little bit of help on growth hormones

[ZTEM]

Wuts up guys...


Im currently off cycle and will be for another week or so....then im going to hit an 8 week cycle which is going to consist of test@500mg a week and EQ @200mg a week.....At the end of the cycle ill probably weigh about 195....then ill be off for 8 weeks and then going to boot camp.....so in approximately 20 weeks after im off I want to start a cycle....sometime around november or so.....Ill probably weigh about 175lbs but pretty damn cut....Im 5'8"

The thing is I want to take growth hormones after im back and Im not sure on the dosage I should take, the length and what an average price will be in the NY/NJ area....


I know theres alot of possibilities on wut my weight will be and shit in here but im using estimates as wut ive experienced and some of my friends have done when doing the same shit.....Just let me know wut i should use if i were 175lbs cut and 5'8"

thanks alot guys

[ZTEM]

bump

[ZTEM]

bump

[jeffylyte]

i assume that you are talking hgh. i wouldnt worry about. its not very good for muscle growth and for leaning up T3 is much better. its also ridiculously expensive.

if you are talking something else, let me know...i hope not IGF or mIGF. I wouldnt touch that stuff with a ten foot pole.

[Anabolism]

Growth Hormone Manual
It was originally posted on AF by Death on the field.
this is an article on GH i have been working on, it takes all the advice from the top vets on GH and has been thoroughly checked and also provides citings so u can look at the info and studies urself if u want. this was made to benefit all who are looking into starting GH or need basic info on it. i am not trying to take credit for it since most of the ideas in here are either common knowledge or by MOD or Ironmaster, this is only till ironmaster can get a book out with all his info on it. If anyone has anything ot add to it please do so, its only to help out hte iron brotherhood, enjoy, and merry xmas
Growth Hormone

Rating: (1 being the lowest, 5 being the highest)
Strength-4
Weight Gain-4
Fat Loss-4
Side Effects-2
Keep Gains--4

Side Effects:
Hypoglycemia- due to lowered insulin levels.
Aromeglia- (abnormal bone growth) GH does not cause it, but if you are predisposed to it, it will speed it up.
GH gut- if predisposed and taking large doses of GH
Carpel Tunnel Syndrome
Soreness in Joints

Benefits of GH:
New Muscle Cells
Mood Enhancement
Smoothing and improving the skin
Leanness, it is a potent fat burner
Joint and ligament strengthening

Where to Inject, How, and How to Make:
You can site inject anywhere you can reach the subcutaneous layer. Pinch the flesh and pull back, then insert the needle in the "pocket" underneath. Doesn't absorb quick enough if you inject into the adipose tissue. Do not inject intra-muscular, though it can be done, it is not recommended. GH is a site injection, where it is shot is where it will burn the most noticeable fat. Most people do it in the stomach since that is a typical sub q shot with most of the fat being in that area. GH should be kept in a fridge; freezing will destroy the GH. On your kit it probably says to use the kit in 18-24 hours, remember these are for AIDS patients, not bodybuilders or athletes. Mixing the GH can either be done with sterile water or bacteriostic water. The kit with water will be fine for 3 days in the fridge, even with the sterile water, but you should not take this chance, rather you should use bacteriostic water and play it safe. This will keep it fine for a couple of weeks. When mixing the GH, let the water slide down the side as to not pulverize the GH wafer. Do not spray it directly against the wafer with any force. Before reconstitution and even after GH is fragile!!! Also once the water is injected into the bottle gently swirl the vial to reconstitute, do not shake or swirl violently!!!!

Conversions:
1 ml = 1 cc -/+
100 units per 1 cc

6 mg = 18iu

1 ml = 18iu

.50 ml = 9iu

.25 ml = 4.5iu

Some people choose to only do it in cc’s but here is how you can do it in units on a slin dart

5.5 = 1iu, so 2iu = 11 on a slin dart

Differences Between Kits:
The main difference between kits is how many iu’s they make when reconstituted. For example, Serostim re-constitutes to make 126iu, while a Saizen kit.... also made by Serono.... makes up 15iu. Another of their kits makes 54iu. It better be way cheaper than a Serostim kit! Humatrope is fine, but costs too much. The other main concern would be fakes; Lilly is the most often faked one. Some older GH kits do not have holograms on them and are legit, but they are usually only less than 100 dollars than new GH kits with holograms, and I would rather be assured of the hologram and legitimacy of the kit. Best buy currently is Serostim 126 iu kits. These are made for people with wasting diseases like AIDs. Many of these patients got infected because they are IV drug addicts..........they sell the Serostim on the street for drug money.


Dose:

4 to 6 iu ed is sufficient. Most people take it 5 days on 2 days off at their designated dosage. There is no reason or evidence why you cannot stay on for various lengths of time; there is no need to go 5 on 2 off other than cost. Considering that our natural production is only .5 to 1.5iu a day, this is still a huge bump for the body. Research has shown that the body's natural defense systems render mega doses of GH ineffective, anyway. GH does not cause gains in mass...it allows you to put on a great deal of lean mass in combination with proper steroid and insulin use. The user before taking must know this. One or two kits are not enough, you need at least 3 to make you happy, GH takes a while to make its effects, but remember they are long lasting, what you see is what you keep. It takes 6 to 8 weeks to notice a dramatic change in body comp using GH on an ED or 5/2 split. Lighter doses for long periods of time are better than large doses for short cycles. Like any other drug, the more you take the more the benefits, but likewise also more risks. 4-6 iu is a standard dose but many people take more, the most repulsing side effects happen at or beyond 12 iu a day but like anything else it depends on your predisposition for it.


How to Stack:
GH is best taken in conjunction with insulin, anabolic steroids, and t3. Insulin is extremely effective with GH, as anyone here who has tried it will testify. This is because GH injections cause a down regulation of insulin sensitivity in the body.
GH alone causes little growth of lean mass, however, when combined with insulin and steroids (and IGF-1 if you can find it), the results can be down right remarkable...esp. in the older bodybuilder. Start light with the humulin...5iu...and work up 1 iu a day till you get use to it. 7 to 10iu in the AM and 7 to 10 iu in the late afternoon, with split doses of GH is your best bet. When splitting GH/insulin doses, I use mid-morning and late afternoon after lifting.... both flat times in our natural GH production. The insulin overcomes the insulin-resistance caused by exogenous GH supplementation. If you are scared to take insulin thought, then Gh with Test and Glucophage is good. GH is good for cutting if used alone. Glucophage allows for improved glucose and amino acid absorption by the muscle tissue and does it safely. This is what you want. The half-life of GH is only 2 hours so spread it out. Avoid bedtime injections since we produce the bulk of our own GH in the first two hours of sleep. Since exogenous GH suppresses this, you should not take it before bed. For best results, use a 17aa oral during the cycle to stimulate the release of natural insulin growth factors. I would run the test throughout. GH/insulin/test is the proven synergistic combination.
It is also wise to preload with testosterone before starting GH if you are going to do it. You should preload with the amount of time it takes for that testosterone to kick in, since most of us take longer acting esters for testosterone you should usually start taking the test 2 weeks before GH use. Likewise, you can accommodate it to fit your needs; the key is for the test to be kicking in the same time you are starting to run your GH. You can cycle you steroids however you want to depending on your goals, if you are going for a more massive look than you would run insulin for most of the cycle and use high androgens, but if you are looking for additional leanness at the end of a cycle you should stop the androgens and run a higher dose of GH or run less androgens. T3 is also another substance that should be used during GH cycling since GH lowers thyroid hormones. T3 should be used for shorter periods though, because it can permanently alter the endocrine system. The magic of GH for men is the ability to gain mass without fat or bloating when stacked properly with insulin, and steroids. GH also makes for amazing improvements in skin...smoothes wrinkles, burns stubborn spots of adipose tissue, gives that paper-thin contest look...and also gives one a real mood lift, a feeling of well being.

Major Difference Between GH and Steroids:
Steroids can increase the size of your muscle cells, but cannot I repeat CAN NOT increase the number of muscle cells in your body, which to start with is governed by your genetics. However Growth hormone CAN increase the number of muscle cells in your body, which goes beyond genetics.

Half-Life of GH:
Exogenous (injected) GH has a "half-life" of approximately 2 hours . . . a 4-hour period of activity during which there is a suppression of naturally produced GH.

GH Naturally Produced:
We release the most of our naturally produced GH during the first two hours of deep sleep...you may take a little time to adjust.... your body thinks you should be in bed when that big influx hits. It is good to take a nap, that’s when you grow anyway. It always helps to take naps after workouts and injections everyday.

GH Causing Acromeglia:
Acromeglia is a disease...you either have it or you don't. Supplementing GH will not cause it. Persons suffering from acromeglia, like Andre the Giant, lack the natural defense mechanisms of the body to regulate the production and effects of GH secretion in he pituitary. It is well established in the medical literature that exogenous GH will not cause the disease.... of course it would worsen the condition in those who had it.
GH Gut: Myth or Reality?:

Some researchers claim that any gains in weight experienced by subjects using GH alone was due to growth of internal organs and connective tissue, which could cause some problems. Most studies do not agree with this theory and consider "GH gut" to be a myth. Some people are allergic to synthetic test, this is something you have to find out for yourself. Some people also feel intestinal discomfort from time to time, if so take it down to one item at a time to see what is causing you discomfort; creatine, glutamine, protein products, orals, and dirty gear have all been known to cause this, so find the problem early.

GH and IGF-1:
Perhaps the most relevant effect of IGF-1 is the ability of IGF-1 to increase protein synthesis by increasing cellular mRNA formation (mRNA makes protein) as well as increasing uptake of amino acids. This effect on protein synthesis can lead to increased lean mass. The research indicates that this effect is dependent on GH presence as well. So IGF-1 alone does not promote such effects. Nor does GH. It appears the combination of the two most consistently lead to increased protein synthesis.

GH and IGF-1 are negative regulators of GH release so an increase in either (from a GH injection) reduces the secretion of GH. IGF-1 is very difficult to obtain in a useable condition.... it must be handled very gently and have bee kept at a rather precise temperature at all times. One can stimulate IGF production through the use of an oral steroid during cycle. Dbol, for example, causes a rather extensive release of IGF during the first pass through the liver.

The leading studies in this area: (Ney, 1999, Yarasheski, 1994.... Am J. App. Phys.)
In the Yarasheski study, no increase in lean muscle mass was noticed in the subjects using GH alone, but significant gains were found in subjects that supplemented with IGF and GH...add in the steroids and look out! Yarasheski studied weight trained athletes, supplementing one group with GH alone, and one group with GH and IGF. "So IGF-1 alone does not promote such effects. (Leanness and increased lean mass) Nor does GH. It appears the combination of the two most consistently lead to increased protein synthesis." Both seem to negatively downregulate the other over time, so as to lead to diminishing returns. Cycling would be in order for that reason. Also supplementing both is necessary because one or the other alone will suppress the natural production of the non-supplemented Latest study by Yarashevski - with GH alone...8 to 12% change in lean body composition. 6% increase in muscle mass.

[jeffylyte]

A little more info: HGH is like T4, it doesnt cause the growing, but causes the body to release growth factors. This is why is can be stacked successfully with AS but by itself doesnt do much. HGH action for anbolism is that it causes the body to release mIGF's that build the muscle. The jury is still out on the negative effects. To say that it cant cause Acromegaly in people not predisposed is iffy. Just look at the CHinese womens swim team from two (or was it three) olympics ago. They all had sloping foreheads. If done in excess it likely will cause acromegaly and maybe some organ enlargment as well. More studies need to be done, but it seems to be very dose dependant. If you dose higher than your body can clear, then you will have problems.

On a side note: NEVER TAKE IGF OR mIGF!!!!!!

I cant stress this enough. muscualr IGF (mIGF) causes muscle to grow. It does this better than any AS. but it causes all muscle to grow including heart muscle. If you are willing to die of an enlarged heart 20 years early then so be it. Otherwise, steer clear. The good thing about AS is that heart muscle doesnt have hardly any Androgen receptors. Therefore pumping steroids will cause your biceps to grow but not your heart.

anyway, back to my tuna!

[jeffylyte]

correction: I meant that T4 is not active but T3 is. I didnt mean to imply that T4 releases anything. HGH is not active but IGF is

[ZTEM]

thanks for the information guys it is very helpful to me and i greatly appreciate it....

1 last question is can i get an estimate on how much growth hormones would cost...for approximately 250iu approximately 12 weeks worth

[Pete235]

Depends on your source but a ballpark for a 126iu serotsim hologrammed kit is about $700-$900usd. Of course there is some btter pricing but it's very hard to find unless you are connected...I am NOT connected!!

[androplex]

I dont want to alarm anyone but.....

Some of the blackmarket hGH comes from humans. If the human had Hiv, hep or what ever then its a good chance that taking the hGH will cause you to contract whatever they had. I read this. I dont know of documented cases but pls be careful if you start doing hgh from the blackmarket.

[androplex]

ZTEM, 3 months is not long enough to run hGH. You need to run it for at least 6 months. High dosage is not better! This is what I have read. I am currently coming to the end of month 3 with my hgh treatments. I am just now starting to see the veins and all poping out of my arms. The fat around my waist is also going away. Its great. More is not better dosage wise. I am currenlty take 15 ius a week, 2 iu's per day, with one day off. I pay out the ass for it since my insurance does not cover it. I only take it from pharmacies that I trust and always use saizen by serono. Dont do it for just 3 months it will be a waist of your money and time sticking yourself every morning in the stomach. Do it for at least 6 months. This is what my doctors tell me. One has been taking it for 8 months himself and he sees great results. Keep in mind every body is different and some my get benefit from it and others may not. My doctor has me on a strict diet because I am on hGH. He does NOT want me taking insulin with it either. Thats why my diet is so controlled. Good luck.

[PURE ADRENALINE]

Originally posted by androplex
I dont want to alarm anyone but.....

Some of the blackmarket hGH comes from humans. If the human had Hiv, hep or what ever then its a good chance that taking the hGH will cause you to contract whatever they had. I read this. I dont know of documented cases but pls be careful if you start doing hgh from the blackmarket.

I am not saying this is not true but I totally do not see how that can be.

I am not sure how AIDS or anything else could live through the process required to contain HGH. Then when it is reconstituted you are saying the AIDS will still be active?

Hmm not sure I follow that bro ??

Can you explain this further?

[androplex]

I dont have the anabolic book that I read this in with me now. When I get home I will post the book name and the page. BTW TNT, ptbyjason both have this book too.

[PURE ADRENALINE]

Originally posted by ZTEM
Wuts up guys...


Im currently off cycle and will be for another week or so....then im going to hit an 8 week cycle which is going to consist of test@500mg a week and EQ @200mg a week.....At the end of the cycle ill probably weigh about 195....then ill be off for 8 weeks and then going to boot camp.....so in approximately 20 weeks after im off I want to start a cycle....sometime around november or so.....Ill probably weigh about 175lbs but pretty damn cut....Im 5'8"

The thing is I want to take growth hormones after im back and Im not sure on the dosage I should take, the length and what an average price will be in the NY/NJ area....


I know theres alot of possibilities on wut my weight will be and shit in here but im using estimates as wut ive experienced and some of my friends have done when doing the same shit.....Just let me know wut i should use if i were 175lbs cut and 5'8"

thanks alot guys

Again this is another post that I am not sure what is the best advice to give you.

If you are looking into HGH then I "assume" that you have been lifting for sometime, are an adult, and have been using AS for sometime and feel you have reached a sticking point.

Is this correct?

How old are you?

How many cycles have you done?

Why do you want to use HGH?

Have you reached a sticking point?

How long have you been training?

However to answer your question. HGH is something that needs to be ran long term at a low dosage, IMO, to obtain maximum results and stay somewhat safe from unwanted sides like activating dormant cancer cells caused by elevated IGF levels.

A "safe" range can run from 2IU per day, which some doctors use, for anti-aging therapy, to 8IU per day.

Now there is NO 100% way to say to anyone that using it at any amount is 100% safe!

HGH is probably the most misunderstood compound used in BB.

Many bros just take it and really have no idea what it is doing and how to use it.
This can cost you your life!

Most HGH users run it in a manner of 5 on and 2 off. This I believe has been established due to the half-life of HGH is 8 hours and raised IGF is 30 hours. I am guessing that the thought behind this is so that you have a min of 48 hours off to keep the body naturally producing HGH and not shutting down.

As we get older our body reduces the natural amount it releases and this is when supplementing HGH can cause anti-aging effects that many look for.

Anyway I am getting off on a long discussion.

Bottom line is you sure you need to be using it at all bro?

Oh and what branch of the service are you going in ?? I hope it is the USMC !!!!!!!


Hope this helps bro..PA

[ZTEM]

bump....let me know an approximation on cost for about 250iu please if anyone knows

[androplex]

Ok here is the source of my earlier post.....


Dangers of the Black Market for hGH page 105, Chapter three, Anabolic Primer by Phil Embleton and Gerard Thorne, copyright 1998.

In the late 1980's a potentially dangerous form of hGH began to make its round on the black market...believed to be derived from South American rhesus monkeys. Whats scary about this situation is that rhesus monkeys are well-known for harboring .....aids virus....bodybuilders would be wise to keep this in mind if buying on the black market.

Cadaver hgh still turns up on the black market. chief source is former Soviet Union where pituitary derived hgh is still produced. Bodybuilders would be wise to avoid this form hgh as analysis carried out...showed samples contained impurities which indicated unsuitable precautions had been taken to eliminate virus contamination.

[the original jason]

i think basically what its saying is that from that particular brand it was dangerous but to say that any kit can give u hiv just cos the original prescribe-e was infected is insane

peace

[ZTEM]

nobody has an approximate cost on HGH then?

[androplex]

My experience; 5 mg vial, $239.39 for 15 iu's Saizen by Serono. That's what it cost with a script and legal purchase.



Black Market

[the original jason]

anywhere from 300-700$ black market