why not to take one bottle of t-200 for ten weeks

[str82hellnback]

not that my opinion or any research that i have done matters, but please consider your opitions before you do 200 mg of t-200 for your first cycle, reason's not to do 200 mg of t-200 for ten weeks for first cycle
1. body naturally produces 70 mg of test per week
2. once you have foreign test in your body your body shuts down natural test production
3. to recieve optimun results your body needs atleast 250 mg of total test per week
4. if you take 200 mg of test per week you are actually only getting 130 mg of test per week that your body is utilizing
5,that is only if your t-200 actually contains 200mg per ml which is very unlikely
6. what is happening is you will receive 160 mg per ml of test and you will shoot that and your natural test production will stop and you will only be getting 90 mg of test per week,so to get optimum results you must reach a number close to 250 mg per week which would end up being two bottles of test over a ten week period,with taht you will benefit from about 240 mg of test per week,which will be sufficient for a first timer,if i am wrong please correct me

[BIG_JDAWG]

that's interesting..i've never heard that before... but if that is true, then why is a simple 1cc a week of test seem to be the normal first stack for a beginner??


Big J

[str82hellnback]

i dont know but i do know that they are actually only getting 20 mg more test then that of which is naturally produced. so little gains are accumilated. but also if good gains are made that is because in most cases drastic changes in diet and training are made when the steroids are taking,also a mental affect is playing into some of the gains as well

[str82hellnback]

no one else has any opinios or research to disagree with me?just curious,i have read this and am wondering if you too have read the same

[str82hellnback]

bump up atleast please

[broncojosh]

I don't know anybody that takes only 200mg per week. A mild first cycle would be something along the lines of 400mg/week. If what you are saying is true though. From what I've read, your body does shut down it's production of test. when you add test from an outside source. I don't know if it completely shuts down production, or just slows it down. Either way, I would say 200mg a week is not enough.

[str82hellnback]

thank you broncojosh, bump up plz

[str82hellnback]

bump,ne mod's or vet have opinion?

[str82hellnback]

dr. evil?big kev? original jason?tnt?where are you guys,pete?someone,i know yall are out there

[Tapout]

i agree st82
200mg is like taking pro hormones
i only gained an average of 10lbs per cycle till juice junkie looked at how i was doing it--- 400mg per week---at 244
he gave me lots of research to look at and i have done my own research and now i know for me i need around 800mg per week after front loading

so you are right 200mg is close(a little better than natural) to a waste or nothing even for a first timer

[TNT]

This may surprise y'all, but I happen to support the concept of light cycles. For newbies, I actually do recommend a maximum of 200 mg. test (cyp or enanthate) per week. (Yes, that means that many guys will benefit from 100 mg. of test per week, especialy if they've never done AS.)

Why? Because 400 mg. or more will skew your system. You'll go into super-test mode for the length of your cycle, you'll be the "Before" screen on a Clearasil commercial come to life, and you'll retain water out the gazoo.

The problem is that some people think an AS cycle is enough. It's not - you need to integrate it with a solid workout routine and a diet targeted to your goals (cutting or bulking). Most people would consider the test to be the cake and the other stuff to be the icing on the cake - I find it works best to think about them the other way around.

To me, testosterone is like Motrin. Seriously. (You won't read this in the textbook, but it's true.) Motrin or Advil, generically ibuprofen, is sold over the counter at 200 mg. per pill. But it's available in prescription strengths of 600 mg. and 800 mg. Why not more? Because if you take more, it won't be any more effective.

Same story with injectable Vitamin B12 (cyanocobalimin). Do any more than 100 mcg once a month, and you waste it. Your body will excrete what it doesn't use, but it doesn't do any good to take more than you need.

There is a common conception that all cycles must come in the form of a stack. Nonsense. If you go from nothing to one thing, it will still have a positive effect. And 200 mg. of test per week will do a lot to improve your profile; you don't need to read the A.R. drug profiles and say, like some guys do, "Cool - I'll have some of everything."

Now, is 200 mg. per week "cycle strength?" Yep. Because the usual medical dose of test is 200 mg. every two or three weeks. And if you have normal test levels, doing even 200 mg. per week will zonk your total test levels way above the top level of normal range. It will make you much less prone to gyno than massive doses, not to mention creating less risk for negative kidney, liver, or prostate effects. And yes, the more you use, the more your natural test will tend to shut down.

Think of a cycle as you would think of open heart surgery. When a surgical team does a CABG (coronary arterial bypass graft), the patient is put on a heart-lung machine. The machine does all the breathing for you, and after the surgery is over, a ventilator is used to help you breathe for the first 24 hours. During that period, a little "beep" will go off each time you take a breath on your own. The number of beeps will increase until, the day after surgery, you have been weaned off the machine. Returning to your natural test levels is a similar "weaning" process - the longer you were on test injections and the more test you were injecting, the longer it will take your body to return to its normal test levels.

So when you come off your cycle, a 200 mg. per week dose will have less of a negative impact than larger doses. Which brings me to the other related point . . .

(Don't go ballistic on the next paragraph, campers. I respect differences of opinion, but for what it's worth, here's mine . . .)

I can't think of anything more absurd than topping off a cycle with Clomid. Guys, this is what women take to induce ovulation. That is its only medical use.

I believe that everyone has to take responsibility for their AS use. And if that means that if, at the end of a cycle, you have to go a few weeks without being horny, so be it. Ride with it. But don't skew the pictrue with a freakin' women's ovulation drug.

For what it's worth, many of the PM's I get have to do with guys who end up with low test levels. (No, I won't discuss any specifics. That's why private messages are private.) The reasons range from doing too much test (or other AS) during a cycle to topping it off with Clomid, and the test levels have not returned to normal after months, let alone weeks. No surprise - there has been a shock to the system.

Finally, st82hellnbak has raised another possibility in his original post: that the T-200 you do may not even contain 200 mg. of test. That's why I have always endorsed only good ol' U-S-of-A, FDA-approved test. Tht means Delatestryl (enanthate) or Depo-Testosterone (cyp), period. I have doubts about the purity, reliability, or quality of all Mexican test, especiall if it's intended for veterinary use. (I have no problem with Canadian test, however, since it's made to the same standards as its U.S. counterparts, to the extent that Canadian enth and cyp are marketed under the same names as the U.S. product.)

Bottom line: A good AS cycle is like learning to play the piano. When you do your first gig, you can dress like Billy Joel, or you can dress like Liberace. I lean toward the first option: a subtle, understated approach when it comes to a cycle - integrated with good workout and diet routines, it will be enough to give you solid results.

[jleighty17]

good post now i finally have someone to agree with me just taking a small dose for my first inj cycle everyone i know says i should be taking at least 500mg a week i was just gonan do 250mg every 5 days then kick it with dbol in the beginning

[BiggerBri2002]

WOW,

TNT you have made me really think. I am currently doing a 200mg-TEST/200MG Deca cycle and was worried about it being too little. The Clomid comments also seem to really make sense also. I am going to serioulsly consider not doing the CLOMID and the end of my cycle.

Also, I was wondering about a recommendation a friend made. He says you should start a cycle low and then work your way up and then cycle down again. He suggest the following:

100mg Test/100 mg Deca -Week 1
150mg Test/100 mg Deca-Week 2
200mg Test/200 mg Deca-Week 3 &4
150mg Test/150 mg Deca-Weke 5
100mg Test/100 mg Deca-Week 6
50 mg Test/50 mg Deca-Week 7

Does this sound nuts to all of you. He Said he used on his very first cycle and saw GREAT results. I dunno?????

[str82hellnback]

well all i was trying to point out in the start of this thread is that if you are taking 200 mg per week and the mex test only has 160 mg per ml then your natural test shuts down that leaves you with 90 mg of test per week to work with. that is big waste of money. i think andro can do the same thing and you'd even save money. basically you'll get the side effects but not the results,and at 200 mg per week you have high dreams of becoming superman after your first cycle and after that doesn't happen you will get pissed and might do something irrational like taking 800mg test per week, 800 mg deca per week, 50 mg d bol per day for five weeks, winstrol weeks 7-12, and maybe even more stuff,just b/c you learned you body wont respond to 200 mg test per week. now that is a good fourth cycle but not for a second time user who's body is not saturated yet,but yes tnt-i do agree,a newbie should start at the lowest dosages possible and stay at that for as long as possible,but i think that 400 mg /week is a very good starting point, my reason- 400-natural test=330mg test then take 330 minus the unsufficient mexican test fuck up which is prolly 60a mg and you actually are utilizing 270 mg per week which is an ideal anabolic state for a first timer, peace

[cnyce89]

woah...so dont use clomid? im alll confused now.... i knew it was to promote womens ovulation and didnt know why it would stimulate out trestlevels back up, but everyone says it keeps gains, so whats the deal with that?

[TNT]

I knew I would open up a can of worms with my comments on Clomid, which is why I acknowledged that I am not in the mainstream of juicers when it comes to this.

However, I'm going to let my coments stand, as I don't want this to turn into a debate.

My advice: Read what I have said, read what the good doctor has said, and read as many other opinions as you can. Then make up your mind about what to use or not use.

It will be a learning experience, I assure you.

[Dr.Evil]

clomid and nolva are also medically used to treat oligo/asthenospermia in men. this is the condition that most bodybuilders are in after a cycle of AS.

[REM]

so what's the real theory about clomid is it
really needed after a cycle or what?

[str82hellnback]

bump

[Deltrain]

is 200mg equal to 2 cc's? If so the first cycle i ever did was test 200 with 1cc a week for3-4 weeks then 2cc's for 2 weeks then finished off the bottle with 1 cc a week. I gained 10 pounds.

[str82hellnback]

1cc a week is 200mg for mexican brand brovel and tornel,that's probly the reason you gained that much weight is b/c you were taking in 400mg some of the time. but 10 pounds is still pretty minimal for a cycle

[str82hellnback]

a