Afghanistan to back Pakistan if wars with U.S.: Karzai

**Times Roman** · 10-23-2011, 02:59 AM

No surprises here folks. Remember, we are infidels!

http://news.yahoo.com/afghanistan-ba...023316217.html

..ISLAMABAD (Reuters) - Afghanistan would support Pakistan in case of military conflict between Pakistan and the United States, Afghan President Hamid Karzai said in an interview to a private Pakistani TV channel broadcast on Saturday.

The remarks were in sharp contrast to recent tension between the two neighbors over cross-border raids, and Afghan accusations that Pakistan was involved in killing the chief Afghan peace envoy, former Afghan president Burhanuddin Rabbani, by a suicide bomber on September 20.

"God forbid, If ever there is a war between Pakistan and America, Afghanistan will side with Pakistan," he said in the interview to Geo television.

"If Pakistan is attacked and if the people of Pakistan needs Afghanistan's help, Afghanistan will be there with you."

Such a situation is extremely unlikely, however. Despite months of tension and tough talk between Washington and Islamabad, the two allies appear to be working to ease tension.

In a two-day visit to Islamabad, U.S. Secretary of State Hillary Clinton issued stern warnings and asked for more cooperation in winding down the war in Afghanistan, but ruled out "boots on the ground" in North Waziristan, where Washington has been pushing Pakistan to tackle the Haqqani network.

The Haqqani are a group of militants Washington has blamed for a series of attacks in Afghanistan, using sanctuaries in the Pakistani tribal region along the Afghan border.

Pakistan is seen as a critical to the U.S. drive to end the conflict in Afghanistan.

Pressure on Islamabad has been mounting since U.S. special forces found and killed Osama bin Laden in May in a Pakistani garrison town, where he apparently had been living for years.

The secret bin Laden raid was the biggest blow to U.S.-Pakistan relations since Islamabad joined the U.S. "war on terror" after the September 11, 2001, attacks on the United States.

Karzai said tensions between the United States and Pakistan did not have any impact in his country's attitude toward Pakistan.

The TV channel, Geo, did not say when the interview was conducted.

Afghans have long been suspicious of Pakistan's intentions in their country and question its promise to help bring peace. Karzai repeated that concern in his remarks.

"Please brother, stop using all methods that hurt us and that are now hurting you.

"Let's engage from a different platform, a platform in which the two brothers only progress toward a better future in peace and harmony," he said.

Following the death of Rabbani, Karzai said he would cease attempting to reach out to the Afghan Taliban and instead negotiate directly with Pakistan, saying its military and intelligence services could influence the militants to make peace.

(Reporting by Augustine Anthony; Editing by Chris Allbritton and Michael Roddy)

..

**lovbyts** · 10-23-2011, 03:35 AM

Yeah I hear about that yesterday. No surprise. The only thing the US or most of the rest of the world for that fact is good for is supplying weapons and money. As for a Nation or people in general our lives are meaningless because we are not Muslim and we are a necessary nuisance for now like a cockroach to most of them.

**Shol'va** · 10-23-2011, 03:10 PM

Sometimes they forget who saved them all from the bogeyman. Us cockroaches

**jasc** · 10-23-2011, 05:37 PM

Irony : If we ever went to war with Pakistan they would be using the weapons we gave them and the training they received from our military
Hell of a decision Washington... ingenious leadership

**dec11** · 10-23-2011, 05:42 PM

Originally Posted by jasc

Irony : If we ever went to war with Pakistan they would be using the weapons we gave them and the training they received from our military
Hell of a decision Washington... ingenious leadership

yep, they're good at that

**Nooomoto** · 10-24-2011, 01:36 AM

Karzai forgets so quickly who put him where he is. What an ass. Like mentioned above Muslims just use our money, weapons and training so they can get back on track with their big picture goal. Our whole relationship with anyone in the mid east is a complete goat-****.

Karzai also forgets that without the US, his "military" doesn't even deserve to be called that...so go ahead and stand with Pakistan, I'm sure we'll all be impressed.

Of course this is all for not, as it's just strong talk and we aren't going to war with Pakistan any time soon.

**Times Roman** · 10-24-2011, 03:49 AM

Originally Posted by jasc

Irony : If we ever went to war with Pakistan they would be using the weapons we gave them and the training they received from our military
Hell of a decision Washington... ingenious leadership

You sound surprised? Really? this happens all the time. IRAQ, Panama, Afghanistan (taliban).....

on a side note, even though Karzai said this, doesn't mean a damn thing other than he is posturing and trying to look good with Pakistan. He may side with Pakistan, he may not. we really don't know, and the manure that comes out of his mouth is not a very reliable indicator of what he may or may not do.

The only one Karzai is looking out for is Karzai.

There are fairly substantial rumors that Karzai is clinically mentally ill. By our definition. His behavior is very irratic according to those that know him, and quite often not very rational.

This could be another example of that.

**Mooseman33** · 10-24-2011, 12:16 PM

kill them all and let GOD sort them out...

every ****ing last one, like the roaches they are...

**spywizard** · 10-24-2011, 02:11 PM

when paki drops a nuke on Isreal

who will the USA attack in retaliation??

since we know they have them..

**Swifto** · 10-24-2011, 02:41 PM

Originally Posted by Mooseman33

kill them all and let GOD sort them out...

every ****ing last one, like the roaches they are...

I think like this when angry, but there are plenty of women and children in that region as well.

Originally Posted by spywizard

when paki drops a nuke on Isreal

who will the USA attack in retaliation??

since we know they have them..

Good point.

F*ck Afchanistan if this ever happened, what the hell are they going to do anyway? The USA would drop 1 bomb and wipe the country of the map.

**gixxerboy1** · 10-24-2011, 04:18 PM

Originally Posted by Nooomoto

Karzai forgets so quickly who put him where he is. What an ass. Like mentioned above Muslims just use our money, weapons and training so they can get back on track with their big picture goal. Our whole relationship with anyone in the mid east is a complete goat-****.

Karzai also forgets that without the US, his "military" doesn't even deserve to be called that...so go ahead and stand with Pakistan, I'm sure we'll all be impressed.

Of course this is all for not, as it's just strong talk and we aren't going to war with Pakistan any time soon.

But its our gov fault too that they really think they can buy true friends or allies

**spywizard** · 10-24-2011, 04:24 PM

you mean like france, isreal, england??

**gixxerboy1** · 10-24-2011, 04:28 PM

Originally Posted by spywizard

you mean like france, isreal, england??

When push came to shove yea. I think Britain is a real allie

**Mooseman33** · 10-25-2011, 04:02 PM

there would be plenty of dead women and children in that region if it was my way.
cruel to say, but bring it to their level, kill em all.

**Times Roman** · 10-26-2011, 10:12 AM

Originally Posted by gixxerboy1

When push came to shove yea. I think Britain is a real allie

they may be the only real allie (sp?) we have, and Canada, 'cept that's not a real country =)

**dec11** · 10-26-2011, 03:57 PM

Originally Posted by Mooseman33

there would be plenty of dead women and children in that region if it was my way.
cruel to say, but bring it to their level, kill em all.

you cant cast the sins of afew over a nation

**Swifto** · 10-26-2011, 03:59 PM

Originally Posted by dec11

you cant cast the sins of afew over a nation

Probably one of the most ignorant statements I've ever read in my life if being serious. (not you)

I've probably said it before, then thought, hang on a minute...

**dec11** · 10-26-2011, 04:33 PM

Originally Posted by Swifto

Probably one of the most ignorant statements I've ever read in my life if being serious. (not you)

I've probably said it before, then thought, hang on a minute...

yeah mate, coming from where im from, ppl say things like that all the time then think, 'wait, sure im great friends with such and such, and he marches on the 12th of July aswell'

**Mooseman33** · 10-26-2011, 05:16 PM

i dont give a shit either way fellas.
my statement was my statement, not either of urs.
woman and children, pending age can be just as guilty. being a woman does not make u innocent.
call it whatever u want, my feelings will not change.

**Swifto** · 10-26-2011, 05:27 PM

Originally Posted by Mooseman33

i dont give a shit either way fellas.
my statement was my statement, not either of urs.
woman and children, pending age can be just as guilty. being a woman does not make u innocent.
call it whatever u want, my feelings will not change.

Your entitled to your opinion, but your blanket statement includes innocent women/children.

Now its obvious by your last post you're trying to justify it.

And... Please dont come back and state Al Qaeda, or terrorists dont care if your innocent, or a soldier, they dont. But it makes you just as bad as those low level scum bag c*nts saying kill everyone.

**dec11** · 10-26-2011, 05:38 PM

Originally Posted by Mooseman33

i dont give a shit either way fellas.
my statement was my statement, not either of urs.
woman and children, pending age can be just as guilty. being a woman does not make u innocent.
call it whatever u want, my feelings will not change.

but that makes you one and the same, the very thing you despise.........

**Swifto** · 10-26-2011, 05:42 PM

Originally Posted by dec11

but that makes you one and the same, the very thing you despise.........

Obviously doesnt understand that mate.

**jimmyinkedup** · 10-26-2011, 05:49 PM

Originally Posted by Mooseman33

i dont give a shit either way fellas.
my statement was my statement, not either of urs.
woman and children, pending age can be just as guilty. being a woman does not make u innocent.
call it whatever u want, my feelings will not change.

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**JD250** · 10-27-2011, 08:09 AM

Innocent people die every day all around the globe because of war, some by accident, many because of hate and lack of education, most are an indirect result of greed, I don't think we need to purposely cause more innocent deaths do we.......but then again what do you do with people like this, give them a hug while they kill you and your family because of their religious beliefs? Give them more weapons and teach them how to run a military? I don't know... but I do know that if you attack me or mine I will kill you and anyone else involved, innocent or not, that's human nature. So what's the answer?

**jasc** · 10-27-2011, 08:48 AM

It's a vicious circle... When you kill the men/husbands, the women n especially the children's hatred towards us grows that much stronger. Younger generations then have an even stronger hatred towards us, and rightfully so. If someone killed my father or brothers, I would get revenge.

It's our own fault. If we weren't trying to police the world and trying to intervene in other people's wars we wouldn't have so many global enemies.

**Mooseman33** · 10-27-2011, 09:31 AM

swifto, i never have tried to justify my stance here.
my second post did not try to justify it. i see it as being required.
innocent people, including women and children may have to die to gut those areas of trouble.
its horrible to say, and bad to hear, but its what needs to be done.
life is cruel, it is not a fairytale...
we all see shit different...

**dec11** · 10-27-2011, 09:47 AM

Originally Posted by Mooseman33

swifto, i never have tried to justify my stance here.
my second post did not try to justify it. i see it as being required.
innocent people, including women and children may have to die to gut those areas of trouble.
its horrible to say, and bad to hear, but its what needs to be done.
life is cruel, it is not a fairytale...
we all see shit different...

your using that phrase well out of context. murder is murder

**Mooseman33** · 10-27-2011, 10:02 AM

that sometimes needs to happen....

**Morgoth** · 10-28-2011, 08:07 AM

Wow, lots of Islamophobia in this thread. You do realize that neither Pakistanis nor Afghanis were involved in 9/11 right? None of the hijackers was Pakistani or Afghani, for instance.

And speaking of killing women and children, Israel does that on a regular basis. That's who America is supporting.

**Times Roman** · 10-28-2011, 08:26 AM

Let me just say this. When I got here, I was fairly open minded. I'd been overseas before, and pretty much every where I went, the people were enjoyable to be with, and basically had a good work ethic.

Flash forward to present time.

After a long and arduous interview process, I hire an educated project accountant, an afghan local. Tirelessly we discuss ethics, what is right and wrong, and played a variety of scenerios, "what if" analysis if you will. This lad came from a good family, had money, and he was well liked in the community. This young man was "the best of the best", so to speak. A few months after hiring him, I caught him in a currency exchange rate scam, bilking the project out of about $11k. Since I immediately caught what was going on, I more or less put him under house arrest, and told him he is not leaving until i get my money back, or I'm calling the police. Within 20 minutes, his brother arrived with the money. After 3 days of admin leave without pay, i fired him.

Since then, someone in our office stole a very large amount of cash out of my safe. It was an inside job, plain and simple. someone or ones know who stole the money, yet we never recovered the money. Our staff goes in our rooms and steals from us. I've had several office staff submit fraudulent medical expense claims for moderately substantial amounts. Money has disappeared from wallets and purses. inventory disappears regularly. Food disappears all the time. This is with a staff of 21 locals.

Evidently, lying is not wrong, but only if you get caught. Steeling from an infidel is seemingly OK. Bribery and corruption is rampant here. To an extreme.

This bad behavior permeates all aspects of society here. It is conducted by the littlest of children, beggin in the streats, pick pockets. Same with the women as far as I can tell. I had a young male, maybe 13, screaming at the top of his lungs that i was beating him, and he said he'd stop if I gave him $5. This was at the market place.

On the one hand, alchohol is forbidden. BUT, if no one is looking, then it is OK to drink. Cops are drunk on the job. Even worse, they smoke hash and heroin to get them through the day.

My point is this. As far as I can tell, this whole society is corrupt. Women, children, all of them to a certain extent.

Why has my point of view changed so much in the year i've been here? Let me tell you why. Through experience and living with the people here.

Sad, but true.

**JD250** · 10-28-2011, 08:43 AM

TR......I have a son in law that recently completed his second tour as a medic, I mentioned to him that I noticed a big difference in his perception of the people there through our conversations, he simply replied "you got that right". I suspect after being there for an appreciable amount of time that he realized the futility of the situation. Trying to help people who only wish to take what they can. You can kill their dictator and rebuild their infrastructure but you can't easily build any sort of moral fiber in their society especially when the only education many of them have comes from a book that tells them to kill infidels (anyone not like them)

**Times Roman** · 10-28-2011, 09:02 AM

Originally Posted by JD250

TR......I have a son in law that recently completed his second tour as a medic, I mentioned to him that I noticed a big difference in his perception of the people there through our conversations, he simply replied "you got that right". I suspect after being there for an appreciable amount of time that he realized the futility of the situation. Trying to help people who only wish to take what they can. You can kill their dictator and rebuild their infrastructure but you can't easily build any sort of moral fiber in their society especially when the only education many of them have comes from a book that tells them to kill infidels (anyone not like them)

you know, after I read what I just wrote above, if someone didn't know me a little and realize i've lived here for awhile, they'd probably think i'm the biggest racist asssshole on the planet. I was a little tentative about even writing it in the first place. It is inflamatory, to say the least. But dammit! I have lived around the world, for lenthy periods at a time, and always came away with a positive impression of the people and the culture. I really was hoping to do the same here. Honestly, i tried hard not to go Archie Bunker over here. But you know what? It is what it is! And don't get me started on male on male pedophilia!!!

It turns my stomach to know that old men are molesting young boys, and it is a "cultural" thing. Can you imagine that?

Say what you will about me, but after being here almost a year, I have a pretty solid basis to form a rational opinion of the people and the culture over here. Not an expert by any means, but I've seen plenty...

**Flier** · 10-28-2011, 09:10 AM

Originally Posted by Times Roman

they may be the only real allie (sp?) we have, and Canada, 'cept that's not a real country =)

Hey, what about us Scandinavian countries?
We´ll take on any country with our "turn the other cheek" approach.
That would teach them Muslims!

**Times Roman** · 10-28-2011, 09:17 AM

one thing I will say about the muslims in afghanistan... as much war and death as they've seen... they may not have any real training, but they are fierce!

**gixxerboy1** · 10-28-2011, 09:27 AM

Originally Posted by Morgoth

Wow, lots of Islamophobia in this thread. You do realize that neither Pakistanis nor Afghanis were involved in 9/11 right? None of the hijackers was Pakistani or Afghani, for instance.

And speaking of killing women and children, Israel does that on a regular basis. That's who America is supporting.

Really? Quote me one post where there is?
Most of the treads were about allies or killing innocents during war. Islam isnt mentioned.
Seems like you are trying to stir things up since you made that comment and then threw in the comment about Isreal

**JD250** · 10-28-2011, 02:35 PM

Speaking the truth that comes from an experience is not a phobia, calling it a phobia is a bunch of PC bullshiite, what I can't understand is the people who are so offended by someone saying the pledge of allegience or that our money has God written on it or that a football team prays before a game are typically the same ones who get pissed because some of us refuse to embrace a religious group who is taught to kill infidels....(you and I)...hypocrisy at it's best, sorry, you can call me a racist and accuse me of Islamaphobia all you want but I have an assload of reservations about any religion that is based on violence against anyone who doesn't convert to the way they think. My beliefs don't dictate that I should harm them......I wonder if they feel the same about me. That's not a phobia, that's the ability to reason.