L'il help...

**Nathan** · 05-10-2002, 09:40 AM

I'll spare you all the details but I'm looking for natural depression remedies - or mood stabilizers if that makes sense. Basically, I'm just wondering if anyone has had any positive and DRAMATIC experiences with such things.
Somebody is going to suggest inositol I'm sure so please also specify doses.

**A_Nice** · 05-10-2002, 09:43 AM

My friend swears by ST Johns Wart (SP).. I heard it doesnt do anything but oh well. Any reason it has to be natural? Some good drugs out there...

**Tankass** · 05-10-2002, 09:49 AM

In all honesty depression is not somthing you should take lightly. I would suggest seeing a doc. My depression started when I was 12 or so and now I am 19 and have been on medication for 2 years. I feel like a new person. I am not edgy, I can focus on work much better and I am no longer feeling suicidial. It started out as a little thing and progressed up to that. It was to the point where I would wakeup and make myslf think of a reason to live. If you want some script drug names let me know Ill let you know everything that I have expierieced on certain drugs. I hope you ger through this bro. We are here for you.

**Nathan** · 05-10-2002, 10:10 AM

Okay, I suppose I will to provide a little more background. My depression started when I was pretty young. My mom noticed that I never left the basement and so took me to the doc. I was diagnosed with OCD, and bi-polar disorder, as well as other anxiety related problems. Anyway, I did try several meds, like paxil, zoloft, I can't remember the others. They made matters worse in one way or another. After a drawn-out suicide attempt (I stopped eating for like a month and lost like 50lbs.), I was almost hospitalized but convincd the doc to not take those steps. Anyway, the past few years I've been quite depressed, with shit like extremely anti-social behavior, more suicidal feelinds, etc. It has recently become extremely bad again and I'm trying not to do anything stupid but, well, you know. Anyway, I have some names of some docs that I will be contacting next week - I promised my mom I would (she catches on to me pretty quick with this stuff). I'll see what they have to say but I thought I'd explore some otehr options instead of actually doing my job. So there's me coming clean. Thanks for replies.

**xplicit** · 05-10-2002, 10:13 AM

I dont belive in cure all pills or anything of that nature to treat depression. The only way u can really beat is if to stop thinking negativly and find some postive things in your life, stay away from msieable negative people and surrond your self around funny happy people it rubs off on ya. Belive me chances are if u find pills thell work cause ull belive thell work or if they dont work its casue u really felt they wont work. Its all in your head but build a strong belief that u will get better and set a goal to elimate as much negative factors in ur life and concerntate on what makes u happy. If ur depressed about ur job quit find something new, everyone wants something everyone desires somethign no matter how depressed u are so figure out what u want that will make u happy and ull be better. You could start by changing ur avator that thing makes me depressed lookin at it, tell ur self every morning that today is gonan be a good day and htink of some of the fun things u can enjoy, when i get depressed i constantly tell my self that it isnt so bad and i try to reinforce postive mesages in my head. i know im rambling and goin all over the palce wit this but my point is dont worry so much about pills this is a society where we feel if there is a probelm we can just swollow a pill and it will go away it wont YOUR the one who will maeks this problem go away and by doing that u have to elimate negative thigns in ur life and re assure ur self of the postive and figure out what makes u happy and ulll feel better.
Name one thing that makes you happy?

**Nathan** · 05-10-2002, 10:37 AM

Prozac didn't do shit for me either except make me gain weight.

xplicit - I appreciate the reply, but, and I hope I'm not assuming too much, that is the type of answer that leads one to believe that you have never experienced a very serious depression. IT doesn't work like that unfortunately. I ahve a chemical imbalance. I don't have the "happy" hormones that most other people do and that is why medication is probably necessary. IT's like chicks trying to get hugs - without the right hormones it ain't gonna happen. It sucks. I wake up and everything I wanted to do is gone. There is just nothing but loneliness and sadness in my head. It's actually painful. IT's hard to describe. It was hard growing up trying to explain your mental problems to other people who have no experience with them. They just kind of figure you can "think" your way out of it, and sometimes that is true. But you have to try and recognize when you're in a tailspin like that I guess. You know when you're screwed. Man, when you start to spend most of your time thinking about dying and how nice that might be you know shit isn't good. The whole natural thing was a long shot but whatever. I do know better.

**Nathan** · 05-10-2002, 10:44 AM

Originally posted by sk*
I know how you feel.

How long have you been on the Prozac? IF it's been a while go back to your doc and tell him. Supposedly, not every med works equally well for everybody since everyone's brain chemistry is different. Man alive, I feel for you.

**Tankass** · 05-10-2002, 10:52 AM

I have been on Zoloft, Prozac, Paxil and I am currently on Celexa. I have no sides with this. Zoloft gave me the shits... Prozac made my junk not function to well an Paxil well just not a fan... Shoot me a PM..

**Iwan2bsolid2** · 05-10-2002, 11:03 AM

I've taken Zoloft as well, didn't do shit but make me break out a little. My dad's bi -polar, I'll talk to him and find out what his doctors prescribe him. He used to be out of hand, he would go into these "episode's" where he thought he was Desperado, and Jesus, he shaved his eyebrows off once because he felt like they were catapilars, anyways crazy stories, but I'll find that out for you and in the mean time take care, I feel ya brother. Just think of this, life is precious, we get down about alot of stupid things, like the flab on our love handles, but there are many people out there that have more tradgic things to deal with, we take our life for granted sometimes when we loose track of reality, and forget how much we have to be thankfull for. My buddy was murdered last Sunday-23 years old! Fucking unbelievable, nightmare I tell you. Just got back from the funeral, went to the gym yesterday and found out that another buddy OD'ed, on GHB and left a 5 page suicide letter. 2 Friends gone in 2 weeks. Life is precious people, just try to remember to be thankfull for your health.

**ragin'** · 05-10-2002, 11:09 AM

damn, nathan.. i had no idea. i have no idea what you're going through, man. i used to date a girl that was diagnosed w/ some kind of depression and she was like an emotional roller-coaster.. so i could only imagine. hang in there until you talk to your docs next week.. they'll help you. stay on the boards... try to do something that you enjoy in the meantime. have you been in the gym at all?... how's that going? PM me if you need to talk, dude... otherwise... be safe and hang on.

peace,
ragin'

**Nathan** · 05-10-2002, 11:11 AM

Originally posted by Iwan2bsolid2
My buddy was murdered last Sunday-23 years old! Fucking unbelievable, nightmare I tell you. Just got back from the funeral, went to the gym yesterday and found out that another buddy OD'ed, on GHB and left a 5 page suicide letter. 2 Friends gone in 2 weeks. Life is precious people, just try to remember to be thankfull for your health.

Sorry for your loses. This is not a happy thread. Maybe I shouldn't have started it in the first place.

Tankass, if that is your real name, you should have mail in a sec.

**ragin'** · 05-10-2002, 11:15 AM

Iwan2besolid2, bro... so sorry to hear that. I know that's something you're going to have to deal w/ for a long time. i've had friends die before but never murdered. handle it the best way you know how, man... use your friends.

**JRob** · 05-10-2002, 11:19 AM

I too have suffered from depression after my first attempt I was hospitalized adn forced on to paxil. It made matters worse so I stopped taking it and three years later I made another attempt and now have a reminder on my wrist forever. It is about 1 1/2 years later now and I am a new person, with a completely different outlook on life. I didn't find it in a pill, I found a therapist that I actually connected with. I have been to many but once you find someone that you can really connect with that is outside of your life(meaning friends are good but at this stage you need unbiased opinions) it can make all the difference. I now many don't like going to them but the outlook on them is become more and more the norm. Good Luck.

**DiMensionX** · 05-10-2002, 11:39 AM

Hey bud, you are 100% correct that depression is a chemical imbalance and there sometimes is no way to just "snap out of it". Takes a lot to ask for help, that is step number one regardless.

I don't know how much your familiar with brain chemicals that have to do with mood stabalization but there are two primary ones. The first being Seratonin and the second being Dopamine.

Most Dr.'s start by working with Seratonin to see if results are found. Low seratonin levels are certainly involved with depression in a lot of cases. This can be caused by a number of things. Diet, drug use, or just simply genetics. Drugs that are called SSRI's (Seratonin Reuptake Inhibitor's) are what have generally been prescribed to help treat this problem. You see, the brain will release Seratonin into the brain and then actually reabsorb it based on your needs, in this way it regulates the saturation level of Seratonin. Alot of depression cases have low Seratonin levels so Dr's will prescribe an SSRI which delays the reuptake of Seratonin and increases your plasma level of it in your brain. This works for a good number of people.

Drugs that Dr's prescribe for this condition include the following. Paxil, Zoloft, Celexa, and many others. From a home remedy standpoint you could try to supplement with 5-HTP which can be bought at your supplement shop. 5-HTP is a Seratonin precursor and can increase your plasma concentrations. You need to be careful NEVER to supplement with 5-HTP while using an SSRI, EVER. It can cause Seratonin syndrome which can be VERY VERY bad. Just NEVER mix two Anti-D type meds without your Dr's knowledge.

Dopamine is dealt with by different drugs. Welbutrin and Zyban are selective dopamine reuptake inhibitor and work by increasing your dopamine levels. Some people respond better to this than an SSRI as there dopamine is slightly out of wack. You can get DLPA or L-Tryptophan to increase these levels on your own. Word of warning about DLPA, considering that deprenyl is a selective, yet irreversible MAO-B inhibitor at dosages above 10mg's a day it should be used with caution until it is know that it is helping.

I wrote this information just for a little knowledge sharing. I would really talk to the Dr about this as your Seratonin/Dopamine system is not somthing to be played with. You can quite easily make matters worse than they are. Also, no matter what NEVER mix MAOI's and SSRI's, it can kill you. If you are bound to try something give 5-htp a shot for a couple of weeks and see how that helps.

One thing, if you use MDMA then you need to stop. It is contributing to this problem. If your taking Anti-D's, especially MAOI's and take MDMA it can kill you very quickly. If I had to guess I would think you had rolled a few times without protecting your Seratonin system and that has helped define this problem. No offence meant, it is quite common these days and if this is the case then 5-htp, no more rolling, and possibly an SSRI would help to restore you chemical balance.

DMX

**xplicit** · 05-10-2002, 11:46 AM

Nate if you really want to feel better and be happy chemical imbalance or none you can make it happen. I honestly feel if anyone wants something badly enough you will obtain it. There has to be hundreds of thousands of people who are diagnosed with types of depression and you mean to tell me not one of them has ever over come it ?? Why dont u do a search on the web trying to find out about hte people who over come this probelm and see how they did it and maybe u can apply some of those techniques to your sitution. Your right i never had a seriuos depression probelm but i have been in depression at periods of times and though of suicide who hasnt ? Do you like to do anything ? What makes you happy? You play sports i find when i play sports nothign crosses my mind except for whats goin on the game its good casue it makes me forget about my probelms for a while. You got to start small and try to enjoy things and when a negative though pops up in ur head battle it and try as hard as u can to find positive things about it. Im not a doctor and i really want to help ya out if ur lookin for help thats a big plus in that u want to feel better and there are ways besides pills. I highy recoomed lookin up some one who has a simialr probelm that u have and see hwo they are dealing with it.

**Nathan** · 05-10-2002, 01:37 PM

Um, thanks you everyone for you kind responses.

DiMensionX - that was some great info and thank you very much for it. MDMA has nothing to do with this problem I don't think. I've only done it a couple of times a few years ago, and this was a serious problem long before then. Thanks very much.

JRob - Glad you feel better. I also have some ridiculous scars that are more embarrassing than anything else.

xplicit - Brother, I completely understand what you are saying. I'll use an analogy here. Depression for me is a lot like a blanket. When it's just a regular blanket you get your shit together and crawl out, back into the light so to speak. However, when that blanket is miles and miles long, crawling out is easier said than done. And no, you can't cut your way out - the damn blanket is made of kevlar, okay?
I'm trying man, believe me.

**xplicit** · 05-10-2002, 02:46 PM

I know ur trying bro and i really wish i can help you out. Im going to a birthday party for my aunt now and i got class tomm but when i get around to it im gonna search my ass off for people who have over come your problem im sure there are people like u out there who are in a simialr siutation as you and are doing well now. Do you know the medical term of the depression that you have ?/? Give me something to work with im sure i can find something.

**Canes4Ever** · 05-10-2002, 04:31 PM

Originally posted by Nathan
I'll spare you all the details but I'm looking for natural depression remedies - or mood stabilizers if that makes sense. Basically, I'm just wondering if anyone has had any positive and DRAMATIC experiences with such things.
Somebody is going to suggest inositol I'm sure so please also specify doses.

Nathan, If you need someone to talk to, I am always here for you. Bro nothing is worse than feeling depressed, especially when you don't know why. I have a panic-disorder that stems from depression I am told, and I take Paxil fro that.

I have friends with panic that swear by St. Johns Wort. Maybe you should look into that.

Again, Nathan if you need to talk PM me anytime, I will be there for you.

**Nathan** · 05-13-2002, 08:15 AM

Thanks guys.

**Tankass** · 05-13-2002, 08:21 AM

If you need any more info I can talk to my doc for you. Let me know. Your avatar shows how I felt before I got medication. Life is much better now.

**ripped_82** · 05-13-2002, 09:57 AM

Well bro i am currently in first year of homeopathic school, abd let me tell you that there are natural remedies that help with depression.

Kava Kava is an excellent herbal remedie, however after taking it for one month I would suggest 3weeks off since at high dosages can damage the liver, but with a little time off the liver hea;s itself.

A nonalcoholic drink made from the root of kava played an important role in social ceremonies in some Pacific islands, including welcoming visiting royalty and at meetings of village elders. Kava was valued both for its mellowing effects and to encourage socializing. It was also noted for initiating a state of contentment, a greater sense of well-being, and enhanced mental acuity, memory, and sensory perception. Kava has also been used traditionally by healers in the Pacific islands to treat pain

The kava-lactones, sometimes referred to as kava-pyrones, are the most important active constituents in kava extracts. High-quality kava rhizome contains 5.5–8.3% kava-lactones.1 Medicinal extracts used in Europe contain 30–70% kava-lactones. Kava-lactones are thought to have anti-anxiety, mild analgesic (pain-relieving), muscle-relaxing, and anticonvulsant effects.2 3 Some researchers speculate that kava may directly influence the limbic system, the ancient part of the brain associated with emotions and other brain activities.4 Kava is a unique anti-anxiety alternative because it does not seem to impair reaction time or alertness when used in the amounts recommended below.5

Kava has been extensively studied as a treatment for anxiety.6 The amount often used in clinical trials is 100 mg of an extract (standardized to 70% kava-lactones) three times per day. Double-blind trials, including one that lasted six months, have shown that kava effectively reduces symptoms of anxiety in people with mild to moderate anxiety.7 8 One trial found that kava also reduced symptoms of anxiety in menopausal women.9 One trial found kava to be just as effective as benzodiazepines (a common class of drugs prescribed for anxiety) in treating mild anxiety over the course of six weeks.

It should not be taken together with other substances that also act on the central nervous system, such as alcohol, barbiturates, antidepressants, and anti-psychotic drugs

In ancient Greece, St. John’s wort was used to treat many ailments, including sciatica and poisonous reptile bites. In Europe, St. John’s wort was used by herbalists for the topical treatment of wounds and burns. It is also a folk remedy for kidney and lung ailments as well as for depression.
The major constituents in St. John’s wort include hypericin and other dianthrones, flavonoids, xanthones, and hyperforin.1 While it was previously thought the antidepressant actions of St. John’s wort were due to hypericin and the inhibition of the enzyme monoamine oxidase,2 current research has challenged this belief, focusing on other constituents, such as hyperforin, and flavonoids.3 4 5 Test tube studies suggest that St. John’s wort extracts may exert their antidepressant actions by inhibiting the reuptake of the neurotransmitters serotonin, norepinephrine, and dopamine.6 This action is possibly due to the constituent hyperforin.7 St. John’s wort is able to act as an antidepressant, by making more of these neurotransmitters available to the brain.

St. John’s wort has a low incidence of side effects compared to prescription antidepressants. An adverse events profile of St. John’s wort found that, of 14 controlled clinical trials, seven reported no adverse reactions, two had no information, and five reported a total of seven mild reactions.11 Adverse effects reported included stomach upset, fatigue, itching, sleep disturbance, and skin rash. The rate of adverse reactions was always similar to that of the placebo. Additionally, in seven trials comparing St. John’s wort with other antidepressants, the adverse reaction rate for St. John’s wort was consistently lower than that of the antidepressant drugs with which it was compared.

St. John’s wort can make the skin more sensitive to sunlight.12 Therefore, fair-skinned people should be alert for any rashes or burns following exposure to the sun. Three cases of severe blistering and burns were reported in people taking St. John’s wort internally or applying it topically and then being exposed to sunlight.13 There is a case report of a woman experiencing neuropathy (nerve injury and pain) in sun-exposed skin areas after taking 500 mg of whole St. John’s wort for four weeks.14 Although St. John’s wort has photosensitizing properties, the severity of this reaction is not typical for people taking the herb.

People with a history of manic-depressive illness (bipolar disorder) or a less severe condition known as hypomania, should avoid use of St. John’s wort as it may trigger a manic episode

Do not use when on:
Cyclosporine (Reduced drug absorption/bioavailability *)

Digoxin (Reduced drug absorption/bioavailability *)

Fluoxetine (Adverse interaction)

Fluvoxamine (Adverse interaction *)

Indinavir (Reduced drug absorption/bioavailability)

Nefazodone (Adverse interaction *)

Oral Contraceptives (Adverse interaction *)

Paroxetine (Adverse interaction *)

Phenelzine (Adverse interaction *)

Sertraline (Adverse interaction *)

Trazodone (Adverse interaction *)

Tricyclic Antidepressants (Adverse interaction *)

Venlafaxine (Adverse interaction *)

Warfarin (Reduced drug absorption/bioavailability *)

**Nathan** · 05-13-2002, 12:25 PM

Thanks for th info ripped_82. Good read. It sounds like the St. John's Wort is out for me though from the statement about adverse effects on people with bi-polar disorder. The kava kava sounds interesting though. Thanks again.