How long can you use clen?

**The Natural** · 07-07-2002, 02:25 PM

Yes! More stupid questions from me!

I have a first cycle, with clen in it! Check this out:
My first cycle
I am gonna use clen two weeks on and two off! How long can I do it?
Is there a limit? Or can I continue until judgement day? LOL!

And can you tip me on my cycle too?

I just wanna make it right this first time!
Thanks for your time!!!

**4plates** · 07-07-2002, 06:50 PM

your cycle looks good bro,but on wk 5 instead of doing 1 tab a day,start off with 3(1-2 wont do shit ) work your way up to 7 and in the same wk,and see if your body can handle it.you might max out at 6.then next wk run 6 -7 a day.
next 2 wks go on eca.
next 2 wks go on clen starting off where you left before.ex 6-7 and run for 2 wks
eca x2 wk
6-7 clen x2 wks etc..
run this until you feel comfortable with the amount of fat lost.
if its 10 wks so be it.if you dont think you can do what you want in 10 wks,lose as much as you can with strict diet/cardio first.

**The Natural** · 07-08-2002, 05:51 AM

well, the clen -cycle is firstly to keep the mass-loss to a minimum!
Is that the right cycle then?
HELP! You are talking the opposite of each other I dont know what to do!

I need a third opinion! PLEASE!!!!!!!

**ulter** · 07-08-2002, 07:52 AM

Go to the AF STORE and get some NYC.

Good God who wrote that cycle for you?
Never use more deca that you do test. You should be using 500mg/wk of test not 250. 250 is a net gain of only 130mg/wk over your natural test. Not much. Never use deca 10 weeks. Stop it in week 8 because the deca is going to be the hardest part of your recovery course to overcome, so you want it to clear somewhat while you are still using test.
What the hell is that clen pyramid? Did someone actually tell you to do that or did you make it up?
Take 2 clen (1) AM and (1) PM for the first day then the next day add one then the next day add one. So now you should be at 4/day. If you still aren't shakey go to 5 and 6 if you are shakey stop there.
Use the clen for TWO WEEKS and then go to NYC for TWO WEEKS and then back. You won't have to ramp up the second time you go back to clen. You will probably just go 2 then 4 the second cycle. Oops you are in Europe. Ok so use ECA if you can't get NYC. You can rotate these two forever but limit it to 8 weeks. ECA works your heart muscle so prelonged use is not good. By prolonged I mean years.

**The Natural** · 07-08-2002, 09:45 AM

Hmmmm...
OK!
So you mean that I should take 500mg test and how much deca ?
Hey, I dont want to be a bodybuilder either, just wanna go up about 10kg of muscle. Do I reach that goal by 250test and 200dec, in 8 weeks?
Ulter... could you answer me?

and what do you other say?
Is Ulter right?
Man, I am getting confused over here!

Please help!

**ulter** · 07-08-2002, 10:17 AM

500 300 will get you where you want to be if you eat and train right. 250 200 won't.

**ironfist** · 07-08-2002, 01:54 PM

You can use the clen indefinatley if you also take ketotifen with it...

**datboychris** · 07-08-2002, 08:45 PM

I thought that ketotifen was in most brands of Clen .

**datboychris** · 07-08-2002, 08:52 PM

Ok...sorry I just did a search. Only in superclen. Also would an allergy medicine such as perscription benadryl or allegra be enough to prolong use of clen ?

**King Samson** · 07-08-2002, 08:52 PM

Ketotifen is not found in clen , only superclen. I assume you can purchase ketotifen somewhere but I have never seen it sold by its self.

***Sicilian30*** · 07-08-2002, 10:26 PM

Utler I hate to say I disagree with you, but I don't see a problem with running less test than the deca . I see alot of guys running more deca than test, to prevent deca dick and so forth. However, I would not waste my money on sustanon with deca if you do run it like that. I would use something like t 200. Sustanon, IMO is better when it is run as a primary AS and stacking it with something lesser. If you do that, then you should run Sustanon 500mg a week.
Again, I don't see anything wrong with running deca at 300-600 mg a week, and adding 200-400 mg of test a week to prevent deca dick. However, again, sustanon is an expensive type of test to be running with deca. Besides, 250 mg a week of sustanon will do nothing for you again just my opinion. You would actually do better with t 200 at 200 a week, which I wouldn't recommend even at that dosage if you are running it as a primary AS. However running it with deca, I don't think it will be a problem.
Also I have seen guys run deca at 10 weeks with no problems. Again Ulter no disrepect or saying that I know more than you, or flamming you.
As far as your clen goes, I have had better success (my own personal experience) with the 2 days on 2 days off theory. I normally run it like this: Clen 3 tabs first day 3 tabs second day. Day three no clen, take 1-2 ECA tabs, same goes for day 4. Day 5 4 tabs of clen, day 6 4 tabs, day 7 off ECA 1-2 Day 8 ECA 1-2 day 9 5 tabs of clen, day 10 5 tabs of clen. ETC all the way up to 6 tabs and tapper down.
The two day on two day off will allow you to run Clen as long as you want, without downgrading your receptors. I have ran Clen both ways, and have better success with 2 days on 2 days off (remember again this is my personal expeience and what works best for me).
Good luck!

**ironfist** · 07-08-2002, 11:33 PM

Originally posted by King Samson
Ketotifen is not found in clen, only superclen. I assume you can purchase ketotifen somewhere but I have never seen it sold by its self.

The china man sells the keto by itself...

**jammergsxr** · 07-09-2002, 01:03 AM

I thought your cycle looked pretty tight myself,I know alot of guys that run mostly deca and use test to counter act deca-dick.I would recomend an EQ and test enanth,for a first cycle though.Don you look like you,ve done your homework...do what YOU wanna do!!we are just here for support and to share our results and hopefully prevent mistakes but only you know your body.

**The Natural** · 07-09-2002, 05:49 AM

thanks sicilian and jammer!

You are right jammer, I want some good advice.
I just dont wanna screw this up my first time, therefore I am listening to what you guys have to say!

I got an contact who can fix pure deca and sust, no fakes! Therefore am I running the sust/deca cycle. Of what I have heard here, You encourage me to use larger ammounts of deca and sust.
IS it right to use 500sust and 400deca on my very first cycle, in 8 weeks? Please suggest! Remember, that I have NEVER used any AS before, so Should I be gentle this first time?

Thanks Yet again!!!

**ulter** · 07-09-2002, 07:44 AM

I have seen guys run deca at 10 weeks with no problems

If I had their permission I would post the last dozen or so emails I have going back and forth helping guys who did 10 weeks of deca . They are usually 2 months behind those who use test as a base in their recovery. Of course you CAN use deca for 10 weeks. You can use it for 50 weeks. But when you come off a 10 week deca cycle you stand a very good chance of being in recovery for 3 months instead of 5 weeks. Test builds mass better than deca period. You always want more test unless you can't because you have genetics that give you unwanted sides.
I don't know all the guys here but you ask therealj, photobear, David, or Pauly if they will ever use deca for 10 weeks again and see what they say. That's only 4. If I went back through my records I could find you pile of them

***Sicilian30*** · 07-09-2002, 08:29 AM

Ulter, I understand what you are saying, I do. I know that deca does stay in your system for long periods of time. I never said I didn't believe you, I have done deca as well as other guys I know, for 10 weeks, with no problems. BUt then again, I guess everyone's different. What I said was no flame bud. I do agree that the test will give more mass, but he was using sustanon as a test base, which IMO was not worth the money. But oh well, that is what I like about this board, different opinions, and everyone is different.
No hard feelings eh Ulter?

**ulter** · 07-09-2002, 08:57 AM

S30, I was real surprised you were the only one. No hard feelings at all.

***Sicilian30*** · 07-09-2002, 09:03 AM

Ahhh good.. Now I feel betta..

**jammergsxr** · 07-09-2002, 10:37 AM

Thats alot if juice for a first cycle Don IMO,For the first time I,d use 250mgs Sust. , 250mgs.Deca start small and see how your body reacts then if your doing good you can opt to up your dose.

**The Natural** · 07-09-2002, 02:56 PM

you know what jammer? YOU are right! I think I should!

***Cycleon*** · 07-09-2002, 05:21 PM

Originally posted by ulter

If I had their permission I would post the last dozen or so emails I have going back and forth helping guys who did 10 weeks of deca . They are usually 2 months behind those who use test as a base in their recovery. Of course you CAN use deca for 10 weeks. You can use it for 50 weeks. But when you come off a 10 week deca cycle you stand a very good chance of being in recovery for 3 months instead of 5 weeks. Test builds mass better than deca period. You always want more test unless you can't because you have genetics that give you unwanted sides.
I don't know all the guys here but you ask therealj, photobear, David, or Pauly if they will ever use deca for 10 weeks again and see what they say. That's only 4. If I went back through my records I could find you pile of them

Ahhh.... where is Decaman when you need him - we know how much Ulter loves nandrolone !!!!

but I hafta say I like test better myself

**ulter** · 07-09-2002, 08:00 PM

Ahhh.... where is Decaman when you need him - we know how much Ulter loves nandrolone !!!!

but I hafta say I like test better myself

TheDon, Whether you grow or not isn't as important as being comfortable with what you are doing. I am tellng you to do 500/300 because I have been doing this for 19 years and I know that's what you should use for a first cycle. But I wouldn't advise it if you're going to be stressed out about it. You have to train and get rest and you won't if you're stressed. Good Luck.