2nd Cycle- Prop/Tren Looking for advice

**Dark Dragon** · 08-09-2005, 10:03 AM

Hey everyone,

New to the boards here and I have a few questions reguarding this cycle i'm about to take, diet, and fat loss.

Ok so here's what I just got in:

50ml bottle of test prop. 100mg/ml
20ml bottle of tren ace. 100mg/ml
5ml's of Deca 200mg/ml - (left over from first cycle, not gonna use it this time)

my first cycle (about a year ago) was pretty weak by the standards of alot of people here i'm sure. It was 6 weeks of winny and deca. winny eod deca once a week 1.5 ml's. I gained a solid 22 lbs and my bench shot from 280 x 2 to 340 x 3. My shoulders and arms got alot thicker and slightly more defined. not as much as i had hoped for but I figure that was because I wasn't doing any "real" cardio the whole 6 weeks because I was so afraid of hindering the muscle gains I was getting.

Some of my stats as of now:
Age: 22
Weight: 221 lbs
BF%: Roughly 19% (give or take 1%)
Height: 6'

What I really want to do right now is drop down to about 7 - 10% BF. My main question is whether or not I should hold off on using my gear and try to burn as much fat as I can Naturally by eatting strict, and doing the usual 30-45 mins of cardio 5xweek? Or would it be better (Faster/Not as difficult) to start my gear now and eat big but clean, and do a junk load of cardio while on this cycle since the tren is anti-catabolic? Would this be able to get me to my BF% goals or should I stick with the natty cutting?
Also my body seems really reluctant to give up this fat, I've been doing some pretty good cardio the last two and 1/2 months mixing it up between interval training and lower intensity longer duration training on the elipticles, and while I have cut up abit more its been very slow 2 lbs a month avg. Even with the last 3 weeks I have cut my Carbs back to less than 100g's/day i'm still not getting decent results.

One more thing is i'm thinking about starting the prop and tren at the same time 50mg prop ED 50mg tren ED, but continuing the prop for 3 more weeks after the tren runs out does this sound good to you guys? and would be 100mg of each EoD be just as good?

Sorry for such a long post but i wanted to get my questions all out at once while they were on my mind.

**tonytone** · 08-09-2005, 11:01 AM

well, first off, you dont have enough tren to run it for the most effective length..i like 8 weeks at 75mg/day..you only have enough to run it at 75mg/day for about 26 days..i understand your frustration in trying to drop the BF%.. since you say you have been doing a good cardio/diet routine, maybe you should add some clen . here's what i would do..
keep up your strict cardio/diet
throw in some clen (read hookers clen profile)
see how that works out for you for 2 months or so
in the meantime, get some more tren a. i think the clen will help you a lot. then start your prop/tren cycle, something like this
prop 75mg ED weeks 1-12
tren a 75mg ED weeks 4-12
maybe throw in some var if you can

**Dark Dragon** · 08-09-2005, 07:39 PM

alright i'll stick with the dieting/heavier cardio for awhile longer and see how that goes. as for the tren i had a feeling it just wasn't enough gear for what i was looking to do but a close friend who did tren for awhile said i shouldn't do tren for any large length of time due to its toxicity, nonetheless i am gonna see about getting ahold of another 20ish doses.

**Dark Dragon** · 08-11-2005, 09:51 AM

also i am definitly gonna run nolva after the cycle, should i get some clomid as well or will the nolva be fine by itself?

**edmen2** · 08-11-2005, 10:06 AM

Originally Posted by Dark Dragon

alright i'll stick with the dieting/heavier cardio for awhile longer and see how that goes. as for the tren i had a feeling it just wasn't enough gear for what i was looking to do but a close friend who did tren for awhile said i shouldn't do tren for any large length of time due to its toxicity, nonetheless i am gonna see about getting ahold of another 20ish doses.

that is why most bros say do at least 8 wks of tren but no more than 12. although people have gone past 12 with no problems. once u start ur cycle u will see if u can tolerate the tren.

**ODC0717** · 08-11-2005, 10:21 AM

Originally Posted by Dark Dragon

Hey everyone,

New to the boards here and I have a few questions reguarding this cycle i'm about to take, diet, and fat loss.

Ok so here's what I just got in:

50ml bottle of test prop. 100mg/ml
20ml bottle of tren ace. 100mg/ml
5ml's of Deca 200mg/ml - (left over from first cycle, not gonna use it this time)

my first cycle (about a year ago) was pretty weak by the standards of alot of people here i'm sure. It was 6 weeks of winny and deca. winny eod deca once a week 1.5 ml's. I gained a solid 22 lbs and my bench shot from 280 x 2 to 340 x 3. My shoulders and arms got alot thicker and slightly more defined. not as much as i had hoped for but I figure that was because I wasn't doing any "real" cardio the whole 6 weeks because I was so afraid of hindering the muscle gains I was getting.

Some of my stats as of now:
Age: 22
Weight: 221 lbs
BF%: Roughly 19% (give or take 1%)
Height: 6'

What I really want to do right now is drop down to about 7 - 10% BF. My main question is whether or not I should hold off on using my gear and try to burn as much fat as I can Naturally by eatting strict, and doing the usual 30-45 mins of cardio 5xweek? Or would it be better (Faster/Not as difficult) to start my gear now and eat big but clean, and do a junk load of cardio while on this cycle since the tren is anti-catabolic? Would this be able to get me to my BF% goals or should I stick with the natty cutting?
Also my body seems really reluctant to give up this fat, I've been doing some pretty good cardio the last two and 1/2 months mixing it up between interval training and lower intensity longer duration training on the elipticles, and while I have cut up abit more its been very slow 2 lbs a month avg. Even with the last 3 weeks I have cut my Carbs back to less than 100g's/day i'm still not getting decent results.

One more thing is i'm thinking about starting the prop and tren at the same time 50mg prop ED 50mg tren ED, but continuing the prop for 3 more weeks after the tren runs out does this sound good to you guys? and would be 100mg of each EoD be just as good?

Sorry for such a long post but i wanted to get my questions all out at once while they were on my mind.

I would hold off on the cycle just for a bit. Get you cardio tight along with your diet before you venture into another cycle. Tren can be rather harsh on your cardio needs (some cats get a shortness of breath while using tren, and that can kill their cardio). Especially when doing interval cardio. You will need more tren and I wouldn't use the deca being that you only have a few ml's left anyway. When you do begin the prop/tren cycle, I would bump the test to 75mg ed instead of 50. By keeping your test higher then you tren you will avoid some of the unwanted sides. For both compounds I would shoot them ed instead of eod. You will get a more even blood hormone level and thereby avoiding other unwanted sides. One good adition to your cycle, IMO, would be clen . Check out the education forum and read through the clen handbook. Tons of good info that fit you needs. Are you on a tradional low carb diet? I would reccomend you try carb cycling. I believe there are some threads in the diet forum on that.

**ODC0717** · 08-11-2005, 10:24 AM

Originally Posted by Dark Dragon

also i am definitly gonna run nolva after the cycle, should i get some clomid as well or will the nolva be fine by itself?

You should definitly run nolva throughout the cycle at 10mg ed, then 20mg PCT. I would also suggest you get some sort of AI like letro or ldex and use it in conjunction with the nolva. Get some clomid and use it during your PCT run. I would lok into the PCT forum and read up on Pheendo's PCT protocol. You could also go one more step and get some B6, 200mg ed and PCT to help control prolactin build-up. All of these things wil help make your recovery much easier.