Overweight first cycle ?

[bigg_poppa]

my buddy just joined the gym wit me and he is looking to run a cycle alone wit me at the same time but the problem is he is over weight hes at like 270 and at 35% bf hes trained for 2 years off and on and is 26 he wants to run test prop for his first cycle but the problem im scared to see what would happen what are some side effects that can happen to someone who ran test being over weight?

[Maldorf]

Not a good idea. Main thing I would be concerned about would be the blood pressure. His estrogen levels are already higher than they should be because of all that bodyfat, and the extra test he would take would throw that over the top. I would encourage him to train naturally until he can drop his bodyfat down to at least 16% or so. Could possibly have him diet and try some clenbuterol at best. Maybe he just needs to feel that he is getting extra help, and the clen might inspire him. Do lots of research on the clen beforehand of course, it can be dangerous if used wrong.

[bigg_poppa]

well we knew about the high estrogen levels and he was going to take this as his first cycle

weeks 1 -10 test prop 500mgs a week
letro @ a dose of .25mg or .50mg ED

PCT
3 days after last injection

Day 1 Clomid 200mg + Nolvadex 40mg
Day 2 - 11 Clomid 50mg + Nolvadex 20mg
Day 12 - 21 Nolvadex 20mg

[Hellmaskbanned]

It seems like he's going to do it anyways , so why even make the thread.
Everyone knows it's a dumb idea.
I'm sure you and him both know why it's bad....so I don't get it?!

[bigg_poppa]

well we wanna know if the cycle is alright for him even though he is overweight he wants to do it so can u look over and comment on the cycle and if here are things he can take to help him through the cycle

[hardgainer12]

if u wanna know if its safe, u already knew the answer before u wrote the thread!

[k0nsl]

Offer him a cycle of cardio. It will yield more pleasing results than the proposed cycle. Really.

[JohnboyF]

i think the cycle is fine IMO. BUt is it going to do anything for him No! will he see results? Probally not.. So why throw money around? How bout using the time on a treadmill.

[audis4]

UNoffical "How to Cut" thread and sample diet...
Read heavily, understand, put it to use. BF is WAYY to high. If you know nothing about diet (like your friend) then your NOT ready for AAS.

Diet and cardio.......and more cardio.
So basically your friend wants to be a strong fat guy....help him choose the right road.
p.s. how do you know your friends BF?

[michaelmotorcycle]

he wount be able to see the muscels, cuz it will be coverd by fat. try eca, it will get him pumped so he will be able to do more cardio. then in two or three months, once his bf is low he could cycle and see results.... don't wast your money/health/gear on a cycle where your not gonna see results.... that would just be foolish. this guy needs to lose 80lb befor even thinking about juice

[DarKOmeN]

if i was u id put stackers clen n winstrol in his breakfast 35%BF n hitting juice bad idea

[Mesomorphyl]

If he was trying just to be big like strongmen contestants or power lifter... I would say 20% would be fine. But bbing or health wise... diet, cardio, diet, anaerobic lifting, diet are going to be key for him... then wait until lower teens before juicing. Let him know that heavier people are more prone to gyno( aka bitch tits ) because fat causes more aromitase(sp?). Also, let him know that 26 years of eating like shit cannot be solved in a cycle. If it took him even 5 years to get that big what would make him think that he does not need to change his lifestyle for quite some time?

[Kal-El]

My best friend is in the same boat as yours man. He is a heavy guy has been since he was a kid, has worked out for the last 10 years off and on. We both play O-line in semi-pro ball. He has no aspirations about being thin or BBing, we ALL know that players in the NFL use gear, ecspecially lineman. He wants the strength and added size that comes with doing a cycle, he isnt concerned about getting shredded or being thin which is probably a shock to most. He has had his BP checked recently and its not abnormal by any means. I told him he is going to have to monitor that and make sure it doesnt become an issue. He has researched and studied and its his decision. As I said he isnt doing this to become the next lee priest he is doing it for use in football(we dont have testing). I say if your buddy gets his bloodwork done, makes sure his BP is at an acceptable level then its his body. As long as he doesnt think that he is going to become shredded and Muscle & Fitness cover model material after 10 weeks then why not. I'll get flamed but oh well, not everyone wants to be a BB

[Mesomorphyl]

I'll get flamed but oh well, not everyone wants to be a BB

I thought I would at suggesting 20% for a power sport... but didnt. Its all cool

[pdog80]

Yikes!!! 35% bf and he's considering a cycle?!!! He's asking for a stroke or heart attack.

[Beefyman]

naaa i don't think it matters and he is very very active being in a baseball team...

i know many many many 300+ pounders do roids big fag guys and seem to do fine.... like some other guys said pro football players take it and they are ****ing FAT!!! so you tell me???

[Hellmaskbanned]

My best friend is in the same boat as yours man. He is a heavy guy has been since he was a kid, has worked out for the last 10 years off and on. We both play O-line in semi-pro ball. He has no aspirations about being thin or BBing, we ALL know that players in the NFL use gear, ecspecially lineman. He wants the strength and added size that comes with doing a cycle, he isnt concerned about getting shredded or being thin which is probably a shock to most. He has had his BP checked recently and its not abnormal by any means. I told him he is going to have to monitor that and make sure it doesnt become an issue. He has researched and studied and its his decision. As I said he isnt doing this to become the next lee priest he is doing it for use in football(we dont have testing). I say if your buddy gets his bloodwork done, makes sure his BP is at an acceptable level then its his body. As long as he doesnt think that he is going to become shredded and Muscle & Fitness cover model material after 10 weeks then why not. I'll get flamed but oh well, not everyone wants to be a BB

Not everyone wants their heart overworked and fail on them either! Being in an athletic sport like a conditioned lineman is completely different than someone gettting around 0 cardiovascular activity at 35% BF wanting to cycle.

[Kal-El]

Not everyone wants their heart overworked and fail on them either! Being in an athletic sport like a conditioned lineman is completely different than someone gettting around 0 cardiovascular activity at 35% BF wanting to cycle.

True....true....

[perfectbeast2001]

you should really be starting a thread entitled "my friend is obese and i'm worried for his health".

[Test4life]

Tell him to wait bro hes not ready at all. Cardio and a proper cutting diet will do the job for him + save him mad money.

[pdog80]

Exactly, Hellmask. You hear that, beefyman?

[cfiler]

His body is no-where near ready for a cycle. Do him a favor, and punch him in the face just for thinking about it.

Rather than buying aas, tell him to buy a used treadmill, or a bike.

[cfiler]

2 years traing on and off in nothing. Most people train for years naturally, before even looking at aas.

[pdog80]

Good point cfiler. I was going to mention that he doesn't have enough time in the gym. Ya beat me to it!!!

[DegoT]

I found an article concerning overweight people and anabolic steroids . Opposed to what many people say on here they are not all right. I'd recommend staying off the scale though and focusing more at your visual improvements in the mirror cause the extra weight may depress a person who is already overweight. The extra weight also has chances to contribute to unwanted estrogen sides so its best to be careful and have nolva at hand. If you workout and eat right while taking steroids no matter how fat you are as long as you stick to a healthy diet and working out you will still gain muscle mass and most likely weight but not from fat unless you over do the calories and the steroids should help with the motivation of staying in the gym after. You do normally want to keep your diet at 5000 caloires a day but if your overweight id try to limit it to 4000 a day though. The calorie intake is important for gaining muscle mass. Alot of people complain about not gaining muscle when they take steroids because they do not eat enough. This doesn't mean you can eat pizza and all the crap you want, You'll have to stick to a healthy diet with lots of protein such as chicken, tuna, plenty of protein shakes, suppliments, etc. Blood pressure is a big concern though and important to have a physical before you even try steroids so you are sure there are no problems with blood pressure or anything else going on in the system. It all depends on the person. It's going to be many weeks of intense training and he should start training at the gym before he even starts steroids. While I posted the article below for you to read. It's a letter to a doctor. The page is located at

http://www.mesomorphosis.com/article...rts/990115.htm

"Overweight condition and steroid use

Dear Bill,

I am an overweight male, mid 20's. I have never used any AAS. I already have "bitch tits"(most likely from being overweight). I weigh 325 and am 5'10. My friends tell me I am not "fat", but rather a big boy. l am not a total slob. I have benched 315 and am taking a karate class. I know l am obese and have very low self esteem. I have read that some people who take AAS have increased self esteem, which is understandable. So naturally l am interested in taking them. I have access to dianabol . My question is, should l take this at your recommended 2wk on 4 off or should I loose the weight first and then try it?

I think it makes more sense for most people to get about as far as they can get naturally before trying steroids. You can probably get great results with careful nutrition and good, dedicated training.

I see a lot of hardgainer advice but not too much for the obese people like myself. If I do take the D-bol should I worry about the Nolvadex since I already have "bitch tits"?

Clomid is equally effective against gyno.

What problems can l expect? What results can expect? Just strength and more size? I know it wont help with the weight but l am almost desperate. And l am definately confused at this point. Please help me and keep up the great website. Thank you.

Josh

Actually, it might help you lose the fat, contrary to what some say. I have seen some people of the endomorph body type who, for the first time in their lives, began losing fat easily when on even moderate-dose anabolic steroids .

I'd see how well you can do naturally, and only if that stalls would I consider the drug route, were it me."

[cj1capp]

what about the fact that the more muscle mass you have the more calories you burn round the clock. So while being fat and taking ASS with intense cardio should equal more fat burned over each 24 hour period. Right?

[cfiler]

I found an article concerning overweight people and anabolic steroids . Opposed to what many people say on here they are not all right. I'd recommend staying off the scale though and focusing more at your visual improvements in the mirror cause the extra weight may depress a person who is already overweight. The extra weight also has chances to contribute to unwanted estrogen sides so its best to be careful and have nolva at hand. If you workout and eat right while taking steroids no matter how fat you are as long as you stick to a healthy diet and working out you will still gain muscle mass and most likely weight but not from fat unless you over do the calories and the steroids should help with the motivation of staying in the gym after. You do normally want to keep your diet at 5000 caloires a day but if your overweight id try to limit it to 4000 a day though. The calorie intake is important for gaining muscle mass. Alot of people complain about not gaining muscle when they take steroids because they do not eat enough. This doesn't mean you can eat pizza and all the crap you want, You'll have to stick to a healthy diet with lots of protein such as chicken, tuna, plenty of protein shakes, suppliments, etc. Blood pressure is a big concern though and important to have a physical before you even try steroids so you are sure there are no problems with blood pressure or anything else going on in the system. It all depends on the person. It's going to be many weeks of intense training and he should start training at the gym before he even starts steroids. While I posted the article below for you to read. It's a letter to a doctor. The page is located at

http://www.mesomorphosis.com/article...rts/990115.htm

"Overweight condition and steroid use

Dear Bill,

I am an overweight male, mid 20's. I have never used any AAS. I already have "bitch tits"(most likely from being overweight). I weigh 325 and am 5'10. My friends tell me I am not "fat", but rather a big boy. l am not a total slob. I have benched 315 and am taking a karate class. I know l am obese and have very low self esteem. I have read that some people who take AAS have increased self esteem, which is understandable. So naturally l am interested in taking them. I have access to dianabol . My question is, should l take this at your recommended 2wk on 4 off or should I loose the weight first and then try it?

I think it makes more sense for most people to get about as far as they can get naturally before trying steroids. You can probably get great results with careful nutrition and good, dedicated training.

I see a lot of hardgainer advice but not too much for the obese people like myself. If I do take the D-bol should I worry about the Nolvadex since I already have "bitch tits"?

Clomid is equally effective against gyno.

What problems can l expect? What results can expect? Just strength and more size? I know it wont help with the weight but l am almost desperate. And l am definately confused at this point. Please help me and keep up the great website. Thank you.

Josh

Actually, it might help you lose the fat, contrary to what some say. I have seen some people of the endomorph body type who, for the first time in their lives, began losing fat easily when on even moderate-dose anabolic steroids .

I'd see how well you can do naturally, and only if that stalls would I consider the drug route, were it me."

That's just one person's opinion. He gives no reference to studies conducted, or resources used. I would definately take that article with a grain of salt, because there is nothing listed in it, to support his idea that AAS is safe for overweight people.

He even lists, that is his opinion that the questioner, should continue naturally, and only if has problems loosing the weight to think about aas.

[cfiler]

what about the fact that the more muscle mass you have the more calories you burn round the clock. So while being fat and taking ASS with intense cardio should equal more fat burned over each 24 hour period. Right?

More muscle doesn't mean more fat being burned, it only means that your maintainance calories would be higher. You still need to be below maintainance, in order to burn fat.

Another thing to remember that it is not possible to gain muscle while loosing body fat. Our diets do not allow it. In order to build muscle, you need to take in a larger caloric intake than your maintainance. While to loose weight, you need to have to intake less calories than maintainance. AAS used while cutting is primarily there to preserve existing muscle, not to build new muscle tissue.

With being overweight, or obese, the body would react more negatively to aas than someone in proper shape. Estrogen related side effects would be much more prominent.

As well, the possible increased blood pressure, with an already high blood pressure or high colostral level could pose to be fatal.

[cj1capp]

what about the fact that the more muscle mass you have the more calories you burn round the clock. So while being fat and taking ASS with intense cardio should equal more fat burned over each 24 hour period. Right?

cflier or any one ,any thoughts on my ideal stated above, doses it make sense ?

[cfiler]

cflier or any one ,any thoughts on my ideal stated above, doses it make sense ?

Yup, read my post above yours.

[pdog80]

Hey cfiler, it is possible to gain muscle while losing fat although it is very hard to do. Basically you gotta consume an exact amount of calories to gain weight yet not go over it so you don't get any excess fat. It's something possible yet very difficult to do.

[DSM4Life]

Hope his gear comes with a bra, he'll need it soon.

[guest589745]

I have researched this a little and the conclusion I have came to is that the lower the BF% you have, the les likely you are to experience negative sides and the more likely it will be to build muscle.

Fat cells contain estrogen and androgen receptors. How much the extra androgen receptors in your BF are going to help I am unsure of. Though the exact amount of aromitazation will differ depending on the person and the dose of aas administered, there WILL be a conversion of that to estrogen (If an aromatizing steroid is present) the more BF a person has. Yes, you MIGHT be able to increase your AI dose to help (Not sure exactly) but it is going to be hard to determine exactly how much is enough/too much without constant bloodwork as far as I know.

Its basically more complicated with higher BF% IMO.

Also, your cardiovascular condition is going to play a large role in your performance when lifting, which you will have to do obviously, to get the results you seem to be looking for. I cant inmagine someone at 35%BF being in less than bad cardiovascular condition.

[cfiler]

Hey cfiler, it is possible to gain muscle while losing fat although it is very hard to do. Basically you gotta consume an exact amount of calories to gain weight yet not go over it so you don't get any excess fat. It's something possible yet very difficult to do.

It's possible to gain only lean muscle, without any fat. That would lower the body fat%, since your muscle to fat ratio would be increased. But you would not be able to directly burn fat, due to not taking in a defict of callories.

Granted there are exceptions to that rule like tren , and a lesser extent, var. But dbol only, would not be able to do it.

[DSM4Life]

Why even waste brain power on this thread. This should be locked. I always thought there was no such thing as a stupid question....


He already knows the answer to it, so why ask ?

[cfiler]

Hope his gear comes with a bra, he'll need it soon.

[cj1capp]

It's possible to gain only lean muscle, without any fat. That would lower the body fat%, since your muscle to fat ratio would be increased. But you would not be able to directly burn fat, due to not taking in a defict of callories.

Granted there are exceptions to that rule like tren, and a lesser extent, var. But dbol only, would not be able to do it.

CFLIER WHAT IF YOU WENT ON A VERY RESTRICTED CARB DIEIT , LIMITING YOUR CARBS AND UPING YOU PROTIEN IN ADDITION TO CARDIO AND AAS IS NOT CONCEVIABLE TO OBTAIN BOTH OF BEST WORLDS, THAT IS GAINING MASS WHILE DROPING FAT? PS I DONT BELIVE THIS IS A STUPID QUESTION MANY BROS MAY NOT HAVE YOUR YEARS OR INFINTE WISDOM DSM4LIFE

[DSM4Life]

CLIFER WHAT IF YOU WENT ON A VERY RESTRICTED CARB DIEIT , LIMITING YOUR CARBS AND UPING YOU PROTIEN IN ADDITION TO CARDIO AND AAS IS NOT CONCEVIABLE TO OBTAIN BOTH OF BEST WORLDS, THAT IS GAINING MASS WHILE DROPING FAT? PS I DONT BELIVE THIS IS A STUPID QUESTION MANY BROS MAY NOT HAVE YOUR YEARS OR INFINTE WISDOM DSM4LIFE

If you do simple searches then you can find more then what you need. It just starts to bother me seeing the same post over and over and over and over (see what i mean) again.

[cj1capp]

If you do simple searches then you can find more then what you need. It just starts to bother me seeing the same post over and over and over and over (see what i mean) again.

YEAH THE SEARCH BUTTON IS OFTEN NEGLECTED BUT THEN AGAIN NEW ANSWERS NEW KNOLDGE MAY BE OUT THERE WITH THE ADDITION OF NEW MENBERS. BUT I FELL YOUR PAIN DSM4LIFE.

[cfiler]

Holy caps button batman!