ATTN: Americans

**Panzerfaust** · 05-11-2008, 03:28 PM

Must see

http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...34866850945507

**Oki-Des** · 05-11-2008, 03:49 PM

Interesting.
But, it is also sad that many outsiders assume all Americans are mindless drones. I personally have created a medical technology that helps people in more than 100 nations. I started this with the help of my friends and now have FDA approval, the CE mark for legal distribution throughout Europe. We now follow the ministry of Health Labor and Welfare in Japan allowing further sales in Asia. We recently moved into Central and South America.
Although appalled by many things in our government, I am also pleased with my ability to use my intelligence and distribute my advancements around the globe. I am sure that living in America has offered me the help needed to facilitate such a task. I am not trying to defend what is wrong with America, but rather remind everyone that there is much to offer if you open your eyes to the opportunities as well. There are morons out there who do not know Europe from Australia. But no one should worry about these people anyways. If we are smart enough to know there is a problem, then we should be the ones to fix it. I know that we can blame others for what is wrong with the world, but when you dedicate yourself to making a change in something for the better, you will spend less time worried about those that do not share your vision.
America may be in trouble, but it has offered me the tools to do something that I feel is wonderful and for that I am grateful.
I am not blind to the problems in the US, but I spend more time appreciating what it has to offer.

**Panzerfaust** · 05-11-2008, 04:04 PM

Originally Posted by Oki-Des

Interesting.
But, it is also sad that many outsiders assume all Americans are mindless drones. I personally have created a medical technology that helps people in more than 100 nations. I started this with the help of my friends and now have FDA approval, the CE mark for legal distribution throughout Europe. We now follow the ministry of Health Labor and Welfare in Japan allowing further sales in Asia. We recently moved into Central and South America.
Although appalled by many things in our government, I am also pleased with my ability to use my intelligence and distribute my advancements around the globe. I am sure that living in America has offered me the help needed to facilitate such a task. I am not trying to defend what is wrong with America, but rather remind everyone that there is much to offer if you open your eyes to the opportunities as well. There are morons out there who do not know Europe from Australia. But no one should worry about these people anyways. If we are smart enough to know there is a problem, then we should be the ones to fix it. I know that we can blame others for what is wrong with the world, but when you dedicate yourself to making a change in something for the better, you will spend less time worried about those that do not share your vision.
America may be in trouble, but it has offered me the tools to do something that I feel is wonderful and for that I am grateful.
I am not blind to the problems in the US, but I spend more time appreciating what it has to offer.

Wow, I think this went way over your head. You didn't even watch the video.

**Diary of a Mad-man** · 05-11-2008, 04:15 PM

Originally Posted by muriloninja

Wow, I think this went way over your head. You didn't even watch the video.

Well Im afraid to comment b/c ive never heard you say anything to anyone that wasnt shitty. So, wow, great, thanks.

**Oki-Des** · 05-11-2008, 04:18 PM

Sorry, after about five minutes "wake up" made me want to "fall asleep."
I will watch it all the way through before I post again to see what is is that I missed.
Sorry.

**thegodfather** · 05-11-2008, 04:31 PM

This video is significant because multiple small offense committed by the government over a small period of time go unnoticed by people. When these multiple offenses are compiled into a video that the average person can see in one shot, then they may realise the real problems we are facing.

**Panzerfaust** · 05-11-2008, 04:37 PM

U.S. SPENDING ON IRAQ AND AFGHANISTAN BY MONTH, WEEK, DAY, HOUR, MINUTE, & SECOND

(based on adjusted DOD FY 2007 obligations)

IRAQ + AFGHANISTAN

Per Month - $12.3 billion

Per Week - $2.9 billion

Per Day - $410 million

Per Hour - $17 million

Per Minute - $284,722

Per Second - $4,745

IRAQ

Per Month - $10.3 billion

Per Week - $2.4 billion

Per Day - $343 million

Per Hour - $14 million

Per Minute - $238,425

Per Second - $3,973

AFGHANISTAN

Per Month- $2 billion

Per Week - $469 million

Per Day - $67 million

Per Hour - $2.8 million

Per Minute - $46,296

Per Second - $771

As you can see, there is no reason to spend this money here at home and on Americans. /sarcasm

**Panzerfaust** · 05-11-2008, 04:41 PM

At least our new currency is going to be pretty.

**Panzerfaust** · 05-11-2008, 04:46 PM

Originally Posted by Diary of a Mad-man

Well Im afraid to comment b/c ive never heard you say anything to anyone that wasnt shitty. So, wow, great, thanks.

Probably afraid to do some research let alone watch this clip.

**feanixco** · 05-11-2008, 05:35 PM

Thats funny.....you used the poster and dvd cover from my church. HA-HA

**nojoke** · 05-11-2008, 07:38 PM

Originally Posted by muriloninja

U.S. SPENDING ON IRAQ AND AFGHANISTAN BY MONTH, WEEK, DAY, HOUR, MINUTE, & SECOND

(based on adjusted DOD FY 2007 obligations)

IRAQ + AFGHANISTAN

Per Month - $12.3 billion

Per Week - $2.9 billion

Per Day - $410 million

Per Hour - $17 million

Per Minute - $284,722

Per Second - $4,745

IRAQ

Per Month - $10.3 billion

Per Week - $2.4 billion

Per Day - $343 million

Per Hour - $14 million

Per Minute - $238,425

Per Second - $3,973

AFGHANISTAN

Per Month- $2 billion

Per Week - $469 million

Per Day - $67 million

Per Hour - $2.8 million

Per Minute - $46,296

Per Second - $771

As you can see, there is no reason to spend this money here at home and on Americans. /sarcasm

Thought provoking thread!...What's your view on who exactly is behind this?...Is it just the U.S. gov.?...Is it the Russian gov. with the USA?...Could it be all the govs. on this planet together?...Or is just one MAIN source outside of gov.?...Peace!

NJ

**Gears** · 05-11-2008, 08:12 PM

Glad this thread was brought up, some people are so naive to what exactly is happening in our country.

**Johnny_Rotten** · 05-11-2008, 09:32 PM

You're a total Oscar the Grouch!

Whinge whinge f#cken whinge. Go change your tampon!

**FallenWyvern** · 05-11-2008, 09:58 PM

Originally Posted by muriloninja

U.S. SPENDING ON IRAQ AND AFGHANISTAN BY MONTH, WEEK, DAY, HOUR, MINUTE, & SECOND

(based on adjusted DOD FY 2007 obligations)

IRAQ + AFGHANISTAN

Per Month - $12.3 billion

Per Week - $2.9 billion

Per Day - $410 million

Per Hour - $17 million

Per Minute - $284,722

Per Second - $4,745

IRAQ

Per Month - $10.3 billion

Per Week - $2.4 billion

Per Day - $343 million

Per Hour - $14 million

Per Minute - $238,425

Per Second - $3,973

AFGHANISTAN

Per Month- $2 billion

Per Week - $469 million

Per Day - $67 million

Per Hour - $2.8 million

Per Minute - $46,296

Per Second - $771

As you can see, there is no reason to spend this money here at home and on Americans. /sarcasm

Pretty sums up the only reason I would be forced to vote non-republican this time around.

**Overhaulz** · 05-12-2008, 05:33 AM

I love watching movies like this. Zeitgeist was the real eye-opener to a lot about the American government. I didn't get too far in to the video yet, but it's right up my alley. I love when truths are spread about the terrible things that America has done, and people either ignore them, or try to say the things never happened. The fact is that these things have happened and more Americans need to know about them.

**Overhaulz** · 05-12-2008, 05:36 AM

Muriloninja since I think you're in to the same videos that I am about America, have you see this:

http://video.google.ca/videoplay?doc...arch&plindex=2

Scary, scary details in there about how great America is.

**Gators** · 05-12-2008, 05:50 AM

Originally Posted by Overhaulz

Muriloninja since I think you're in to the same videos that I am about America, have you see this:

http://video.google.ca/videoplay?doc...arch&plindex=2

Scary, scary details in there about how great America is.

Do black helicopters follow you around? If it's so bad here, you can always leave, i hear Iran is a great place.

Yes, we've done some wrong, but BY FAR the good we've done and do in the world outweighs the mistakes we've made. I'm proud to be an American, feel free to kiss my ass if you're not.

**Overhaulz** · 05-12-2008, 05:58 AM

How in god's name could you possibly be proud to be an American if you even bothered to watch these videos? I know you didn't bother watching because if you did then you'd think differently. You fall in to the "people ignore the horrible things America has done" portion of my post above.

I'm American, yeah, but I'm not proud of what we've done. Please do share the "good" we've done that so far outweighs the things in these videos. (Only problem is that you have no clue what is in the videos since you didn't watch them).

**Edgar** · 05-12-2008, 06:41 AM

All war and violence sucks, it's about killing for $, but their is no country in the world that through out their political history was not a fu****g scumbag at some point and time. It's a lame argument that Americans should feel ashamed, here is the way I see it.

Example: Your a piece of sh!t because you killed 10 people, and I am not, because I only killed one.

Don’t be so naive scumbags are born everywhere!!!

All governments from every country in the world have done fu@$%d up Sh!# !!!

**Overhaulz** · 05-12-2008, 07:19 AM

^^ Well said, sir.

I can agree with that.

**Overhaulz** · 05-12-2008, 07:29 AM

On a side note, does anyone know the name of that bill that Bush signed in May of 2007 that stated if there was a national emergency that he could remain president indefinitely? I'm unable to find the name of that bill

**damiongage** · 05-12-2008, 07:55 AM

Originally Posted by Overhaulz

How in god's name could you possibly be proud to be an American if you even bothered to watch these videos? I know you didn't bother watching because if you did then you'd think differently. You fall in to the "people ignore the horrible things America has done" portion of my post above.

I'm American, yeah, but I'm not proud of what we've done. Please do share the "good" we've done that so far outweighs the things in these videos. (Only problem is that you have no clue what is in the videos since you didn't watch them).

are you basing your feelings by "these videos"?

I could make you video, twist things to support my beliefs,then would you take my word for the truth?

The real truth is...we will never know the truth, and you can drum up evidence and facts too support what ever you want to belive...I am not saying these videos are wrong...but I am not saying they are right either...I refuse to base my opinion on what are government is really doing by some youtube video.

the only real truth is....if you are not happy being an American...you ARE free to leave when ever you like.

**Overhaulz** · 05-12-2008, 08:11 AM

I really tire of the "if you don't like being an American then you can leave" spiel. What do I want? Maybe a good old debate about these videos would be nice. Heck, if you do have a video that is fact based, then please, I'd enjoy watching that too.

It just seems so many people cop out of a good argument nowadays with the typical "if you don't like it, leave it" response. (By good argument I mean no flaming and intelligent things said, not immature things like, "if you don't like it, you can kiss my ass," etc.)

More than anything I really like videos on this topic because more Americans need to be aware of what is happening. I don't get mad when people state their views, and I don't even care when people start calling me names or telling me to leave the country. Why? I was there once. I used to be a naive person that just sat back and listened to the media and believed everything that was going on.

I just really want more people to see what's really going on behind the scenes. I want people to see everything and then form their own truth from that.

Damiongage, please don't feel that I was flaming you in any way when I spoke of the "don't like it then leave it" saying. I completely respect your opinion and can understand your point of view that you stated in the above post. I like the fact that you at least acknowledge that the videos are not right or wrong. In my book that beats anyone that watches 3 minutes of it and says, "That's hogwash! It's all lies!" It means that you're thinking for yourself and that's all I really want out of people!

People need to wake up!

Edit: Sorry for not answering your initial question. Partially, yes, my opinion is formed from these videos, but the bulk of my opinion was formed when I watched Zeitgeist and did a lot of research on the internet / library. It's scary most everything in the these videos and Zeitgeist is factual and you can find information about it anywhere. It's just things that the media "forgets" to include in their coverage of topics

**Atomini** · 05-12-2008, 08:45 AM

Originally Posted by Gators

Do black helicopters follow you around? If it's so bad here, you can always leave, i hear Iran is a great place.

Yes, we've done some wrong, but BY FAR the good we've done and do in the world outweighs the mistakes we've made. I'm proud to be an American, feel free to kiss my ass if you're not.

Ignorant.

**Schmidty** · 05-12-2008, 08:55 AM

Is anybody suprized at this??? You shouldnt be if you are becausse its been happening to us slowly for sum time now. The blanket has been pulled so far over most peoples eyes that nothing is going to get done till its to late. Big brother is here without a doubt. Were constantly watched, listened to, followed to make sure if u try to open your mouth they are their to silence you. The one guy is sooo right about the banking system controlling everything. I have pissed a lot of people off by saying this but as soon as i finish my time in the army im moving the fvck to another country because this one is so fvckd and for the most part everybodys a sheep... Keep your mind, eyes and ears open, if u dont everything will be taken from you.

**Panzerfaust** · 05-12-2008, 09:37 AM

Listen, I am proud to be an American! The bottom line is this, the policies and war mongoring that this country implement on a daily basis is Un-American.

This is no longer "America"....America had a Constitution in which laid the ground work and guidelines for its peoples civil liberties and freedoms. "America" is the greatest nation on the face of the planet and the potential it had was endless.

We were unfortunately sold out and this nation we have today should no longer call itself "America" as it no longer follows the will of the people, nor does it protect and preserve its peoples civil liberties. It only seeks to slowly remove said rights and freedoms from its populace in order to gain total control.

People that are too afraid to wakeup and say "Whoa, let me have a look around and see what all this fuss is about" are the ones that spew the "If you don't like America, leave it" or the infamous "Leave, I hear Iran is a nice place to live". These people do not question authority, they accept it and follow like sheep.

It is in our great Declaration of Independence that states

"Governments are instituted among men, deriving their just Powers from the consent of the Governed, that whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these Ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government".

How can you assume to have rights and civil liberties when you don't even know what they are, you just hear everyone say your whole life "I'm an American, I have rights". Wake the **** up so you can see just what has been taken from you.

**Lemonada8** · 05-12-2008, 09:53 AM

wow... i havent even watched the vids and i know what they are about... hey dont freakin worry about what we are doin in iraq and afganistan... it aint noone else's business... OK?! and you say, cause we spent this much money in the iraq and afganistan stuff... well what about other spending? ok? we have as much damn money as we need... and dont hvae troops here to protect us here basically is the argument? hey we are using not even half of the current troops which would kick anybodys ass in the world... and we are plenty fine against any threat....

**Schmidty** · 05-12-2008, 10:26 AM

Wow!!! Very well said.

Originally Posted by muriloninja

Listen, I am proud to be an American! The bottom line is this, the policies and war mongoring that this country implement on a daily basis is Un-American.

This is no longer "America"....America had a Constitution in which laid the ground work and guidelines for its peoples civil liberties and freedoms. "America" is the greatest nation on the face of the planet and the potential it had was endless.

We were unfortunately sold out and this nation we have today should no longer call itself "America" as it no longer follows the will of the people, nor does it protect and preserve its peoples civil liberties. It only seeks to slowly remove said rights and freedoms from its populace in order to gain total control.

People that are too afraid to wakeup and say "Whoa, let me have a look around and see what all this fuss is about" are the ones that spew the "If you don't like America, leave it" or the infamous "Leave, I hear Iran is a nice place to live". These people do not question authority, they accept it and follow like sheep.

It is in our great Declaration of Independence that states

How can you assume to have rights and civil liberties when you don't even know what they are, you just hear everyone say your whole life "I'm an American, I have rights". Wake the **** up so you can see just what has been taken from you.

**damiongage** · 05-12-2008, 10:38 AM

Originally Posted by Overhaulz

I really tire of the "if you don't like being an American then you can leave" spiel. What do I want? Maybe a good old debate about these videos would be nice. Heck, if you do have a video that is fact based, then please, I'd enjoy watching that too.

It just seems so many people cop out of a good argument nowadays with the typical "if you don't like it, leave it" response. (By good argument I mean no flaming and intelligent things said, not immature things like, "if you don't like it, you can kiss my ass," etc.)

More than anything I really like videos on this topic because more Americans need to be aware of what is happening. I don't get mad when people state their views, and I don't even care when people start calling me names or telling me to leave the country. Why? I was there once. I used to be a naive person that just sat back and listened to the media and believed everything that was going on.

I just really want more people to see what's really going on behind the scenes. I want people to see everything and then form their own truth from that.

Damiongage, please don't feel that I was flaming you in any way when I spoke of the "don't like it then leave it" saying. I completely respect your opinion and can understand your point of view that you stated in the above post. I like the fact that you at least acknowledge that the videos are not right or wrong. In my book that beats anyone that watches 3 minutes of it and says, "That's hogwash! It's all lies!" It means that you're thinking for yourself and that's all I really want out of people!

People need to wake up!

Edit: Sorry for not answering your initial question. Partially, yes, my opinion is formed from these videos, but the bulk of my opinion was formed when I watched Zeitgeist and did a lot of research on the internet / library. It's scary most everything in the these videos and Zeitgeist is factual and you can find information about it anywhere. It's just things that the media "forgets" to include in their coverage of topics

No offense taking....I like these types of debates. Unlike alot of people I have a pretty open mind, that can be changed when new things are brought to light.

There may have been a bit of confusion bye my "if you do not like it, you CAN leave" remark. I was not trying to direct it towards you or any person directly. More like stating that you have the ability to leave. Some of these videos like to compare what they believe the government is doing to Nazi Germany. The difference lies in the fact that they could not leave...it was conform...or be killed. If we do not agree....we can leave.

My eyes are not closed, and I truley believe that our government does things everyday that, if brought to light, would astound most people. Where the question lies is....is what we are doing a necessary evil, and at what price?

One of the huge media exploits after 911 was the fact that we( be we I mean our government) did nothing to prevent the attacks, and waited until after we were attacked to do anything.

So now we have Saddam...we here that he is making WMD's. He has a record of using chemical weapons, he will not allow the UN in to inspect, and refuse to cooperate on any level. So what do we do....wait until he attacks us....we did that already with AlQuida...people did not like that. So we make a decide not to wait until he has WMD's and decide to overthrow him. Now the issue is, "Iraq never attacked us." we must be there for the oil.

I do not even try to understand or try to weed through all the lies.

**thegodfather** · 05-12-2008, 10:39 AM

Originally Posted by damiongage

the only real truth is....if you are not happy being an American...you ARE free to leave when ever you like.

Ya know... maybe the founding fathers of this country should have just LEFT because they didnt like how the British were treating them and the rest of the colonies. In fact, thats an excellent idea, they should have just picked up and left. That is exactly what you think they should have done right? They didnt like the oppressive condition created by the King and the British government, so they should have left the country.

Those of us who are unhappy with our government do not want to leave, we want things to return to a state of liberty, and not one where big brother controls or is involved in every aspect of a persons life!

**thegodfather** · 05-12-2008, 10:43 AM

Originally Posted by damiongage

So now we have Saddam...we here that he is making WMD's. He has a record of using chemical weapons, he will not allow the UN in to inspect, and refuse to cooperate on any level. So what do we do....wait until he attacks us....we did that already with AlQuida...people did not like that. So we make a decide not to wait until he has WMD's and decide to overthrow him. Now the issue is, "Iraq never attacked us." we must be there for the oil.

Iraq never had the capability to attack us even if they had a million WMD's. They had no delivery system, no possible way of attacking our homeland. In addition, Saddam was too pre-occupied with trying to invade his neighbors to waste any of his time on us. In fact, he dispised terrorists and frequently executed them. What really needs to be understood here, is that Congress is the only one authorized to send us into a war. Next, the only time that Congress may authorize a war is if the country in question poses a direct threat to our national security, which of course Iraq never did, that is a fact.

**smokethedays** · 05-12-2008, 10:56 AM

America is in the hands of bunch of WEALTHY SUPER POWERED individuals, matter of fact the whole world is.
America and the founding fathers did lay a fertile gorund for a great nation to come and flourish the entire world, but the draw back to that capitalist foundation is what we have today. Less that 1% with endless finances and powers rule everything, everywhere.

**damiongage** · 05-12-2008, 11:03 AM

Originally Posted by thegodfather

Ya know... maybe the founding fathers of this country should have just LEFT because they didnt like how the British were treating them and the rest of the colonies. In fact, thats an excellent idea, they should have just picked up and left. That is exactly what you think they should have done right? They didnt like the oppressive condition created by the King and the British government, so they should have left the country.

Um...yeh...thats pretty much what they did...this is not England...They moved to America, and when England's rule got too much for them...the went to war to throw England out of their country.

Those of us who are unhappy with our government do not want to leave, we want things to return to a state of liberty, and not one where big brother controls or is involved in every aspect of a persons life!

Comparing modern day American to the revolution, is a bit of a stretch.

**gixxerboy1** · 05-12-2008, 11:13 AM

I just think its funny that most people who say "if you dont like it your free to leave" Have never been to any other country. USA is the greatest country in the world. Why?

**damiongage** · 05-12-2008, 11:14 AM

Originally Posted by thegodfather

Iraq never had the capability to attack us

Didn't we say the same about the Japanese prior to WWII?

even if they had a million WMD's. They had no delivery system,

So we should allow felons to buy and posses bullets as long as they do not have the gun?

no possible way of attacking our homeland. In addition, Saddam was too pre-occupied with trying to invade his neighbors to waste any of his time on us. In fact, he dispised terrorists and frequently executed them. What really needs to be understood here, is that Congress is the only one authorized to send us into a war. Next, the only time that Congress may authorize a war is if the country in question poses a direct threat to our national security, which of course Iraq never did, that is a fact.

Not so sure if it is a fact...but I respect it as your opinion. Alquida did not have any WMD's not a "delivery system" but they were able to attack us.

Look I am not trying to defend the war...But to say it was impossible for him to attack us, or have an impact in the Middle East that would greatly effect our way of life (yes oil) is silly.

**gixxerboy1** · 05-12-2008, 11:19 AM

Originally Posted by damiongage

Not so sure if it is a fact...but I respect it as your opinion. Alquida did not have any WMD's not a "delivery system" but they were able to attack us.

Look I am not trying to defend the war...But to say it was impossible for him to attack us, or have an impact in the Middle East that would greatly effect our way of life (yes oil) is silly.

but with that theory you can justify us attacking anyone we dont like. Also
Alquida is a broup we attacked and invaded a country

Also if thats enough reason for justify us attacking someone. What if another nation used that with US. Bush has made threats with NK and Iran. Should they attack us now?

**rockinred** · 05-12-2008, 11:28 AM

no,no, no... the threat was nuclear technology development... To monitor and control this is important to the world. when you have a country developing this and it refuses to act responsible and cooperate then the UN gets involved. This technology can be sold and given to terrorist groups, etc...

Still, even with this being the case, there are many ways to prevent this development without a full scale war. The war on Iraq was about different reasons that had nothing to do with this... but this is the real threat to the world and surrounding countries...not the development of war missles to attack the U.S. or anything you guys are talking about as a threat.

**gixxerboy1** · 05-12-2008, 12:00 PM

Originally Posted by rockinred

no,no, no... the threat was nuclear technology development... To monitor and control this is important to the world. when you have a country developing this and it refuses to act responsible and cooperate then the UN gets involved. This technology can be sold and given to terrorist groups, etc...

Still, even with this being the case, there are many ways to prevent this development without a full scale war. The war on Iraq was about different reasons that had nothing to do with this... but this is the real threat to the world and surrounding countries...not the development of war missles to attack the U.S. or anything you guys are talking about as a threat.

why not Iran Pakistan or North Korea then?

**nojoke** · 05-12-2008, 12:03 PM

Originally Posted by rockinred

no,no, no... the threat was nuclear technology development... To monitor and control this is important to the world. when you have a country developing this and it refuses to act responsible and cooperate then the UN gets involved. This technology can be sold and given to terrorist groups, etc...

Still, even with this being the case, there are many ways to prevent this development without a full scale war. but this is the real threat to the world and surrounding countries...

Good points indeed...Here are some tid bits of info regarding the International arms trade that occurs yearly...

1. International trading in arms is soaring beyond $1,000,000,000,000 each year, while hundreds of millions of humans are deprived of life's necessities...

2. Armaments appear to be a basic support of the world's economy...For example, on April 11, 1987, an article in London's Spectacle reported: "Counting only directly related industries, some 400,000 jobs are involved in the U.S. and 750,000 in Europe...

3. What's ironic about 1 and 2?...Interestingly enough, as the social and economic role of building weapons has grown, the actual question of whether the producers are well defended is a question of concern...Huh?...

You see, huge profits are made as bombs and other weaponry are traded all over the earth, even to potenital enemies...One needs to give this thought...Why?...Some day those bombs may come back in a fiery holocaust to destroy those selling them...Quiet the paradox!...

Now to add to this, in the United States alone, according to the Spectator, "every year the Pentagon inexplicably loses $900-million worth of arms and equipment"...

So then, in general, the world as a whole is in trouble...Peace!

NJ

**rockinred** · 05-12-2008, 12:10 PM

Originally Posted by gixxerboy1

why not Iran Pakistan or North Korea then?

true, the threat is prominent in different areas fore sure... which goes to support what I was saying..."this wasn't the real motive for the US war with Iraq".... All I was saying is that this REAL THREAT was being sold to the American public as the motive.... which is more hostile then terrorist attacks, etc... what was being mentioned above.