How much protein can your body absorb on/off cycle

**Schwarz** · 02-27-2006, 05:24 AM

OK was having a big argument at the gym on the weekend and I'm hoping some of you knowledgeable bros can help me win (Pinn, Marcus and Booz get in here...pls).

This guy (he's huge but a known AAS user) was saying that the body can only absorb up to 30g of protein at each sitting. The only time the body can absorb more is when you are on AAS.

I call BS on this. If you can only get 3og at each sitting and you eat even 7 meals a day thats like 210g which may be OK for some ppl but what happens when you get to needing 300-400g a day?? How do you get all that protein in. I believe the body adapts and takes what it needs...

Anyone got any interesting research on this?

S

**stupidhippo** · 02-27-2006, 05:41 AM

How much of the protein is absorbed is also a completely diffrent question than how much of it is utilized in anabolic processes (in regards to muscle).

**Schwarz** · 02-27-2006, 06:05 AM

Originally Posted by stupidhippo

How much of the protein is absorbed is also a completely diffrent question than how much of it is utilized in anabolic processes (in regards to muscle).

YOur right. Let's stick to how much is utilized in the anabolic process. Although if anyone want to answer the former as well then that would be good.

**Pooks** · 02-27-2006, 06:45 AM

we might need that dyke teacher and her magic school bus.. to answer this one...
like how much time is "at any give time"... if u spread your 60gram protein shake over an hour... would that span over 2 any given times... maybe....

**Chemical King** · 02-27-2006, 08:42 AM

I could be wrong but think it also depends on the weight of the person.
Even when maintaining your muscle you need 1.5g of protein per pound bodyweight so it stands to reason that a bigger person would need more to maintain and more again to add mass.

**Schwarz** · 02-27-2006, 08:43 AM

Originally Posted by Chemical King

I could be wrong but think it also depends on the weight of the person.
Even when maintaining your muscle you need 1.5g of protein per pound bodyweight so it stands to reason that a bigger person would need more to maintain and more again to add mass.

Well that's my point exactly. So how can someone possibly regulate themselves to 30g of protein per serving!

**SS1476** · 02-27-2006, 08:46 AM

I couldnt...I do 50 per serving.
If this dude is huge, hes obviously
taking in more IMO.

**marcus300** · 02-27-2006, 08:57 AM

Ive read various studies regarding this subject and to be honest there is'nt a straight answer, many conflicting reports giving all different grams each serving.
The bigger you are in muscle mass the more protien you must have to maintain it than a guy with less muscle mass, 1.5-2grams per pound of LBM split evenly over the amount of meals you can consume in a day.

**sbeast007** · 02-27-2006, 09:03 AM

def depends on how big ur muscles are the bigger they are the more protein they will absorb to maintain/grow, a small guy may only be able to absorb 30g per sitting but a bigger guy may be able to absorb as much 50-60g thats my take on it anyway

***SPIKE*** · 02-27-2006, 09:05 AM

Originally Posted by marcus300

there is'nt a straight answer

And there's your answer, wait does that make sense

Anyway, it isn't a false statement to say that your body can "naturally" digest 30g per sitting (digesting period). Thats for the average individual somewhat following the bull$hit RDA of .9g per kilo. We are far from the average individual, especially when on AAS.

Protein intake will also vary on the size of the individual. The more LBM you have the more protein you need to consume just to maintain that. Not to mention the increased amount to further enhance that LBM.

I used to get into it with my nutrition professors on this topic and it was always agreed that for "bodybuilders" there isnt a set limit as we need more protein for other things rather then daily living. Yet another based on the individual answer....................All IMO of course...............

**ruffrydadd** · 02-27-2006, 02:44 PM

Ive read a lot of statistics and guestimations, and this is the best advice anyone that knows what they are talking about will ever tell you. There has been research over the past 10 years showing that there are advantages for power athletes to consume 50 to 100 percent more protien than the RDA of 0.36 grams of protien per pound of body weight. But I wouldn't completely listen to that. Probably the most successful trainer in body building history says this (arthur jones) "Only intense exercise generates cellular messages that stimulate DNA to begin the process of expanding muscle fibers. An excess of dietary protien, or other nutrients, won't generate these messages. Nutrition enters the picture only after the muscles are stimulated to grow. And even then, rest is AT LEAST as equally important as nutrition." Do not think this means stop taking a little extra protien, just do not go overboard and bump it up to 3 or 4 times the RDA like I have already seen people in here tell you to do. "Consuming 250 to 300 grams of protein per day whether its from food or supplements is expensive, wasteful, and not the safest thing you can do for your liver and kidneys." Too much protien actually retards muscle growth so remember that next time you go on a protien binge.

**magic32** · 02-27-2006, 03:09 PM

Originally Posted by Jayhova

I used to get into it with my nutrition professors on this topic and it was always agreed that for "bodybuilders" there isnt a set limit as we need more protein for other things rather then daily living. Yet another based on the individual answer....................All IMO of course...............

I too had professorial debates on similar topics. And one my scenarios had to do with precontest Ketosis (as determined by the urine strip), or a diet that's awfully close to it.
At these times, when you're body is literally using only protein and fat for normal functions and training, the consensus was absorption goes up exponentially. Thus, the components of one’s diet play a role in protein synthesis also.

Kids don’t try this at home but:
For example, let’s say all you consumed for three days (which appears to be the bodies turning point) were Isopure shakes which are basically pure protein and Flax. Your body regardless of weight, preference, precedent or genetics will adapt to this unique resource by upgrading its synthesis of both for functioning and energy expenditure. If you eliminate the flax (leaving only protein), your body has no choice but to further adapt. All systems will essentially be rewired around the 72nd hour to function less efficiently, but dramatically increase uptake.

What the heck did he say?

Moral here (for those who missed it) is:
Available dietary resources, timing, and the body's phase of dieting are invaluable in dictating the protein synthesis level.

M.

**stupidhippo** · 02-27-2006, 03:25 PM

I think u have misunderstood sumin or I have completely misunderstood ur post.. the events ur talking about will increase protein utilization - not protein synthesis. Aminoacids will be used for gluconeogenesis and energy.. insulin glucagon ratio will decrease. all in all the whole metabolism will change and it might eventually lead to ketoacidosis.. What kind of corrrelations are u suggesting here? r u suggesting that a protein high diet with no little carbs fat will actually increase protein synthesis in muscle tissue? what is the logic behind this? can u elaborate a lil..

The previous post by ruffry.. I agree with that pretty much.

**stupidhippo** · 02-27-2006, 03:27 PM

Originally Posted by magic32

Moral here (for those who missed it) is:
Available dietary resources, timing, and the body's phase of dieting are invaluable in dictating the protein synthesis level.

M.

this is is a really good sentence though..

**Wildcatbadass** · 02-27-2006, 05:33 PM

Please dont forget about how bioavailable ur shakes are. 60g protein could mean on 45grams AVAILABLE for the body if its 75% bioavailable.

**magic32** · 03-01-2006, 08:26 AM

Originally Posted by stupidhippo

I think u have misunderstood sumin or I have completely misunderstood ur post.. the events ur talking about will increase protein utilization - not protein synthesis. Aminoacids will be used for gluconeogenesis and energy.. insulin glucagon ratio will decrease. all in all the whole metabolism will change and it might eventually lead to ketoacidosis.. What kind of corrrelations are u suggesting here? r u suggesting that a protein high diet with no little carbs fat will actually increase protein synthesis in muscle tissue? what is the logic behind this? can u elaborate a lil..

The previous post by ruffry.. I agree with that pretty much.

Yeah, retrospectively, I see your confusion forgive me for the inaccurate terminology.

Briefly, what it means is that when there is good mix of carbs, protein and fats, protein is absorbed at a specific rate (experts widely disagree but typically place it between 40 - 60gms per sitting).
Regress the equation by one, eliminating carb availability, and the body naturally turns to it's second preference...fats for fuel. However, when a lot of fat is burned, some of the fat fragments - ketones - get excreted to preserve the body's acid-base balance (because ketones are acid), this is called "ketosis", during which stored fat is burned at a higher rate, and protein uptake is slightly increased.

Further regression, restricting fats to only supplemented EFAs (with minor infractions often found in bars) presents the body with another level of alert, as it necessarily (due to availability, need, and survival) shifts to greater stored fat consumption and even higher protein absorption for self preservation (the very reason fat is stored anyway). Obviously energy levels plummet, but that's when thermogenics come in to play…to fuel/trick the brain with non-caloric energy while the body burns stored fat. The upside of which is continued training coupled with high protein consumption preserves muscle. And we have yet to incorporate the immense value of aas in both the aforementioned muscle preservation, but more importantly for its constructive anabolism of protein (macromolecular synthesis).

Hence the point and only sentence you approved of, aptly entitled the 'moral':
"Available dietary resources, timing, and the body's phase of dieting are invaluable in dictating the protein synthesis level."

GOOD POINT:

Wildcatbadass: Please dont forget about how bioavailable ur shakes are. 60g protein could mean on 45grams AVAILABLE for the body if its 75% bioavailable.

But if you're consuming upwards of 300gms of protein a day during this short period (and it should be), biovavailability shortfalls are obligatorily offset.

M.

**Solidmass** · 03-01-2006, 09:05 AM

I say if you eat a lot of carbs you dont need more then 200-300g protein ED.

**magic32** · 03-01-2006, 09:20 AM

Originally Posted by Solidmass

I say if you eat a lot of carbs you dont need more then 200-300g protein ED.

He said paradoxically.

M.

**MAXIMA5** · 03-01-2006, 09:52 AM

I always heard you should limit protein portions to 50 g per serving. We all agree that a bodybuilder needs more protein than the average man, but the question is how much to consume at one time. Even though we may be able to utilize more than 50 g, or 30 g in one sitting, I'd rather be safe and consume 30-50g portions periodically throughout the day, just in case larger servings would be wasted. I ate a huge 7 serving can of salmon the other day, and read the can afterwards. It was 12 grams per serving totalling 84 grams. I felt sick while I was digesting it, which led me to believe that there might be something to the smaller recommended portions. Carbs also help break down protein, so i always try to throw in some clean carbs.