Hoping for some advice on first time cycle

**rx4yvon** · 06-09-2006, 01:26 AM

Hello everyone myself and my husband are fairly new to this board and until now have just been lurkers and researching as much as we can.
I want to ask ya'll about my husbands possibility of starting his first cycle.
First off he is 35 yo
5'6" 160lbs about 22% body fat
He has a muscular build with really just some fat around the belly area.
He is currently on a routine and strict Diet and has been following this religiously.
Diet is as follows:
Alternating weeks
get big week
2800 calories
258g protean
375g carbs
40g fat

Get lean week
2000 calories
275g protean
175g carbs
20 g fat

He takes creatine/glutamine
magnesium
amino acids
carnitine prior to cardio
and a fat burner on the get lean weeks(hydroxycut hardcore)

He has been wanting to do a cycle and has everything that he needs. His main concern before starting this cycle was that his body fat was to high. He has had people at the gym tell him to just start the cycle and the muscle that he builds will burn that fat that he does have.
He is not trying to be a body builder and really just wants to have a really nice physic for me to enjoy. Also he wants the body he never had. He has mostly always been fit and muscular. worked out off and on since age 16 but never had the "wow" body. He just wants to do one cycle and then just try to maintain as much as possible without doing any other cycle's.

His cycle plan

week 1 eq 1/2cc daily
week 2 eq 1/2cc daily
week 3 eq 1cc daily
week 4 eq 1cc and 5 dbol tabs everyday
week 5 eq 1cc and 5 dbol tabs everyday
week 6 eq 1cc and 5 dbol tabs everyday
week 7 eq 1cc and 5 dbol tabs everyday
week 8 eq 1cc and 5 dbol tabs everyday
week 9 eq 1cc and 5 dbol tabs everyday
week 10 eq 1cc, estanzol 1cc 3x week mon/wed/fri
week 11 eq 1cc, estanzol 1cc 3x week mon/wed/fri
week 12 eq 1cc, estanzol 1cc 3x week mon/wed/fri
week 13 estanzol 1cc 3x a week mon/wed/fri
week 14 estanzol 1cc 3x a week mon/wed/fri
week 15 estanzol 1cc 3x a week mon/wed/fri
week 16 estanzol 1cc 2x week tues/thur

He also has a concern that there is no test in this cycle and he wants to know if ya'll think this would be needed. He could probably get some if you think it would be necessary. Otherwise this is what he has and the amount that he has is used up entirely with this cycle. If test is need please post what type would be best and how much / how long.
One more thing PCT. any suggestions

Please post what you think about this program/cycle/diet. Any input would be much appreciated.
Thank you so much,
Y

**topvega** · 06-09-2006, 01:44 AM

What is the strength of the compounds u listed?? Y dbol and eq?? 22% BF and running dbol? I know this isn't the answer u want but diet and cardio till he gets his bf down a bit more... dbol, eq and no test sounds like a mess...

**Warrior** · 06-09-2006, 02:04 AM

You look like you have put a lot of effort into this and you are ready to dive in...

He is right to want to shave off some fat before beginning his cycle. It will allow him to net more muscle gains (which will raise his metabolic rate) if he isn't trying to shave weight at the same time. And the Equipoise will certainly increase hunger - well, it has for me and many others.

How about keeping the cycle nice and simple with some testosterone -only for his first run at it. The superphysiological levels of testosterone alone will increase anabolism, decrease catabolism, as well as elevate mood and libido. Testosterone should be included in any cycle where you take control of the endocrine systems output... at least at a replacement dose. Shutting down the system's natural androgen (testosterone) production for deriatives (like Equipoise) without even a replacement dose can cause problems. The best first-timer advice, IMO, is to simply run some testosterone enantate at 250mg every 3-5 days depending on the cycle's goals and the person's LBM... your husband would do well with 250mg of TE every 5 days. Assuming everything else is in proper order.

Don't get all wrapped up in big complicated stacks - let him get his feet wet first with the testosterone only.

Just remember, training and diet are never an after thought addition to a steroid cycle - steroids are a simple addition, or supplement, to proper training and diet.

Can we see pics of his current shape? How old is he?

**rx4yvon** · 06-09-2006, 02:24 AM

He is 35. Im sure we can get some pics posted tomorrow. Warrior you suggested test only to start. Should he do this now or after shaving off some more body fat. Remember he is not looking to be perfect. Just alot better than he is now. Would also like to have this body during the summer.
Thank you,
Y

**Warrior** · 06-09-2006, 02:43 AM

Originally Posted by rx4yvon

He is 35. Im sure we can get some pics posted tomorrow. Warrior you suggested test only to start. Should he do this now or after shaving off some more body fat. Remember he is not looking to be perfect. Just alot better than he is now. Would also like to have this body during the summer.
Thank you,
Y

I think you are looking for some magic pill here. Perfect does not come in something you can swallow or inject. Perfection comes from years of dedication and hammering out your flaws. He can have this new body for as long as he works on it... the testosterone can certainly help him, but how fast he gets it depends on how hard he works on it. Your realistic goals should probably be next summer - not next month.

**Vial** · 06-09-2006, 02:46 AM

I would suggest you add some test maybe even remove the dbol . EQ and test will make a nice combination for his main goal. Also remember that it is important to have test in a cycle as your hubbies labido could be affected due to natural test production being none or limited. Which ever cycle you follow remember to keep looking at the diet and also add in lots of cardio. That will do the trick. Has he tried "hotrox"? if not add it in.

**ascendant** · 06-09-2006, 02:48 AM

Originally Posted by rx4yvon

He is 35. Im sure we can get some pics posted tomorrow. Warrior you suggested test only to start. Should he do this now or after shaving off some more body fat. Remember he is not looking to be perfect. Just alot better than he is now. Would also like to have this body during the summer.
Thank you,
Y

doing any kind of gear now will make him fall well short of expectations. gear is not for "cutting up", and putting on more muscle is not his solution to getting rid of that bf.

sorry to say, but 22%bf is not just a little extra around the belly. that is overweight, pretty bad as well. how long has he been on a diet and what is his training and cardio regimen like? we need to see his diet cause either he's just getting into losing the weight or something is just not in order here. many people think they have a good diet and find out in actuality they have big problems like not enough protein, too many high GI carbs, or other big problems that are severely inhibiting their progress.

if he takes gear now, the majority of it will do what's called aromatizing, which means it will convert into a chemical called estrogen, something he really doesn't want in high levels like that. the reason being is that gear aromatizes in fat, so the more a person has, the more the gear will convert into estrogen.

at this point, have him focus on "fine tuning" his diet by posting it here in the diet section and having people help him with that. also, to lose the fat, he should be doing cardio at least 3-5 times a week, preferably in the mornings before breakfast. however, i think it would be a very bad idea for him to start getting involved in gear at this point.

one final thing i have to ask is why is it that you're posting for him??? he should be able to give a much better description of exactly what's going on with his goals, training, diet, etc than you'd be able to do?

**rx4yvon** · 06-09-2006, 03:26 AM

He alternates a get lean week and get big 2weeks. So for every get lean week there are 2 get big weeks. In other words he lifts more reps and less rest between, lighter weights on the get lean week. Then the get big week heavier weight less reps and longer rest times.

Meal plan the week is
mon get lean meal
tues get lean meal
wed get lean meal
thur get lean meal
fri get big meal
sat get big meal
sun get lean meal

Get lean meal consists of 6 meals a day
1st
8 egg whites
1 slice fat free cheese
1 medium whole wheat bagel

2nd
8oz chicken breast
1 cup green beans

3rd
2 scoops whey protien with water

4th
6oz sliced turkey breast on a garden salad
2tbs low fat dressing

5th pre workout meal
2 scoops whey protien with water

6th post workout meal
2 scoops whey protien with water
1 cup fat free cottage cheese

Get big meal consists of

1st
4 egg whites
2 whole eggs
2 wheat pancakes
2 tbsp reduced calorie syrup
10 oz orange juice

2nd
7oz chicken breast
large baked potatoe with salsa on it

3rd
1 cup low fat cottage chees with pinapple
2 fig newtons

4th
turkey/roast beef sandwich
6 slices
1 slice cheddar cheese
whole grain bread

5th
2 scoops whey protien with water
1 medium bagel

6th
2 scoops whey protien with water
1 fat free muffin or 2 fig newtons

So get lean meal 5 days a week and get big 2 days a week
He does 30 min cardio 5 days a week right before his workout mainly because that is really the only time he has to do it.
I am posting because we are both at work but he does not have computer access and I do. We are on the phone discussing this as I type.
It is also somewhat of a problem is that we both work overnights and it is sometimes hard to stick to the exact eating schedule due to varying times of sleep.
His body fat could be off since it was done by some joe blow at the gym. I have to say he is not fat by most people standards. No one would ever describe him as fat if they met him with his clothes on. I will try to get his pics up this morning when we get home from work.
He has been doing this diet for about a month.
Thanks

Y

**SMAN12b** · 06-09-2006, 07:39 AM

Get body fat down to at least 15% or lower before doing ANY aas, then First cycle should ALWAYS be just ONE compound - A single ester Testosterone like Test E or Test Cyp, that way HE can learn how his body reacts to it. NO Dbol , NO eq NO anything else. If he is gonna take multiple compounds that he has NEVER used before, how will he know what his body is responding to?? How will he know which of those compounds are helping him grow and which are causing terrible side effects??

You can check out the Diet forums to get a better handle on the diet part
and the workout forums for that part as well. But it will be much more benificial if he has a better base foundation to start from when adding any AAS cycle

Hope this helps

**ascendant** · 06-09-2006, 10:54 AM

alright, not sure where he got the idea of 2 weeks cutting, 2 weeks bulking, but that has got to go. he needs to focus on cutting alone and toss the bulking till he gets that bf down. people do not switch back and forth every couple of weeks. that's just going to get him nowhere.

his "cutting" diet seems way too low on calories and doesn't have enough carbs. he doesn't even use any carbs PWO, which will be making his body go extremely catabolic afterwards. he needs to up his calories with his cutting diet and stick with that for the next couple months to effectively lose bodyfat.

i would watch what kinds of carbs he adds to his cutting diet however, as many of the ones listed on his bulking diet are high or at least med GI. you want carbs that are low GI, which are basically slower digesting.

at this point i can tell you he definitely needs to work on his diet and you should post it in the diet section of these forums and begin by working on that. also like i said previously, toss the 2 weeks cut, 2 weeks bulk "merry go round that gets you nowhere" deal that he's doing now and focus on one at a time till a specific goal is reached, in this case lowering his bf.

once you get the diet fixed up and him focused on one goal, then we can take it to the next step.

another thing i just noticed is that he does his cardio right before his workout. if that is the only time he can fit in his cardio, he should be doing the exact opposite and doing cardio after his weight training.

weight training needs blood sugars and muscle glycogen as it is an anaerobic workout. cardio is intended to burn fat as an aerobic activity. however, you will not begin to burn fat till you burn out substantial amounts of body sugars (glucose/glycogen) first. so by him doing his cardio before his weight training, he's burning out his energy source for his workouts and will fall short of energy during it. doing his weight training first will allow him to utilize those sugars for the training and then when he hits his cardio afterwards, he will begin burning bodyfat much sooner that way.

as far as not being able to have a consistent sleep schedule, obviously just do what you can. as long as he makes sure to eat at least every 3 hours to keep cortisol levels down, that's the most important thing. well, other than what he's eating of course.

switching the order of his weight training and cardio and working on his diet are two big steps to helping him get closer to where he wants to be. the training issue will hopefully be corrected as soon as he reads this, and posting his diet in the diet forums will help you work on that. people there can suggest carbs that are low GI for him. i would here, but i think this post is long enough and i know there are others who could do an even better job at helping him with his diet in the diet threads.