Prop + Tren + Proviron?

[Taurus]

on Jan 1st i will be starting my thrid cycle, Prop/tren /var cutting cycle for 10 weeks.

i've been reading that proviron will help give my muscles a hard look and this is exactly what i am going for. i can get proviron cheaper than i can get nolva funnily enough. i've been searching the forums to get my questions answered.

1) can proviron be taken instead of nolv during a cycle to combat estrogen?
2) what are the sides on proviron besides hairloss?
3) i will be doing pct with nolv/clomid... but can proviron be taken during pct too? (i have read some threads that say it shouldnt be taken uring pct, and ive read some threads which say they swear by it during pct).

[GHO5T]

on Jan 1st i will be starting my thrid cycle, Prop/tren /var cutting cycle for 10 weeks.

i've been reading that proviron will help give my muscles a hard look and this is exactly what i am going for. i can get proviron cheaper than i can get nolva funnily enough. i've been searching the forums to get my questions answered.

1) can proviron be taken instead of nolv during a cycle to combat estrogen?
2) what are the sides on proviron besides hairloss?
3) i will be doing pct with nolv/clomid... but can proviron be taken during pct too? (i have read some threads that say it shouldnt be taken uring pct, and ive read some threads which say they swear by it during pct).

Anabolic Review Steroid Profile: Proviron (Mesterolone)

A good read, many of your questions can be answered after you read this. If you have any further questions just let us know.

[Taurus]

a few questions i have regarding the thread:

1) it says proviron can be used as an oral with test. does that mean i dont need the var?

2) it says it can be used in pct...but it didnt say whether it is better than nolv.

it did however answer that if i'm using it on cycle to prevent estrogen related sides, then i dont need the nolv as this does the same thing.

[G-1000]

you will still need b-6

[Taurus]

you will still need b-6

b-6?

for what exactly? is it in pill form or also an inectable? dosage specifics?

(i know i could do a search but i am limited in time as i am checking this from work...sorry guys).

[G-1000]

to lower prolactin levels 200mg day work fin.

[Swifto]

on Jan 1st i will be starting my thrid cycle, Prop/tren /var cutting cycle for 10 weeks.

i've been reading that proviron will help give my muscles a hard look and this is exactly what i am going for. i can get proviron cheaper than i can get nolva funnily enough. i've been searching the forums to get my questions answered.

1) can proviron be taken instead of nolv during a cycle to combat estrogen? Your talking about two entiraly different compounds.

Nolva is a SERM and will block estrogenic sides fairly well. It can be used during PCT or if prone to estrogenic sides when "on". Note it shouldnt really be used with a 19-Nor also.

Proviron is a steroid and bind to the aromotase enzyme, reducing estrogen, SHBG. My personal experience with Proviron would state thats its not a good compound to prevent/stop esrogenic sides but better at reducing SHBG and masking a decrease in sex drive. A near perfect compound for PCT then I'd say.

In your case, as your running a 19-Nor (Tren), Letro's use may be warranted. Though it depends on how prone to estrogenic/progestenic sides you are? If your not, then Aromasin or Arimidex/Liquidex could be used. However, I would not be using Nolva with a 19-Nor, as already stated above. Problems can occur when combining the two, possibly increasing progestic sides.

2) what are the sides on proviron besides hairloss?

I have never experienced any at all. I would say the study I have seen on Proviron and its HPTA suppressiveness was done on less than 150mg/ED. So could one assume over this its may be suppressive? Possibly. I wont be using over this figure during PCT, exactly for this reason.

3) i will be doing pct with nolv/clomid... but can proviron be taken during pct too? (i have read some threads that say it shouldnt be taken uring pct, and ive read some threads which say they swear by it during pct).

I've used it with no adverse sides or compromising my PCT in any way, shape or form. Read this thread I wrote on it:

Use PROVIRON during PCT!

[Swifto]

to lower prolactin levels 200mg day work fin.

Personally, I wouldnt be using more than 100mg/ED. It reduces androgen gene-transcription and can damage the CNS at higher doses.

[G-1000]

Personally, I wouldnt be using more than 100mg/ED. It reduces androgen gene-transcription and can damage the CNS at higher doses.

Why i have run 500mg a day for 12 weeks and had 0 problems.

[Swifto]

Why i have run 500mg a day for 12 weeks and had 0 problems.

Study:

Vitamin B6 modulates transcriptional activation by multiple members of the steroid hormone receptor superfamily.

Allgood VE,
Cidlowski JA.
Department of Physiology, University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill 27599-7545.Recent studies have shown that vitamin B6 modulates transcriptional activation by the human glucocorticoid receptor in HeLa S3 cells. We have now examined the possibility that vitamin B6 might similarly influence transcriptional activation by the glucocorticoid receptor in other cell types, as well as gene expression mediated by other members of the steroid hormone receptor superfamily. We show that elevated vitamin B6 concentrations suppress by 40-65% the level of transcription mediated through the endogenous murine L cell glucocorticoid receptor, as well as the human receptor transfected into E8.2 and T47D cells. In contrast, glucocorticoid receptor-mediated transcription was enhanced 60-110% in mild vitamin deficiency. The level of hormone-independent constitutive gene expression was not affected by these same alterations in vitamin B6 concentration. These studies indicated that the transcriptional modulatory effects of the vitamin were neither restricted to specific cell types nor limited to the human form of the glucocorticoid receptor. We next determined if hormone-induced transcription by several other steroid receptors (androgen, progesterone, and estrogen receptors) was analogously affected by alterations in vitamin B6 concentration. Analysis of gene expression mediated through the mouse mammary tumor virus promoter revealed that transcriptional activation of both the androgen and progesterone receptors was reduced by 35-40% under conditions of elevated vitamin B6 and enhanced by 60-90% in deficiency, again under conditions where constitutive expression was unaffected. Using a different promoter, the estrogen-regulated vitellogenin promoter, we found that transcriptional activation of the estrogen receptor was similarly affected. Estrogen-induced gene expression was reduced by 30% under conditions of elevated intracellular vitamin B6 and enhanced by 85% in vitamin deficiency. Thus, vitamin B6 modulates transcriptional activation by multiple classes of steroid hormone receptors. The similarities in vitamin B6 effects on transcription mediated through different promoters, the mouse mammary tumor virus and vitellogenin promoters, suggest that this vitamin may modulate the expression of a diverse array of hormonally responsive genes. These observations together support the hypothesis that vitamin B6 represents a physiological modulator of steroid hormone action.
PMID: 1310983 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]


The Food and Nutrition Board of the Institute of Medicine has established a tolerable intake level (UL) for vitamin B6 of 100 mg per day for all adults.

[G-1000]

Study:

Vitamin B6 modulates transcriptional activation by multiple members of the steroid hormone receptor superfamily.

Allgood VE,
Cidlowski JA.
Department of Physiology, University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill 27599-7545.Recent studies have shown that vitamin B6 modulates transcriptional activation by the human glucocorticoid receptor in HeLa S3 cells. We have now examined the possibility that vitamin B6 might similarly influence transcriptional activation by the glucocorticoid receptor in other cell types, as well as gene expression mediated by other members of the steroid hormone receptor superfamily. We show that elevated vitamin B6 concentrations suppress by 40-65% the level of transcription mediated through the endogenous murine L cell glucocorticoid receptor, as well as the human receptor transfected into E8.2 and T47D cells. In contrast, glucocorticoid receptor-mediated transcription was enhanced 60-110% in mild vitamin deficiency. The level of hormone-independent constitutive gene expression was not affected by these same alterations in vitamin B6 concentration. These studies indicated that the transcriptional modulatory effects of the vitamin were neither restricted to specific cell types nor limited to the human form of the glucocorticoid receptor. We next determined if hormone-induced transcription by several other steroid receptors (androgen, progesterone, and estrogen receptors) was analogously affected by alterations in vitamin B6 concentration. Analysis of gene expression mediated through the mouse mammary tumor virus promoter revealed that transcriptional activation of both the androgen and progesterone receptors was reduced by 35-40% under conditions of elevated vitamin B6 and enhanced by 60-90% in deficiency, again under conditions where constitutive expression was unaffected. Using a different promoter, the estrogen-regulated vitellogenin promoter, we found that transcriptional activation of the estrogen receptor was similarly affected. Estrogen-induced gene expression was reduced by 30% under conditions of elevated intracellular vitamin B6 and enhanced by 85% in vitamin deficiency. Thus, vitamin B6 modulates transcriptional activation by multiple classes of steroid hormone receptors. The similarities in vitamin B6 effects on transcription mediated through different promoters, the mouse mammary tumor virus and vitellogenin promoters, suggest that this vitamin may modulate the expression of a diverse array of hormonally responsive genes. These observations together support the hypothesis that vitamin B6 represents a physiological modulator of steroid hormone action.
PMID: 1310983 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]


The Food and Nutrition Board of the Institute of Medicine has established a tolerable intake level (UL) for vitamin B6 of 100 mg per day for all adults.

I have read it before.

[Swifto]

I have read it before.

I thought you may have.

I'd use a maximum of 100mg/ED for the benifits you stated.

Although its a study and not real world experience I'd still go with the dose I stated above. I remember Marcus stating he's used more than this and didnt experience any negative sides the study mentions.

People differ greatly so use which works for you.

If you used 500mg/ED and it worked and you didnt feel it, in any way, reduced the effectiveness of your cycle, use that dose.

[Taurus]

I've used it with no adverse sides or compromising my PCT in any way, shape or form. Read this thread I wrote on it:

Use PROVIRON during PCT!

so basically your saying nolv should not be used with tren (19-nor), and proviron isnt as good an estrogen blocker as nolv. This only leaves me with letro, or arimadex right. Letro is too strong, i'll look up armiadex/liquidex... what should my doses be for armidex?

[Taurus]

can l-dex be used instead of nolv during pct? i normally do a nolv/clomid pct... i was just wondering whether l-dex can be substitued for nolv?

[Mighty Joe]

Proviron made my test/prop cycle a success!

MJ

[Taurus]

bump on the dose of l-dex and whether takin l-dex for pct over nolv is a good idea or not?

[Mista Massive]

l-dex at 0.25mg/day is enough to reduce bloat and keep gyno away

[Mista Massive]

as far as PCT goes. you will need to make your own decision on what u believ will work best. some say just nolva. some say nolva + clomid. and some say nolva + clomid + arimidex .


check out the PCT forum and read the sticky's. i will be going with pheedno's PCT for my cycle which is nearly finished.

[Mista Massive]

b-6?

for what exactly? is it in pill form or also an inectable? dosage specifics?

(i know i could do a search but i am limited in time as i am checking this from work...sorry guys).

i know B6 comes in pill form, unsure about injectable form.

i know B12 comes in both injectable and pill.

did a search last night and couldn't find any injectable B6. does it exist?

[G-1000]

i know B6 comes in pill form, unsure about injectable form.

i know B12 comes in both injectable and pill.

did a search last night and couldn't find any injectable B6. does it exist?

b-12 complex has b-6 in it.

[Mista Massive]

but if u wish to take B6 by itself, which is what i think you suggested to this guy taurus, did you mean the tabs?