19-22 whats the difference

[testosterona]

hi all i've been reading on the board for obout a year now. thanks to everyone for all the education. i just finished a 13wk cycle (my 1st) consisting of 400mgdeca and 500wk test e. with some suspension in the mix about 3 months ago. finished with nolva only pct. Everyone suggests to wait until early twenties to juice but whats the difference in 2 years. test levels of a 21yr old must be similar to 19. I'm 19 years old, feel great, my sex drive is high as ever and no regrets. just looking for educated opinions. thanks

[Spyder]

You can stuff up your test levels with anabolic steroids, does not matter how old you are 19 or 35 but the difference is in your teens your endocrine system is still developing, so you can not only stuff up your test levels but also stop your endocrine system from fully developing. The longer you wait, the better.

[testosterona]

so endocrine is testosterone production i assume?

[Spyder]

have a look at this thread for example http://forums.steroid.com/showthread.php?t=193732

[wolfyEVH]

where those ages came from.....i doubt anyone knows....its just what most guys here will recommend. mainly to try and max out your genetic limit and get used to training and eating properly first. everyone here is different. someone can be ready for gear earlier or later. there isnt a fixed age. but we're all human here, and we realize most won't follow this. but to each his own. we can't stop you.

[Spyder]

Yeah what wolfy said. I think it all depends how big you want to get versus how much of a price you're prepared to pay. If you want to be ronnie coleman, you better start at the age of 17, but you better have your kids early.

[testosterona]

well the reason i juiced was to break through a plateau i was stuck at for months dispite my caloric intake. When i started lifting i was 6ft 143lbs. I gained 22lbs naturally then got stuck. i've known how to eat and have changed many bad habits in my decision to use AAS. thanks for the replies

[Spyder]

well the reason i juiced was to break through a plateau i was stuck at for months dispite my caloric intake. When i started lifting i was 6ft 143lbs. I gained 22lbs naturally then got stuck. i've known how to eat and have changed many bad habits in my decision to use AAS. thanks for the replies

No problems. Well you may have gained 22lbs but the cold truth is you're still only 165lbs and you can still gain alot more naturally, maybe it is just time for a new workout routine, not AAS. I am only 20 years old, which may be only a year or so more then you but i was 205lbs at 5" 10 when i started, and i wasn't fat.

[wolfyEVH]

well the reason i juiced was to break through a plateau i was stuck at for months dispite my caloric intake. When i started lifting i was 6ft 143lbs. I gained 22lbs naturally then got stuck. i've known how to eat and have changed many bad habits in my decision to use AAS. thanks for the replies

like spyder said......22 lbs on 143 is still only 165...which is VERY skinny at 6 feet IMO. you got stuck cause you didnt know how to eat properly. getting on gear that soon was a poor choice. not by your age, but because you thought that would help you get over that plateau even though it was your diet and possibly training that needed tweaked.

[testosterona]

wrong. i did know how to eat. i was on a 4500-5000 calorie diet eating every couple hours. Some people have metabolisms that strongly limit gains. Tell me you wouldn't be frusturated on 5000 cals and no gains. i'm very into food and know exactly what to eat. also i'd post pics if i could, but im genetically screwed in my legs. they are very skinny and probably wiegh 20lbs each. i trained them twice a week on cycle and just saw mostly strenght, not much development. my training is in check. i've worked with a personall trainer of and on for the past two years. Hey wolfe while your bashing my training and diet why don't you tell me what eccentric and cocentric movement is. don't judge people by what you don't know. i'm currently 175lbs but look alot larger because i'm top heavy. I rep 90lb dumbells on flat chest press 12x. i think i'm doin ok

[testosterona]

thanks for the reply spyder i prob could of gained a few more pounds but i'm sure you know how it is.

[Spyder]

Well you definately have no problem with strength, so you are doing something right. Eating that much, and gaining no size must have really hurt your motivation. I was in a similar position when i was abit younger around mid teens, i ate and ate and ate, did not gain a damn thing, i even tried once to eat nothing but junk food for a week straight(as stupid as that was), yet there was no weight gain, the strength was there because i could do 220 pushups straight when i was 16 i was frustrated and angry and dissapointed in myself, because others were gaining with half the effort and i was not. I just hung in there and stopped comparing myself to others, just kept doing what i could. I kept changing workout routines every 2 months or so, and suddenly after about a year of nothingness, weight started to pack on, i kept gaining. Now very happy with size and strength, though i still have the mentality that i am not big enough regardless of how big i am, but i think i need that to drive me further.

[chest6]

man do you know how many plateaus i have hit and im 18..one plataeu aint enough to start. Try getting your natty test back..if you havent already. Get your calories even higher than they are now, perfect your training etc. I messed up at 17 1/2 with a deca/dbol cycle and it took forever to recover from that. I did manage to gain at least 20-25lbs lean muscle naturally since then and I plan on doing that for another year and 1/2 or so.

[wolfyEVH]

wrong. i did know how to eat. i was on a 4500-5000 calorie diet eating every couple hours. Some people have metabolisms that strongly limit gains. Tell me you wouldn't be frusturated on 5000 cals and no gains. i'm very into food and know exactly what to eat. also i'd post pics if i could, but im genetically screwed in my legs. they are very skinny and probably wiegh 20lbs each. i trained them twice a week on cycle and just saw mostly strenght, not much development. my training is in check. i've worked with a personall trainer of and on for the past two years. Hey wolfe while your bashing my training and diet why don't you tell me what eccentric and cocentric movement is. don't judge people by what you don't know. i'm currently 175lbs but look alot larger because i'm top heavy. I rep 90lb dumbells on flat chest press 12x. i think i'm doin ok

you're right bro....i have no idea what i'm talking about. you obviously train and eat 110% perfectly.

and i have no idea about the emphasizing of the negative and the postive

and you look larger cause you're top heavy?? oh, you mean you're disproportional!! i see!!

you rep 90lb db's on flat. ok.....what do you squat with your 20lb legs???

learn how to take advice bro. and NO....you don't know how to train and eat properly. stalling out at 175 and only 6ft....you have a problem. if you knew how to do all this properly, you would have a developed lower body and would be 200lbs. we are all trying to help you. don't disrespect bro.

[testosterona]

Thanks for the motivation spyder. its good to hear. as for wolfe i understand you have strong opinions, i've read them many times. I'm trying to work on my weak points(legs) and have been for years, yes i am disproportionate if it makes you feel better. I now you know your shit so you know that if you have a genetic disability, things aren't going to change overnight. it takes years of dedication, wich i'm in the middle of. so try and not cut me down saying that i have a problem because my legs are small. notice how the other guys give advice without flaming, it's alot easier to take advice from those types like spyder. keep that in mind, respect gets respect.

[chest6]

Thanks for the motivation spyder. its good to hear. as for wolfe i understand you have strong opinions, i've read them many times. I'm trying to work on my weak points(legs) and have been for years, yes i am disproportionate if it makes you feel better. I now you know your shit so you know that if you have a genetic disability, things aren't going to change overnight. it takes years of dedication, wich i'm in the middle of. so try and not cut me down saying that i have a problem because my legs are small. notice how the other guys give advice without flaming, it's alot easier to take advice from those types like spyder. keep that in mind, respect gets respect.

when those stubborn legs start growing you will start to see some major weight..leg press and squats made my weight go up pretty quickly when i started them

[testosterona]

by the way i rep 350 on squats. their strong just small. god made people with smaller bones than others. people assume that its wrong to start AAS before a certain wieght....BS another guy 6ft could outwiegh me by 20lbs just because of the bone structure he was born with, nobody puts that into consideration. try to be openminded about others situations. everytime i spot the guy in the gym with the biggest calfs and ask how he trains. he says "good genetics man, i got lucky." i've tried all the routines dude, trust me it sucks. don't need the negativity, advice is good enough.

[testosterona]

chest6, ya man i can't wait. Considering they are half my body i look forward to the growth. I recently switched to higher weight lower reps to switch things up a bit. I'm constantly trying to shock them into growing ya know

[Slic4788]

well man, the other guys might be right here, why risk it? You don't compete or anything right?...you can't gain in legs...whatever life goes on, don't make it obsession...

[big&tall]

sup testo Iam 26 and untill i was 23 i was 140lbs now im 213lbs and on the third week of my first test cyp only cycle hope to see good from it. when your young hard too gain but then one day its like you wake up and poof you have too watch what you eat. do not get too much in a hury it will come if you stay at it good luck.

[mizuno]

21 reached naturaly production i think at 231lbs cut down to 225 then started aas, gained to 250 cut again at 241 right now. im happy would like to stay between 235 and 250.

[powerliftmike]

dont get so mad and lets dont start a flame war. Everybody is different, all the guys are trying to say is that you should get more experience under your belt. I myself have a small bone structure but that doesnt mean I cant gain. You sound like a young guy and during this time of life gaining weight can be very difficult, i know cause ive been there. Eating 1000000000000 Cals a day isnt always the solution either.

[testosterona]

thanks for the replies. sorry if i sounded pissed, it's just irritaiting getting flamed for my downfalls instead of helped. But you guys are right. i''m young and soon my metabolism will catch up to my body and i'll start gaining easier. and slic4 wieghtlifting is most of my life, preparing food, lifting, constantly watching out for what will benifit my training everyday, the only way to gain as fast as possible is to be dedicated or as you call obssessed. It's all for a good cause,,,,,,,,,,,,,gettin strong as hell.

[AG5678]

How much did you get from your cycle? You said you were 145lb then gained 22lb naturally =167lb and now after your cycle your 175lb. So you gained 8lb's from your cycle?

AG5678

[testosterona]

sorry AG wasn't clear. math was a little off. Started cycle when i was 165-163. Peak wieght on cycle was 188, when i started taking nolva it stript me down a few good pounds.....water i assume. When i ended my cycle i was about 185lbs and still bloated as hell. lost a good 8lbs during pct think it was mostly water as i didn't lose noticable strength. Currently 175, so i guess i gained a solid 10-12lbs. could've been better, but it was my first cycle and i slacked off towards the end on my foods hoping that the drugs would compensate for the calories, throwing the occasional party onthe weekends didn't help much. though i'm happy with my results, ive learned my lesson and gained alot of knowlege on this board. Next time around will be a different story.