Still can't diagnose shoulder problem/any advice?

**boxer08** · 08-27-2008, 08:09 AM

I'm a 19 year old male that has been having shoulder pain for nearly two years the right being the worse. It has got so bad that i cant workout or even get a job. I have been to a rheumatology, seen a osteopath, sports therapist, had a x-ray on both shoulders, had a blood test and a Mri on the right shoulder. Every one of them had come back clear and they cant find nothing wrong. My symptoms are as follows - griding, cracking, grating, poping and clicking felling's and sounds which feel like they are coming from the joints in the shoulder. My shoulder constantly aches from morning to night and the ache is eased by rest and made worse by using the shoulders. On certain movements i can make my shoulder click every time which are really lound clicks. Ive tried anti-infflamotories and joint supplemets with no sucess. I'm starting to think that i have osteoarthiritis in both shoulders, but wouldn't all of those test found it . I have full motion of the shoulders. I would really appreciate any advice and help as i just dont know what to do anymore. Thanks

**boxer08** · 08-27-2008, 08:12 AM

I know this should be in the injury froum but i thought i would post it here as i will get more answers and quicker.

**Odpierdol_sie!** · 08-27-2008, 11:15 AM

Can you be a bit more specific as to where you are feeling pain and Is it localised to a certain area or does it affect other areas also, e.g. shooting pains down your arm between the bicep and tricep?

**Hoggage_54** · 08-27-2008, 11:17 AM

I have the same grinding and popping feelings and sounds you were talking about. Prior to a workout, I will take a light dumbell, 2 1/2lbs - 5lbs, hold it in my hand, bend over and let my shoulder completly relax but hold on to the weight in my hand. Let it hang and do small circular motions while trying to keep your shoulder as relaxed as possible. The shoulder is a ball joint or whatever you call it (make a fist and cover your fist with your other hand, thats what it is like). Holding the weight while keeping your shoulder relaxed slightly pulls on the joint and lets more blood flow into it. See how that works.

**boxer08** · 08-27-2008, 12:10 PM

The pain is just in the shoulder's. It is at the front of the shoulder and feel's like its coming from in the joints. The shoulder aint tender to touch or sore anywhere. There aint no swelling either. I found a pic on google and circled around about where if feel's like the pain is coming from. I aslo have my Mri scan pics.

**Odpierdol_sie!** · 08-27-2008, 01:27 PM

Originally Posted by boxer08

The pain is just in the shoulder's. It is at the front of the shoulder and feel's like its coming from in the joints. The shoulder aint tender to touch or sore anywhere. There aint no swelling either. I found a pic on google and circled around about where if feel's like the pain is coming from. I aslo have my Mri scan pics.

Ok, now whats your work out split like? just wanna know what you train like before i make any judgment.

**boxer08** · 08-27-2008, 01:50 PM

Monday - chest and triceps
Wednesday - back and biceps
Friday - shoulder and legs

**boxer08** · 08-27-2008, 01:54 PM

The sports therapist checked me for tendonitis so it aint that. Thanks for the replies.

**Odpierdol_sie!** · 08-27-2008, 02:17 PM

From the area you say it is, id say its tendonitis/tandonosis, i know you have been told otherwise but you have had no end of tests done, i think that there is not much else that can be that is wrong with you.

Doing some form of rehab training in your split for tendonitis wont hurt you and you may find it eases ur pain etc

**boxer08** · 08-27-2008, 03:43 PM

I understand what you a saying but i am not having any symptoms of the both. I have tried rehab in the past but it causes more pain. I took 3 months of this year but there was no change at all. I have been icing my shoulder recently with no sucess, should i ice it or apply heat to it. I am also taking ibuprofen 1200mg daily, cod liver oil and animal flex.

**scibble** · 08-27-2008, 03:48 PM

which arm motions worsen pain?

my opinion is "no" x-rays and MRIs don't always pick up the problems; surgeons sometimes open up joints are are surprised to find the MRI didn't reveal everything. You may need an orthopedic surgeon to scope your shoulder.

certainly all those noises lead me to believe there is osteoarthritis

**boxer08** · 08-27-2008, 03:55 PM

I think it is osteoarthritis and it is aslo in both shoulders, the right being the worse. If they look in the shoulder will they find osteoarthritis that way. I have attached one image from my Mri scan. Thanks again for all the replies.

**boxer08** · 08-27-2008, 04:38 PM

Here's another, my grapics on my laptop aint the best so i cant have a good look at it. I can circle on this image around where the pain is coming from if that will help.

**testigator** · 08-27-2008, 06:13 PM

Hey Boxer, I'm sure you tried most everything in the gym but are there any exercises that hurt it more than others? I suffer from bad shoulder pain and have had to adjust my workouts accordingly. I had to move shoulders and chest day together so I could have the rest of the week to recover for the first six months. I also dropped incline bench, deep flys and the pec deck as they were the worst for me. My shoulder pain came more on chest day and the days after. I thought mine was tendentious and started doing rotator cuff exercises everyday in the gym. I still have a little pain on occasion but I am pretty much back to normal.

**Builder15** · 08-27-2008, 06:29 PM

Sounds to me like it could be a labral tear. Is there any pain with the clicking in your shoulder? It seems unlikely you have OA because of your age, and it is more common for younger active people to have anterior shoulder instability. Did anyone you see perform any special tests for labral tears, or shoulder instability?

**Psychotron** · 08-27-2008, 09:14 PM

You can have an orthopedic surgon scope the shoulder. That is the only way they will know what's going on. The entire posterior labrum was torn on my left shoulder, but the MRI showed almost nothing. I demanded a scope be done on it to locate the issue, and I ended up spending like 3 hours in surgory to repair it. Six months out and the Physical Therapy still isnt done.

**boxer08** · 08-28-2008, 03:20 AM

Originally Posted by testigator

Hey Boxer, I'm sure you tried most everything in the gym but are there any exercises that hurt it more than others? I suffer from bad shoulder pain and have had to adjust my workouts accordingly. I had to move shoulders and chest day together so I could have the rest of the week to recover for the first six months. I also dropped incline bench, deep flys and the pec deck as they were the worst for me. My shoulder pain came more on chest day and the days after. I thought mine was tendentious and started doing rotator cuff exercises everyday in the gym. I still have a little pain on occasion but I am pretty much back to normal.

all exercices hurt but chest and back being the worse, pull ups cause really bad pain, decline and fly's to. The fly's cause alot of grinding.

**boxer08** · 08-28-2008, 03:26 AM

Originally Posted by Builder15

Sounds to me like it could be a labral tear. Is there any pain with the clicking in your shoulder? It seems unlikely you have OA because of your age, and it is more common for younger active people to have anterior shoulder instability. Did anyone you see perform any special tests for labral tears, or shoulder instability?

I thought at first it was a labrum tear but according to most peope ive seen its not that although they did not preform any special tests for it and seemed like they didn't have a clue. I do have OA in my back, the people that viewed my Mri scan results said that it was possibly caused by previous schemann's disease, so i wouldn't of thought that was related to my shoulder.

**boxer08** · 08-28-2008, 03:28 AM

Originally Posted by Psychotron

You can have an orthopedic surgon scope the shoulder. That is the only way they will know what's going on. The entire posterior labrum was torn on my left shoulder, but the MRI showed almost nothing. I demanded a scope be done on it to locate the issue, and I ended up spending like 3 hours in surgory to repair it. Six months out and the Physical Therapy still isnt done.

Iam waiting to see a orthopedic surgon but i'm doing it through the Nhs so its taken ages, when i do i will try and get them to have a look in there.

**boxer08** · 08-28-2008, 03:48 AM

If i put my finger on the area that is marked red and do a bench press movment, i can feel it moving inside,it feels like its grinding and grating. If i keep repeating the bench press or fly movement and take the movement's all the way the whole shoulder feels like its gringing and i get like a pop and click every time.

**TranscriptionFactor** · 08-28-2008, 04:23 AM

I don't think its OA based on your age and no mention of bony trauma to the joint. Btw did you mean "scheuermann's" disease/kyphosis? No, its not related to shoulder.
Based on a quick scan of your posts, I think there's a good chance of a labral tear, specifically SLAP lesion. I think a diagnostic scope would be in order, talk to your orthopod.

No history of dislocations, right?

**boxer08** · 08-28-2008, 04:41 AM

Yes Scheuemann's disease i meant, couldn't spell it. I havent had no previous dislocations or any sort of injury to neither of the shoulders. I am having the symptoms in both shoulders but the right is the worse thats why i think it is OA or could both shoulders have a labrum tear.

**boxer08** · 08-28-2008, 05:30 AM

Just been feeling my shoulders and if put preassure with my finger where the area is marked that aslo causes a little pain, only if i do it from the top of my shoulder. Its feels like im pressing a a bone but it hurts, not sure if that is normal.

**MuscleScience** · 08-28-2008, 10:07 AM

I agree with TF, some labrial tears can not be seen very well by Imaging. A ortho going in and scoping your shoulder would more than likely be the best way to get a confirmed diagnosis. Since your a weight lifter you could also be looking at impingement syndrome also.

**boxer08** · 08-28-2008, 03:10 PM

What i dont understand is that i have full ROM in the shoulder even the right one at the moment. I am going to see the doc tomorrow and was thinking to ask for another x-ray, the last one i had was May this year. Do you think it will find anything. Is there any certain tasks or movements that i can preform myself to see if its OA.