cycle opinions

[dragon69]

planning a follow up cycle. Here goes

Sust 250mg EOD
Masteron 100mg EOD
EQ 150mg EOD
Anavar 40-60mg ED (7 weeks)

Whole cycle should go about 12-14 weeks

Is this too many compounds? I could take out the EQ perhaps or maybe even the masteron.
Opinions on this cycle?

[anaBROLIC]

i like the sounds of the combo..trying to cut up?

[chest6]

Im not seeing the masteron here. Are you shooting EQ eod just bc you will be running the sust eod...makin it easier? This is what Im guessing I really dont even know why I asked.

[slitsoul13]

you should use prop instead of sus imo

[hosam4ever]

so ur going with 750 mg sus e/w

[dragon69]

actually it works out to be 875mg Sust/week.
Ya this is a cutter to maybe follow up the prop/tren cutter I'm on now. (unless I go with another prop/tren cycle first)
Ya I'm used to ED shots now with prop tren so EOD with sust/eq/mast would make sense.
Just wondering how this combo sounds together and IF you think there's too many compounds in there. I will keep the Anavar in there for sure.
If I had to drop 1, would it be the EQ or masteron?

[dragon69]

bump

[dragon69]

If I had to drop 1, would it be the EQ or masteron?

[dragon69]

bump

[dragon69]

bump

[Two4the$$]

Dragon dragon... Interesting ... the same guy who professes Test is the only thing that can cause keepable gains is using sust - something few people I regard as experts prefer. In fact, the only reason I thought anyone would want to use sust was to avoid frequent injections (the reason it was first made).

Anyway, if you read about the most successful cutters ... it appears they all include:

Test (generally short ester)
DHT (Masteron has a following of people I respect)
19-Nor (probably Tren, given that you don't want to hold water and lipolytic is the goal)

The Anavar is a good keeper... but EQ (if anything) would be my pick to sh1t can, only because of the increased hunger. Thus, if you're trying to keep a strict diet ... it'd seem counterintuitive to include something that might make being disciplined more difficult. Honestly ... Just do ED injections. Find gear that runs through a 25g, and it's not really that much of a bitch. I think you'll get good results, so long as your hair line can withstand the DHT and Tren (provided you are interested in my suggestion). Of course things are dose-dependant ... but if that was a concern (MPB) you could keep the dose of the Tren and Mast light, and use 100mg ED of Prop.

You should pop your head back in on that other thread and rebutt...

[dragon69]

You should pop your head back in on that other thread and rebutt...

I apreciate your input, but I think that comment is just plain rude and quite frankly it really pissed me off.
Like I have said before I am in medicine. Textbooks are available for you to read. I don't want an argument from anyone just because I decided to share. It's stuff like this that makes me not want to share anymore.

Other than that I do appreciate your comments on opinion of the cycle.

I picked sust here only because I got an impossible deal on it so I need to use it some time and it IS considered by some to be on the cutter side of tests.

[Two4the$$]

Yes, but lets not refer to the Sust as an ester - lets acknowledge it's blend values... which are comprised of long esters (in addition to short). I think it'd be wiser saved for a bulking cycle if you have the economic discretion to do so at the present time.

As far as the other thread - I'm sorry that it seems like there were people ganing up on you. I know that kind of thwarts a persons desire to engage. But please, without being defensive, Hookers point is valid. I post challenging statements, yes. But I don't mean to insult you ... but you have to accept this (being that you are studying a science) that the burden of proof lies in the hands of the person making the claim. Thus, please, since you have a minority view, support it. That's all. No rudeness intended, I just want the discourse to contain dialogue and support.

Here's a REALLY interesting read ...

http://www.earlham.edu/~peters/courses/log/terms1.htm

[Two4the$$]

Also, what are your thoughts on Tren? Have you run it before? I'll tell you ... day 5 I'm on ... WOW! My hunger is off the charts. It's GREAT! And I think I'm leaner too!

[dragon69]

yes yes that is very basic knowledge (the link). Again, with my profession of course I know all that, it's the basics. I just am so sick of arguements on this panel, and quite frankly I don't have the time for it (again the profession). I have cut down my posts to like 1/10th for this very reason. I'm more refering to those who ask a question and then argue your reply cause they don't like the answer.
Yes I do know that some stuff needs to be supported, but like I said before I just don't have the time for it. Although I do think my position has some weight to it due to many many years of study as opposed to listening to 'joe blo' user that thinks they know some shit. I think there's quite a difference there.
Now I have mentioned to you 3 times already that I am CURRENTLY ON PROP / TREN. The leaning has been good.
I'm trying to figure out whether or not to run sust/mast/var next (or something like that) or another prop/tren cycle.

[dragon69]

by joe blo user I mean some people on this forum that have no training at all, very research done but post things like they're fact without even saying where it came from. Now coming from someone in my position it is much more credible due to my credentials.
I am not refering here to you btw. just comparing an average user to someone with my medical education, pharmaceutical knowledge and clinical experience.

[Two4the$$]

Why not stick to the Test/19nor/DHT combo? In fact, have you considered throwing Masteron in your CURRENT cycle? And if you get good results on the cycle you're on, why change to a different one? I mean, I understand your reasoning for the Sust - we've covered that. But why the Var instead of Tren? I would ADD the var to the aforementioned long before I'd substitute it out ... unless you think theres some aspect of this cycle that you don't need or want to repeat.

[dragon69]

Yes I have consider masteron now, but I think I'm around 11% nnot 8% and supposedly you need to be under 8%. I'm scheduled to add winstrol and could maybe add some proviron.
This thread is intended for a FOLLOW UP CYCLE though. I was thinking that maybe I'd give myself a long rest from the tren (even though I liked it) since it'll be 12 weeks of use and you know how suppressive it is. That AND the tren gave me occassional libido issues despite the 700mg prop a week.
So you don't like the sust/eq/mast/var idea? Could use cyp instead but that's not really cutting test.
Actually, for that future cycle I am contemplating doing tren/prop/masteron together as my supplier now has it packaged together in a single bottle for much less $.

[dragon69]

oh and I wasn't sure if I wanted VAR AND TREN together (already have var) as I didn't think I'd cut any faster. So given that AND the desired rest from tren it didn't make sense to use tren for that one. But maybe I will, not sure yet.

[Two4the$$]

Perhaps a lower dose of Tren?

And I've heard that injectibles and orals should be regarded someone separately ...

[MASTERDBOL]

why are you using masteron? i love the compound personally, but i used it prior to competitions to shed the remainder of any fat. i was already at single digit bf prior to starting it. personally i would boot the masteron for that purpose, unless your bf is in the single digits. if not, the eq will do what you need it to do.

[Two4the$$]

EQ burns fat? I didn't really notice that effect from it.

[MASTERDBOL]

EQ burns fat? I didn't really notice that effect from it.

its good to use in a cutting cycle, that i've noticed. i'm not a big fan of eq at all. but masteron isnt what he needs unless he is already down. if he wants a "fat burner", then he needs to get some ephedrine or clen. as far as cutting.....eq, or primo.

[MASTERDBOL]

there really isnt a steroid that "burns fat". masteron, eq, primo, etc. none of them burn fat. they harden up the muscle, remove water (masteron), etc. that i have found.

[dragon69]

I agree there about masteron, it's not considered a fat burner. Although test, tren and Var ARE known to burn fat under the right circumstances (diet etc). At least THAT is what is said amongst the elite here on this panel.

I have heard masteron cuts in some people very well though (not like I'm expecting it to....hope maybe). Just like any drug its exact action will depend on your personal biochemistry. I have also heard before that masteron can make you very very randy. Any input there?

[MASTERDBOL]

explain "randy".

[MASTERDBOL]

I agree there about masteron, it's not considered a fat burner. Although test, tren and Var ARE known to burn fat under the right circumstances (diet etc). At least THAT is what is said amongst the elite here on this panel.

I have heard masteron cuts in some people very well though (not like I'm expecting it to....hope maybe). Just like any drug its exact action will depend on your personal biochemistry. I have also heard before that masteron can make you very very randy. Any input there?

test, tren, and var dont have any "fat burning" compounds in them that i am aware of. proper diet and those compounds will help you get hard as a rock however. diet and "fat burners" (i.e. clen, ephedrine, t3, etc), and cardio are the only things to "burn fat". the other things compounded with these elements will give you the hard, striated look.

[dragon69]

Well I was HOPING to be single digit by the time I used it though.
See that's what I was thinking of doing, using the sust and Eq as mass support or builders with little conversion while the masteron/var is the cutting component. Masteron would also be there for the AI as well while the var could further burn.
So gaining mass while maintaining a more ripped look sounds good to me.
Perspective is further desired here cause I may be missing something (I haven't used those compounds yet).
Actually, for that future cycle I am contemplating doing tren/prop/masteron together as my supplier now has it packaged together in a single bottle for much less $.
But if I do this one I will save the sust for later, but put it with what? EQ & Tbol maybe?

[Two4the$$]

test, tren, and var dont have any "fat burning" compounds in them that i am aware of. proper diet and those compounds will help you get hard as a rock however. diet and "fat burners" (i.e. clen, ephedrine, t3, etc), and cardio are the only things to "burn fat". the other things compounded with these elements will give you the hard, striated look.

Randy = increased libido.

With regards to your statement of which drugs "cut" ... well, I disagree. All drugs that bind strongly to the AR are known for it. Var, Test, Tren... as well as DHT drugs in general. Winny is known for it - as well as proviron and masteron. In fact, I'll tell you with personal certainty that Tren works WAY better than Clen for fat burning. And I think a poll would discover that I'm not alone. It's simply BAD ASS!

[Two4the$$]

Well I was HOPING to be single digit by the time I used it though.
See that's what I was thinking of doing, using the sust and Eq as mass support or builders with little conversion while the masteron/var is the cutting component. Masteron would also be there for the AI as well while the var could further burn.
So gaining mass while maintaining a more ripped look sounds good to me.
Perspective is further desired here cause I may be missing something (I haven't used those compounds yet).
Actually, for that future cycle I am contemplating doing tren/prop/masteron together as my supplier now has it packaged together in a single bottle for much less $.
But if I do this one I will save the sust for later, but put it with what? EQ & Tbol maybe?

I like the direction you went in with that thread...

Tren/Mast/Prop would be nothing short of dramatic. I've got to be down 2% in 7 days of Prop/Tren/Var/Tbol (the var is at a loooow dose, it's already mixed with my TBol caps) ... and I'll be adding Masteron as soon as it arrives. I'm also running 4iu ED of HGH. This cycle is going to be AMAZING. I can tell.

I agree with running the Mast as an anti-E ... so long as you aren't using anything progestenic (and you weren't in that post - however, things tend to be dynamically created - and thus if you DO decide to run a 19-nor, don't forget the letro.)

[MASTERDBOL]

Randy = increased libido.

With regards to your statement of which drugs "cut" ... well, I disagree. All drugs that bind strongly to the AR are known for it. Var, Test, Tren... as well as DHT drugs in general. Winny is known for it - as well as proviron and masteron. In fact, I'll tell you with personal certainty that Tren works WAY better than Clen for fat burning. And I think a poll would discover that I'm not alone. It's simply BAD ASS!

I like tren, but what "fat burning" compounds does it have?

tren, winny, primo, var, masteron, etc are great cutting agents, but dont actually burn fat. i'm not a chemist, so i can speak with absolute certainly, but as far as i've learned in the last 16 years, it doesnt contain those compounds.

[dragon69]

ya I love the tren for cutting. Winny is known to be water remover only not a cutter. Not sure about any of the others as they are new to me. Tren has worked very well for me though. Proviron is known as a cutter so masteron should be too but some say not so. But as I said this will be individual case likely too.
Take for example codeine and other opiate family drugs such as morphine....they are strong drugs but have absolutely NO effect on me personally (had them all post surgery before). There are so many variables.
Oh, one other reason I wanted to use masteron in this cycle is to see what effects it had on me without confusing it with the tren.

[Two4the$$]

Things that bind tightly to the AR cause fat loss. DHT drugs also do this... one of which ways is by enhancing the effectiveness of other compounds by reducing SHBG.

Click Drug Name to View Profile: Parabolan


Click Drug Name to View Profile: Anavar

Click Drug Name to View Profile: Masteron

so?

[MASTERDBOL]

well i stand correct on the chemistry of the compounds.

[Two4the$$]

We're all here to learn dude. And we will all be humbled at times.

[dragon69]

what mg dose are VAR are you taking then?
Don't you think var with tren is a waste? The strength gains are similar to tren and it's also a cutter too. I would think it's better to use it as a cutter in another cycle.

Like to see what your opinion is here.

[Two4the$$]

Well, I guess it's somewhat of an experiment. I just want to get as lean as possible. I mean, muscle can show up slowly, but leanness... the sooner the f-ing better. I may even use some DNP at 1mg x kg... the lightest dose possible ... for about 20 days if I can stand it. I want to be able to see my lower abs. Whatever BF% that is, perfect. No need to have an ass with 0 fat on it... I just want to be able to see my abs. I have so little fat anywhere else but my stomach that no matter what % that is it suits me. I know, a bit different than most here... but that's me.

[dragon69]

this has to be one of the only times you didn't actually have an opinion.
I personally tend to suspect that you can only lose so much fat at a time no matter what combo you use.
However then there are those that use tren, T3 and GH together that swear it all melted off in a few weeks.
Judging by your pic your BF already looks low. Could be your development in the lower ab area is lacking too.
So I have a question. What did you see with masteron in your experience with it. Also wondering if it made your sex drive higher like some claim.

[Two4the$$]

Well, I haven't received my Masteron yet ... probably about 5 days from it getting here. I've used Clen, and I believe it takes a lot of effort for even me (ectomorph with low bf to begin with...) thus, my belief in its efficacy as a stand alone product is limited ... however, adding it to other effective fat burners would have at least a cumulative advantage of using them individually (especially an AAS compound which will offer the assurance of muscle protection) ... and possibly a synergistic affect.

One thing to consider is this; given the strong evidence that there is a "dose dependant" effect of AAS compounds (within the users comfort range) would lead me to believe that ... 50mg ED of Tren (being that it's less effective than 100mg) doesn't provide the body as much androgen as there are androgen receptors to bind to. I.e., perhaps there are a million androgen receptors, and each milligram of Tren can perhaps bind to 5,000 of them (TOTALLY hypothetical) ... thus, 50 x 5,000 equals a bind between 250,000 of the million you have ... or billion - whatever the number is. Anyway, since using enough Tren to bind to all of them would certainly entail a whole HOST of physical, psychological, and probably social consequences... we keep the dose lower. But, when you start adding other drugs (which NOT be a combined negative affect, but rather concurrent negatives... ) however they may have CUMULATIVE positives, or even synergistic as they may enhance one another ... you probably get stronger benefits.

Also, lets say you had 5 different compounds which could be ran consecutively ... each providing a 10% advantage over BMR. Lets say you could do each of them for 70 days straight ... I'd venture a guess that it would be LESS effective (especially given the lack of diet discipline most people (myself included) have, and the "dead zone" of our metabolism ... (another belief of mine is that my weight will not change as long as my daily intake is between 2000-3000 calories... regarless of consistency, duration, content, or distribution (excluding exercise) slight advantages may not even yeild visible indications of success) .... than a 30% advantage over 2 - 3 months. So, concisely ... 10% advantage over a year is less effective than 2 - 3 months of a 30% advantage. Maybe for some? Who knows, but thats my current opinion with my experiences thus far.

Okay, that was a confusing paragraph - but these have been my PERSONAL experiences. So, adding a bunch of sh1t up at the same time taking advantage of cumulative, and possibly synergistic compounds to yeild a higher Calorie expendeture over a short period of time ... is more effective.

A great example to compare... try 20 days of Clen without change in your diet or exercise... wait a few weeks... then do the same with a very modest dose of DNP.... perhaps with some Anavar at the same time. I'd be willing to bet ... and I mean WAGER, that the later will prevail as the fat burning champ... and not by a narrow margin. More importantly, I think if we used GROUPS of people this would be a landslide victory.

Okay, obviously this is ALL opinion... I have no justifications other than the ones provided... but these are interesting thoughts.

If this is all too convaluted for even my opinoins to be understood, let me know, I'll use the WYSIWYG editor and make it a more logical layout...

[Two4the$$]

No ones ridiculing or cross examining my conjecture? WTF? lol