the perfect cycle

[cj1capp]

i got from a different board and it may well all ready be here but i thought id post as its just good solid info IMO.

Originally Posted by: DUANABOL

INTRO:
So you want to create the perfect cycle for yourself. So how do you go about this? Well there’s a lot of things you need to know before you can sit down and create yourself a perfect cycle.

The most important thing you need to know is what your EXACT goals are for THIS cycle. From here you can figure out exactly what steroids are right for you and at what dosages.

BASICS:
So what about steroids, ancillaries, and other drugs do you need to know? You need to know the basics of the most popular drugs available.

Steroids:
-Testosterone (Enan, Cyp, Prop, Sust, Omna)/Test
-Deca -Durabolin /Deca
-Equipose/EQ
-Dianabol /D-bol
-Winstrol /Winny
-Anadrol /Drol
-Halotestin /Halo
-Anavar /Var
-Tren /Fina
-Primobolan /Primo

Ancillaries:
-Nolvadex /Nolva (Tamoxifen )
-Arimidex /Arim (Anastrozole)
-Femera/Fem (Letrozole )
-Aromasin (Exemestane)
-Clomid
-HCG
-Proviron (technically a steroid , but oft considered an ancillary)
-Finasteride/Proscar
-Bromocriptine/Bromo

Other BBing/Performance Enhancing Drugs:
-Clenbuterol /Clen
-Cytomel /Cynomel/T3
-DNP
-Insulin /Slin
-Human Growth Hormone /hGH/GH
-EPO

There are of course many other types of steroids , ancillaries and sports enhancing drugs, but they are extremely rare. I won’t go into a full discussion about each of the drugs above, but will just list properties of the drugs and state which steroids have those properties.

-Large Mass Steroids: Test, Deca, Drol, D-bol and to a lesser extent: EQ, Primo
-Strength Steroids: Test, Drol, D-bol, Tren and to a lesser extent: Halo, Var
-Steroids that have low/no aromatization: Drol, EQ, Primo, Halo, Var, Tren, Winny
-Steroids that raise red blood cell count: EQ, Drol and to a lesser extent: most others
-Low-Lean Mass Steroids: Winny, Halo, Var, Tren
-Steroids with direct fat-burning properties: Test, Tren, Var
-Mostly Androgenic Steroids: Halo, Methyltest
-Mostly Anabolic Steroids: Deca, EQ, Primo, Winny, Var
-Highly Anabolic Androgens: D-bol, Drol, Tren
-Mostly even Androgenic/Anabolic Steroids : Test
-Steroid most likely to cause aggression: Tren
-Liver Toxic Steroids: D-bol, Winny, Drol, Halo, Methyltest, Var
-Short Acting Steroids: Test Prop, D-bol, Winny, Drol, Halo, Var, Tren
-Long Acting Steroids: Test Enan, Test Cyp, Deca, EQ, Primo, Sust, Omna
-Progestins: Deca, Anadrol
-Prolactins: Tren
-Acts like an estrogen: Anadrol
-Anti-Progestin: Winny* (anecdotal evidence)
-Drugs for Mass (excluding AAS): Slin
-Drugs for Strength (excluding AAS): Slin, GH
-Anti-Aromatases: Arimidex, Femera, Aromasin, Proviron
-Anti-Estrogens: Nolvadex, Clomid
-Anti-Androgens: Finasteride
-Fat Burners: Clen, T3, DNP, GH
-Anti-Prolactin: Bromo
-Stimulates LH release: HCG
-Aids HPTA recovery: Clomid, Nolva, GH
-Drugs that increase red-blood cell count (excluding AAS): EPO, GH
-Drugs that raise IGF-1 (excluding oral AAS): Slin, GH

THEORY:
Ok so now that you know what drugs do what, we can begin to discuss what properties a cycle should have. From there we can begin to see how these drugs can be combined to form a “stack.” The idea behind the stack is to create a synergy between the drugs involved to give an effect that’s greater than the sum of the parts.

Mass Cycles:
These are cycles were all out mass is required. Here we give no consideration to fat gain, water gain or any of that stuff. We are just looking to pack on as much muscle as possible (don’t forget, water and fat are GOOD for muscle gains).

To get all out mass, we need to attack our system from all angles. We need steroids that are highly androgenic and highly anabolic. We need steroids that are known to pack on a lot of mass. In general, steroids that do not aromatize, do not activate the AR and do not pack on a lot of mass aren’t needed. For injectables we would rather have long acting esters than short ones, as the long acting esters tend to pool up in your blood and generally leave you with more hormone at any given point. For orals we prefer those that either aromatize heavily, or cause an explosion of mass by similar estrogenic properties. The use of orals is mainly to kick off the mass cycle, gives you near instant results and puts your body in a good anabolic state when the long acting esters kick in.

With all that said the best steroids for mass are: Test Enan, Test Cyp, Deca, D-bol and Drol. Advanced users can also use things like Insulin and GH.

Cutting Cycles:
Realize that with the exception of Test, Tren and Anavar, no steroid has a direct impact on fat burning. Even Test, Tren and Var have limited effects on fat burning. You shouldn’t go into a cutting cycle with the mindset of “These steroids are going to help me loose fat.” Instead you should think of the steroids as muscle sparring. Basically you’re using them to preserve the muscle that you have, while cardio and your true fat burners (like Clen, DNP and T3) work on the fat. All steroids listed above meet the first requirement; they will all help you retain muscle in a calorie deficient diet. However, if you are cutting you certainly do not want your steroids to be in the way either. Some steroids (drol) actually make it harder to loose fat. Others can bloat you up so bad that even with a low body fat percentage, most of your definition can be lost. So what we need here is steroids that are more androgenic than anabolic. We need steroids that have direct fat burning properties and steroids that do not aromatize heavily. If we do use a long acting ester, we would prefer to use one that doesn’t aromatize heavily, if the injectable does aromatize significantly, we would prefer to use a short acting ester as short acting esters don’t pool up, and an anti-aromatase would be a good idea.

Best fat burners: Clen and T3. Advanced users may also use DNP and GH

Best steroids for cutting: Test Prop, EQ, Primo, Tren, Winny, Halo, Proviron, Var

Sports/Performance Enhancing Cycles:
Now I can’t claim that I know what’s really best for a non-bodybuilding athlete. But I can take a guess and you guys that do participate in sports can probably figure it out given my explanations.

First let's look at sports that require strength without increased mass. Obviously any “mass builder” is out the door. Any steroid that aromatizes heavily is not desirable here, as the extra water will certainly make you put on weight. Your best drugs for this purpose would be: Halo, Winny, Var and GH. If you can afford a few extra pounds (like in the offseason or what not), Tren would also be a good steroid.

Now let’s look at cycles for sports that require endurance. As we’ve discussed before, some steroids increase red blood cell count significantly; this equals better endurance performance. The best drugs to use for this purpose are EQ, GH and EPO. Because EPO can have such a drastic effect on red blood cell count, it is NOT recommended that you use it along with steroids.

POST-CYCLE THERAPY (PCT):
When you use any steroid, your HPTA will be suppressed. What this means is that your system is not producing any endogenous testosterone, which means you won’t have any hormone to help maintain your gains. What good is a cycle if you can’t keep your gains? So the key to cycling is to get your endogenous test back on track ASAP.

One thing that will hinder HPTA activation is excess estrogen, whether it is from aromatizable steroids used in your cycle or whether it be endogenous estrogen. Using anti-estrogens like Clomid and Nolva will help prevent this negative feedback.

When your body sends out LH (leutinizing hormone), it signals your testicles to begin producing test again. During your cycle, LH release will be suppressed and will remain suppressed for a few weeks after your cycle. HCG mimics LH and helps your testicles start producing testosterone. For our purposes we should view HCG as a “bridge” between your cycle and the time your LH returns to normal function. However, HCG when used to heavily or for too long will actually suppress natural test production so it can be counter productive.

Different cycles will suppress your HPTA to different degrees. Cycles including Deca and Fina will be more suppressive than cycles including Var and Primo. I don’t have the energy to design a post cycle therapy for each cycle, so I will post here a post cycle therapy program that should help you recover from any sane and sensible cycle.

Before we outline the universal post-cycle therapy, we need to define when a cycle officially ends. If you are using long acting esters, your cycle ends 2-3 weeks after you take your last shot of the long ester (I wont explain why, just accept it). If you are using ONLY short acting steroids OR your last shot of long acting steroids was over 3 weeks ago, and the only thing you’ve been running since then is short acting steroids, then your cycle officially ends the last day of administration of your steroids.

So given that, here is the universal post-cycle recovery program:

HCG
2 Weeks Before End of Cycle: HCG @ 1500IUs 3 times a week
1 Week Before End of Cycle: HCG @ 1500IUs 3 times a week
First Week Post-Cycle: HCG @ 1500IUs 2 times a week

Clomid
Day 1 Post Cycle: Clomid @ 300mg
Days 2-14: Clomid @ 100mg ED
Days 15-28: Clomid @ 50mg ED

Nolva
Days 1-28: Nolva @ 20mg ED

More advanced users can also experiment with GH, Slin and DNP

Enjoy guys,
dirtyvegas

[BlackWidow]

Great post man !

[t-gunz]

looks good bro!!

[cfiler]

Nice post.

[guest589745]

I want to see someone rip this apart.............

Some good info but IMO some of it isn't as accurate as it could be.

The way they are categorized makes it seem like anything that isn't in that category doesnt have the effect of one that does.

For example, Tren is more likely to cause aggression than halo ?

[cj1capp]

I want to see someone rip this apart.............

skull do you think the info is lacking, or do yopu think its solid?

[Snrf]

So given that, here is the universal post-cycle recovery program:

HCG
2 Weeks Before End of Cycle: HCG @ 1500IUs 3 times a week
1 Week Before End of Cycle: HCG @ 1500IUs 3 times a week
First Week Post-Cycle: HCG @ 1500IUs 2 times a week

sounds like a lotta hcg doesn't it? someone correct me if i'm wrong, i thought the dose was around 500ius

[HighandWide]

Acts like an estrogen: Anadrol

don't understand this...someone explain

[HighandWide]

sounds like a lotta hcg doesn't it? someone correct me if i'm wrong, i thought the dose was around 500ius

these number seem better suited for someone how did nothing for shrinkage during the cycle and trying to get them back in a hurry.....I agree with you and would think most would prefer stretching HCG into a cycle so you aren't rushing to get natty again and possibly getting intense sides

[guest589745]

Ther is only these fast acting steroids ?

"Short Acting Steroids: Test Prop, D-bol, Winny, Drol, Halo, Var, Tren "

Trenbolone is not the only steroid that has direct fat burnign capabilities either.

[guest589745]

Cutting Cycles:
Realize that with the exception of Test, Tren and Anavar, no steroid has a direct impact on fat burning. Even Test, Tren and Var have limited effects on fat burning. You shouldn’t go into a cutting cycle with the mindset of “These steroids are going to help me loose fat.”

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...=pubmed_DocSum

Dose-dependent effects of an anabolic steroid , nandrolone phenylpropionate (Durabolin ), on body composition and muscle protein metabolism in female rats.Choo JJ, Emery PW, Rothwell NJ.
Department of Nutrition, King's College, London, UK.

The effects of three doses (1, 4 and 10 mg/kg body weight) of an anabolic steroid, nandrolone phenylpropionate (NPP), on body weight and composition, and muscle protein metabolism were investigated in female rats. Daily injections of 1 mg/kg of NPP for 10 days caused a significant increase in weight gain which was associated with an increase in body protein (9%) without affecting body fat. At higher doses this effect on body weight was attenuated, resulting in no change in body weight at 10 mg/kg. However body protein content was still increased (9%) whereas body fat content was significantly reduced (32%). NPP did not affect metabolizable energy intake at any dose tested. Body energy gain and gross energetic efficiency were both significantly reduced in animals treated with a dose of 10 mg/kg. The mass and protein content of gastrocnemius muscle were significantly increased in animals injected with NPP at all doses. Muscle protein synthesis measured in vivo was also significantly stimulated at 1 and 4 mg/kg but was not affected at 10 mg/kg. These data confirm an anabolic action of NPP and suggest highly dose-dependent effects on other parameters such as body weight, fat deposition and muscle protein synthesis.

PMID: 1952814 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]


No direct effect there I guess.

[cj1capp]

Ther is only these fast acting steroids ?

"Short Acting Steroids: Test Prop, D-bol, Winny, Drol, Halo, Var, Tren "

.

Short Acting Steroids: Test Prop, D-bol, Winny, Drol, Halo, Var, Tren
I think he is refering to short chain esters wic h i think he is correct about


Trenbolone is not the only steroid that has direct fat burnign capabilities either
he also lists these

-Low-Lean Mass Steroids: Winny, Halo, Var, Tren

[HighandWide]

Acts like an estrogen: Anadro

l

don't understand this...someone explain

[cj1capp]

Ther is only these fast acting steroids ?

"Short Acting Steroids: Test Prop, D-bol, Winny, Drol, Halo, Var, Tren "

Trenbolone is not the only steroid that has direct fat burnign capabilities either.

Cutting Cycles:
Realize that with the exception of Test, Tren and Anavar , no steroid has a direct impact on fat burning. Even Test, Tren and Var have limited effects on fat burning. You shouldn’t go into a cutting cycle with the mindset of “These steroids are going to help me loose fat.”

I think you are over reading what is said, his words are solid advice no steroid is going to help you drop fat, for the most part unless you are at a % of body fat low enough to notice its effect.

[guest589745]

I think you are over reading what is said, his words are solid advice no steroid is going to help you drop fat, for the most part unless you are at a % of body fat low enough to notice its effect.

Well that is good info to give to newbs for safety sake but according to my experience and what I have read, it is also false.

Did you read the study I posted?

Anyway, he has a good outline but he could have done a better job in the areas I mentioned IMO.

[cj1capp]

l

taken from the AR steroid fact sheet

don't understand this...someone explain

Since Anadrol is derived from DHT, it can´t actually convert to estrogen (via the aromatase enzyme), and it´s not a progestin or a compound with progestenic activity& so the estrogenic (?) side effects produced by it are of a very mysterious nature. It has been speculated that perhaps it can stimulate the estrogen receptor without actually being converted to estrogen& that´s about as plausible an explanation as I´ve heard& However, things really get strange, when Oxymetholone has been used in studies to alter the female reproductive/menstrual cycle; in those cases, it has lowered plasma progesterone levels! (7)One would expect that an AI (aromatase inhibitor) wouldn´t be of much use with this drug, but many have found that Letrozole (which has, in some cases been shown to reduce estrogen in the body to an undetectable amount)(6) can greatly reduce or even eliminate many of the more noticeable side effects of Anadrol, such as the bloating.

[guest589745]

The fact is, steroids DO "help burn fat".

[guest589745]

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...=pubmed_docsum

Aggression in male rats receiving anabolic androgenic steroids : effects of social and environmental provocation.Breuer ME, McGinnis MY, Lumia AR, Possidente BP.
Department of Cell Biology and Anatomy, Mount Sinai School of Medicine, New York, NY 10029, USA.

This study examined the effects of anabolic androgenic steroids (AAS) on aggression under different social and environmental conditions. Three AAS were tested in gonadally intact male rats: testosterone propionate (TP), nandrolone (ND), and stanozolol (ST). Doses of 5 mg/kg were given 5 times/week, with gonadally intact controls receiving vehicle only (propylene glycol). Animals received six weekly tests under each condition in a counterbalanced order. Results show that the three AAS differed in their ability to elicit aggression. Males receiving TP were more aggressive than controls, ND males were similar to controls, and ST males were less aggressive than controls. In the social and environmental provocation tests TP-treated males were more aggressive than other groups, but were able to discriminate between intact and castrated opponents and between their home cage and a neutral cage. In the environmental provocation test, TP males were also more aggressive against opponents when tested in the opponent's home cage. It is suggested that chronic exposure to high levels of TP does not eliminate the ability to discriminate between social or environmental cues, as might be expected if it induces a " 'roid rage ." However, TP does increase the likelihood that the animal will respond with aggression/dominance in a provoking situation. All three AAS variably affected serum testosterone and LH levels, as well as testes, seminal vesicle, and prostate weights. No effect on body weight was observed. Copyright 2001 Academic Press.


Many other steroids besides tren can cause aggression, winstrol however has shown to decrease it and nandrolone seems to have little effect on it. There are a few other studies that say basically the same thing too. Just wanted to show hwo test has been shown to as well.

Maybe I am being too picky but still, like I said .............

[guest589745]

he never even mentions masteron /drostanolone.

[cj1capp]

well over all i think its a very soild post and i hope bros well versed in this area will chim in.

[guest589745]

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

i got from a different board and it may well all ready be here but i thought id post as its just good solid info IMO.

Originally Posted by: DUANABOL

INTRO:
So you want to create the perfect cycle for yourself. So how do you go about this? Well there’s a lot of things you need to know before you can sit down and create yourself a perfect cycle.

The most important thing you need to know is what your EXACT goals are for THIS cycle. From here you can figure out exactly what steroids are right for you and at what dosages.

BASICS:
So what about steroids, ancillaries, and other drugs do you need to know? You need to know the basics of the most popular drugs available.

Steroids:
-Testosterone (Enan, Cyp, Prop, Sust, Omna)/Test
-Nandrolone - decanoate, phenylpropionate, Cyclohexylpropionate
-Equipose/Boldenone - Undeclynate, propionate
-Dianabol /D-bol/methandrostenolone /methandienone
-Winstrol /Winny/stanozolol
-Anadrol /Drol/Oxymetholone
-Halotestin /Halo/Fluoxymesterone
-Anavar /Var/Oxandrolone
-Tren /Fina- acetate, enanthate , HexaHydroBencylCarbonate
-Primobolan /Primo - acetate, enanthate
-Drostanolone/masteron-propionate enanthate

Ancillaries:
-Nolvadex /Nolva (Tamoxifen )
-Arimidex /Arim (Anastrozole)
-Femera/Fem (Letrozole )
-Aromasin (Exemestane)
-Clomid
-HCG
-Proviron (technically a steroid , but oft considered an ancillary)
-Finasteride/Proscar
-Bromocriptine/Bromo
-Cabergoline/Caber

Other BBing/Performance Enhancing Drugs:
-Clenbuterol /Clen
-Cytomel /Cynomel/T3
-DNP
-Insulin /Slin/IGF-1 LR3
-Human Growth Hormone /hGH/GH
-EPO

There are of course many other types of steroids , ancillaries and sports enhancing drugs, but they are extremely rare. I won’t go into a full discussion about each of the drugs above, but will just list properties of the drugs and state which steroids have those properties.

-Large Mass Steroids: Test, Deca , Drol, D-bol and to a lesser extent: EQ, Primo *WTF?
-Strength Steroids: Test, Drol, D-bol, Tren and to a lesser extent: Halo *WTF?, Var
-Steroids that have low/no aromatization: Drol, EQ, Primo, Halo, Var, Tren, Winny, drostanolone
-Steroids that raise red blood cell count: EQ, Drol and to a lesser extent: most others
-Low-Lean Mass Steroids: Winny, Halo, Var, Tren
-Steroids with direct fat-burning properties: Test, Tren, Var *What else?
-Mostly Androgenic Steroids: Halo, Methyltest
-Mostly Anabolic Steroids: Deca, EQ, Primo, Winny, Var
-Highly Anabolic Androgens: D-bol, Drol, Tren
-Mostly even Androgenic/Anabolic Steroids : Test
-Steroid most likely to cause aggression: Tren *Thats all?
-Liver Toxic Steroids: D-bol, Winny, Drol, Halo, Methyltest, Var
-Short Acting Steroids: Test Prop, D-bol, Winny, Drol, Halo, Var, Tren * So any tren is "short acting" ? What about nandrolone phenylpropionate ? drostanolone propionate ?
-Long Acting Steroids: Test Enan, Test Cyp, Deca *"Deca" Is all "Long acting" ? Nandrolone decanoate would be a better/more accurate description, EQ same thing, Primo, Sust, Omna
-Progestins: Deca, Anadrol
-Prolactins: Tren
-Acts like an estrogen: Anadrol
-Anti-Progestin: Winny* (anecdotal evidence)
-Drugs for Mass (excluding AAS): Slin
-Drugs for Strength (excluding AAS): Slin, GH
-Anti-Aromatases: Arimidex, Femera, Aromasin, Proviron
-Anti estrogenic steroids: Stanozolol, drostanolone
-Anti-Estrogens: Nolvadex, Clomid, -Anti-Androgens: Finasteride
-Fat Burners: Clen, T3, DNP, GH
-Anti-Prolactin: Bromo, Cabergoline
-Stimulates LH release: HCG
-Aids HPTA recovery: Clomid, Nolva, GH
-Drugs that increase red-blood cell count (excluding AAS): EPO, GH
-Drugs that raise IGF-1 (excluding oral AAS): Slin, GH

THEORY:
Ok so now that you know what drugs do what, we can begin to discuss what properties a cycle should have. From there we can begin to see how these drugs can be combined to form a “stack.” The idea behind the stack is to create a synergy between the drugs involved to give an effect that’s greater than the sum of the parts.

Mass Cycles:
These are cycles were all out mass is required. Here we give no consideration to fat gain, water gain or any of that stuff. We are just looking to pack on as much muscle as possible (don’t forget, water and fat are GOOD for muscle gains).

To get all out mass, we need to attack our system from all angles. We need steroids that are highly androgenic and highly anabolic. We need steroids that are known to pack on a lot of mass. In general, steroids that do not aromatize, do not activate the AR and do not pack on a lot of mass aren’t needed. For injectables we would rather have long acting esters than short ones, as the long acting esters tend to pool up in your blood and generally leave you with more hormone at any given point. *Short esters contain more active hormone on a MG to MG basis. Long esters tend to keep blood levels more stable but that isnt what he said so I have to disagree.For orals we prefer those that either aromatize heavily, or cause an explosion of mass by similar estrogenic properties. The use of orals is mainly to kick off the mass cycle, gives you near instant results and puts your body in a good anabolic state when the long acting esters kick in.


Just a few little things that I would change. Its not awful by any means though.

[guest589745]

skull do you think the info is lacking, or do yopu think its solid?

Its a good start for a lot of people, not bad but not perfect.

[notorious_mem]

good read

[BG]

I almost cryed at the end of The Perfect Storm.

[guest589745]

I almost cryed at the end of The Perfect Storm.

[BG]

sounds like a lotta hcg doesn't it? someone correct me if i'm wrong, i thought the dose was around 500ius

When I did pcts, I used 1000iu's eod as my doctor perscribed, worked well with nolva.

[BG]

Gotta save some face.

[cj1capp]

still looking for more input

[cj1capp]

well i liked it !

[Growingpains]

Excellent!

[crazycrab]

very nice

[magic32]

Good initial post CJ it has some valuable info, but as cited it is lacking on some of the finer points.

Skull raises an often overlooked point about the 'pure' fat burning properties of several compounds. Of course, you'll get better aesthetic results if bf is low, cardio is performed, diet is strict, etc., but the fact of the matter is that multiple studies have been performed on numerous sample groups proving statistically significant fat loss (and muscle development) without any form of exercise. And such properties are certainly consistent with the 'original' intent for the development of these medications.

For obvious reasons we don't broadcast this information, nevertheless it is fact, and that's all Skull is saying.

I enjoyed both the review and the debate.

M.

[guest589745]

Good initial post CJ it has some valuable info, but as cited it is lacking on some of the finer points.

Skull raises an often overlooked point about the 'pure' fat burning properties of several compounds. Of course, you'll get better aesthetic results if bf is low, cardio is performed, diet is strict, etc., but the fact of the matter is that multiple studies have been performed on numerous sample groups proving statistically significant fat loss (and muscle development) without any form of exercise. And such properties are certainly consistent with the 'original' intent for the development of these medications.

For obvious reasons we don't broadcast this information, nevertheless it is fact, and that's all Skull is saying.

I enjoyed both the review and the debate.

M.

Thanks magic, I agree completely with your statement above.