Is there a varying degree that one can be "shutdown" ?

**guest589745** · 11-25-2006, 03:37 PM

Or is it either shutdown or not?

Know what I'm sayin?

Just makin sure......

**Triple X** · 11-25-2006, 04:08 PM

Originally Posted by Skullsmasher

Or is it either shutdown or not?

Know what I'm sayin?

Just makin sure......

Absolutely can vary

**Xtralarg** · 11-25-2006, 04:10 PM

Yes, I think there is varying degree. Its something that will sneak up on you and you wont know before its possibly too late.

All IMHO, DYOR etc etc

**ecivon** · 11-25-2006, 04:11 PM

Originally Posted by Triple X

Absolutely can vary

Yeah, I agree. Sometimes might have to slap the shit out of the little bugger to get it to work.

**guest589745** · 11-25-2006, 04:15 PM

How can you determine how much any given steroid will shut you down ?

I know we are all going to vary from one to another but is there a basic way to estimate this ?

**plzr8** · 11-25-2006, 04:19 PM

Originally Posted by Skullsmasher

How can you determine how much any given steroid will shut you down ?

I know we are all going to vary from one to another but is there a basic way to estimate this ?

i can only comment on "shutdowns" from personal experience and i do believe the amount of shutdown does vary, which is why i personally stay away from deca , as i feel it has shut me down harder in the past when trying to recover during pct when compared to other anabolics

**GHO5T** · 11-25-2006, 04:21 PM

this thread and all the posts in it proves my point exactly skullsmasher

**Xtralarg** · 11-25-2006, 04:26 PM

Originally Posted by ecivon

Yeah, I agree. Sometimes might have to slap the shit out of the little bugger to get it to work.

It goes beyond 'getting the little bugger to work'.I have friends who suffer with serious psycholicical disorders due to permanent shut down/supression.

**ecivon** · 11-25-2006, 04:36 PM

Originally Posted by Xtralarg

It goes beyond 'getting the little bugger to work'.I have friends who suffer with serious psycholicical disorders due to permanent shut down/supression.

My last cycle was exactly a year ago and included deca and I have not fully recovered. Plan one beginning next week (again with deca) and will use hcg , aromasin and nolva for pct and see what happens.

**guest589745** · 11-25-2006, 04:37 PM

I must be lucky. Never had any problems (Knock on wood) with being shutdown. Only side effect I notice is acne.

**Xtralarg** · 11-25-2006, 04:38 PM

Originally Posted by ecivon

My last cycle was exactly a year ago and included deca and I have not fully recovered. Plan one beginning next week (again with deca) and will use hcg, aromasin and nolva for pct and see what happens.

When you say you hav'nt fully recovered, how exactly have you been affected?

**guest589745** · 11-25-2006, 04:40 PM

Originally Posted by GHO5T

this thread and all the posts in it proves my point exactly skullsmasher

Not really. It just proves that it can vary, not that having a higher amount of test than deca and masteron is required, or that boldenone gives you "drier gains" than deca or "quality muscle".

You have no idea what their cycles were and cannot conclude whether or not you are "right".

**magic32** · 11-25-2006, 04:44 PM

Originally Posted by Skullsmasher

Or is it either shutdown or not?

Know what I'm sayin?

Just makin sure......

No!
There are not varying degrees of 'shut down', however, there are degrees of suppression. Think of suppression in terms of illness. You can be slightly ill, moderately ill, very ill, gravely ill or dead. In this analogy 'shut down' is death, it is a definitive or absolute condition in which NO natty Test is being produced.

And as expressed earlier, it's far more than the failure of your soldier to salute. ED (Erectile Dysfunction) is merely one of many symptoms leading up to, or during 'shut down' and need not necessarily occur at all because synthetic Test alleviates the condition...which is why we run low doses of Test with suppressive gear.

Lastly, 'shut down' can have varying speeds as alluded to in earlier posts. Though MOST ALL gear run for cycle durations will eventually shut one down, some are more adept at this and thus do so much faster.

M.

**ecivon** · 11-25-2006, 04:46 PM

Originally Posted by Xtralarg

When you say you hav'nt fully recovered, how exactly have you been affected?

Libido, functionality, output, not as they were before started last cycle.

**Xtralarg** · 11-25-2006, 04:49 PM

Originally Posted by ecivon

Libido, functionality, output, not as they were before started last cycle.

Sorry to hear that, how many cycles have you done?

**ecivon** · 11-25-2006, 04:51 PM

Originally Posted by Xtralarg

Sorry to hear that, how many cycles have you done?

4th coming up. My oldest kid has a friend who is now 22, who did a deca only cycle when he was in high school on bad advice from someone he knew and he has absolutely zilch interest in sex and girls and that is sad for a kid his age.

**Hellmaskbanned** · 11-25-2006, 04:53 PM

Originally Posted by ecivon

4th coming up. My oldest kid has a friend who is now 22, who did a deca only cycle when he was in high school on bad advice from someone he knew and he has absolutely zilch interest in sex and girls and that is sad for a kid his age.

He's gonna come out of the closet soon.....

**Xtralarg** · 11-25-2006, 04:55 PM

Originally Posted by ecivon

4th coming up. My oldest kid has a friend who is now 22, who did a deca only cycle when he was in high school on bad advice from someone he knew and he has absolutely zilch interest in sex and girls and that is sad for a kid his age.

What PCT have you done and what time off between cycles have you had? I have done many more cycles than that and im fine.

**ecivon** · 11-25-2006, 04:58 PM

Originally Posted by Xtralarg

What PCT have you done and what time off between cycles have you had? I have done many more cycles than that and im fine.

I think the after effects really vary depending on the individual, even if both were doing exactly the same cycle. In the past I've always done nolva ed during cycle and then clomid and nolva post cycle. I've always followed time on = time off.

**Xtralarg** · 11-25-2006, 05:04 PM

Originally Posted by ecivon

I think the after effects really vary depending on the individual, even if both were doing exactly the same cycle. In the past I've always done nolva ed during cycle and then clomid and nolva post cycle. I've always followed time on = time off.

I agree the effects vary in individuals. Have you never used HCG as part of PCT?

**ecivon** · 11-25-2006, 05:06 PM

Originally Posted by Hellmask

He's gonna come out of the closet soon.....

He's a great kid, bad depression and hardly goes out to socialize. Just lately he's hooked up with a girl who's extra aggressive and pushy and forced the issue with him and they say she is the first he's been with since high school. Have no idea how it went, but it's been going on for a few weeks so it must be working for him.

**ecivon** · 11-25-2006, 05:10 PM

Originally Posted by Xtralarg

I agree the effects vary in individuals. Have you never used HCG as part of PCT?

Nope. But plan on HCG for this pct and will not use clomid. HCG (500iu/ed for 3 weeks), aromasin and nolva. Suggestions?

**Xtralarg** · 11-25-2006, 05:14 PM

Originally Posted by ecivon

Nope. But plan on HCG for this pct and will not use clomid. HCG (500iu/ed for 3 weeks), aromasin and nolva. Suggestions?

500iu ed for 3 weeks is fine, I always use clomid and nolva as well, sometines proviron . If I had supression I would pull out all the stops to ammend it.

**ecivon** · 11-25-2006, 05:17 PM

Originally Posted by Xtralarg

500iu ed for 3 weeks is fine, I always use clomid and nolva as well, sometines proviron . If I had supression I would pull out all the stops to ammend it.

Care to elaborate? I can get proviron easily enough and was planning to get some to have on hand.

**Xtralarg** · 11-25-2006, 05:28 PM

Originally Posted by ecivon

Care to elaborate? I can get proviron easily enough and was planning to get some to have on hand.

I usually run proviron at 50mg through PCT along with clomid at 100mg and nolva at 20mg for 20 days and have never had a problem. Hcg is done before the clomid abviously.

**skipp** · 11-25-2006, 05:36 PM

I don't even know if this can be proved through studies. I mean once you inject the test, there is no way to tell which one is exo and which one is endo. So them they move on to testing LH; Which has previously shown in some studies that it doesn't decrease a whole lot with administration of testosterone . But then you look at testicular atrophy, which doesn't even happen to all people. But is for sure a good sign of being suppressed pretty bad. It's going to be different for everyone, and I'd love to see a study that came up with a real conclusion.

**ecivon** · 11-25-2006, 05:38 PM

Originally Posted by Xtralarg

I usually run proviron at 50mg through PCT along with clomid at 100mg and nolva at 20mg for 20 days and have never had a problem. Hcg is done before the clomid abviously.

So, if I'm planning a 12 week test prop 125mg/eod; deca 200mg/ twice week; anavar 50mgs/ed last 4 weeks; long igf 60mcgs/ed week 1-4 and 8-12; run the hcg from end of cycle up to start of pct and plan clomid, nolva, aromasin and proviron for pct? Would you run nolva 20mg/ed through cycle?

**Xtralarg** · 11-25-2006, 05:43 PM

Originally Posted by ecivon

So, if I'm planning a 12 week test prop 125mg/eod; deca 200mg/ twice week; anavar 50mgs/ed last 4 weeks; long igf 60mcgs/ed week 1-4 and 8-12; run the hcg from end of cycle up to start of pct and plan clomid, nolva, aromasin and proviron for pct? Would you run nolva 20mg/ed through cycle?

I would run a-dex through cycle, if not, then nolva.

**ecivon** · 11-25-2006, 05:47 PM

Originally Posted by Xtralarg

I would run a-dex through cycle, if not, then nolva.

Okay, that's easily done. One last one though Bro, stick with a-dex even during pct, or use nolva in pct? You've been a big help appreciate it.

**Xtralarg** · 11-25-2006, 05:55 PM

Originally Posted by ecivon

Okay, that's easily done. One last one though Bro, stick with a-dex even during pct, or use nolva in pct? You've been a big help appreciate it.

I usually switch/run nolva through PCT.

**ecivon** · 11-25-2006, 05:57 PM

Originally Posted by Xtralarg

I usually switch/run nolva through PCT.

Thanks Bro, you've been a big help, especially since I'm getting ready to start. Need to get some proviron and arimidex but that is easily done.

**Xtralarg** · 11-25-2006, 05:59 PM

Originally Posted by ecivon

Thanks Bro, you've been a big help, especially since I'm getting ready to start. Need to get some proviron and arimidex but that is easily done.

No probs, Skullsmasher, sorry for hyjacking thread.

**ecivon** · 11-25-2006, 06:01 PM

Originally Posted by Xtralarg

No probs, Skullsmasher, sorry for hyjacking thread.

Yeah, Sorry Skullsmasher, though you're a good guy, probably used all that info anyway.

**guest589745** · 11-25-2006, 10:04 PM

Whatever Hijackers!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

No prob.

Bump for more opinions ?

**guest589745** · 12-17-2006, 11:33 PM

Bump for more opinions/input.

There is varying degrees of suppression depending on what compound correct?

But within the same compound, you will be just as supressed from 100mg of that compound, as you would with 500 etc etc correct ?

**worldpower** · 12-17-2006, 11:37 PM

Originally Posted by Xtralarg

It goes beyond 'getting the little bugger to work'.I have friends who suffer with serious psycholicical disorders due to permanent shut down/supression.

their shutdown permanantly by aas? what are the odds of this happening?!

**worldpower** · 12-17-2006, 11:45 PM

Originally Posted by Skullsmasher

Bump for more opinions/input.

There is varying degrees of suppression depending on what compound correct?

But within the same compound, you will be just as supressed from 100mg of that compound, as you would with 500 etc etc correct ?

as far as i know , most if not all will shut you down completly while on,even with
a small dose

**topvega** · 12-17-2006, 11:52 PM

I can only speak for myself but from reading thru these posts I guess I have been really lucky. I have done tren =A, Prop, eq, Masteron for 20+ weeks and my Pct was a basic one and I never suffered any ED symptoms.. I did go from always wanting to have sex...hehe to not caring if I did or didn't but I cld always get my equipment to work... I think high dosage not compound wld be the only factor in shutting me totally down... thank god I have not gotten there yet...

**shrpskn** · 12-18-2006, 12:44 AM

The only way one is going to be able to gauge their degree of suppression is via blood work...not physiological symptoms, as there can be many other causes to such symptoms that can be linked to shutdown.

I do believe that certain compounds have a significantly higher risk for causing complete shutdown and at certain doses shutdown can occur more quickly. However, no matter the compound, there will be some form of suppression to the HPTA which with prolonged use or compound dependent, complete shutdown will eventually occur. No ifs, ands, or buts about it...otherwise we'd all be on all the time..nobody would ever come off the sauce.

Just my .02

-ShrpSkn