Beginner needing barely noticeable gains

**linksys2400** · 06-17-2007, 10:39 AM

Hey everyone, I've read manys posts as a guest over the past month, but I'm not finding a specific answer to my question.

I have been lifting steadily for 4 years. I am 6'1" 208lbs with 15% BF. I lift hard 5 times a week, isolating different muscle groups. I run 1/2 mile after every workout, and a compete in MMA 3 times a week. I eat extremely healthy with no preservatives and rarely any sugars. I take whey protein, multi-vitamin and ZMA. But I've seemed to reach a plateau no matter what I change up...

I will not shoot, due to the fact that I have roomates that would not be trustworthy if they found any evidence ; I think pills are easier to disguise. I am also in the guard, so I was want to stick with testosterone since it leaves your system very quickly and I could stop taking it before drill (good idea??). I also can't have too noticeable of gains because my commander is very observant.

With all this being said I was wondering if andriol is the answer for me?
8 pills of andriol daily for 4 weeks, with the contunuation of my protein and workout? I know andriol is pricey and I know the gains are slow, both of these facts are okay with me.

If any of you experts have any better ideas for my specific case then please let me know.

**gixxerboy1** · 06-17-2007, 10:42 AM

wow. Dude you are way off.

Also if your training that much with that much cardio (mma and running) I guarantee your diets your problem. I would post that up. If your diets off taking anything isn't going to help

**SMAN12b** · 06-17-2007, 10:50 AM

YEP, steroids are NOT the answer for you....sorry. Your diet is NOT as good as you may think..... you may eat healthy, but that doesn't mean you are eating correctly for your goals.

**linksys2400** · 06-17-2007, 11:12 AM

Yeah, it very well could be my diet.

My diet consists of:

Breakfast : 4 egg omelet with Gold Whey protein shake
Lunch: 2 cans of tuna and protein shake.
Before workout (around 5): 2 turkey sandwiches with whole grain bread & protein shake.
After workout: Protein shake within 30 mins of workout, also either grilled chicken breast, steak or salmon.
Before bed: More turkey or chicken and protein shake. Then I take my ZMA.

During the day I will snack on walnuts and almonds. With most of my meals I also eat grilled vegetables and fresh fruit that I always have readily available. I have been eating like this for 5 months straight...rarely breaking the groove.

I've always had high bodyfat percentage. I look like I'm in really good shape, people accuse me all the time of being on roids. I am currently max{correctly} benching 320 as well.

**SMAN12b** · 06-17-2007, 11:38 AM

Originally Posted by linksys2400

Yeah, it very well could be my diet.

My diet consists of:

Breakfast : 4 egg omelet with Gold Whey protein shake
Lunch: 2 cans of tuna and protein shake.
Before workout (around 5): 2 turkey sandwiches with whole grain bread & protein shake.
After workout: Protein shake within 30 mins of workout, also either grilled chicken breast, steak or salmon.
Before bed: More turkey or chicken and protein shake. Then I take my ZMA.

During the day I will snack on walnuts and almonds. With most of my meals I also eat grilled vegetables and fresh fruit that I always have readily available. I have been eating like this for 5 months straight...rarely breaking the groove.

I've always had high bodyfat percentage. I look like I'm in really good shape, people accuse me all the time of being on roids. I am currently max{correctly} benching 320 as well.

YEP, its not that your diet is terrible, BUT it is NOT a diet for cutting BF
You got NO carbs !!!
TOO many shakes

Check out the diet forum. You will be amazed at how the CORRECT eating can drop BF on you!!!

I really don't think steroids are what you need right now as diet has to be even MORE on the ball while using steroids

**linksys2400** · 06-17-2007, 12:07 PM

Thanks, I will definately look more into the dieting section.

What's your advice on the andriol after my new diet? Should I stick with testosterone since I need my levels rapidly normal before drill?

**gooer** · 06-17-2007, 12:25 PM

you could try clen

**mickdiesel** · 06-17-2007, 12:26 PM

u should bot be juicing. drol is def not a mild compound. ull grow a lot and quick. tbol is pretty much oral test and is very mild but u don't need juice. u need creatine and supps. "barely noticeable" gains usually come from not doing the roids right and training shitty. good luck though cause I know no matter what we say ur not gonna listen. be well

**mickdiesel** · 06-17-2007, 12:31 PM

oh u said andriol , not anadrol . yeah that's mild but u still don't need it. get the diet straight first

***perfectbeast2001*** · 06-17-2007, 01:02 PM

Originally Posted by linksys2400

Yeah, it very well could be my diet.

My diet consists of:

Breakfast : 4 egg omelet with Gold Whey protein shake
Lunch: 2 cans of tuna and protein shake.
Before workout (around 5): 2 turkey sandwiches with whole grain bread & protein shake.
After workout: Protein shake within 30 mins of workout, also either grilled chicken breast, steak or salmon.
Before bed: More turkey or chicken and protein shake. Then I take my ZMA.

During the day I will snack on walnuts and almonds. With most of my meals I also eat grilled vegetables and fresh fruit that I always have readily available. I have been eating like this for 5 months straight...rarely breaking the groove.

I've always had high bodyfat percentage. I look like I'm in really good shape, people accuse me all the time of being on roids. I am currently max{correctly} benching 320 as well.

diet needs to be totally re done. Too many shakes. Need some quality low gi carbs in the breakfast and pre WO slots. High gi carbs in a pro shake for post. Stop snacking on nuts. Nuts are excellent and should be included in your diet BUT they are VERY high in cals and fat so snacking on unmeasured ammounts is unwise. to give you an idea including 15g of nuts with each meal would add about 9g fat per meal which would be a good starting point.

**(1*)** · 06-17-2007, 01:43 PM

if you still wanna try a pill with not so noticable results try methyl rage.. highly toxic to the liver but you will lift heavier.

**linksys2400** · 06-17-2007, 01:44 PM

Originally Posted by perfectbeast2001

diet needs to be totally re done. Too many shakes. Need some quality low gi carbs in the breakfast and pre WO slots. High gi carbs in a pro shake for post. Stop snacking on nuts. Nuts are excellent and should be included in your diet BUT they are VERY high in cals and fat so snacking on unmeasured ammounts is unwise. to give you an idea including 15g of nuts with each meal would add about 9g fat per meal which would be a good starting point.

Thanks, I will totally take everyone's advice. What BF percentage should I be aiming for? Someone suggested clen , but should I wait on that too until my diet is staright?

**SMAN12b** · 06-17-2007, 01:46 PM

Originally Posted by linksys2400

Thanks, I will definately look more into the dieting section.

What's your advice on the andriol after my new diet? Should I stick with testosterone since I need my levels rapidly normal before drill?

By the Original title of this thread, you are looking for BARELY NOTICEABLE GAINS and there are TOO many factors that you are worried about to be taking any AAS including orals since they will be NOTICED.

Just redo your diet and your training and you will get better gains that you will not have to explain or worry about being caught doing anything you shouldn't

**GOT FIGHT?** · 06-17-2007, 02:02 PM

A bf% of 6-8 is a prime zone for fighting plus youll be cut as hell.

**10nispro** · 06-17-2007, 02:06 PM

Did anyone notice an age given, for linksys2400? Turkey is good but no so if it's loaded with preservatives.

**linksys2400** · 06-17-2007, 02:13 PM

Originally Posted by 10nispro

Did anyone notice an age given, for linksys2400? Turkey is good but no so if it's loaded with preservatives.

Forgot to mention that I am 25. Luckily I am able to buy unpreserved meats straight from the butcher.

**10nispro** · 06-17-2007, 02:19 PM

I am stupid for not knowing what a MMA is? Do you drink lots of water?

**linksys2400** · 06-17-2007, 02:27 PM

Originally Posted by 10nispro

I am stupid for not knowing what a MMA is? Do you drink lots of water?

It's mixed martial arts, mainly I do Jiu jitsu. We usually fight the last hour of class, some fights can go up to 30 mins.

I drink lots of water during my workouts, usually about 3-4 liters during a 2 hr workout. I don't drink a lot of water throughout the day, mainly V8.

**SMAN12b** · 06-17-2007, 02:31 PM

Originally Posted by linksys2400

It's mixed martial arts, mainly I do Jiu jitsu. We usually fight the last hour of class, some fights can go up to 30 mins.

I drink lots of water during my workouts, usually about 3-4 liters during a 2 hr workout. I don't drink a lot of water throughout the day, mainly V8.

V8?? do you have any idea how much SODIUM is in V8??? That will not help much with weight loss

**10nispro** · 06-17-2007, 03:01 PM

ahhhh haaaa.....the sodium culpret....I knew if I watched and learned to ask the appropriate questions(learned from SMAN12B), we could help.

**(1*)** · 06-17-2007, 03:03 PM

3 to 4 liters!!! wow! your'e like a buffalo.. i trained mma (bjj and muay thai) and we were instructed to drink about a half a liter per session or else cramps would set in... then rehydrate after.

**(1*)** · 06-17-2007, 03:04 PM

lol @ v8

**linksys2400** · 06-17-2007, 03:15 PM

It's v8 fusion, I'm sure that doesn't make a big difference.
Ultimately losing bodyfat is not my primary concern. I am currently wanting more size and strength than anything else.