are pros of today training like pussies?

Reading Arnold's encyclopedia, he did a insane amount of work into training which many people would think to be overtraining. Although he has superior genetics and hold the title for the perfect build for a man in the history of the world in the Guisness book of world records, he still maintained to put on muscle size that is still bigger than some pros of today who take more potent juice compared to the crap they were using back then. For example, Lou Ferrigno did not have any GH or diuretics and yet had 22.5" arms while today's pros' arms are around that size and smaller. Can the size of arnold and lou be accredited to Arnold's insane training principles??

If training like a pussy gets me that big...........I wouldnt give 2 ****s about being called a pussy.......Ive been called worst :D

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Originally Posted by will86

Reading Arnold's encyclopedia, he did a insane amount of work into training which many people would think to be overtraining. Although he has superior genetics and hold the title for the perfect build for a man in the history of the world in the Guisness book of world records, he still maintained to put on muscle size that is still bigger than some pros of today who take more potent juice compared to the crap they were using back then. For example, Lou Ferrigno did not have any GH or diuretics and yet had 22.5" arms while today's pros' arms are around that size and smaller. Can the size of arnold and lou be accredited to Arnold's insane training principles??

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Well….if you’ve ever watched Dorian Yates “Blood and Guts” you might think Arnold was the pussy. Otherwise, I think that more emphasise is put on drug use now a days, than training. As for Big Lou Ferregno…..back when he competed with Arnold he wasn’t a GH user, but when he measured his arms at 22.5 inches, it was after his ’92 comeback, he was an early “Poster Boy” for GH. He just didn’t rely solely on it like some of the pro’s today do.

Well the proof is in the pudding...Take a look at Ronnie Colemans video... 5 weeks out from the olympia he is dumbell pressing 200lbs dumbells, deadlifting 800lbs, LOL...the guy rows 12 plates on T-bar rows... History does not repeat itself my friend...

No. They're training smarter. 3 decades of trial and error to find the best combination of training, eating and drugs.

:scratch: 22.5 arms? :lol: same or smaller? :?:


ya Cold at 22.5... and thats the small ones. most arms now measure over 23, colemans... Tom Prince measured his at 23... and that was cold measurments.

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Originally Posted by markas214

No. They're training smarter. 3 decades of trial and error to find the best combination of training, eating and drugs.

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I agree with that ;)

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Originally Posted by markas214

No. They're training smarter. 3 decades of trial and error to find the best combination of training, eating and drugs.

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Agreed

regardless.....everyones method of training can differ slightly from the next guys.....but you cant argue......that every pro dedicates their life to the sport........

With the transition of training along with changes in technology it has become easier to obtain more than ever. The core of every bodybuilder is still to train like an animal. I dont care how much gear your take you will never look like a pro unless the dedication and intensity is there.

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Originally Posted by markas214

No. They're training smarter. 3 decades of trial and error to find the best combination of training, eating and drugs.

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I mean to making a different thread for this questions but since we are already talking about it. Do you guys think that there will be anymore advances in the next few decades on bodybuilding, like there has the last few decades?

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Originally Posted by Xavier_4446

I mean to making a different thread for this questions but since we are already talking about it. Do you guys think that there will be anymore advances in the next few decades on bodybuilding, like there has the last few decades?

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As we advance further into the future science is going to allow us to do things we aren't able to do now, that's a given. But whether that means that the pro's of 2034 will be 430 lbs and lean.... I don't know. I doubt it. There's only so much a human body can take. I am hoping people will resort back to aesthetics and symmetry, like bodybuilders in 70's.

Take all the drugs you want sitting on the couch is not gonna make you grow :stick:

Personaly i find the earlier bb'rs physiques better but if you put big lou against big ron id say no contest. Guys like ruhl just blow my mind the amount of blood and guts these guys go threw is something you have to respect. do they work harder maybe not smarter yes.

Bodybuilders of the 70's in My Opinion looked alot better then most of todays bodybuilders. I think todays Body vuilders have taken a relativly healthy sport that became popular in the 70's and have gone to majour extrems and is no longer a healthy sport at that level.

Platz looked good as a 70-80's BB'r

Todays BB'rs are the best. <-- period

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Originally Posted by bigol'legs

Todays BB'rs are the best. <-- period

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I'm gonna piss a few of you off with this, but.....I don’t see any period!

Biggest maybe, but the best….eh, that’s based on what? Sheer size? The most muscle mass? The sport of bodybuilding has gone the way of who’s able to pack the most meat onto their frame, rather than who’s put together the best overall package. I’ve never though Coleman had a great physique. Huge? Yes, but where’s the tight mid section? Where’s the balance? The man looks like a He-Man figure for Christ sake! Why do all of the bodybuilders of today feel as though they’ve got to look like they’re trying to smuggle a medicine ball onto the stage? Everyone is so concerned with stacking on weight and who’s on the best drug plan that the thought of genetic potential or presentation has gone right out the window. It’s almost as if these guys are made on an assembly line. There’s no distinction in their builds anymore. The guys are looking less like bodybuilders and more like circus freaks. You’re either a Mass Monster, or you’re not competitive. It’s crazy. The IFBB has seriously got to put a cap on this thing somewhere. It makes people who are just starting out, not even want to get into it now.

As a matter of fact, you can’t be even the slightest bit competitive in the lower levels anymore without some serious financial backing. I challenge you to try to walk into even a level 1 show without seeing 95% of the contestants jacked to the gills? It’s impossible for anyone with just a love for the sport, good genetics and ambition to compete. Most of these clowns have been geared up right from their first contest and have been awarded win after win, based on nothing more than being the biggest on stage. That’s great, but when you hit the upper levels and everyone’s on drugs, then what? You get a lot of cookie cutter builds that were build mainly with drug use and financial backing, rather than superior genetics and a great overall package. Admittedly Pro's of today have built what they've built with hard work and dedication. But very few are distinct, in their masses or the greatest the sport has to offer.

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Originally Posted by THE BIG RED MACHINE

I'm gonna piss a few of you off with this, but.....I don’t see any period!

Biggest maybe, but the best….eh, that’s based on what? Sheer size? The most muscle mass? The sport of bodybuilding has gone the way of who’s able to pack the most meat onto their frame, rather than who’s put together the best overall package. I’ve never though Coleman had a great physique. Huge? Yes, but where’s the tight mid section? Where’s the balance? The man looks like a He-Man figure for Christ sake! Why do all of the bodybuilders of today feel as though they’ve got to look like they’re trying to smuggle a medicine ball onto the stage? Everyone is so concerned with stacking on weight and who’s on the best drug plan that the thought of genetic potential or presentation has gone right out the window. It’s almost as if these guys are made on an assembly line. There’s no distinction in their builds anymore. The guys are looking less like bodybuilders and more like circus freaks. You’re either a Mass Monster, or you’re not competitive. It’s crazy. The IFBB has seriously got to put a cap on this thing somewhere. It makes people who are just starting out, not even want to get into it now.

As a matter of fact, you can’t be even the slightest bit competitive in the lower levels anymore without some serious financial backing. I challenge you to try to walk into even a level 1 show without seeing 95% of the contestants jacked to the gills? It’s impossible for anyone with just a love for the sport, good genetics and ambition to compete. Most of these clowns have been geared up right from their first contest and have been awarded win after win, based on nothing more than being the biggest on stage. That’s great, but when you hit the upper levels and everyone’s on drugs, then what? You get a lot of cookie cutter builds that were build mainly with drug use and financial backing, rather than superior genetics and a great overall package. Admittedly Pro's of today have built what they've built with hard work and dedication. But very few are distinct, in their masses or the greatest the sport has to offer.

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I couldnt have said it better myself :lift: :lift: :lift:

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Originally Posted by THE BIG RED MACHINE

I'm gonna piss a few of you off with this, but.....I don’t see any period!

Biggest maybe, but the best….eh, that’s based on what? Sheer size? The most muscle mass? The sport of bodybuilding has gone the way of who’s able to pack the most meat onto their frame, rather than who’s put together the best overall package. I’ve never though Coleman had a great physique. Huge? Yes, but where’s the tight mid section? Where’s the balance? The man looks like a He-Man figure for Christ sake! Why do all of the bodybuilders of today feel as though they’ve got to look like they’re trying to smuggle a medicine ball onto the stage? Everyone is so concerned with stacking on weight and who’s on the best drug plan that the thought of genetic potential or presentation has gone right out the window. It’s almost as if these guys are made on an assembly line. There’s no distinction in their builds anymore. The guys are looking less like bodybuilders and more like circus freaks. You’re either a Mass Monster, or you’re not competitive. It’s crazy. The IFBB has seriously got to put a cap on this thing somewhere. It makes people who are just starting out, not even want to get into it now.

As a matter of fact, you can’t be even the slightest bit competitive in the lower levels anymore without some serious financial backing. I challenge you to try to walk into even a level 1 show without seeing 95% of the contestants jacked to the gills? It’s impossible for anyone with just a love for the sport, good genetics and ambition to compete. Most of these clowns have been geared up right from their first contest and have been awarded win after win, based on nothing more than being the biggest on stage. That’s great, but when you hit the upper levels and everyone’s on drugs, then what? You get a lot of cookie cutter builds that were build mainly with drug use and financial backing, rather than superior genetics and a great overall package. Admittedly Pro's of today have built what they've built with hard work and dedication. But very few are distinct, in their masses or the greatest the sport has to offer.

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Amen to that brother. I agree with you 100%. In the 70s and early 80s the amount of muscle the pros had was balanced with aesthetics and symmetry. I hope the tide will turn and we can have more human looking physics to admire and strive to emulate in professional bodybuilding. I doubt it though.

lvl 1? Ive done some shows and placed well in them, They are natural shows of course, but my goal is to have higher placings in NPC's shows and still be natural. Coleman does have a narrow waist, I think it was actually measured at 30. inches. For having that much mass and having a 30 inch waist :eek:

Now as far as asteics and symmetry... I hope your not talking about arnold. He was great at the time, but now in this time, Shawn Ray, Lee Priest, and A lot of the shorter crowds win. And the bigger ones, no compitition.

22.5 arms and 29 legs is NOT symmetry

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Originally Posted by bigol'legs

Coleman does have a narrow waist, I think it was actually measured at 30. inches. For having that much mass and having a 30 inch waist :eek:

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Narrow waist, yes, but tight mid section??? The man looks like he swallowed a medicine ball. He has absolutely no taper to his mid section. It’s like someone synched a rope around his waist and pulled it as tight as they could and forced the rest of his stomach to the top. It's the bloated physiques like that that are killing the sport. People are so amazed and blinded by how much mass these guys have packed on that they’re blind to the fact that they’ve completely ruined their symmetry with these grotesque stomachs. Heaven forbid some of these guys ever actually relax on stage, their gut sticks out farther than their feet! The GH abuse is impossible to hide. Don’t get me wrong, there have been many great advancements in the sport of bodybuilding since the 70’s and 80’s….and even a good porting of the 90’s, but it’s my opinion (and many others) that things have just gotten way out of hand in the last several years with the focus on mass over aesthetics.

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Originally Posted by bigol'legs

Now as far as asteics and symmetry... I hope your not talking about arnold. He was great at the time, but now in this time, Shawn Ray, Lee Priest, and A lot of the shorter crowds win. And the bigger ones, no compitition.

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Yes the Time of Arnold and those alike is over, but do you honestly thing that better bodybuilders are being produced now, or has it got more to do with the advancements in the level and choices of drugs and supplements that are available? Not to mention that most of these guys do nothing but body build! The financial backing has increased so much (which isn't necessarily a bad thing), that most of these guys don't have to work at all anymore. Just spend their days eating, sleeping and training. That accounts for the ability for these new pro’s to stack on tremendous amounts of weight, but have you ever seen an off season pic of Arnold when he wasn’t prepping for a contest? He looks like he’s barely ever lifted a weigh? To go from looking like a normal guy, to Mr. Olympia in the span of just a few months is definitely a display of superior genetics.

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Originally Posted by bigol'legs

22.5 arms and 29 legs is NOT symmetry

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I do agree with your perspective on Lou Ferrigno, which is who I assume you’re talking about when you mention this and that’s why he could never beat Arnold. A 6’ 5” frame was just too tall to pack that amount of muscle mass onto to stay competitive with a shorter man back then….although I still think he was robbed finishing 2nd to Robby Robinson in the ’94 Masters :bw: . That being said, it finally seems as though advancements in the sport have allowed taller pro’s like Gunter Schilerkamp to slowly start turning the tide to the tall mans favour.

Don’t get me wrong, I’m not downing all of the pros of today. I still think several of them have outstanding physiques, but none of them are carrying the unrealistic amounts of mass that has become so popular. I do think Shawn Ray definitely should have placed higher throughout his career (although I think that’s had more to do with his lousy attitude, than his physique!) Dexter Jackson and even Chris Cormier when he’s on his game are a couple more I can think of. Lee Priest on the other had…. He’s just a smaller version of the current crop of mass monsters and although it’s impressive the amount of muscle he’s been able to pack onto his frame, he’s definitely not a poster boy for symmetrical shape.

This is all an argument that’s been going on since the days of Dorian Yates...and before him, Lee Haney. Some guys like the Mass monsters, some like the more traditional physiques. It’s all irrelevant since it’s opinion based, but being bigger doesn’t qualify the pro’s of today as being superior, just different.

BRM point well made.... different :wg:

But I think Lee priest symetery is Superior, (not in this recent olympia :lol: ) but in the past, very nice waist line and defined abs.

There was a recent article in a FLEX mag. polling the best "arms" of all times, including bi/tri/forearms, and I agree the Priest was #1

In one of those FLEX articles, Lee Priest says something about just working his arms untill he cant anymore and that over-training is bull**** or something along the lines of that. I think it was the article with him and Titus.

Mr. symmetry of the 70's Frank Zane

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Originally Posted by cjp85

In one of those FLEX articles, Lee Priest says something about just working his arms untill he cant anymore and that over-training is bull**** or something along the lines of that. I think it was the article with him and Titus.

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ya some crazy stuff! like 30-34 sets on arms.. :eek:

Bodybuilding simply isnt the same as it use to be, you are either gonna be the type who loves the mass monsters or the type who loves the symetrical type bodybuildings.

Ronnie have a 30 inch waists! hmm maybe but i highly doubt it i would guess closer to 34 or 36 inches from the way it looks in those magazins and the shows i have seen on Tv. But i could be wrong.

I am not even sure who i could pick as the most symetrical bodybuilder today is, because frankly they are far from few and most of the time they dont get the recognition they deserve.

Think about how much money you spend a year on gear and supplements. DO you still think you could do well in Amature contest. some of you might be able to but the fact is most of you wont,

The sport has gone to a huge extrem and i hope it wil eventually make its way back to the way it use to.

Well in my opinion u look at the pumpin iron video and ronie colman the unbelievable video and Arnold i think looks better because he has that test look, but ronnie colman is bigger and more defined... Ronnie looks like he could kill a gorrilla... Like other people said, its 30 years of trial and error... Its what works for u... Becuase i know so people that dont go super heavy on all their lifts and they look bigger than the guy that puts up twice as much weight... Its genitics, and supplementation as well as training techneques...

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Originally Posted by Bigboy123

... Becuase i know so people that dont go super heavy on all their lifts and they look bigger than the guy that puts up twice as much weight... Its genitics, and supplementation as well as training techneques...

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I agree. I worked out with a friend of mine's little brother this morning. He is a pretty big guy, but not what you would call "jacked up" or anything. He put up 415lbs X 5 on flat bench with no problem, then 385lbs x 8. To me, that's a lot of weight...I don't care who you are. I have seen guys that look twice as huge and cut as him, but I know they can't lift weight like that. It's funny how strength and appearances don't always match up like you would think.

peace,

ttgb

i dont see it at all the same, bodybuilding, just like football and baseball and any other sport has evolved, smaller guys arnt in it, they can pose for abercrombie or gay pornos, bodybuilding is about being the biggest and definition, symetry is also there, those guys today, ronnie for one, look awesome, arnold cant hold a candle to his ass. just like the football players of 70s count be pro today, neither could the men who were at gold in venice in 1975. to many ppl knock it bc they cant get there, or dont have the intestical fortitude for it. i think its awesome and i love how it is, i cant wait till BBers are bigger and better than now.

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Originally Posted by markas214

No. They're training smarter. 3 decades of trial and error to find the best combination of training, eating and drugs.

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Even though this guy is constantly busting my balls, I gotta agree with him. Good point bro,

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Originally Posted by decadbal

i dont see it at all the same, bodybuilding, just like football and baseball and any other sport has evolved, smaller guys arnt in it, they can pose for abercrombie or gay pornos, bodybuilding is about being the biggest and definition, symetry is also there, those guys today, ronnie for one, look awesome, arnold cant hold a candle to his ass. just like the football players of 70s count be pro today, neither could the men who were at gold in venice in 1975. to many ppl knock it bc they cant get there, or dont have the intestical fortitude for it. i think its awesome and i love how it is, i cant wait till BBers are bigger and better than now.

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Do you honestly think the Pros of today are where they are because of superior genetics? I don’t think the sport of bodybuilding (or football for that matter) has evolved so dramatically as has the complexity and usage of the drugs and supplements, not to mention the salaries and prize money now made more readily available to the players. Never mind trying to compare Arnold to a GH fuelled Ronnie Coleman of today. Try comparing Ronnie Colman to Arnold in his prime, if Colman competed in the late 60’s and 70’s and used what was available at that time, like that generation did. No my friend, Colman and the current crop of mass monsters alike are and would still be nothing without his extensive use of GH and other drugs of that nature, that have become so popular since the late 80’s and have since evolved until today. Like I said before, the new generation of bodybuilders today isn’t better, just of a different variety than the Pros of yore.