U.S Monetary System

**Panzerfaust** · 01-11-2008, 02:29 PM

It amazes me how ignorant the American population is when asked basic questions regarding the Constitution and our monetary system. Is it truly any wonder why we have been deceived?

Please have a look at this movie, it will explain to you how the Federal Reserve works as well as why our currency should be backed by gold & silver.

Fiat Empire Movie

**Machdiesel** · 01-11-2008, 02:57 PM

THeres alot of these floating around. There anything involving aaron russo, and Zeitgeist-the federal reserve is on youtube

**Panzerfaust** · 01-11-2008, 02:58 PM

No this is a different video about Monetary Policy and History.

Nothing to dow ith Aaron Russo etc.

**thegodfather** · 01-11-2008, 03:23 PM

Much more factual and straight forwad video...No fringe conspiracy ideas, so this video has alot more credability...

**soccer#3** · 01-11-2008, 04:46 PM

they have done a good job of keepin us uninformed and stupid. and soon as we start askin questions which is our right to do, we are called conspiracy theorists, this and that.

ron paul sees this and want to create change but he's fightin againt whole washington and the elite.

i dont wanna sound too pessimistic but this country is goin str8 to hell

**Atomini** · 01-11-2008, 04:50 PM

Awesome. They intervewed all the same people that Aaron Russo interviewed in America: Freedom To Fascism.

**soulstealer** · 01-11-2008, 05:41 PM

Originally Posted by soccer#3

they have done a good job of keepin us uninformed and stupid. and soon as we start askin questions which is our right to do, we are called conspiracy theorists, this and that.

ron paul sees this and want to create change but he's fightin againt whole washington and the elite.

i dont wanna sound too pessimistic but this country is goin str8 to hell

Its not pessimistic if its the truth...LOL

**Oki-Des** · 01-11-2008, 07:07 PM

I know there are plenty of ignorant people in the US, but there is a little of everything including wonderful opportunity.
I too can see the problems we are having but make every effort to make a positive difference. If the US is going to hell, it is our responsibility to make it wonderful again.
It is easy to find somewhat less intelligent than yourself and mock them. But we should find someone smarter than ourselves and aspire to be more like them.
There are plenty of intelligent people living in countries that will not offer them the resources to exploit their talents. At least if you have any talent you can utilize it to earn a living here. If the US does go to sh*t whose fault will it be? Will it be your grandparents or your children's fault? No, it is us that will take the blame.
If you know that everyone around you is a moron than you should be somewhat intelligent. This also carries some responsibility as someone who can make a change as well. We cant expect the morons to make a change.
Sorry, its just my 2 cents.

**soccer#3** · 01-11-2008, 08:02 PM

Originally Posted by Oki-Des

I know there are plenty of ignorant people in the US, but there is a little of everything including wonderful opportunity.
I too can see the problems we are having but make every effort to make a positive difference. If the US is going to hell, it is our responsibility to make it wonderful again.
It is easy to find somewhat less intelligent than yourself and mock them. But we should find someone smarter than ourselves and aspire to be more like them.
There are plenty of intelligent people living in countries that will not offer them the resources to exploit their talents. At least if you have any talent you can utilize it to earn a living here. If the US does go to sh*t whose fault will it be? Will it be your grandparents or your children's fault? No, it is us that will take the blame.
If you know that everyone around you is a moron than you should be somewhat intelligent. This also carries some responsibility as someone who can make a change as well. We cant expect the morons to make a change.
Sorry, its just my 2 cents.

speak ur mind bro, dont apologize. greatness and opportunity is what made this country. but some are abusing it

**Atomini** · 01-11-2008, 08:30 PM

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants."
- Thomas Jefferson

I think this is very true, but it doesn't HAVE to be with blood. What's going on called entropy. Everything slowly breaks down. EVERYTHING. Even the fabric and ideals that a country is based upon. The United States was created with good intentions - to have a place of opportunity and freedom (both economic and personal). And they did just that. America was the perfect place to live up until this point. Everything slowly degenerates, corrupts, and degrades, and it's happening to America. It's been happening to America for the last 70 some odd years now (give or take a few years). And this is something normal that happens to everything. That is why "the tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time", otherwise the whole country will degenerate 100%! ONE HUNDRED PERCENT! The key is to refresh the tree before it gets that far. Do it before it gets to the point of no return (and we're only a hair away from that point). Does the tree have to be refreshed with blood? I don't think it HAS to be. The United States can be restored without bloodshed... up to a certain point. After that point of no return I mentioned, the only way to fix the situation will be to have an armed uprising and you will have to shed blood.

America was perfect in the beginning. But like everything, entropy takes it's toll and now it's gotta be fixed/restored/refreshed/reset/whatever you wanna call it.

**SMCengineer** · 01-12-2008, 02:14 PM

Informative. I like the other videos you posted about the fed as well.

**Fat Guy** · 01-12-2008, 10:12 PM

Originally Posted by muriloninja

It amazes me how ignorant the American population is when asked basic questions regarding the Constitution and our monetary system. Is it truly any wonder why we have been deceived?

Please have a look at this movie, it will explain to you how the Federal Reserve works as well as why our currency should be backed by gold & silver.

Fiat Empire Movie

I just finished watching this film and it is exceptional…. This is the film that changed my vote to Ron Paul. Thanks

Everyone should watch this.

**Panzerfaust** · 01-12-2008, 10:17 PM

Originally Posted by Fat Guy

I just finished watching this film and it is exceptional…. This is the film that changed my vote to Ron Paul. Thanks

Everyone should watch this.

Welcome aboard!

More and more people are waking up everyday...

**alphaman** · 01-13-2008, 06:06 PM

It would have been a more reliable source, imo, if they had some views from the other side of the line. Also... did they address the fact that money is regularly taken out of circulation, as well? Because if they did, I didn't catch it.

I don't know enough about a lot of what was said in the video to know it's true. But I do know that the Fed reacts to the market too easily, and these "soft-landings" that Greenspan started in in the beginning of the decade,and that Bernanke has continued in the last two years are catching up with us, and something needs to be done about it. Ron Paul is the only one who is talking about it and nobody can deny that.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AkuV9gwEqcQ

**Big** · 01-13-2008, 06:10 PM

"It is well enough that people of the nation do not understand
our banking and monetary system, for if they did,
I believe there would be a revolution before tomorrow morning."

-Henry Ford

**MASTER** · 01-14-2008, 06:42 PM

Don't get me started on the inevitable long term shortcomings of regulating a money supply that is backed by nothing. I find it rather humorous that world trade is based on nothing more than monopoly money.

**Panzerfaust** · 01-14-2008, 06:47 PM

Originally Posted by alphaman

It would have been a more reliable source, imo, if they had some views from the other side of the line. Also... did they address the fact that money is regularly taken out of circulation, as well? Because if they did, I didn't catch it.
I don't know enough about a lot of what was said in the video to know it's true. But I do know that the Fed reacts to the market too easily, and these "soft-landings" that Greenspan started in in the beginning of the decade,and that Bernanke has continued in the last two years are catching up with us, and something needs to be done about it. Ron Paul is the only one who is talking about it and nobody can deny that.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AkuV9gwEqcQ

You are missing the whole point! Regardless what they circulate, it is worth NOTHING..can you undestand that? The paper money in our pockets is worth jack shit.

In reality, your $20 bill is worth around 80 cents.

Inflation is not what the majority of citizens think, it is the value of the dollar going down which in turn means it takes more of those dollars to purchase something.

**alphaman** · 01-14-2008, 08:40 PM

Originally Posted by muriloninja

You are missing the whole point! Regardless what they circulate, it is worth NOTHING..can you undestand that? The paper money in our pockets is worth jack shit.

In reality, your $20 bill is worth around 80 cents.

Dude. I appreciate what you're doing. So don't get me wrong on this, but what you said up there doesn't make any sense....

First of all, if the paper money in my pocket wasn't worth "jack shit", than I wouldn't be able to buy anything with it....

Second, how the hell could $20 only be worth 80 cents??? That's like saying that one loaf of bread is only worth one piece of the exact same bread. If the dollar crashes and we see inflation like Germany did after WWII, then sure... it won't be worth jack shit. But not until then.

Inflation is not what the majority of citizens think

I agree that this is very possible.

I understand the concepts in the video very well, as thoroughly understanding the financial markets, monetary policy, and economics is critical in what I do for a living.

I think it's possible that the current financial data that the Fed looks at (the Consumer Pricing Index, the Producer's Pricing Index, and most of all, what they call "core inflation", which is the CPI minus food and energy) to set monetary policy might not be the best economic indicators available.

Ron Paul claims that the old calculation for CPI showed inflation to be at 10% in 2006, rather than 3%. I believe that's very possible. But if you look at my post, I already indicated that I think restructuring is in order. I'll go even further to say that things could very well get out of control with no oversight on the Fed and the fact that they can print $ on a whim.

But you need to chill out a little. Ron Paul needs his supporters to not act crazy. It's not as bad as you think..... yet.

**SMCengineer** · 01-14-2008, 09:02 PM

Originally Posted by alphaman

Dude. I appreciate what you're doing. So don't get me wrong on this, but what you said up there doesn't make any sense....

First of all, if the paper money in my pocket wasn't worth "jack shit", than I wouldn't be able to buy anything with it....

Second, how the hell could $20 only be worth 80 cents??? That's like saying that one loaf of bread is only worth one piece of the exact same bread. If the dollar crashes and we see inflation like Germany did after WWII, then sure... it won't be worth jack shit. But not until then..

I think what he is saying is that your dollar is literally worth only $.04 in gold, therefore making your $20 worth only $.80 in gold. However, American trust (or ignorance) in the monetary system leads the public to believe that a dollar is actually worth something in terms of gold. Essentially, the worth of the American dollar is an intangible amount because it really is worthless, yet we still accept it as legal tender.

**Panzerfaust** · 01-14-2008, 09:20 PM

Originally Posted by Blome

I think what he is saying is that your dollar is literally worth only $.04 in gold, therefore making your $20 worth only $.80 in gold. However, American trust (or ignorance) in the monetary system leads the public to believe that a dollar is actually worth something in terms of gold. Essentially, the worth of the American dollar is an intangible amount because it really is worthless, yet we still accept it as legal tender.

I don't know how that got by him, but yeah in essence you are correct.

**alphaman** · 01-14-2008, 09:26 PM

Originally Posted by Blome

I think what he is saying is that your dollar is literally worth only $.04 in gold, therefore making your $20 worth only $.80 in gold.

I'm not in commodities, but I can tell you gold is trading around $900 per oz. If you want to talk about how much the us dollar is worth in relation to gold, then that's how you do it, but to say $20 is worth 80 cents in gold doesn't make any sense. You could say that a dollar is worth 1/900 of an oz of gold....

However, American trust (or ignorance) in the monetary system leads the public to believe that a dollar is actually worth something in terms of gold.

You can buy gold with US dollars, so it is worth something in terms of gold...

Essentially, the worth of the American dollar is an intangible amount because it really is worthless, yet we still accept it as legal tender.

It is has intrinsic value because you can buy TANGIBLE goods with it.

Again, I am on you guy's side, but you need to get your facts straight. This kind of stuff is why Ron Paul was asked about "911 truthers" at his last debate.

**SMCengineer** · 01-14-2008, 10:17 PM

Originally Posted by alphaman

I'm not in commodities, but I can tell you gold is trading around $900 per oz. If you want to talk about how much the us dollar is worth in relation to gold, then that's how you do it, but to say $20 is worth 80 cents in gold doesn't make any sense. You could say that a dollar is worth 1/900 of an oz of gold....

You can buy gold with US dollars, so it is worth something in terms of gold...

It is has intrinsic value because you can buy TANGIBLE goods with it.

Again, I am on you guy's side, but you need to get your facts straight. This kind of stuff is why Ron Paul was asked about "911 truthers" at his last debate.

I fully agree with what your saying, but I think your looking at it from the wrong pespective. What were debating is what the dollar is backed by, which is nothing. By that I mean literally, not figuratively. If the gold standard was in place you would be able to trade-in your dollar to the government for relatively the same amount of gold you were able to trade it in to the for in the early 1900's. For example, in 1910 the price of gold was about $20/ounce. It stayed relatively constant with only a few minor peaks (which coincided with the FDR ban on the gold standard) up until the 70's when it was about $37/ounce. In 1971 the gold standard was abandoned and your dollar became worthless, meaning you could not trade-it-in to the government for anything. The result was that in less than a decade the price of gold shot up to $650/ounce.

I know your on our side, but I see nothing wrong with logical and civil conversation/debating.

**Pooks** · 01-14-2008, 10:28 PM

GOLD as an investment has been a great dissapointment since 1973.. when we completely got off the gold standard cause De Gaulle tryied to screw us over......( DE Gaulle.. was collecting US Dollars from every other country or bank, and trading them in for Gold that we held at the Reserve, which meant that we had to ship gold to France... Nixon I believe, knew the stupidity of having someone else control the world's stockpile of gold so he took the USD off the gold standard)

Yes gold has been going up recently.. and its nearing $1000 an ounce..

but guess what if gold price in 1973 is adjusted for inflation today it should be worth $2000+ an ounce..

that means inflations has outpaced the value of gold.. which makes it historically a horrible investment...

but it is trending up right now... so I'll encourage anyone here to buy GOLD SPOT.. or buy some GOLD STOCKS such as AUY (which I happen to own :-D )

just play it safe and if it turns against you cut your losses quick.

**alphaman** · 01-14-2008, 10:41 PM

Originally Posted by Blome

I fully agree with what your saying, but I think your looking at it from the wrong pespective. What were debating is what the dollar is backed by, which is nothing.

I never debated as to whether it was backed by gold or not.

By that I mean literally, not figuratively. If the gold standard was in place you would be able to trade-in your dollar to the government for relatively the same amount of gold you were able to trade it in to the for in the early 1900's.

Inflation didn't start in 1971, we've seen inflation and deflation both for a long time before that.

http://inflationdata.com/inflation/I...currentPage=7e

For example, in 1910 the price of gold was about $20/ounce. It stayed relatively constant with only a few minor peaks (which coincided with the FDR ban on the gold standard) up until the 70's when it was about $37/ounce.

Knowing that gold was flat (and really, it has been flat since as well when adjusted for inflation compared to the major indces) and now seeing that the dollar was all over the map, should help you see my point.

In 1971 the gold standard was abandoned and your dollar became worthless, meaning you could not trade-it-in to the government for anything. The result was that in less than a decade the price of gold shot up to $650/ounce.

Just because you can't exchange your money for gold with the government... again.... doesn't mean it's worthless.

I know your on our side, but I see nothing wrong with logical and civil conversation/debating.

I don't disagree with that.

**SMCengineer** · 01-14-2008, 10:52 PM

Originally Posted by alphaman

Inflation didn't start in 1971, we've seen inflation and deflation both for a long time before that.

http://inflationdata.com/inflation/I...currentPage=7e

The link is dead, but I'm interested to see if inflation was as rampant as it was after we abandoned the gold standard.

Originally Posted by alphaman

Knowing that gold was flat (and really, it has been flat since as well when adjusted for inflation compared to the major indces) and now seeing that the dollar was all over the map, should help you see my point.

Honestly, I don't. Can you elaborate?

**alphaman** · 01-14-2008, 10:56 PM

Originally Posted by Blome

The link is dead, but I'm interested to see if inflation was as rampant as it was after we abandoned the gold standard.

Honestly, I don't. Can you elaborate?

http://inflationdata.com/inflation/I.../Inflation.asp Click on "historical inflation rate.

I'll elaborate tomorrow -- I gotta get some sleep...

**Pooks** · 01-14-2008, 10:57 PM

US got on the gold standard in 1873 so u have to look at inflation rates

between 1873 and 1932.

**Pooks** · 01-14-2008, 11:16 PM

OK GUYS I DID THE LEG WORK

Read this article..
http://www.haifc.com/haifc/articles/...ments_2006.pdf

in the 19th century we saw DEFLATION...

and deflation happened again during the great depression.. which was obviously bad for growth.. so FDR took us off that standard.

**SMCengineer** · 01-15-2008, 11:50 PM

Originally Posted by alphaman

http://inflationdata.com/inflation/I.../Inflation.asp Click on "historical inflation rate.

I'll elaborate tomorrow -- I gotta get some sleep...

I think I kind of understand what your saying. Correct me if I'm wrong. Do you mean that the value of money is basically a function of supply and demand. Meaning, that the more we have the less it's worth and vice versa.

**Pooks** · 01-16-2008, 12:49 AM

Originally Posted by Blome

I think I kind of understand what your saying. Correct me if I'm wrong. Do you mean that the value of money is basically a function of supply and demand. Meaning, that the more we have the less it's worth and vice versa.

DUH!
but here is the catch..

If you want to stop printing currency you have to make sure that you currency does not leave the nation..

What happens in our global economy, is that we can get certain things for cheaper elsewhere.. therefore our money end up in foreign lands, in exchange for goods..

so... unless you want there to be a shortage of dollars within the nation,= DEFLATION = no growth, = possible depression...
you better be printing loot.
Its growth! Its robust!