Forced to stop cycle: Body reacting negatively to gear

**ward065** · 10-22-2005, 02:05 PM

today makes it 10 days into my prop and fina cycle, 150mg eod of prop and 100mg eod of fina.

The fact is over the last 2 shots my body has reacted extremely negatively to the gear. Initially, i thought the pain would be tolerable (with quad shots) but it turns out i was wrong.

I did a delt shot on Tuesday so i could work my legs on wednesday, and it turns out i couldnt work my legs on wednesday, because my arm/ shoulder was all swollen, and i could not balance the bar when doing squats, i had no choice but to stop!

i came back to the gym on thursday to try again, and had a little more success- but my arm was still all nasty, swollen with puss so it hurt a lot

Thursday evening, after my leg workout i did another shot in my quads; friday and today i feel like i belong in a wheelchair.

Additionally, i had to skip 2 workouts due to the swollenness in my shoulders, because it was red and swollen, there was no way i could do my workout since it involved moving my arms!

the point i am trying to make.....and please don't call me a wussy....is that for whatever reason my body is rejecting and acting very negatively to short acting gear. The pain it has been causing has been at times horiffic, and if i can't do my planned workouts because of the pain, what the hell is the point of taking gear???????? It is acting in effect counter productive to my goals

My solution: Take a few weeks off and start a cycle with LONGER ACTING gear. My late spring/ early summer cycle consisted of test-e and deca , shots twice a week and i got excellent results........Not to mention that the pain after the shots was MUCH, MUCH MUCH more tolerable and MUCH less painful than these prop/ fina shots have been lately.

Fortunately, the sides i got from fina were not bad at all. So fortunately in the cycle i will start in 3-4 weeks or so, will include ALL longer acting gear- including tren enanthate , since the sides of the actual tren are not bad for me.

i wanted to let people know- this short acting gear, prop and fina, at least for me and i doubt i am the only one, is much, much more painful than longer acting gear is. And i can't tolerate it any longer, so i am beginning pct immediately (not for too long, since i only took shots over a 9 day period)

oh yeah, and today my leg's killing me so much, i have to wear a heating pad over it to try to limit the incredible pain

**topvega** · 10-22-2005, 02:09 PM

if your arm is swollen with puss.. as u put it.. then it might not be the ester, but rather the sterility of the gear...

**shortie** · 10-22-2005, 02:11 PM

Big bump on that Top-you got puss coming out you got infection, and that doesn't matter what ester is attatched, I would def worry about the cleanliness of my gear IMO. Is this UGL or homebrew?

**ward065** · 10-22-2005, 02:12 PM

no, believe me the gear is sterile.....very trusted lab among the guys who use it

it became inflammed and red.....and i only saw this with the prop, NOT with the enanthate or deca - i did delt shots with enanthate and deca months ago and guess what, it hurt a little after, but it was extremely tolerable.

**ward065** · 10-22-2005, 02:15 PM

Originally Posted by shortie

Big bump on that Top-you got puss coming out you got infection, and that doesn't matter what ester is attatched, I would def worry about the cleanliness of my gear IMO. Is this UGL or homebrew?

it is a lab, not homebrew

also, the arm is much, much better today than it was a few days ago- but it is still not totally back to normal

if you have read Big Cat's steroid profiles on bodybuilding.com, he mentions that some people using Prop have got the exact same symptons i have gotten- swollenness, itchiness when touched, redness, etc. So this is why i tend to think it is the prop itself

**topvega** · 10-22-2005, 02:19 PM

ok... but no puss. that's where u had me worried.. i shot 1.5 cc's in my tri and had the same thing happen. red, swollen, and painfull... u might be right and just are 1 of those guys that have a severe reaction to prop... or then again it cld get better after a couple shots in the same muscle... i know now i never have soreness after shooting, but it wasn't like that in the begining...

**shortie** · 10-22-2005, 02:21 PM

Swollen red, this can be from prop absolutely, but Puss is indicative of infection.

**Pinnacle** · 10-22-2005, 02:24 PM

It's the prop crashing in your muscle.Not the BA.This is quite common,and the cause of most soreness/inflammation associated with Prop.

~Pinnacle~

**ward065** · 10-22-2005, 02:25 PM

Originally Posted by topvega

ok... but no puss. that's where u had me worried.. i shot 1.5 cc's in my tri and had the same thing happen. red, swollen, and painfull... u might be right and just are 1 of those guys that have a severe reaction to prop... or then again it cld get better after a couple shots in the same muscle... i know now i never have soreness after shooting, but it wasn't like that in the begining...

perhaps i should try to clarify:

Wednesday evening and thursday had the most pain.

Wednesday i noticed that my delt, and down to the upper part of my bicep, was red and swollen quite a bit.

About halfway down my bicep the swollenness and redness stopped.

Additionally, when i felt the skin below my delt, my tissue felt harder than normal. i dont know if it was puss or not though (there was nothing leaking, but why was my arm hard like that? that is why i think maybe puss was under the skin, maybe not). But the area form my medial delt to the upper part of my bicep, had harder skin, redness, soreness when touched, and it was also extremely painful to extend my arm.

**shortie** · 10-22-2005, 02:27 PM

Yeah, I would def quit the cycle, I no like that much pain, plus no point if you can't work out, hope your next cycle goes better.

**shortie** · 10-22-2005, 02:28 PM

Originally Posted by Pinnacle

It's the prop crashing in your muscle.Not the BA.This is quite common,and the cause of most soreness/inflammation associated with Prop.

~Pinnacle~

Is there anything we can do to alleviate this? And is it less common with fresh prop then?

**ward065** · 10-22-2005, 02:30 PM

Originally Posted by Pinnacle

It's the prop crashing in your muscle.Not the BA.This is quite common,and the cause of most soreness/inflammation associated with Prop.

~Pinnacle~

then why is enanthat SO MUCH less painful?

The advantages for enanthate seem to be a) two shots a week only (vs 4), b) less pain after injection (which makes it much easier to have great workouts)

the only real dis-advantage is you have to wiat 3 weeks for it to kick in, versus 3-4 days for prop. But i am beginning to think this is a good tradeoff

**shortie** · 10-22-2005, 02:32 PM

Come on Pinn I see you in here type faster damnit-LOL

**ward065** · 10-22-2005, 02:33 PM

another reason i think that the gear is probably sterile: the delt shot i did was the only one i have ever done with prop. Secondly, the quad shot which gave me incredible pain, was done the evening after a very hard-core leg workout. I did several quad shots with the prop The pain here was also quite a bit more than enthate gave me though

Last cycle, i was able to shoot enanthate and deca in my quads right after a leg workout, and don't get me wrong it hurt, but still it was nothing like this, doing it after a leg workout...

**Pinnacle** · 10-22-2005, 02:36 PM

Originally Posted by shortie

Is there anything we can do to alleviate this? And is it less common with fresh prop then?

The best one can do is find a lab that has a high ratio of BB in their Prop.The lower the BB ratio,it's seems that's when ppl get these type problems.I know this from first hand experience,since I make my own gear.I've made prop at 2%BA/10% BB and most would say WOW,that won't hurt becasue of the low BA content.Quite the opposite.That gear crashed in my muscles and was useless.I had swelling and soreness(fever at times).I chucked it.I made 2% BA/15 % BB,it was better.At 2% BA/20 % BB it is totally painless and a joy to shoot.Friends at my gym have tried my stuff when they ran short on their gear and needed some quick.All can't believe the difference.

~Pinnacle~

**shortie** · 10-22-2005, 02:38 PM

Ok, my ignorance is showing BB? I know I know this but it's not coming to me.

**Pinnacle** · 10-22-2005, 02:39 PM

Originally Posted by shortie

Ok, my ignorance is showing BB? I know I know this but it's not coming to me.

Benzyl Benzoate

**ward065** · 10-22-2005, 02:40 PM

Originally Posted by Pinnacle

The best one can do is find a lab that has a high ratio of BB in their Prop.The lower the BB ratio,it's seems that's when ppl get these type problems.I know this from first hand experience,since I make my own gear.I've made prop at 2%BA/10% BB and most would say WOW,that won't hurt becasue of the low BA content.Quite the opposite.That gear crashed in my muscles and was useless.I had swelling and soreness(fever at times).I chucked it.I made 2% BA/15 % BB,it was better.At 2% BA/20 % BB it is totally painless and a joy to shoot.Friends at my gym have tried my stuff when they ran short on their gear and needed some quick.All can't believe the difference.

~Pinnacle~

pinnacle, the lab i use has BB alchohol, NOT BA alchohol in their gear

**Pinnacle** · 10-22-2005, 02:43 PM

Originally Posted by ward065

pinnacle, the lab i use has BB alchohol, NOT BA alchohol in their gear

It has Benzyl Alcohol AND Benzyl Benzoate or it wouldn't hold.trust me!

**ward065** · 10-22-2005, 02:50 PM

pinnacle...sent you a pm

**ward065** · 10-22-2005, 03:05 PM

one more question......if i decide to do a cycle with longer acting gear (t-enanthate and tren -enanthate) are there any other disadvantages that i could see over short acting gear, besides having to wait 3-4 weeks for the gear to kick in?

is 500mg/ 3ccs of test -e the same as 500mg/ 5 ccs of prop?

**mranak** · 10-22-2005, 03:08 PM

Originally Posted by ward065

one more question......if i decide to do a cycle with longer acting gear (t-enanthate and tren-enanthate) are there any other disadvantages that i could see over short acting gear, besides having to wait 3-4 weeks for the gear to kick in?

Not really. Many of us are big fans of long-ester testosterone .

**mranak** · 10-22-2005, 03:09 PM

Originally Posted by ward065

Originally Posted by Pinnacle

It's the prop crashing in your muscle.Not the BA.This is quite common,and the cause of most soreness/inflammation associated with Prop.

then why is enanthat SO MUCH less painful?

It is a different molecule. Doesn't crystalize like testosterone propionate .

**topvega** · 10-22-2005, 03:10 PM

Originally Posted by ward065

one more question......if i decide to do a cycle with longer acting gear (t-enanthate and tren -enanthate) are there any other disadvantages that i could see over short acting gear, besides having to wait 3-4 weeks for the gear to kick in?

is 500mg/ 3ccs of test -e the same as 500mg/ 5 ccs of prop?

no... as long as u already know how u are going to react to tren, then tren e wld be just as good...

**ward065** · 10-22-2005, 03:14 PM

Originally Posted by topvega

no... as long as u already know how u are going to react to tren, then tren e wld be just as good...

Thanks.....Well that is good because the only sides i have gotten with trenA are night sweats, an increase (but tolerable amount) in aggressiveness. Thank God it hasn't effected my sleep patterns, or i'd have to trash it.

**Z-Ro** · 10-22-2005, 04:54 PM

Hey man I feel you I've had the same problem in the past with Prop. The first time I used Prop it was some very bad pain. Keep in mind this was a UG Test Prop. I would inject the Prop and seriously a few hours later I would start to feel very tired and sickly. This happened the very first shot I took and continued untill I stopped. Well EVERY SINGLE site I had injected at became very very swore, red, hot but no pussing or anything. Needlesstosay I decided that something was wrong and quit. Next time I used HG Prop and had no problems it was pain free my friend, so this makes me think there is something wrong with your gear. This is why I prefer HG things and for other things that aren't HG I get from a very reputable source (not implying yours is not) If its keeping you from working out I would suggest stop and get well and get some HG Prop !

**Z-Ro** · 10-22-2005, 04:57 PM

I also expereience intense pain as you mentioned. I know a lot of guys tell you to tough it out on Prop but I did the same thing as you in that it was effecting my work outs. I did my quads and my quads hurt for just about a week after each shot very painful I was actually limping and people would look at me like funny and even my friend was asking me what I had done to myself.

**ward065** · 10-22-2005, 04:57 PM

my prop IS human grade......

and regarding the puss, i am thinking now i didnt have any, nothing was leaking out of my skin. Basically the skin as i said was harder than average, the skin was thick, red, and swollen and painful to extend arm

**ward065** · 10-22-2005, 05:00 PM

Originally Posted by Z-Ro

I also expereience intense pain as you mentioned. I know a lot of guys tell you to tough it out on Prop but I did the same thing as you in that it was effecting my work outs. I did my quads and my quads hurt for just about a week after each shot very painful I was actually limping and people would look at me like funny and even my friend was asking me what I had done to myself.

oh yeah, when i went to train my legs the other day, my arm was all swollen and red...i wore a tank top gym shirt and this was not a good idea, i think people could tell i was injecting myself or something based on their look. Then there was this one guy who told me to be careful with steroids and i told him i didnt know what he was talking about

i also was curious and checked the temperature of both arms in the same area and fortunately both were the same- this probably means there is no infection, so it wasn't unsterile gear.

**Darkness** · 10-23-2005, 11:57 AM

Sorry to hear that bro, I ordered some prop from the same source you did because I got some fake drol from some other source and I need to get the jump going. So, your prop has a problem mine will too. I'll let you know. You could go with his enanthate . Very smooth, if you get pain its only in the 1st or 2nd shots, then its all good.

Later.

PS if you still have puss, you should take some antibiotic or something to help that infection cause it could get serious.

**Darkness** · 10-30-2005, 10:00 AM

Hey bro, I've shot this guy's prop 3 times already and no pain, not getting swolen or anything. Its the same prop as yours so I dont know what could've happened. As a matter of fact this prop is the best I've found. Very nice, with prop like this I dont think I'll ever do enanthate again. Maybe you got an infection from something else and not the prop.

Later

**SCMedic** · 10-30-2005, 10:21 AM

Hey Ward.. got a couple questions, that I'd like to keep off the board, and my PM's aren't working..Could you email me @ [email protected]. Thanks!

**zircon** · 10-30-2005, 11:47 PM

well I had BD prop, the first vial didnt hurt at all, the second one I couldn't walk!!!

THey change the BB ratio, that's all. Funny thing is afetr a ocuple of weeks of sheer hell, my right glute got used to it. Left one was still sore but ok.

Just go with enan, if u use tren enan with it use tren ace as fronload the first 2-3 weeks, shoold be fine.

and send me your prop lol