why isn't more juice water based?

[broncojosh]

I know this is an ignorant question, but why isn't more "juice" water based? Just curious...

[RON]

I'm no chemist. So, this is just speculation. I would guess it's because water based gear is more prone to bateria.

[Iron horse]

Im guessing it might be easier to suspend long acting items in oil then water????

[broncojosh]

Lets go TNT, get on this one...

[John Hubbard]

I'm thinking it's because of solubility and time release issues.

[jbrand]

Originally posted by RON
I'm no chemist. So, this is just speculation. I would guess it's because water based gear is more prone to bateria.

You're right on the money. It is generally recommended to finish a vial of water-based gear as soon as possible due to bacterial contamination.

[ripped_82]

I believe it has more to do with the fact that there is less injections required

[jbrand]

Originally posted by ripped_82
I believe it has more to do with the fact that there is less injections required

I'll give you a clue: name one human grade water-based AAS?

[ripped_82]

Originally posted by jbrand


I'll give you a clue: name one human grade water-based AAS?

ICN

[broncojosh]

so has my question been answered? Can somebody go a little more in depth for an idiot like myself...What about winny...why is there no problem with that being a water based injectable?

[Billmister]

bump...

[LiftHeavy]

icn is water based???? how come i tasted some cause i was curious..and it tasted and smelled like vegetable oil?

[seeker]

Most esters aren't very water soluble.

[John Hubbard]

One obvious human grade water based AS is Zambon winny depot.

[seeker]

Here is a little of what I learned from Bill Roberts, this might clarify it up for you guys:
"Testosterone, nandrolone, and other anabolic steroids have poor solubility in either water or oil. Esterifying them improves oil solubility. This enables useful dosages of perhaps 100 mg or more per cc. But the more carbons the ester has, the lower the water solubility becomes, and the higher the partition coefficient (ratio between lipid and water solubilities) becomes. If the partition coefficient is high, then at any moment a high proportion of the prodrug is dissolved in oil or body fat, and only a small proportion is dissolved in water.

This is important. If testosterone itself is given in oil solution, it transfers too easily from oil to the water in the blood. The result is that an oil injection of testosterone gives a sudden spike in testosterone levels, which rapidly drops. Injections would be required at least twice per day, and perhaps even more often. Improving the oil solubility and decreasing the water solubility slows this transfer, and extends the half-life of the drug to several days or more."

"While there are a number of interesting oral steroids that, at first glance, would be appealing candidates for making esters, in fact there are very good reasons why no such products are available. Indeed, there are absolutely no 17-alkylated steroid esters on the market.

First, they would be difficult to synthesize. The 17-methyl group which works to block liver enzymes from reacting with the steroid molecule will also hinder the material one would use to make the ester from reacting with the steroid.

More seriously, there is the fact that a 17-methyl would also block enzymes in the body from hydrolyzing (removing) the ester, which would be necessary to yield the active steroid.

So I do not expect that you will ever see esters of Winstrol, Dianabol, or any 17-alkylated steroid on the market, and don’t recommend that anyone try making them. They would probably be inactive, or if they have any activity, it would be very low."

BTW ICN's are oil based.

[seeker]

So obviously those drugs with esters will be oil based because they are much more oil soluble than water soluble. Cottonseed, seseme, or sunflower oil are most commonly used. Those drugs without esters attached (test suspension and methylated compounds such as winny and dbol) are generally water based although technically either could be used (such as *P's susp/prop) and they should be shaken since they don't suspend well.

[ironmaster]

I'm thinking it's because of solubility and time release issues

.........John Hubbard.......succinct and correct.
Some good answers at the end here, too.

[hammerhead]

The main transport in your body is the blood stream. It is primarily a water-soluable transport system. The body also transports items that are not water soluable using lipids and fatty acids - these items are referred to as "fat soluable" in medicine. The body has a very limited ability to transport fat soluable substances hence these items are very slowly moved around and eliminated from the body. A perfect example is THC. It takes the body months to move this stuff out because it is only fat soluable. On the other hand cocaine is removed in days because it is water soluable. Fat-dissolved mediums are the ideal candidates for substances where an extended stay in the body is desired as is the case with anabolic steroid injectible medications. There is also the bonus that oil solutiuons are slightly less succeptible to bacteria and are less sensitive to light and changes in temperature.

[jbrand]

Originally posted by John Hubbard
One obvious human grade water based AS is Zambon winny depot.

Notice how it is directed to finish amps in one sitting. You won't find a human-grade vial of Winstrol simply because once opened it would be too suseptible to bacterial contamination.

[JP1570]

Originally posted by jbrand


Notice how it is directed to finish amps in one sitting. You won't find a human-grade vial of Winstrol simply because once opened it would be too suseptible to bacterial contamination.

uhhhhhh, Upjohn winny can be found in vials no??? I thought upjohn was human grade....

[jbrand]

Originally posted by JP1570


uhhhhhh, Upjohn winny can be found in vials no??? I thought upjohn was human grade....

very good point, i stand corrected.