My first cycle

[HoytT]

And my first post!

Well here goes...

I'm 23 years old and have been training die hard for about five years. I train seven days a week with at least one or two "two a days" throughout the week. In the last six months I've only taken two days off from training. When I started lifting i weighed 128, now I'm up to about 152 with, this is a guess, probably 9% body fat (i never get it taken, but I'll include a pic of where I'm at right now). I'm a pretty hard gainer tho (as you can see given how long it took me to gain weight). I've been eating about 4000 calories a day and workin' out like a fiend, but i seem to have stalled so I'm considering my first cycle. I've been intrigued by steroids for some time, reading all the profiles on this site as well as any other research material I can find.

My Goal: 15lbs. of lean muscle mass and get down to 5% body fat, which i hope to maintain.

Given that I had a cycle all planned out... and then i hit a few road bumps (I'll get into it in a minute), but here's what i had planned:

weeks 1-8
Deca-Durabolin (Organon) - 200mg/week
Sustanon250 (Organon) 500mg/week
Arimidex - 0.5mg/day

weeks 8-12
Masteron - 300mg/week
Clenbuterol - begin at 20mcgs a day and work up as necessary. (more for the anti-catabolic effect than for the fat loss, as i rely on a very strict diet and cardio to burn any extra pounds).

And then I'll do HCG and Clomid treatment to kickstart my natural test production.

I'll also be running propecia (gotta at least slow the hairloss a little) and probably some bactrim or accutane to help keep the acne in check.

So, with that info, here are my road bumps:

1. I've recently become intrigued reading about Trenbolone ( it seems like the perfect steroid), do you think I could sub that into the cycle in place of the Deca for better gains? If so (assuming i intend to use British Dragon products) would you recommend the Parabolan (Tren hexahydrobenzylcarbonate), the Trenabol (trenbolone enanthate), trenbolone acetate, or Trinabol (a combo of all three each at 50mg)?

2. If i do decide to go with the tren, will Arimidex still help counter the gyno? Or, because Tren does not affect estrogen, instead affecting progestin, will I need a different form of protetction?

Any help and or suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Also, if i've violated any rules or left out any neccessary info please let me know.

Thanks!!

P.S. if you want to see pics of where I'm currently at, they are attached.

[theboss]

i think you are over training.....take more days off and let yourself grow.

oh...and no need for all those compounds for a 1st cycle....everyone will tell you to just use Test for 10-12 weeks........a PCT of Nolvadex would suffice if you must use AAS.

[Tesla]

Why do you want to take clen? You're already ripped to shreds.

[HoytT]

I'm hoping to get SHREDDED beyond belief, the lower abs just aren't getting to where I want them.

I've been told before that I may be over training... I hate taking days off tho... i love to train... i'm hoping the AAS might speed up my recovery time enough to eliminate the need to take days off.

[SMAN12b]

Way WAY too much for a first cycle !!! your goals can actually be obtained by your diet and training alone. You can use the clen to help aid in fat loss but for what you are looking at, you don't need steroids !!

[z3488]

I'm hoping to get SHREDDED beyond belief, the lower abs just aren't getting to where I want them.

I've been told before that I may be over training... I hate taking days off tho... i love to train... i'm hoping the AAS might speed up my recovery time enough to eliminate the need to take days off.

Perhaps the worst idea ever. Half of getting stronger is how you lift and the other part is how you rest. Try doing a little bit less core and cardio. That may help you pack on some pounds. I think anything under 180 using juice is a waste. I know what eating 4,000 calories a day and 300+ grams of protein is. IT IS NOT EASY! I have done it for the last year. Post up your diet. Ill bet you are shorting yourself. I am actully younger than you, and I have been gaining hard off of nothing at all except intense workouts, spot on diet, and rest. Wait till you hit at least 180, and then start the juice. Hope this helps.
-Z

[UberSteroids]

Hey Chief! Get on a good bulking diet!
If You trained "die hard" for past 5 years, You'd be more than 150-160s. With the right workout split and diet, I don't care if You are hard gainer or not, You'd be more than 150s for sure. So yeah, before You do it, why don't You post up Your current diet and workout split for a review. Because it is a MUST that these are in check before You start Your first cycle!

About cycle itself, I wouldn't mix so much, You want to see how Your body will react to everything, so... start off with one. Test E only cycle would be something to do.

Get that diet and workout routine here first.

Take care

[pigrond]

you definately need to get a day or 2 off to recover you cant grow if you over train .your strength will stay stuck at 1 limit and its almost impossible to break that limit until you start to let your body recover ,and dude you are ripped no doubt you're working hard at it just try to get 1 to 2 days off a wk and you will see some gains ,tren is to much for a 1st cycle way to harsh and decca has to be run for 12 wks ,and as everyone here will tell you test is the best for a 1st cycle probably wouldnt hurt to throw in some dbol for 4-5 wks but thats my opinion ,and even tho the steroids will help you recover from your intense workout over training will still eat up your muscle especially when you come off ,clen will stop catabolism of the muscle but you really dont have much fat to burn so theres not much reason for you to use it ,unless your trying to be crack head skinny

[HoytT]

Hey guys, thanks for the replies!

Here's a little more on my training regiment and diet:

Exercises grouped together with a "<" are supersets.

Training:

Monday - Chest and Abs

I go in a pyramid, beginning with a moderate weight for 10-12 reps in my first set and get progressively heavier while lowering the reps, usually finishing with a set of three to five, whatever causes failure.

Flat bench - 4 sets + 1 forced negative above estimated max + 1 drop set (Best is 225 for a double)
Incline bench(smith) - 3 sets + 1 drop set
Decline bench - 4 sets
Flat dumbell press - 3 sets

<Pec Deck - 3 sets
<Cable crossovers - 3 sets

Burnout on pushups

Abs for about an hour, i'll detail the ab workout at the end.

Tuesday - Back and Abs

Deadlift - 4 sets (max is 405)

<Lat pulldowns - 4 sets
<Reverse lat pulldowns - 4 sets

<Gorilla pulls - 4 sets
<T-bar rows - 4 sets

<One hand pull downs - 3 sets
<Dumbell rows - 3 sets

Burnout with bodyweight pull ups and another exercise of choice.

Abs for an hour.

Wednesday - Arms and Abs

<Olympic bar curls - 4 sets (best is 135lbs. for 4)
<Skullcrushers - 4 sets

<Preacher curls - 4 sets
<tricep extension machine - 4 sets

<Hammer curls - 4 sets
<Tricep rope extensions - 4 sets

<spider curls - 4 sets
<Pull-downs - 4 sets

<One hand cable curls - 3 sets
<cable kickbacks - 3 sets

Burnout with a superset of 50 curls on an olympic bar with dips(weighted).

Hour of abs.

Thursday - Shoulders and Abs

Military press - 4 sets
Icarian shoulder press - 4 sets
Rear delt machine - 4 sets

<John Henry's - 3 sets
<Truck drivers - 3 sets
<Front dumbell raises - 3 sets
(It's a triple superset)

Shrugs (dumbell or barbell) - 3 sets

Abs for an hour.

Friday - Back and Chest and abs.

<Flat bench - 3 sets (lighter, higher reps than monday)
<Lat pull downs - 3 sets (lighter, higher reps than tuesday)

<Incline bench - 3 sets
<Gorilla pulls - 3 sets

2 more chest/back supersets, i vary them based on what i feel like doing that day, they could include seated rows, hammer strength chest presses, and so forth.

Abs for an hour.

Saturday - All abs all day!

1200 reps.

+

On saturday nights i like to do another arm workout, similar to the one on wednesday.

Sunday - Legs

Squats - 4 sets (max is 325)
Leg press - 10 sets of 10.

<Leg extensions - 3 sets
<leg curls - 3 sets

Burnout on lunges.

My ab workout usually looks about like(all supersetted):

flat bench leg raises (think Rocky) 8 sets of 30
Hanging leg raises 8 sets of 20
Roman chair 4 sets of 30
Weigthed cable crunches 4 sets of 25
100 situps in the morning and 100 more before bed.

Sorry for the horrendously long post, i'll shorten up the part about my diet.

8 meals a day roughly 100 fat(90% unsaturated) 150 carbs, and 450 protein. Mostly chicken/tuna/turkey, vegetables(brocoli, green beans, spinach), protein shakes, low carb high fiber burrito shells, fat free cheese, skim milk, extra lean beef, and PEANUT BUTTER.

[auslifta]

i would strongly disagree with going down the aas path now. try day on day off, one body part per workout eg chest,rest ,back, rest, legs, rest,shoulders,rest......ect. your in a good state to negate the need for cardio. i know you dont want to gain any fat but you can lose this after you gain 15-20. if you unfortunatly decide to do aas keep it simple 500mg/week test E shot twice a week for 10-12 weeks. but you will prob lose most of your gains this way.i really believe after 30 weeks you will be in same condition either path you chose only no risk natty.
good luck

[auslifta]

oh yeah i think you are over traing abs

[HoytT]

Taking days off is kinda outta the question... i've gotta train every day, i can't stand not being in the gym. It seems that if i do intend to go the aas route that most people are recommending a test only cycle, but the more I read about tren, the better it sounds: increased feed efficiency, accelerated aggression, no water retention, better ability to sustain gains than with straight test. Any testimony on just how harsh it is?

[Bigmax]

Trust me tren is harsh on your body and on the system...But i dont care what you use...your progress be will slow if any...you sound obessed bro...no rest=no growth...the gym is where you go to break your body down...eating and resting is how you recover.

[ekeaz]

Wow you are definitly a fiend bro... but IMO you should seriously make time for some rest... just like everyone else has told you... if you do not rest then you do not grow plain and simple... but as for your first cycle... when I did my first cycle I weighed about as much as you and about an inch shorter but I did Test E 400 every week for 12 weeks and the first 5 weeks I did 30mg of dbol to kick start it... my friend is on it now too and so far so good... ask if you have any questions.

[goalseeker]

Dont run Tren...... you need a few more cycles under your belt before messin with that stuff. Trust me, I know...

[HoytT]

BigMax,

What kinda sides did you experience from the tren bro? Any feedback would be much appreciated.

Ekeaz,

What kinda weight gains did you make on that first cycle? How much were you able to retain?

[Bigmax]

Well,Hot as hell all the time...I did wake up in a pool of sweat all the time...but worse of all my Hdl was way off when I went get to my blood work done...irritability is also higher when I use tren...Trust me it is a good compound but toxic as all hell!!!...you're more than likly not ready for it bro...

[testosterona]

if you can't stand to take days off, your not ready to grow, period. you need to learn gow to split your training/rest so you can maximize your muscle growth and protien sythisis. i bet if you started training eod youd start growing like a fiend!

test

[SuperLift]

take some rest days bro, you need em. let your body recover from all the hard work. also dont want to get burned out. lookin real shredded tho.

[testosterona]

yeah ^^, you do look shredded as a mofo. good work so far man!

test

[ekeaz]

BigMax,

What kinda sides did you experience from the tren bro? Any feedback would be much appreciated.

Ekeaz,

What kinda weight gains did you make on that first cycle? How much were you able to retain?

I made significant weight gains on my first cyle... I would say like 25 lbs and kept a good 20 lbs of it. But it differs from person to person. And you need to run a good PCT also. And like I said earlier. Take sometime to rest man it won't hurt at all.

[stacked566]

I'm on my first run through with tren. Sides noted so far: mild increase in acne, increased irritability, sweating in my sleep pretty bad. Other than that great compound. You aren't ready for it. I used to be like you when I first started training, training 7 days a week and some two a days....then i switched to a 4 day split...blew up- 20lbs blew up in 2.5 months with a decent diet. If you switched to a split that allowed adequate rest and continued eating for a month or two, then jumped on a simple test cycle...you could be 200lbs and pretty cut. This looks a lot better than 170 or so ripped to shreds.

[ekeaz]

I agree with stacked hoytT... you need to split your training up... It will make for some real quality growth.

[HoytT]

Man that would be rough... i won't know what to do with all the free time away from the gym. But if it's gonna help me make gains i guess i gotta go with it.

[Swifto]

Your training split needs some work. And so does your cycle.

First cycle = 1 compound, possibly one oral.

[ekeaz]

I think that ^^^ one oral cycle is wrong IMO. I think you should run Test E for like 10 or 12 weeks with 30 mg of Dbol the first 4 weeks. IMHO.

(No offense to Swifto, I just haven't heard good things about just running one oral.)

[SMCengineer]

He was referring to 1 injectable compound with the possibilty of adding one oral as a kickstart.

[Swifto]

He was referring to 1 injectable compound with the possibilty of adding one oral as a kickstart.

Certainly was.

If you want to run an oral only cycle for your first, thats fine. Make sure you choose a decnt compound, run it at a decent dose and for long enough.

Tbol and Var alone seem to work well.

[ekeaz]

Certainly was.

If you want to run an oral only cycle for your first, thats fine. Make sure you choose a decnt compound, run it at a decent dose and for long enough.

Tbol and Var alone seem to work well.

I agree with that completely.

[yenstrol]

bro u have to rest or u will go nowhere. period

[Peducho0113]

I think you have to rest more, try one day on and one day off and a good diet, and you will accomplish the results that you are looking for. As for your first cycle I think you are going to be using too much/ way too many AA, so try to go with a simpler cycle. Test 500 per week 12 weeks.

you are looking very good so keep up the good work.