Forget the republicians and the democrates

[FreeDOOM]

Forget McCain and Obama they are typical globalist filled with same rehotric of change change change and when they get in office they take your change. Change to what, A New World Order if you ask me. All they care about is power and money. I used to be republican then I realized they are not conservative or even God fearing but are all for more government. Hell all we get is Iraq war, Perscription drug plan which cost billions more then he said it would, and crap like the patriot act. Remember Governor Spitzer well he was busted using the Patriot act. Well so much for using it to stop terrorism. I am voting 3rd party and no I am not throwing away my vote, if you think that how can you ever expect change. It is time for people to start voting there conscious and vote for who they want instead instead of being so partisan.

[bigt10]

It isnt like Obama or McCain are going to follow the constituion, fix the budget deficit, stop washing away our civil liberties, or restore to some kind of hard money.

I tell people not to vote, period. Both are not qualified.

The founding fathers of this country would be ashamed and disgusted for the programs and plans both of these TYRANTS are offering for this country.

And aslong as we have a federal reserve and the power to create money this whole thing wont stop.

The central bank is the heart of the state. The central bank gives the state it's power, it is like the heart without it all its options would fail.

The central bank makes the militaristic, nationalistic, and socialist state all possible at the same time and it will only get worse.

The politicians will use the central bank to provide more hands out and more war otherwise known as Guns and Butter.

Your going to lose more civil liberties.

And the problem with our central bank is this globalist non sense. Since our dollar is used as the reserve asset of the world foreigners soak up our dollars and treat them as if they are gold. This gives our government unlimited power to create new money and literally export our inflation as we have done for years.

This is why the most serious threats this country are ever going to face our oil bearing countries or major asian trading countries that have such huge trade surpluses with us, there unwillingness to accept our dollars would expose the printing press behind the closed curtains.

America has lost our respect and our ways that include civil liberties, protection of private property and property rights, low taxes, and a free market.

It all starts with the central bank and it will all end with the central bank. Without the central bank what we have today would be a dream land. We would never be able to afford this with a real hard money. We wouldn't have such a huge military, or such a massive socialist state.

The keys to prosperity are production and savings, not spending and consumption.

Now we have 2 presidents coming up both are willing to increase welfare at home and at the same time propose massive expansions to our military.

Is every american stupid or do some of ask perhaps how can we afford this? In the end this will all have to be paid for, and wealth can not be created on a printing press. The empire is going to fall and the longer we continue on this destructive path the more suffering will take place when we do.

A restoration to a sound money backed by gold is this country's only hope to control, and perhaps drift back towards the constitution. As long as the government has the ability to create money none of this can ever happen. I some day dream of sound money and the constitution, it seems these are 2 words the American government or people have lost touch with.

[Voice of Reason]

Voting ain't gonna do shit, at the level of corruption the government is at now a HUGE social movement is required to take back OUR White House, Country, Rights.

[KatsMeow]

i think we are screwed no matter what.

[FreeDOOM]

It isnt like Obama or McCain are going to follow the constituion, fix the budget deficit, stop washing away our civil liberties, or restore to some kind of hard money.

I tell people not to vote, period. Both are not qualified.

The founding fathers of this country would be ashamed and disgusted for the programs and plans both of these TYRANTS are offering for this country.

And aslong as we have a federal reserve and the power to create money this whole thing wont stop.

The central bank is the heart of the state. The central bank gives the state it's power, it is like the heart without it all its options would fail.

The central bank makes the militaristic, nationalistic, and socialist state all possible at the same time and it will only get worse.

The politicians will use the central bank to provide more hands out and more war otherwise known as Guns and Butter.

Your going to lose more civil liberties.

And the problem with our central bank is this globalist non sense. Since our dollar is used as the reserve asset of the world foreigners soak up our dollars and treat them as if they are gold. This gives our government unlimited power to create new money and literally export our inflation as we have done for years.

This is why the most serious threats this country are ever going to face our oil bearing countries or major asian trading countries that have such huge trade surpluses with us, there unwillingness to accept our dollars would expose the printing press behind the closed curtains.

America has lost our respect and our ways that include civil liberties, protection of private property and property rights, low taxes, and a free market.

It all starts with the central bank and it will all end with the central bank. Without the central bank what we have today would be a dream land. We would never be able to afford this with a real hard money. We wouldn't have such a huge military, or such a massive socialist state.

The keys to prosperity are production and savings, not spending and consumption.

Now we have 2 presidents coming up both are willing to increase welfare at home and at the same time propose massive expansions to our military.

Is every american stupid or do some of ask perhaps how can we afford this? In the end this will all have to be paid for, and wealth can not be created on a printing press. The empire is going to fall and the longer we continue on this destructive path the more suffering will take place when we do.

A restoration to a sound money backed by gold is this country's only hope to control, and perhaps drift back towards the constitution. As long as the government has the ability to create money none of this can ever happen. I some day dream of sound money and the constitution, it seems these are 2 words the American government or people have lost touch with.

Wow someone who thinks like me! Sometimes I think I am all alone in this country. I agree the Federal reserve is a absolute mockery of US Constitution and a cruel joke against the American people. Look at this simple fact in 1913 if you had 1 dollar in today's money you would need 21.78 to buy the same think. I am sorry to say its only a matter of times before the dollar is worth 0$, we owe China over a trillion dollars in debt. I can not express in words how ridiculous it is that we have had a government that spends as much as it does. How can you tell me that 2.8 trillion dollars a year is not enough. Not to mention medicare, medicaid, social security, welfare, public schools ect...... I tell you what look on youtube at Chuck Baldwin he is the Pres candidate for the Constitution party. Listen to what he says about the Federal Reserve, Patriot act, and the UN. I am sold.

[stpete]

i think we are screwed no matter what.

I second this.

[xlxBigSexyxlx]

Your vote does not count, and you can thank the electoral college for that.

McCain and Obama are both clowns.

McCain is going to fall over in a few months. And Obama will be assassinated


People these days....its sad

Anarchy 08!!! lol jk.

[Amorphic]

Voting ain't gonna do shit, at the level of corruption the government is at now a HUGE social movement is required to take back OUR White House, Country, Rights.

agreed. it would take real action to change the system. paper pushing and politics arent the answer anymore.

[KatsMeow]

I feel like voting for mickey mouse.

[bigt10]

"A democracy is nothing more than mob rule, where fifty-one percent of the people may take away the rights of the other forty-nine." - Thomas Jefferson

[Bojangles69]

So wait.. how do you guys really feel?

[40plusnewbie]

FreeDOOM and bigt10, you guys warm my heart (no homo).

Anarcho-capitalism is the only way to go IMO (although I would be fine with a minarchy-i.e. a small centran gov't that strictly adhered to the constitution and had very limited powers and very limited involvement in people's lives, I just doubt that's possible due to the inherent corruption that happens when you create 2 classes of people- one with special powers adn authority over others).

Mark Stevens is my favorite anarch-capitalist. He runs a website:

www.adventuresinlegalland.com

He writes articles, puts on videos, and also has (or used to have) a radio spot weekly on some public radio station-it at least used to be possible to download prior broadcasts, plus you could listen on the internent, haven't checked those out lately so not sure where that stuff stands).

The reason government can and does do what it does is because WE LET IT. IT's because WE GIVE IT POWER.

If everyone (and I realize this is fantasy, I"m just trying to illustrate a point) stopped paying taxes, stopped going to the registry to renew licence's and stopped going to the registry to renew their registrations.... if people all started to barter for goods and services and businesses all stopped providing tax id numbers to the IRS for their employees and stopped deducting payroll taxes and started paying in gold and silver, or paper money for that matter....what the heck could the government do? NOTHING. The only reason they have control is becuse we give it to them. If a few people don't obey they send ppl with guns to lock them up in the Gulag. But if 45% of the population stopped obeying they couldn't do anything! (again, I"m not an idiot, I"m not suggesting this is a feasible short term plan).

Government brainwashes all it's citizens in public schools from the time they are small children to get them to fall in line as adutls to bow to the govenment and not question it, or the 2 party system.

I swear, if Stalin was running against Mousolinni in this election 90% of the population would be talking about 'which of the lesser of 2 evils to vote for' rather than throwing fits in public in massive rallies all over the place, rather than marching on washington dc.

If no one paid taxes the government would disolve. If all people simply stopped paying attn to the RMV they would disolve. When a few people ignore them they get spanked, but if 50% of us ingnored them they are screwed. Cops can't pull over 1/2 of the cars on the roads to slap them with fines if they have no 'valid' regsitration. And then the other 1/2 of the population would begin to feel like idiots for sending in their money for new registrations.

Here is one video off of Mark Stevens web site that demonstrats how government forcibly gets up in people's business when they are simply minding their own business and harming nor endangering anyone. It's kind of a radical concept, but makes a very powerful point IMO. Give the vid a minute to load before clicking the play button:

http://www.adventuresinlegalland.com...nt/view/28/33/

Hey FreeDOOM, it seems we have more in common that an interest in brewing. Sweet! Keep up the good work.

Our world can change for the better if people are woken up to the b/s that is going on. They just don't receive the info b/c the media bombards them with 2 party system b/s day and night. With the internet information can be passed along to others to let them see other points of view they would othewise never be exposed to.

And when I was 19 I was a devout republican. In fact I was a delegate at my republican state convention. Not long after I began to realize that the republicans are not for small government (anyone who doubts this go look up a graph of how their spending trend has been over the past 50 years). So at about 25 I became a libertarian. About 2 years ago I was exposed for the first time to the concept of anarcho-capitalism, I had fears, doubts and reservations initially but was eventually convinced by a couple of very smart posters at another site (a poker site with a politics sub forum if anyone cares) that this was a better approach (well my #1 political system preference is 40plusnewbie King of the World system, if anyone is up for championing that cause pm me lol, and my #2 choice is anarcho-capitalism).

Basically everyone reading this (well a disproportional % of the ppl here are younger than the nat avg so maybe not everyone=but you will) pays more than half of EVERYTHING they earn in taxes.

Don't think so? Think you yourself, I"m in the 28% tax bracket, plus I get a refund?

Well think about this:

Social security tax (which is being paid out to 70 year olds the moment they collect it from YOUR check...money supposedly for your own retirement)
State tax
Federal tax
Gas tax
Booze tax
Cigarette tax
Sales tax
Property tax (built into the cost of your rent for all renters)
Exise tax
Registration of your car fee- (i.e. tax)
Drivers license fee (i.e. tax)
Road toll taxes (I don't care what the people who take them call them, it's a TAX)
No seatbelt wearing ticket tax
Speeding ticket tax
Headlight out or taillight out ticket tax
Parking violation ticket tax
little taxes on your phone bills and electric bills and cable bills
I"m sure I"ve missed a few, and now the big one...

Inflation tax

Bigt10 talked about how our inflation is outsourced to other nations. Well we pay out the ass for this and it is a TAX. Why do you think prices rise every year? Is there something inherent in the cost of a candy bar that makes it cost more to produce every year? Are the small store owners who own a 7/11 ultra rich now because the costs of all their products cost 10,000% more than they did 150 years ago? Like back then they barely got by and now they own a dozen beach houses and a small private island because of the massive increase in price they charge for their products relative to the ppl who owned those types of stores 150 years ago?

It is because of inflation. Inflation is caused, as bigt10 said, because the government just prints money out of thin air. That makes every dollar you own prior to the printing WORTH LESS. It also makes every good you own worth less as well (as in your car, your gear, your clothes, etc). The way the decrease in worth is noticed is an INCREASE In PRICE for similar products for sale in stores, etc.

The way I like to illustrate it is this. Imagine that the biggest room in your house or apartment was filled floor to ceiling with gold bricks and diamons. You would be quite happy, right? You would litterally be sitting on a gold mine. But now imagine that every single house and apartment all across the entire planet also had the biggest room in their dwelling filled floor to ceiling with gold bricks and diamonds.

You went from sitting on a gold mine to having a pile of rocks filling your living space. Now instead of being rich you would be considering hiring someone to come and haul them off for you because they are so prevalant they are not worth anything (or hardly anything).

That is the way it is with the money supply because it is backed by nothing (actually it's backed by 'the full faith and trust of the us government'- and all that means when you come right down to it is the government ability to stick a gun in your face and demand you give them some of your hard earned money or shoot you- or offer you the consolation prize of shipping you off to the Goulag for not paying).

So when the government prints money out of thin air it's just like if gold or diamonds fell out of thin air into everyone's hands. The more there is the less they are worth. Eventually they become worth nothing.

So inflation is a major tax on your ass. That's why houses cost 1/2 million today and used to cost 20K a hundred years ago.

[FreeDOOM]

Well think about this:

Social security tax (which is being paid out to 70 year olds the moment they collect it from YOUR check...money supposedly for your own retirement)
State tax
Federal tax
Gas tax
Booze tax
Cigarette tax
Sales tax
Property tax (built into the cost of your rent for all renters)
Exise tax
Registration of your car fee- (i.e. tax)
Drivers license fee (i.e. tax)
Road toll taxes (I don't care what the people who take them call them, it's a TAX)
No seatbelt wearing ticket tax
Speeding ticket tax
Headlight out or taillight out ticket tax
Parking violation ticket tax
little taxes on your phone bills and electric bills and cable bills
I"m sure I"ve missed a few, and now the big one...

Inflation tax

Bigt10 talked about how our inflation is outsourced to other nations. Well we pay out the ass for this and it is a TAX. Why do you think prices rise every year? Is there something inherent in the cost of a candy bar that makes it cost more to produce every year? Are the small store owners who own a 7/11 ultra rich now because the costs of all their products cost 10,000% more than they did 150 years ago? Like back then they barely got by and now they own a dozen beach houses and a small private island because of the massive increase in price they charge for their products relative to the ppl who owned those types of stores 150 years ago?

It is because of inflation. Inflation is caused, as bigt10 said, because the government just prints money out of thin air. That makes every dollar you own prior to the printing WORTH LESS. It also makes every good you own worth less as well (as in your car, your gear, your clothes, etc). The way the decrease in worth is noticed is an INCREASE In PRICE for similar products for sale in stores, etc.

The way I like to illustrate it is this. Imagine that the biggest room in your house or apartment was filled floor to ceiling with gold bricks and diamons. You would be quite happy, right? You would litterally be sitting on a gold mine. But now imagine that every single house and apartment all across the entire planet also had the biggest room in their dwelling filled floor to ceiling with gold bricks and diamonds.

You went from sitting on a gold mine to having a pile of rocks filling your living space. Now instead of being rich you would be considering hiring someone to come and haul them off for you because they are so prevalant they are not worth anything (or hardly anything).

That is the way it is with the money supply because it is backed by nothing (actually it's backed by 'the full faith and trust of the us government'- and all that means when you come right down to it is the government ability to stick a gun in your face and demand you give them some of your hard earned money or shoot you- or offer you the consolation prize of shipping you off to the Goulag for not paying).

So when the government prints money out of thin air it's just like if gold or diamonds fell out of thin air into everyone's hands. The more there is the less they are worth. Eventually they become worth nothing.

So inflation is a major tax on your ass. That's why houses cost 1/2 million today and used to cost 20K a hundred years ago.[/QUOTE]

those are only the taxes that we see. corporations and business pay billions and billions more in taxes which guess what they pass on to us in the price of their products. Also I think you forgot school tax. I honestly believe that "among a few other things" the worth of dollar will determine our countries future. If we continue to deficit spend at the rate we do, if the dollars value keeps going down what happens when you need so much money that you need a wheel barrel to buy a loaf of bread. I'll tell you what, the country the economy collapses and we become a 3rd world nation. Maybe the lovely UN would send its forces here to stop the fighting, or perhaps China and Russia would be so kind to send some. Oh great I am probably on the Patriot Acts short list now.

[SMCengineer]

I'm assuming you guys already know about http://www.campaignforliberty.com/ and rallyfortherepublic.com?

[bigt10]

know get into touch with reality thats all.

read www.mises.org and lewrockwell.com

I am going to make a big ass post on this housing market cause no body seems to get it.

And why was that thread with the obama lies deleted, this Biden guy is even worse.

[RuhlFreak55]

bush passed all the necessary laws for him to stay in office and declare martial law here anyway.....and half of me thinks he just may do it.....we'll have to see.....i just want the country to end already so i can go about my business

[FreeDOOM]

bush passed all the necessary laws for him to stay in office and declare martial law here anyway.....and half of me thinks he just may do it.....we'll have to see.....i just want the country to end already so i can go about my business

This country isnt just going to simply end. Expect a collapse into the super rich and dirt poor just like in soviet russia. Expect to have no food, water, gas, car, and electricity. I would assume another civil war though not north against south but of many factions.

[RuhlFreak55]

This country isnt just going to simply end. Expect a collapse into the super rich and dirt poor just like in soviet russia. Expect to have no food, water, gas, car, and electricity. I would assume another civil war though not north against south but of many factions.

umm yea....it's gonna end....and i'm gonna carve out my own little kingdom, that's the plan