Greater Israel: A Dream Closer to Fulfillment

**BDTR** · 03-15-2004, 05:27 PM

I'm staying out of this...

**BOUNCER** · 03-15-2004, 06:18 PM

Originally Posted by bdtr

I'm staying out of this...

Why, Hezbollah are openly anti-American. They'd gladly murder you or your loved ones. They publicly celebrated the WTC murders, the Bali bombings, Madrid and no doubt their next attack on your country.

**BDTR** · 03-15-2004, 06:26 PM

Oh, im in now way going to suport hezbollah, I meant im not going to chime in with my anti-israel sentimet in this topic as i dont want to be associated with "the other side" in this thread. I really hate both sides.

Originally Posted by BOUNCER

Why, Hezbollah are openly anti-American. They'd gladly murder you or your loved ones. They publicly celebrated the WTC murders, the Bali bombings, Madrid and no doubt their next attack on your country.

**BOUNCER** · 03-15-2004, 06:42 PM

Originally Posted by bdtr

Oh, im in now way going to suport hezbollah, I meant im not going to chime in with my anti-israel sentimet in this topic as i dont want to be associated with "the other side" in this thread. I really hate both sides.

Although I'm very supportive of Israel, I realise the concern people express regarding Israel. But not one Israeli ever few a jet into a skyscraper in the USA, 'nor blew up a bomb in Bali or a train in Spain. 'Nor will they ever. Unlike most here I've lived and served in the Middle East and the hate these people hold for the US has is palpable.
Bdtr, these people would gladly dance on your grave without a seconds thought, or the graves of your loved ones.

**Tock** · 03-15-2004, 06:53 PM

Originally Posted by BOUNCER

Tock, read 'Spy Catcher' the US spied on the UK, and the UK on the US etc.. It happens. Bama, Arkan was a war criminal and got his dues.

I don't doubt that there's lots of spying between countries going on. Back when I was working for a big semiconductor company, they told everyone over and over again not to tell anyone about our processes, and call security if we saw any faces that didn't belong in the area. Seems corporate spying is big business these days . . .

But . . . when taxpayers give $9 billion a year to a country who's supposed to be our ally, they shouldn't be stealing our nuclear secrets and handing 'em over to the **** Soviets. With allies like that, who needs enemies?
If it was up to me, I'd pull that $9 billion in foreign aid and put it to better use here in the US.
--Tock

**OGPackin** · 03-15-2004, 06:54 PM

Originally Posted by bdtr

Oh, im in now way going to suport hezbollah, I meant im not going to chime in with my anti-israel sentimet in this topic as i dont want to be associated with "the other side" in this thread. I really hate both sides.

hmmm...anti-isreal sentiment huh? What has isreal done to u that u say ur anti-isreal? Or, should we just call a spade a spade? Anti-Jewish is more like it, right? Because as a country, im pretty sure isreal has never done anything to u that u can say ur "anti-isreal"! So just admit what ur really trying to say?!?

Im not saying both sides dont have their faults. But all isreal has ever done is try to survive as a country. Have u ever looked at a map of the middle east? Check out how small isreal is compared to syria, iran, libya...etc

If YOU lived every day having to worry about terrorist attacks while ****ting in a side walk cafe eating lunch u may feel different. I maybe wrong? U just might be a anti-semite?

See, its stupid **** like this, and this whole post for that matter that has made me not want to come around AR anymore. What ever happend to the saying, Theres two subjects u dont talk about? Religion and politics!!

OG

**OGPackin** · 03-15-2004, 06:59 PM

Originally Posted by Tock

I don't doubt that there's lots of spying between countries going on. Back when I was working for a big semiconductor company, they told everyone over and over again not to tell anyone about our processes, and call security if we saw any faces that didn't belong in the area. Seems corporate spying is big business these days . . .

But . . . when taxpayers give $9 billion a year to a country who's supposed to be our ally, they shouldn't be stealing our nuclear secrets and handing 'em over to the **** Soviets. With allies like that, who needs enemies?
If it was up to me, I'd pull that $9 billion in foreign aid and put it to better use here in the US.
--Tock

Ummmm, Tock and u dont think the US doesnt spy on isreal ur frickin nutz!! We spy on everyone!! Allies or not. Or are u just so blinded by ur anti-isreal thoughts that u dont realize that? Come'on now! Should we be calling another spade a spade?

OG

**BDTR** · 03-15-2004, 07:03 PM

Don't put words in my mouth, I never said "anti jewish". Everytime you say "anti-israel" to a jew, they immediatly shout anti-semite and beg for a hanging. If someone said "i dispise china" for being communist, does that mean they despise the chinese or the country? Exactly. I detest zionism, and i would love to see out of all the countries in the world, Israel burned to the ground and a disney world resurected over its ashes. That being said, i hate the whole middle east, entirely too much trouble alltogether, but I dont enjoy having my country be a puppet to any foriegn body, nevermind one as keniving as Israel and Sharon. I dont want to get into this subject again, i had a 10 page thread about it a while back that we deleted and I dont feel like opening up that bag of worms again. I'm sorry but i see Ariel Sharon as much as of a terrorist as Osama Bin Laden, one is a pupper master, the other is a bomb thrower, both are equally detrimental to the well being of the United States. Our founding fathers are rolling in their graves.

Originally Posted by OGPackin

hmmm...anti-isreal sentiment huh? What has isreal done to u that u say ur anti-isreal? Or, should we just call a spade a spade? Anti-Jewish is more like it, right? Because as a country, im pretty sure isreal has never done anything to u that u can say ur "anti-isreal"! So just admit what ur really trying to say?!?

Im not saying both sides dont have their faults. But all isreal has ever done is try to survive as a country. Have u ever looked at a map of the middle east? Check out how small isreal is compared to Syria, Iran, Libya...etc

If YOU lived every day having to worry about terrorist attacks while ****ting in a side walk cafe eating lunch u may feel different. I maybe wrong? U just might be a anti-semite?

See, its stupid **** like this, and this whole post for that matter that has made me not want to come around AR anymore. What ever happend to the saying, Theres two subjects u dont talk about? Religion and politics!!

OG

**Red Ketchup** · 03-15-2004, 07:06 PM

Originally Posted by OGPackin

I maybe wrong? U just might be a anti-semite?

See thats why I won't get into any debates on israel... the minute you disagree with anything you're histercally branded an "anti-semite"...

Why bother caring?

Red

**BDTR** · 03-15-2004, 07:11 PM

Exactly! Disagree with anything Jewish and you're immediatly an anti-semite. This practice has been done for years.

Originally Posted by Red Ketchup

See thats why I won't get into any debates on israel... the minute you disagree with anything you're histercally branded an "anti-semite"...

Why bother caring?

Red

**BOUNCER** · 03-15-2004, 07:11 PM

Originally Posted by OGPackin

Have u ever looked at a map of the middle east? Check out how small isreal is compared to syria, iran, libya...etc

OG

http://www.conceptwizard.com/conen/conflict_2.html

**OGPackin** · 03-15-2004, 07:16 PM

U made it easy calling u an anti-semite. U didnt answer my question when i asked, what has Isreal as a country done to u to say ur "anti-isreal"? If i was spewing negative comments about the US ud be calling me all kinds of names wouldnt u? Lets keep focus here guys. Speak from ur heart and not out of crooked lips.

OG

**BOUNCER** · 03-15-2004, 07:17 PM

http://www.conceptwizard.com/nutoo/nutshell3.html

**BDTR** · 03-15-2004, 07:18 PM

Call me an anti-semite then, no sweat off my back at all. To answer your question, Israel has a stranglehold on the USA and its descions, for their own good, not for the mutual good of both nations.

Originally Posted by OGPackin

U made it easy calling u an anti-semite. U didnt answer my question when i asked, what has Isreal as a country done to u to say ur "anti-isreal"? If i was spewing negative comments about the US ud be calling me all kinds of names wouldnt u? Lets keep focus here guys. Speak from ur heart and not out of crooked lips.

OG

**inheritmylife** · 03-15-2004, 07:21 PM

Out of innocent curiosity, what special allegiance do you hold with Israel? As your profile states, you are located in Florida.

**Tock** · 03-15-2004, 07:22 PM

Originally Posted by mart651

1) As usual, you have some good points but in this situation none of them apply.
2) You can believe that it is better for us to back the Palestinians all you like.
3) Myself, I will follow blindly behind the bible and hope Israel takes over the Middle East.

1) I see. Hmmm . . .
2) Um, I don't have much affection for the Palestinians; they're wedded to the Koran, which obliges them to all sorts of civil travesties, just as the fundamentalist Jews and Christians are wedded to the Torah and the Bible, which inclines them to all manner of irrational acts . . . The planet would be greatly improved if space aliens would come along and abduct each and every one of them, and feed them to giant spiders or the buxom Amazon cannibals in another galaxy . . .
What I'm "backing" is Justice, plain and simple. The UN gave Israel land in 1947, they were supposed to peacefully co-exist with Palestinians already there, BUT they drove 'em out at the end of their guns, and now the fundamentalist Jews say that the entire region was given to them by God 3000 years ago, and they're building settletments outside Israeli borders with the backing of the Israeli military, which is getting $$$ from US taxpayers via foreign aid. So, that makes the US complicit in the injustice perpetrated upon the Palestinians.
I can understand why the Palestinians are hopping mad . . . lots of 'em were illegally forced off the land their families had owned for generations, and nowadays, the Israeli military bulldozes down their small towns and builds villages for Jewish fundamentalists.

This ain't rocket science. It's pretty obvious who is getting s*** on and who is doing the s***ing. IMHO, the smartest thing the US government could do is to be on the side of Justice, not on the side of either Israel or Palestine. But, there are too many special interest groups in the US who are on the side of Israel, Justice be ****ed. And this, mon petite, is the central issue that makes terrorists want to bomb the US. Fix this problem, and we can do away with all the metal detectors at airports, all the crap the Justice Department does that restricts individual liberty, and all the stupid foreign aid to those idiots in the middle east.

3) "Follow blindly," eh? The big problem nowadays is that too many people "follow blindly" and don't think things through. Folks pay $$$ to go to church so someone can tell them what they beleive. Leaders of special interest groups love folks who follow and never ask questions . . . but it's folks like them who end up on the front lines of wars (like what we've got in Iraq) and who end up making them rich, rich, rich . . .
The middle east is full of people who "follow blindly," like suicide bombers, and most of the Moslems, folks who don't think things through because they're supporting "their side" of the conflict. Because of this, there will never be a shortage of idiots willing to do stupid things at odds with their best interests . . .
"Following blindly" is a dangerous thing to do, mon ami. I strongly recommend you choose another path, 'cause if you don't, someone will be waiting to take advantage of you.
--Tock

**BOUNCER** · 03-15-2004, 07:24 PM

http://www.conceptwizard.com/info.html

Bdtr, and the USA has no vested interests in having a supportive Israel ?. Or what about the financial backing the also give to Egpyt, more per head of population than Israel.

How about the financial backing the US has given other African and Middle Eastern countries who have turned on America in the end.
Unlike EVERYOTHER middle eastern country, Israeli's don't P*ss and Sh*t on the American flag, not to mention burn it at every photocall opppertunity.

**OGPackin** · 03-15-2004, 07:24 PM

Originally Posted by bdtr

Call me an anti-semite then, no sweat off my back at all. To answer your question, Israel has a stranglehold on the USA and its descions, for their own good, not for the mutual good of both nations.

Hmmmm...funny, i can remember someone else thinking the same thing....Hitler! Real nice. We have nothing else to say to one another.

OG

**Tock** · 03-15-2004, 07:26 PM

Originally Posted by bdtr

Exactly! Disagree with anything Jewish and you're immediatly an anti-semite. This practice has been done for years.

True, true.
Anytime you criticize one side, it's assumed you support the other.
IMHO, both sides are screwed up, and the only thing that needs to be supported is Justice.
--Tock

**BDTR** · 03-15-2004, 07:27 PM

I've done it... finally. I've finally been compared to Hitler. Someone give me a round of applause. Next time I'll blindly support a nation who has destroyed this country.

Originally Posted by OGPackin

Hmmmm...funny, i can remember someone else thinking the same thing....Hitler! Real nice. We have nothing else to say to one another.

OG

**OGPackin** · 03-15-2004, 07:30 PM

Originally Posted by Tock

1) I see. Hmmm . . .
2) Um, I don't have much affection for the Palestinians; they're wedded to the Koran, which obliges them to all sorts of civil travesties, just as the fundamentalist Jews and Christians are wedded to the Torah and the Bible, which inclines them to all manner of irrational acts . . . The planet would be greatly improved if space aliens would come along and abduct each and every one of them, and feed them to giant spiders or the buxom Amazon cannibals in another galaxy . . .
What I'm "backing" is Justice, plain and simple. The UN gave Israel land in 1947, they were supposed to peacefully co-exist with Palestinians already there, BUT they drove 'em out at the end of their guns, and now the fundamentalist Jews say that the entire region was given to them by God 3000 years ago, and they're building settletments outside Israeli borders with the backing of the Israeli military, which is getting $$$ from US taxpayers via foreign aid. So, that makes the US complicit in the injustice perpetrated upon the Palestinians.
I can understand why the Palestinians are hopping mad . . . lots of 'em were illegally forced off the land their families had owned for generations, and nowadays, the Israeli military bulldozes down their small towns and builds villages for Jewish fundamentalists.

This ain't rocket science. It's pretty obvious who is getting s*** on and who is doing the s***ing. IMHO, the smartest thing the US government could do is to be on the side of Justice, not on the side of either Israel or Palestine. But, there are too many special interest groups in the US who are on the side of Israel, Justice be ****ed. And this, mon petite, is the central issue that makes terrorists want to bomb the US. Fix this problem, and we can do away with all the metal detectors at airports, all the crap the Justice Department does that restricts individual liberty, and all the stupid foreign aid to those idiots in the middle east.

3) "Follow blindly," eh? The big problem nowadays is that too many people "follow blindly" and don't think things through. Folks pay $$$ to go to church so someone can tell them what they beleive. Leaders of special interest groups love folks who follow and never ask questions . . . but it's folks like them who end up on the front lines of wars (like what we've got in Iraq) and who end up making them rich, rich, rich . . .
The middle east is full of people who "follow blindly," like suicide bombers, and most of the Moslems, folks who don't think things through because they're supporting "their side" of the conflict. Because of this, there will never be a shortage of idiots willing to do stupid things at odds with their best interests . . .
"Following blindly" is a dangerous thing to do, mon ami. I strongly recommend you choose another path, 'cause if you don't, someone will be waiting to take advantage of you.
--Tock

Tock, i think u need to go back and read up on ur history. Or maybe u should watch the video on the link Bouncer has posted. And see who attacked who first.

**inheritmylife** · 03-15-2004, 07:31 PM

Congratulations bdtr...

**BDTR** · 03-15-2004, 07:31 PM

I'd rather see a country burn our flags and piss and **** on them at every chance they get than to be our puppet master. I'm sorry, but I believe in autonomy.

Originally Posted by BOUNCER

Israeli's don't P*ss and Sh*t on the American flag, not to mention burn it at every photocall opppertunity.

**chicamahomico** · 03-15-2004, 07:31 PM

Seems like nothing is ever going to change in the middle east. If it was up to me I would just ignore them for 10 years, check to see if anyting has changed, which it won't. Ignore, check, repeat.....then I would only have to hear about it once every ten years.

**OGPackin** · 03-15-2004, 07:33 PM

Originally Posted by inheritmylife

Congratulations bdtr...

Hey n00b, if u dont have anything constructive to add keep ur 244 posts since July of 03 out of this disagreement! thxs and have a nice day

OG

**BOUNCER** · 03-15-2004, 07:34 PM

Originally Posted by OGPackin

Tock, i think u need to go back and read up on ur history. Or maybe u should watch the video on the link Bouncer has posted. And see who attacked who first.

And I thought everyone else here was too blind to see the evidence I posted. I remember a saying my father used to use.

"There's none so blind as he who will not listen".

I dare any christian or Jew o go visit Israel with a open mind and not come back fully supportive of Israel.

Erez Israel.

**BDTR** · 03-15-2004, 07:34 PM

Or what? You're going to label him an anti-semite and send Mossad agents to his house and kill him?

He can say what he pleases, just as you can.

Originally Posted by OGPackin

Hey n00b, if u dont have anything constructive to add keep ur 244 posts since July of 03 out of this disagreement! thxs and have a nice day

OG

**OGPackin** · 03-15-2004, 07:37 PM

Ya right, a country thats about 10,000 square miles big is the puppet master to the US. Get a grip!

OG

**BOUNCER** · 03-15-2004, 07:39 PM

Originally Posted by chicamahomico

Seems like nothing is ever going to change in the middle east. If it was up to me I would just ignore them for 10 years, check to see if anyting has changed, which it won't. Ignore, check, repeat.....then I would only have to hear about it once every ten years.

But your so wrong. Look at Israel and what they've done in 50 years!. They've turned a country which was desert in the south and maleria smampland in the north into the succesfully beautifull country they enjoy today. Where the Arabs p*ssed and Sh*t into the Jordan river since christ walked the earth, look at how Israel powered a country from it, among other things. I dare anyone to visit Israel and not come back a believer.

**OGPackin** · 03-15-2004, 07:39 PM

Originally Posted by bdtr

Or what? You're going to label him an anti-semite and send Mossad agents to his house and kill him?

He can say what he pleases, just as you can.

See, now ur just being an asshole! I feel sorry for u

OG

**BDTR** · 03-15-2004, 07:40 PM

It's not about size here, it's about power and control in a non physical sense. It's all about money. Who controls 90% of financial investment banks in the United States? If they control the money, they have the power, because descions can be bought, plain and simple.

Originally Posted by OGPackin

Ya right, a country thats about 10,000 square miles big is the puppet master to the US. Get a grip!

OG

**BOUNCER** · 03-15-2004, 07:40 PM

Originally Posted by OGPackin

Ya right, a country thats about 10,000 square miles big is the puppet master to the US. Get a grip!

OG

BWAHAHAHAHA

**BDTR** · 03-15-2004, 07:42 PM

I'm sorry, but im not the one comparing me to Hitler here.

Don't feel sorry for me, i'm enlightened to what 90% of the population is both too blind and frightened to see, as they'll also be compared to Hitler.

Originally Posted by OGPackin

See, now ur just being an asshole! I feel sorry for u

OG

**BOUNCER** · 03-15-2004, 07:43 PM

Originally Posted by bdtr

It's not about size here, it's about power and control in a non physical sense. It's all about money. Who controls 90% of financial investment banks in the United States? If they control the money, they have the power, because descions can be bought, plain and simple.

So if the Jes withdrew that money and invested it in Israel, and left the remainding 10% to native Indians, Arabs, nation of Islam to name but a few who would run your wonderfull country ?.

Amd why not, if they run everything there move their money into Israel ?.

**OGPackin** · 03-15-2004, 07:44 PM

Originally Posted by bdtr

It's not about size here, it's about power and control in a non physical sense. It's all about money. Who controls 90% of financial investment banks in the United States? If they control the money, they have the power, because descions can be bought, plain and simple.

hahaha, u make me laugh! Isreal controls 90% of the financial investment banks in the US???? Isreal does, or Jews? I thought we were talking about Isreal here. Not jewish people in general. Seeeeeeee u can only hide ur true colors for so long. Sad, so sad! Thanks for making my point for me bdtr.

OG

**Red Ketchup** · 03-15-2004, 07:44 PM

Originally Posted by OGPackin

Hmmmm...funny, i can remember someone else thinking the same thing....Hitler! Real nice. We have nothing else to say to one another.

OG

Thats low....

Hitler was a maniac bent on destroying the jewish people because he claimed they were the root of all evil and "controlled everything"...

Bdtr made no such claim, he did not even say "jews control the usa", he did say that Israel as a country controls the USA... now wether thats true or not I don't care at all (I don't live in the US), but even I can see a difference between blaming a country of foreign influence (politics) and blaming a people of the same thing (racism).

I think everyone needs to cool down in this thread... this is getting rather very unfriendly.

Red

**Red Ketchup** · 03-15-2004, 07:45 PM

Hmmmmm

**Tock** · 03-15-2004, 07:46 PM

Originally Posted by OGPackin

1) Tock and u dont think the US doesnt spy on isreal ur frickin nutz!! We spy on everyone!! Allies or not.

2) Or are u just so blinded by ur anti-isreal thoughts that u dont realize that? Come'on now! Should we be calling another spade a spade?

OG

1) I would be surprised if the US does not spy on Israel. IMHO, if the US had a rational foreign policy, it wouldn't be necessary. Also, IMHO, if the US gives another country a few hundred billion $$$ over a period of years, you certainly wouldn't expect it to spy on its benefactor, and certainly not turn over top secret national defense information to the Soviet Union!

2) No, it is NOT "anti-Israel" to suggest that they should not have done what they did. It is, however, irrational to suggest that Israel should not experience some sort of retaliation for passing US military secrets to its enemies.
Maybe you think it's ok for foreign nations to take billions of $$$ in foreign aid then spy on us. That's your privilege. I, however, think that betrays the trust we had placed in our supposed "ally."
Do I harbor "anti-Israel thoughts?" Not at all. I ain't exactly pleased with them taking our $$$ and then spying on us. What I do harbor are pro-Justice notions that require Israel to move back to the land granted it by the United Nations in 1947, and to stop building settlements outside its territory, and to remove the existing settlements. See, what they're doing is exactly the same thing if Mexico decided they wanted more territory and started having their military protect Mexican settlements in Texas and Arizona and New Mexico and California. There's no way that US citizens would stand for that; and there's no reason for Palestinians to have to put up with Israel doing it to them.

Justice requires everyone to move back to their own territory. And Justice is what I support, and f*** the fundamentalists who oppose Justice and clamor over some ancient religious text.

--Tock

**FmRommel** · 03-15-2004, 07:46 PM

Originally Posted by BOUNCER

Amd why not, if they run everything there move their money into Israel ?.

Why would they? To lose control of the most powerful country in the world? It was the same in Europe before America became the superpower it is today.

FM

**Tock** · 03-15-2004, 07:52 PM

Originally Posted by MilitiaGuy

this is the flag of my party ...this party is legal in lebanon..and we have a lot of respect from ppl because we kicked the israeli invadors from our occupied lebanese land that israel took in 1982 go make a search about hezbollah and see

Yah, and if I recall correctly, Israel invaded Lebanon not because it had done anything, but because Israel wanted to establish a "security zone" in your territory?
It seemed to me that if they wanted to set up a security zone in their own territory, that would be one thing, but in your territory, that would be quite another . . .
It's been a while, but I recall rooting for your side of the battle . . .
--Tock