Long time listener, first time caller.

[JPizzle]

So I just joined today, but I've been lurking for a couple of months. I've been considering taking the plunge and I'm pretty sure now that I'll be getting wet. I've probably read what seems like a hundred of those "For Newbies" post, but I want to get a bit of tailored advice. My stats:

22
5'7"
195
18%

I've been lifting steady for about 3 years. My diet is pretty good, I maintain about 2800 calories, 225+ protein, 250+ carbs, and usually about 70 fat.

This will be my first cycle, and I know a lot of the more experienced here will and have recommended a test only cycle, but I think I need a little more. My relatively high bodyfat % makes me scared of the bloat that comes with test. I've heard good results about starting the cycle with Test and Tren to combat the bloat. On the other hand, a cutting cycle comes to mind but I've read that it isn't generally recommended to start your first cycle as a cutting cycle. But I've really considered my first cycle as a cutting cycle because I feel like that will give me a better look than just bulking up. Since this is my first cycle, I don't want to go all crazy but maybe I would benefit from adding some Mast into the mix. I'll have clomid and nolvadex on hand in case the nips start getting itchy, and I'll probably use both of them for my PCT.

So, I'll leave the rest to you professionals; flames or comments are welcome (preferably comments)

[shifty_git]

Look into doing a clen cycle first and drop the bf%...

Then go with the test cycle...

Is the best way forward as trying to use aas to cut on a first cycle is going to get a lot more complicated.

[Dukkit]

well first off ill say hello

are you set on doing a cycle now? you can cut back that body fat quite a bit with just tweaking your diet and upping your cardio. (do you do cardio? if so, whats your regimen look like?) then when you reach a lower bodyfat youll be more comfortable getting into a bulking cycle. i would go with a basic test e and d-bol cycle. i dont know how you are about pinning yourself. but if you can stand doing it EOD maybe go with Sust. I have found Sust to give me less bloating. but everyones different remember. ill bump this so more experienced guys can give you a bit more advice.

[VTliftVT]

I agree. With running clen first or somehow dropping your BF % to somewhere below 15% before starting a cycle. You will not see all the great results you are getting if its hidden in flub.

Second off, your diet macros dont look that great, especially for cutting if thats what you decide to do. You definitely want to lower your carbs and up your protein. Unless I am bulking I never like to see my carbs above my protein. Fat looks ok.

What does your diet consist of anyway? Give me some food sources.

[shifty_git]

I also agree with hitting the cardio hard and tweaking the diet...

Condition the machine first, then add aas....

Dont rely on aas to condition the machine.

[jstraw428]

Definately look to drop some of that bf% before you begin a AAS cycle......also i believe you need to reevaluate your diet, but if you diet was pretty good, you would not be at 18% bf........Just continue to do your research while you diet and do cardio....that way, when you are ready to cycle, you are that much more knowledgable.....Knowledge is True Power....

[shifty_git]

If you wanna loose that fat fast, check out the diet forum and tweek the diet (theres stickies on how to do a cutting diet)

Then check out this HITT cardio routine (just like to thank Merc for originally posting this as its spot on), ive just started it and it fecking hurts, but you know its making the difference and can feel it already.

http://www.morandosozinho.net/bar/wp...llacardio1.pdf

[JPizzle]

Cardio: I usually do 30 mins either all elliptical (5/10 interval), or elliptical for 15 and then like 15 sprints. 4x/week.


This is yesterday's diet. (2810/276 pro/274 carbs/72 fat)

1.
3/4 c. egg whites
1 whole egg
1 whole wheat bagel (ran out of oatmeal)
2 Tbl PB

2.
3 oz. turkey
2 slice whole wheat bread

3.
Can chicken noodle soup
Can of chicken breast
1 slice whole wheat bread

4. Pre
2 Scoops protein
Storm/Shock/Creatine

5. Post (between cardio and lifting)
2 scoops protein
4 tbl. dextrose
Storm/creatine

6.
6 oz steak
1 baked potato
1 small can green beans

7.
1/2 c. cottage cheese (2%)

[VTliftVT]

Cardio: I usually do 30 mins either all elliptical (5/10 interval), or elliptical for 15 and then like 15 sprints. 4x/week.


This is yesterday's diet. (2810/276 pro/274 carbs/72 fat)

1.
3/4 c. egg whites
1 whole egg
1 whole wheat bagel (ran out of oatmeal)
2 Tbl PB

2.
3 oz. turkey
2 slice whole wheat bread

3.
Can chicken noodle soup
Can of chicken breast
1 slice whole wheat bread

4. Pre
2 Scoops protein
Storm/Shock/Creatine

5. Post (between cardio and lifting)
2 scoops protein
4 tbl. dextrose
Storm/creatine

6.
6 oz steak
1 baked potato
1 small can green beans

7.
1/2 c. cottage cheese (2%)

Food sources look pretty legit, for cutting I would personally only include carbs pre and post workout. Try to eat as little of bread type starches as possible. As shifty said, check the diet sticky's out...great info there.

[JPizzle]

BTW, I was just lifting for a long time and not doing cardio. I've been doing my cardio routine regularly now for like 5 months, and have noticed a drop in bodyfat. I would have guessed my highest bf was like 25%. But my skinfold test like 3 weeks ago, put me at 18%.

[SMCengineer]

As everyone else said, you should cut your bodyfat first before you start a cycle. If your going to do a cycle anyway and your afraid of the bloat, go with test prop, but be prepared to do ED injections. Do not use Tren for your first cycle. It's overkill and unnecessary. You'll get plenty of gains from the test alone and if you think that's not enough than you can throw some dbols in there.

[JPizzle]

Blome,

What kind of dosing would you recommend for the prop and the dbols? Is the shorter half life of the prop the reason I would need to do it daily?

[SMCengineer]

^^Yeah, you want to keep your blood levels constant and with the short half life you'll need to shoot everyday. Be advised, prop shots are said to be more painful than most other test shots. I haven't ran it yet so I'm only speaking from what others have reported.

A good dose for a first time user of test prop would probably be 75mg/day or 525mg/wk. For the dbol I wouldn't go higher than 30mg/day for your first time.