How many members believe in ghosts/had a supernatural experiance?

[Matt]

^^^ Fvck lol, il read all this when ive got a spare few days....

[xlxBigSexyxlx]

^^^ Fvck lol, il read all this when ive got a spare few days....

hahaha, lazy bastard!
Takes like 5 minutes! lol

[yannick35]

The link is amazing but read the comments has well some people have strong points too.

[jbm]

[The Deuce]

What is it about the thought of supernatural things that intrigues people so much? I should say alleged supernatural things. Maybe it’s not intrigue. Maybe it’s something else…

People are intellectually lazy! Why do people believe in the supernatural? ESP, psychics, Astrology, ghosts, etc? Because it’s easy to just say that something is caused by supernatural forces, rather than to actually think about things, to do a little research or even perform an experiment… to actually find out what the cause of something is. It’s really not that hard.

I want to talk about ghosts for now. What are ghosts? Or, what do people purport ghosts to be? Basically, what survives of our soul or spirit (whatever you want to call it) after we die. Okay. Let’s take a look at just what this would imply.

In order for something to exist, it has to consist of something. To start with, everything consists of atoms. From there, we know that atoms emit energy. And energy has certain limits, as does matter, or atoms. The first thing we know for certain is that one object cannot pass through another object and retain its original form. There is a certain topic in quantum mechanics called “quantum tunneling” which deals with this very topic. The quantum tunneling principle basically says that it may be possible for the energy from an object, namely on the atomic level – not automobiles or people, may pass through another object.

It follows that if ghosts are real, in that they consist of matter, then they cannot pass through walls. It is physically impossible.

The next topic to deal with are the claims that people make that ghosts throw objects, move chairs, open and close doors, etc. These claims make believers chose one or the other. Either ghosts are physical beings, or they are not. Either they consist of atoms, or they don’t. We know this is true because in order for a ghost to move or throw anything, or to turn a door handle, friction is required. And friction is caused by two surfaces working against each other. Simple physics… not to be confused with psychics.

Because friction is required, then any claim that a ghost caused some object to move locks one into saying that a ghost is a solid object, or that at least it is atomic in structure and is in some phase of matter, i.e. solid, liquid or gas… probably not plasma. And if this is the case, then the ghost could not “become invisible” unless it was bound by specific temperatures. Meaning, whatever material the ghost consisted of has a particular temperature at which it changes states of matter – boils, melts, evaporates, etc. And the way to make the ghost visible is to simply change its form from a gas to a solid… to simply lower the temperature to make its material “solid.” And with everything we know about matter, if you were to bring an actual human being to its boiling point… well, you know what would happen.

To say that the ghost is not a solid or physical object totally goes against everything that we know about science. If one claims that a ghost is not made of matter, or atoms, then it totally throws out the possibility of its existence. Everything we know about energy and matter totally contradicts this theory. In order to interact with reality, it has to consist of something. And if these alleged ghosts do consist of something other than any kind of matter or energy that we know of, then they do not even enter into our reality. They cannot interact with us on any possible level and are outside the realm of science. The most one could say, in this situation, is that they were agnostic in terms of belief in ghosts, because they would be neither visible, nor noticeable in any circumstance. They could neither show themselves to us, nor could they interact with any object in order to “show us a sign.” They would be likened to the pink Unicorn on the dark side of the Moon. No one is there to see it, and it doesn’t effect us in any way, so whether or not there is a pink Unicorn on the dark side of the Moon means nothing to us.

So what do we do? Do we rewrite every book on science, physics and biology to support the wild claims of a few people who have never actually proven any in any scientific way? Or, do we simply disregard these claims as the result of the inner workings of these people’s imaginations, and rely on thousands of years of human observation, and hundreds of years of compounded, unrefuted scientific knowledge? You tell me.

Then we come to these “Ghost Hunter” shows on television. These people are, to start with, not scientists. They say so themselves. They have an agenda. To prove that ghosts do, in fact, exist. Any evidence that points in any other direction is disregarded. And look at the equipment they bring to these sites: Geiger counters, Infrared surface thermometers. Are they looking for nuclear fallout? They wave that stupid Infrared surface thermometer around wildly and say, “Look, the temperature is constantly changing.” Yeah, no kidding. You don’t know how to use that thing. It’s for measuring the temperature of a solid surface, not for waving around the room like a magic wand. Of course you’re going to get odd readings.

The main problem is that they never actually do any real scientific research. The first main component in scientific research is hypothesis testing. Say, for example, you believe there might be ghosts in a certain location. Ok. So what are these ghosts purportedly doing? Moving an object around the room? Making the temperature change? Well, design an experiment that aims to disprove that theory. That’s how the Scientific Method works. You don’t start with a conclusion and look for every bit of evidence that supports that claim, then disregard anything that doesn’t support it. It’s the same thing with “Creation Scientists.” They want to prove that God created everything, so that’s the only evidence they look for. When they see that biology and genetics prove that people evolved from other forms of life, they throw that evidence away because they aren’t interested in the truth. They want to prove that “God did it.”

In this way, the Scientific Method doesn’t work for ghost hunters. These guys go in there with a whole bunch of crap they bought at Radio Shack, stuff that isn’t designed to “detect ghosts.” Then they go through looking for things they can’t explain. Like why they get electromagnetic readings when they’re in a room with an electrical panel. Hmmm… I wonder why? Could it be that there is electricity in the room? Then, in the true scientific spirit, instead of trying to figure out what caused the strange occurrence (say, for example, having the electric company shut off the power to the house, and then performing another reading), they simply assume it was a ghost causing these readings. How intellectually lazy these people are. It’s nonsense.

Then there are people who claim to have had very real experiences which include things such as a ghost attacking them, accompanied by the feeling of paralysis, being unable to breathe, etc. These experiences are very vivid to those who have them.

These experiences are easily explained. Here is a link to a study on the topic, although this study was done on those who claimed to be abducted by UFOs. But the situations are similar enough to note this study. Both are relatively similar experiences.

Basically, what happens is when one falls asleep, there is a part of the brain stem that paralyzes the body once you enter REM sleep. This happens so that you don’t act out your dreams. The frightening thing that can happen is that the sleeping person wakes up, but this part of the brain stem fails to release its paralyzing effect on the body. The person cannot move, possibly has a very difficult time breathing, and also possibly is still experiencing the dream they were having. It’s called a waking dream, and the person experiencing it is totally convinced that what is happening in their mind is happening in reality.

The basic point that I want to make is that instead of immediately jumping to the supernatural conclusion, try doing some experimentation to actually discover what really caused what you claim to be ghost activity. You’ll be surprised at what a little research will reveal.

Do some research and read a book.


http://godkillzyou.wordpress.com/2007/07/20/189/

I'm going to Dig up this OLD THREAD... And because I wanted to point something out real quick..

You are quantifying EVERYTHING In your statement on Physics and what we know as SCIENTIFIC FACTS..

Well think about it.. Who decided these physics were correct, and that Matter had to consist of this and that.. every day scientists find something WRONG with what they once KNEW..

They at ONE POINT thought that Dark Matter didn't exist, and ANTI-MATTER for that fact was nothing but science fiction.. oh as we all KNOW now.. all this stuff does exist.

Science is disproved TIME and TIME again.. Humans only can go as far as the human mind will allow.. we decided to say that an atom was an atom and it consists of this this and this.. but who says that that is correct?? Who says that there isn't another form of MATTER that does exist outside of what we already know "I.E..- SPIRITUAL BEINGS AND GHOSTS"

You are going to believe what YOU want to believe, what you choose to believe and what you WANT TO RELY ON AS FACTS.. Point blank dude, you don't really KNOW what is truly going on out there.. YOU JUST KNOW WHAT THEY WANT YOU TO KNOW, WHAT IS RELEASED (Or LEAKED) to the Public for knowledge. Who is to say that the Government doesn't have programs that far surpass anything that currently exists in the PUBLIC'S OPINION as impossible and improbable.. It's been proven TIME and TIME again.. just look at that friggen PARTICLE ACCELERATOR !!

Point is, you as a stand along citizen, of whatever country you live in, whether it's the US or any other Country of the world.. what you believe to be known as scientific fact is ONLY what the people WHO HAVE THE CONTROL on the information DEEMED SAFE FOR PUBLIC KNOWLEDGE Want you to know or believe....

Plain and SIMPLE...


Now back to the GHOSTS...



If you CHOOSE not to believe and remain un-open to the possibility that is your own choice...

But from my personal experiences.. They do exist. I am not asleep when things have occurred, I don't dream things up that My Wife/Kids/Me see at the exact same time.. I am not on Hallucinogens..

What I have seen, what I have felt, what has happened... IS REAL !!

Science aside. Knowledge Aside.

It's as real as the computer screen you are using to read this...

And let me tell you one thing, when it first happened, I was scared, I was terrified, I questioned myself, I thought am I going insane. And it started happening, more... and more... and MORE.

If you want I CAN go into details but I am sure you will just brush it aside as false, because it doesn't possibly fall into WHAT YOU KNOW as SCIENTIFIC FACT.

[MaNiCC]

I don't believe in anything of the sort. somebody's shows me proof i'll be a believer. My mum a big thing in spirituality etc but again no proof. People seem to believe what they want without actually challenging or proving their own beliefs

[The Deuce]

I don't believe in anything of the sort. somebody's shows me proof i'll be a believer. My mum a big thing in spirituality etc but again no proof. People seem to believe what they want without actually challenging or proving their own beliefs

I would never ask you to believe in anything you didn't want to..that isn't how the world works...

I would ask you that if you were ever interested in the 'seeing is believing' thing then come spend a day and night with my family in me, in my home... I think that maybe you might begin to question your current belief system...

[*El Diablo*]

I don't believe in anything of the sort. somebody's shows me proof i'll be a believer. My mum a big thing in spirituality etc but again no proof. People seem to believe what they want without actually challenging or proving their own beliefs

How do u know the wind blows outside?
U can see the tree's move, but u cant see it, how do u know its the wind? ...