Newbie question

**gq_neo** · 10-21-2004, 07:23 PM

Hey everybody ... this site seems to be a fountain of knowledge.

I'm about to start my first cycle of D-Bol and had a question.

My main sources here tell me that the Dianabol tabs are ALL 5mg tabs and for me to take 4 daily 2 in the am and 2 pre workout.

However my workout partner has been getting a brand of Methandrostenolone from sweden, the bottle is labeled "Orbitz" and CLAIMS to contain 10mg of Methandrostenolone in each pill thus needing only 2 daily and being a whole lot less expensive (both the 5mg that I'm being sold and his 10mg are about $1 / pill (canadian))

Is there a 10mg Methandrostenolone pill? ... of is the packaging mislabled ... he's only been taking 2/day and had BIG gains in 2 cycles with no stacking.

**Soldier of Misfortune** · 10-21-2004, 07:30 PM

If I were you, I would read TONS on here. Everyone, including me, is going to tell you not to do a dbol only cycle. Add testosterone to it. Dbol only cycles will result in tons of water gain and you will loose most muscle gains coming off of it. Dbol is used only to kick start an AAS cycle of test-e or prop or somthing.

**gq_neo** · 10-21-2004, 08:23 PM

Wow serious? ... thats good to know, I was going to do a 6 week cycle ... off for 4 then a dbol decca stack for 8 weeks ...

Finnancially at the moment I was going to do the D-Bol only simply for the lack of money to spend on test e or decca at the moment, however I know it'll be said and I agree that is the wrong reason.

Being a novice ... I'm 5'10 176lbs, and to tell you the truth I don't know my body fat ... What would be the best way for me to approach this to get the best gains, I already have a good gym dicipline, and have been working out for about 3 years now on protien and creatine only, and eat like a horse. All I know is I'm not seeing much for size gains anymore or strength.

I'm currently 27 and I'm not looking to get HUGE ... I would like to be a little larger then now ... ie: 5-10 lean pounds more and then I'd like to "cut up" ... I'm not scared or shying away from the work, but what is my best cycle.

Locally here ...I'm told Dbol(1-4wks), Decca(1-8wks), Winni(4-8) I don't know if this makes sense. Is Decca a better or worse option then Test enanthate for a first time user?

**dive_kid** · 10-21-2004, 09:14 PM

I would start by trying to get the bf% down a bit.
d-bol only is not a good Idea. d-bol and deca is even worse. when you come off the d-bol you will loose most gains and deca only will give you limp dick. both of those drugs will shut you down. the solution....add test.for a first cycle I would stick to test only, but if ya want you can add
4 weeks of d-bol to the start. just for ****s and giggles.
my first cycle was 500mg/week test. 400mg/week deca.
worked well for me. also dont forget about nolva all the way and clomid for pct. very important.
later bro

**Demon Deacon** · 10-21-2004, 09:31 PM

Wks 1-10 Test E @ 500mg/wk

If you want you can use dbol at 20-25mg a day for the first 4 weeks or so. And i have dbol tabs that are 10mg so yes they do come in other forms than 5mgs.

**gq_neo** · 10-21-2004, 09:44 PM

So from the sounds of things ... I should throw out the idea of Decca.

I'll entertain Test E then ... and start my research on that, as it seems to be the popular choice.

Thanks for the opinions thus far ... more are welcome.

**Demon Deacon** · 10-21-2004, 10:00 PM

test should be the base of any cycle. Do some research before you jump into anything. I jumped head first into steroids and screwed myself up for awhile isnt wasnt fun

**123BJ** · 10-21-2004, 10:45 PM

yes like the others said... go with 1-12 test e @ 500mg ew..is a good basic cycle for a first timer..

**gq_neo** · 10-22-2004, 12:24 PM

OK ... I've spoken with my guy here ... and gotten some contradicting information ...

I'm being told theat a Test E, D-Bol stack will be HUGE for a first cycle .. I'm told that the gains will be ridiculous but the loss after would be just as big because of the water retention properties of test e.

My guy is telling me that dobl and decca would give me leaner more true gains ...

I don't want to gain huge fast, as I don't want TOO much mass... just more then I have.

Basicallly I've received alot of contradicting information , on what to take and what each thing will do for me ... I don't want HUGE water retention ... I know some is good and important for the strength gains and thats fine ... but I don't want it to be the majority of my gains.

I've read the drug profiles on numerous sites and books, and am torn now as to what to do ... I'm not looking to start the cycle until probably mid to late december ... so I have some time for this back and forth info ... so now is a good time for the questions for me.

I've done my reading and talking/listening ... and just don't want to get steered wrong.

Please help thank you.

**Demon Deacon** · 10-22-2004, 12:27 PM

Look up my thread about my deca cycle with no test. Tell me if you want that to happen to you?

**gq_neo** · 10-22-2004, 12:41 PM

Originally Posted by Demon Deacon

Look up my thread about my deca cycle with no test. Tell me if you want that to happen to you?

Forgive me ... do you have the link ... I'm searching ... but dont' see anything.

**gq_neo** · 10-22-2004, 05:43 PM

bump

**Skinz** · 10-23-2004, 10:27 PM

Originally Posted by gq_neo

OK ... I've spoken with my guy here ... and gotten some contradicting information ...

I'm being told theat a Test E, D-Bol stack will be HUGE for a first cycle .. I'm told that the gains will be ridiculous but the loss after would be just as big because of the water retention properties of test e.

My guy is telling me that dobl and decca would give me leaner more true gains ...

I don't want to gain huge fast, as I don't want TOO much mass... just more then I have.

Basicallly I've received alot of contradicting information , on what to take and what each thing will do for me ... I don't want HUGE water retention ... I know some is good and important for the strength gains and thats fine ... but I don't want it to be the majority of my gains.

I've read the drug profiles on numerous sites and books, and am torn now as to what to do ... I'm not looking to start the cycle until probably mid to late december ... so I have some time for this back and forth info ... so now is a good time for the questions for me.

I've done my reading and talking/listening ... and just don't want to get steered wrong.

Please help thank you.

Your guy...yeah...whats more expensive bro...test or deca . Make sure this guy isnt trying to sell you what profits him more. Deca and Dbol only....aint gonna happen bro. Water retention....? Oh yeah deca is better then Test E in that department...bullshiznit bro. Take the test E ONLY for you first cycle, stay away from the sauce (sustenon, cause guaranteed that was your next question), IMHO, 400-500mg test E /week for your first cycle...good quality gains, make sure PCT...but hey what do I know...what your stats kiddo?

**gq_neo** · 10-24-2004, 06:41 AM

I'm 5'10 176lbs, about 18% bf ... can't seem to get it any lower at the moment. I'm gained BIG from 150lbs to now naturally, but I'm stuck now.

Test Enanthate is for sure cheaper, and yea the reason for coming on here is that I don't necessarily trust someone that sells to me, because you're right ... he is making more money on decca and he probably has it right now to get rid of.

Test Enanthate seems to be the way to go (question 1, are the side effects of acne and aggression VERY common or rare)... now for the cycle and the PCT what is reccomended for a first timer ... Nolvadex throughout the whole cycle? or just near the end? or just on hand? ... Clomid PCT? Clen ?

I say this now but after results are seen I may change, but I'm looking to do one cycle to push my past my limit, but I"m not looking to continue cycle after cycle to maintain it, What is the best PCT for maintaining the gains I've gotten and my sexual function.

Thanks.

**almostgone** · 10-24-2004, 07:40 AM

run nolva @ 10mg/day and l-dex @ .25mg/day with your test..they will minimize bloat problems..if you really do have a bad problem with bloat, femera(letrozole ) will dry you out...use the search button, it has alot of good info, believe me you'll be glad that you make test the base of your cycle(any cycle)..good luck

**ODC0717** · 10-24-2004, 08:00 AM

Originally Posted by gq_neo

I'm 5'10 176lbs, about 18% bf ... can't seem to get it any lower at the moment. I'm gained BIG from 150lbs to now naturally, but I'm stuck now.

Test Enanthate is for sure cheaper, and yea the reason for coming on here is that I don't necessarily trust someone that sells to me, because you're right ... he is making more money on decca and he probably has it right now to get rid of.

Test Enanthate seems to be the way to go (question 1, are the side effects of acne and aggression VERY common or rare)... now for the cycle and the PCT what is reccomended for a first timer ... Nolvadex throughout the whole cycle? or just near the end? or just on hand? ... Clomid PCT? Clen ?

I say this now but after results are seen I may change, but I'm looking to do one cycle to push my past my limit, but I"m not looking to continue cycle after cycle to maintain it, What is the best PCT for maintaining the gains I've gotten and my sexual function.

Thanks.

You need to read Pheendo's PCT protocol in the PCT forum. This will answer you questions about recovery.
I think that test sides will vary drastically from person to person. If you are concerned about acne take B-5 throughout the cycle. I like to load for 5-10 days with 5g. and go with 3g. daily thereafter and I've noticed that my acne is just about no more.
Agression is a mind-fvck. Meaning that it's all in your head. Granted I feel there are certain AAS certain people should stay away from, but for the most part people are looking to fly off the handle just because they are on cycle and they think that roid rage is all to real, when in fact if they would exercise some self control it would not be there. Just my opinion on roid rage
Nolva should be ran at 10mg ed throughout the cycle and bumped up to 20mg PCT.
Hope this helps you get your cycle figured out a bit better. I would spend a lot of time reading and researching, though. Knowledge is power...

-ODC

**gq_neo** · 10-24-2004, 08:40 AM

Originally Posted by ODC0717

You need to read Pheendo's PCT protocol in the PCT forum. This will answer you questions about recovery.
I think that test sides will vary drastically from person to person. If you are concerned about acne take B-5 throughout the cycle. I like to load for 5-10 days with 5g. and go with 3g. daily thereafter and I've noticed that my acne is just about no more.
Agression is a mind-fvck. Meaning that it's all in your head. Granted I feel there are certain AAS certain people should stay away from, but for the most part people are looking to fly off the handle just because they are on cycle and they think that roid rage is all to real, when in fact if they would exercise some self control it would not be there. Just my opinion on roid rage
Nolva should be ran at 10mg ed throughout the cycle and bumped up to 20mg PCT.
Hope this helps you get your cycle figured out a bit better. I would spend a lot of time reading and researching, though. Knowledge is power...

-ODC

Thanks for the info .. that does in fact help me with my decission, only question left is about the B-5, should it be taken orally or is it to an injectable as well?

**ODC0717** · 10-24-2004, 08:49 AM

No, don't shoot it. You can buy it at GNC in capsules. 500mg caps, 100caps/bottle. There's other places you can buy the powder B-5 and cap it yourself to make a higher mg ratio.

**gq_neo** · 10-24-2004, 08:56 AM

Originally Posted by ODC0717

No, don't shoot it. You can buy it at GNC in capsules. 500mg caps, 100caps/bottle. There's other places you can buy the powder B-5 and cap it yourself to make a higher mg ratio.

so taking 5g for loading and 3g as a maintenance ... thats 10caps daily for loading and 6 for the rest ... how did you split that up, cuz thats significantly higher the reccommended dosage no?

**ODC0717** · 10-24-2004, 09:57 AM

Yes it is higher then the reccomended dose, but then again the USRDA for vitamin c is something like 60mg or some shiz like that, and I take 3g. daily. I would split the doses of B-5 as follows...

wake up-2g. / 1g. (maint.)
mid-afternoon-1g. / 1g. (maint.)
prior to bed-2g. / 1g. (maint.)

If it dosen't start getting better in a week in a half or so bump it up another gram all around. I know it sounds like a lot, especially compared to the reccomended dose. If you want you could do the reccomended dose and see what, if any, results you'll see...
Don't say I didn't warn ya though.

-ODC

**gq_neo** · 10-24-2004, 10:10 AM

Originally Posted by ODC0717

Yes it is higher then the reccomended dose, but then again the USRDA for vitamin c is something like 60mg or some shiz like that, and I take 3g. daily. I would split the doses of B-5 as follows...

wake up-2g. / 1g. (maint.)
mid-afternoon-1g. / 1g. (maint.)
prior to bed-2g. / 1g. (maint.)

If it dosen't start getting better in a week in a half or so bump it up another gram all around. I know it sounds like a lot, especially compared to the reccomended dose. If you want you could do the reccomended dose and see what, if any, results you'll see...
Don't say I didn't warn ya though.

-ODC

Thanks ... I'll add that to my diet ... as an extra ... I have mild b'acne in spurts as the norm. So I imagine I'll flare up after a cycle ... I am sick of taking the anti-bi's cuz they work ...but how much can you take. Lately I've been taking Oregano Oil (2 drops sublingual (under the tongue) twice daily ... and thats been keeping it at bay ... http://www.thewolfeclinic.com/oregano.html

Not many people know about this ... but if you have the red cyst like acne on your face/ back ... this will take the redness away in a matter of days.

**ODC0717** · 10-24-2004, 10:19 AM

B-5 works wonders. I am going to have to give that Oregano Oil a shot...or drop I should say. I have had acne since I was 12-13 or so, and I've taken everything under the sun for acne, and I mean EVERYTHING. I've done 2 cycles of accutane when I was in 9th or 10th grade and it helped, but nothing worked for me like the B-5. Not even the accutane totally got rid of it, but for some reasone, the B-5 does the trick for me.