Keeping Tren Strength?

**SledgeHammer** · 10-22-2005, 08:34 AM

Bro's, I have done mounds of tren research but can't find the answer to my question. If I PCT correctly will I keep my strength gains I got from Tren?

**topvega** · 10-22-2005, 08:42 AM

i havn't done tren yet, but it will be in my next cycle.. i think keeping gains and strength is dependent on how well u do your pct and genetics.. i don't think there is anyway to keep 100% of your gains and strength though...

**Charged_UP** · 10-22-2005, 08:46 AM

enjoy the strength while u are on it. Just do ur planned PCT and remember what u lifted before u took it and be happy.

**SledgeHammer** · 10-22-2005, 08:50 AM

thanks bro! I'll just have to jump back on it after my body is rested! haha

**ODC0717** · 10-22-2005, 08:55 AM

Umm, diet and training will be a big part of it too. Keep yourself in the gym and keep a good diet so you can hang on to what you gained. Expect to loose some amount of strength since you won't be on, but you don't have to loose all of it. Keep you intensity levels up and you should be okay. As for genetics, I don't think genetics dosen't have much of anything to do with strength, maintaining it or building it. Size can be dictated by gentetics, but I can't see how strength is. Anyone can be strong.

**juicehoe** · 10-22-2005, 09:03 AM

genetics do play a big role in strength. Its how your muscles socket into the tendons and what not

Originally Posted by ODC0717

Umm, diet and training will be a big part of it too. Keep yourself in the gym and keep a good diet so you can hang on to what you gained. Expect to loose some amount of strength since you won't be on, but you don't have to loose all of it. Keep you intensity levels up and you should be okay. As for genetics, I don't think genetics dosen't have much of anything to do with strength, maintaining it or building it. Size can be dictated by gentetics, but I can't see how strength is. Anyone can be strong.

**SledgeHammer** · 10-22-2005, 09:05 AM

I've read that tren creates more muscles fibers? if this is try wouldn't that help? May be a stupid question?

can anyone validate this?

**topvega** · 10-22-2005, 09:05 AM

by genetics i mean if u are a naturally small person who thru the wonders of anabolics has put on 35 lbs of muscle then u might have a harder time holding onto all that muscle than someone who is geneticly a larger more muscled person.
and isn't strength largley based on muscle size? bigger muscles lift heavier weights?
so size being a genetic thing= strength also being influenced by genetics?
jmo

**SledgeHammer** · 10-22-2005, 09:09 AM

thanks for all replys brothas! this helps. I loved the strength will on this stuff..it da shiznit!

**ODC0717** · 10-22-2005, 09:15 AM

Originally Posted by topvega

by genetics i mean if u are a naturally small person who thru the wonders of anabolics has put on 35 lbs of muscle then u might have a harder time holding onto all that muscle than someone who is geneticly a larger more muscled person.
and isn't strength largley based on muscle size? bigger muscles lift heavier weights?
so size being a genetic thing= strength also being influenced by genetics?
jmo

that's also what I was reffering too, I think I just worded it wrong, but oh well.

**groundandpoundpwr21** · 10-22-2005, 05:52 PM

I dont really loose much strength at all after tren only cycles. Its real strength not water strength. usually a couple reps here and there maybe 5 pounds on a core lift thats it.

***G-1000*** · 10-22-2005, 06:22 PM

when you come off trn you drop strength fast. that is why running test prop for a week or 2 more help keep some of it up.

**juicehoe** · 10-22-2005, 11:14 PM

Id agree for the most part, but there is a guy whos 150lbs and looks 15years old and can bench 315lbs at my gym. Exception to the rule i guess

Originally Posted by topvega

by genetics i mean if u are a naturally small person who thru the wonders of anabolics has put on 35 lbs of muscle then u might have a harder time holding onto all that muscle than someone who is geneticly a larger more muscled person.
and isn't strength largley based on muscle size? bigger muscles lift heavier weights?
so size being a genetic thing= strength also being influenced by genetics?
jmo

**groundandpoundpwr21** · 10-23-2005, 08:30 PM

Why would running prop for 2 weeks after tren help you keep strength?

**Tren Bull** · 10-23-2005, 10:22 PM

don't worry bro, tren will give you rock hard gains that are easily maintained, especially if you run clen at the end of your cycle. hell, i managed to maintain most if not all of my gains off all of my cycles by using clen and clomid every time pct

**Glock-19** · 10-23-2005, 10:58 PM

I just finished my 2nd tren cycle and Ive kept most strength gains and all vascular gains. gl

**macrophage69alpha** · 10-24-2005, 02:21 AM

Originally Posted by SledgeHammer

Bro's, I have done mounds of tren research but can't find the answer to my question. If I PCT correctly will I keep my strength gains I got from Tren?

NO- at least not most of them- which are due to trebolones very strong androgenic stimulus of the CNS.

**Two4the$$** · 10-24-2005, 03:31 AM

The physical changes are easily kept... but people neglect to realize the way AAS works...

Anabolic = Muscle building.
Androgenic = Stronger

You will keep the anabolism... but you CANNOT keep exogenously increased strength. Your strength, from Tren , is caused by the increase in aggression and androgens... you won't have that off cycle... even if you have more muscle.

Heres how it works... the anabolics help you build the muscle ... that youre artificially induced strength (androgens) produce... the androgens always keeping your physical exertion abilities higher than your physical size could normally create ... and the nutrient partitioning enhancements is what aids all this. Anyway, this is why some people can't do much on nandrolones alone - their own Test is shut down, they haven't enough androgens to push hard... so they can't tear enough muscle fibers to produce much anabolism.

Just a thought about the hand-in-hand affects...

**Two4the$$** · 10-26-2005, 02:22 PM

Surprised this didn't warrant a comment...?

***SPIKE*** · 10-26-2005, 02:37 PM

Originally Posted by TrumanHW

The physical changes are easily kept... but people neglect to realize the way AAS works...

Anabolic = Muscle building.
Androgenic = Stronger

You will keep the anabolism... but you CANNOT keep exogenously increased strength. Your strength, from Tren , is caused by the increase in aggression and androgens... you won't have that off cycle... even if you have more muscle.

..

Simple yet very informative..................Nice Truman

**IronReload04** · 10-26-2005, 03:32 PM

Originally Posted by TrumanHW

The physical changes are easily kept... but people neglect to realize the way AAS works...

Anabolic = Muscle building.
Androgenic = Stronger

You will keep the anabolism... but you CANNOT keep exogenously increased strength. Your strength, from Tren , is caused by the increase in aggression and androgens... you won't have that off cycle... even if you have more muscle.

Heres how it works... the anabolics help you build the muscle ... that youre artificially induced strength (androgens) produce... the androgens always keeping your physical exertion abilities higher than your physical size could normally create ... and the nutrient partitioning enhancements is what aids all this. Anyway, this is why some people can't do much on nandrolones alone - their own Test is shut down, they haven't enough androgens to push hard... so they can't tear enough muscle fibers to produce much anabolism.

Just a thought about the hand-in-hand affects...

good chunk of info, i just learned somthing..

Does anyone else agree or disagree?

**Two4the$$** · 10-26-2005, 08:06 PM

I was actually HOPING for someone to disagree ... of course, by supplying what I didn't; studies. :-)

It's a logical presumption I made... but those aren't always accurate, in spite their believability.

**Tren Bull** · 10-26-2005, 08:11 PM

regardless of what steroids you take, when you finish a cycle you will lose some strength and size. that is unavoidable, but tren is one of the best steroids to take as far as making keepable gains. i love tren, but unfortuneately it makes it so i cant sleep much at all. im on it now, and for the last 8 weeks ive gotten about 3-4 hours of sleep every night. its fu_king annoying

**Two4the$$** · 10-27-2005, 01:20 AM

Well, for me, I upped the dose, and my sleep improved ... but now I feel lethargic all day. it's a weird compromise. But ... the stuff is great ... and I'm sure by week 10 I'll know the extent of it.

**stupidhippo** · 10-27-2005, 02:34 AM

to trumans comment on strength: it is well reasoned but IMO u cant apply it like that. Strength and anabolism go more hand in hand IMO. More muscle = more strength BUT stength has more factors in play also. androgens contribute more to the psychological side (and party also increase strength through other mechanisms I suppose) to my knowledge. Im not checking any of this so I might be wrong but this is my reasoning here..

**vitor** · 10-27-2005, 04:09 AM

Originally Posted by TrumanHW

The physical changes are easily kept... but people neglect to realize the way AAS works...

Anabolic = Muscle building.
Androgenic = Stronger

You will keep the anabolism... but you CANNOT keep exogenously increased strength. Your strength, from Tren , is caused by the increase in aggression and androgens... you won't have that off cycle... even if you have more muscle.

Heres how it works... the anabolics help you build the muscle ... that youre artificially induced strength (androgens) produce... the androgens always keeping your physical exertion abilities higher than your physical size could normally create ... and the nutrient partitioning enhancements is what aids all this. Anyway, this is why some people can't do much on nandrolones alone - their own Test is shut down, they haven't enough androgens to push hard... so they can't tear enough muscle fibers to produce much anabolism.

Just a thought about the hand-in-hand affects...

This is very true, I am able to keep most of my muscles from cycles, but not the strenght gains, which make perfect sense with what you said! But some of the muscle gains you make from roids are probaly permenant. Steroid Guru "Bill Roberts" said in an interview; "Ime sure steroid gains are permenant because of more mature muscle cells caused by increased proteinsynteize, which would be a permenant change". About 2-3/4 of the muscle you gain on cycle, not counting water.
But you will get stronger and bigger on a nadrolone-only cycle too. (Remember nadrolone also increase some cemicals in the brain that makes you train harder and more agressive). A gain is a gain, doesnt matter what drugs you use as long as you can restore your natrual test fast enough, to keep it!

**stupidhippo** · 10-27-2005, 04:52 AM

maybe but not any muscle gain in permament so how can steroid gains be??

**IronReload04** · 10-27-2005, 01:45 PM

1. For the guys who say how they loose gains after a cycle, i would like to see what some of their diets are like. I would like to see if they are eating the way they should be, like a 180 pounder or like a superheavyweight. I am willing to bet those guys lose gains for 1 of 2 reasons
a. A guy says, hey i am on steroids now. i am gonna eat like a monster now. then they come off. now they are like, hey, i am not on steroids anymore, so i am gonna go back to eating normallly so i dont get fat. And muscles get eatin alive because the calories and protein are not there to support that expensive (energy terms) mass
b. A guy doesnt change how he eats when on. he gains loads of muscle, and his diet remains the same when he comes off. again, he is in the same scenerio as situatuon a

Not like i have any experience yet, but a good solid theory

and as far as losing "androgenic " induced strength gains, how do you know the strength gains lost are not water strength lost. that would sure explain keeping the muscles but losing some strength

**IronReload04** · 10-27-2005, 01:51 PM

o, and providing the guy is not taking olympia competeror doses

**fred9** · 10-27-2005, 02:49 PM

first few cycles that i took were test,test deca , test dbol etc...everytime i stopped the cycles i lost a lot of strength...
but when i added tren into the stack then the strength after the cycles were very easy to keep..greetz

supersteve · 10-28-2005, 07:01 PM

Originally Posted by TrumanHW

The physical changes are easily kept... but people neglect to realize the way AAS works...

Anabolic = Muscle building.
Androgenic = Stronger

You will keep the anabolism... but you CANNOT keep exogenously increased strength. Your strength, from Tren , is caused by the increase in aggression and androgens... you won't have that off cycle... even if you have more muscle.

Heres how it works... the anabolics help you build the muscle ... that youre artificially induced strength (androgens) produce... the androgens always keeping your physical exertion abilities higher than your physical size could normally create ... and the nutrient partitioning enhancements is what aids all this. Anyway, this is why some people can't do much on nandrolones alone - their own Test is shut down, they haven't enough androgens to push hard... so they can't tear enough muscle fibers to produce much anabolism.

Just a thought about the hand-in-hand affects...

I agree entirely about the strength gains. However, i'm not sure it's as simple as anabolic = muscle building and androgens = strength.
Winny is highly anabolic yet produces no muscle.
There are AR mechanisms of muscle growth.
So anabolic = muscle building. Androgrens = strength and muscle building.

**powerliftmike** · 10-28-2005, 07:11 PM

Anabolic is the building of new muscle. New muscle is more muscle and more muscle can move bigger weights. This can get confusing because there are so many biological factors at play. Size does NOT equal strength of a muscle. Androgens have an effect on the brain which helps the CNS communicate better with the muscle making it stronger.

**powerliftmike** · 10-28-2005, 07:14 PM

Originally Posted by supersteve

I agree entirely about the strength gains. However, i'm not sure it's as simple as anabolic = muscle building and androgens = strength.
Winny is highly anabolic yet produces no muscle.
There are AR mechanisms of muscle growth.
So anabolic = muscle building. Androgrens = strength and muscle building.

Winstrol is not highly anabolic, only moderately. Androgens and anabolics play off each other in the body. It finally all comes down to what steroid molecule you are dealing with and how your body reacts to it.