into purcahseing one...thats crazy your wife used it twice already

[Sierra_Breeze]

thats a very valid point...it would be for fun too...but i guess all in all it would make alot of sense to have its main priority as saftey for me and the others that reside in my house.

The one I have has never let me down, it did one time in the many years that I've owned it missfire once, due to bad ammo, no fault of the gun, but being that it's semi-hammerless, I only had to squeaze the trigger again to cure that.
Also it will shoot either ,.357 or .38 calliber shells so you could re-load the .38's fairly inexpensively for when you just want to mess around and buy a box of .357 shells to load it with for other purposes.

It all boils down to whichever you feel most comfortable with I guess, but for me that's gotta be a revolver. We had a 9mm once and it missfired every other shot, whenever you tried to chamber a bullet it got stuck and you'd have to pry it loose, and in the event you actually needed for it to fire, ya may as well just throw it at the person. Or ask politely could you wait one sec before you kill me untill I get this thing to work??

[ColdSore]

well...the more and more i look at the glocks the more i like em...i know, you fukks are gonna have something to say...but...the model 17 compact is what i kinda like...i think it princess could handle it pretty easy too....

but...as SB said...a revolver would be more logical almost, and possibley cheaper for a nicer gun???....still looking though

[Doc M]

Glock- .40cal Would pick that hands down from the guns listed above..

Doc M

[OSTIE]

Im sorry, I could have possibly missed half of this thread, but I had to comment. I mostly agree with BDTR's earlier threads about handguns in our youths' hands. The majority of them already carry illegal handguns. Making the handguns where normal citizens already have to go through an indepth background search, illegal, isnt going to keep already illegal handguns out of the hands of little houlighans. There will always be some underground connection. IMO, banning guns from everyone only makes the innocent more of a target for hoodlums who will obtain illegal guns either way.

Back to the original post. I used to work at Gander Mountain (big outdoors superstore for those not familiar). I worked archery cause I love bowhunting a billion times more than gunhunting. Just because I was good with people, I eventually did both. I never knew sh!t bout handguns, technically, and I probably still dont according to some of you enthusiats.

BUT, from the guns I got to play arround with to show customers, and the very few I got to shoot. One of the best beginner/protection/accuracy pistols IMO is the RUGER stainless semi .45. I think its the p90, but im not sure, its been awhile. My pops who is a hunting fanatic, bought it for my ma for xmas a while back. Even she shoots great with it and its a powerful, reliable gun.

Sorry for my rambling, good luck on the choice,

-ost

[hung-solo]

well what do you like???...thats why im asking...all of my dads semi auto pistols have been .22 caliber playguns...but he had a smith and wesson .38 snubby for protection, and a smith and wesson .44 for hunting loaded down with a red dot scope ect...

so i dont really know what i want???

i just know 9mm target loads, and reloads seem to be the cheapest...and has decent knockdown if i need it...

you can also get modles that are about the same gun, just a diff caliber...so tell me what modles, brands, ect, you like if you want

9mm really doesnt have any knockdown power. hollow points help but still it is a reaonably weak cal. but, i have one and i like the accuracy with the bullet. if you and your gf are using it then it would be great for her. low recoil and yes it will def kill something considering reasonable range. look at baby glocks, rugers are ok but not as accurate as perhaps a glock, hk, springfield..imo.. i have a kel-tec 9mm which is the lightest and smallest 9mm made so far that i know of and i really like it. but i have it to carry in my jeep not just to shoot cans with. ask around more and go to a local firing range and rent one and just try it out. if you buy a 9mm and decided to go with like .45(which is my all time favorite) then you can always sell it and get something else.

[hung-solo]

HK USP compact .45. Best carry gun i ever owned.

finally someone that has one!, i have the full size hk usp .45 and love it i just wanted a smaller version. i really dont need a full size pistol. i have read good things about the compact .40's and 9's but not too many people have the .45 compact..another gun that is somewhat comparable imo. is the glock 36 or i think maybe 30 baby glock in .45 and i know cops that carry that as a personaly weapon and swear by them...

[hung-solo]

well if it werent for our guns and prez your country would be speakin german, so sit down and shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

hahahaha thats about right.. uk go do some homework bro. hate to sit on the high horse but you guys were getting ready to be handed your dicks on a platter until we stepped in ww2.. facts are facts.. and let us handle or " violent society" and you just go have fun in uk playing grab ass with each other..

[Elysium]

How about you invest in some rope and hang yourself?

[hung-solo]

How about you invest in some rope and hang yourself?

na pistols work faster.

[Elysium]

na pistols work faster.

Ahh good point, shoot yourself.

[hung-solo]

Ahh good point, shoot yourself.

na i like shooting other people too much.

[Elysium]

na i like shooting other people too much.

of course you do, silly me. well you are american aren't ya

[hung-solo]

of course you do, silly me. well you are american aren't ya

and proud.....well for the most part. if we can get g.w. bush out of office i would be much happier.. why are you arguing about crap in the u.s.? worry about your own **** country.