Is Deca+Propecia=Hair Loss a Myth ?

**davpet** · 10-31-2008, 05:16 AM

I've heard this a million times, in parrot fashion sheep mentality, don't take deca with a 5-alpha reductase inhibtor as it will cause more hair loss, DHN is weaker than DHT and Nandrolone is stronger than DHN, therfore Nandrolone will attach to the androgen receptors in your scalp and make your hair fall out.

Pure testosterone attaching to androgen receptor in your scalp doesn't even make your hair fall out, so how is nandrolone (nor-testosterone) going to make your hair fall out ?

If anything all taking a 5-ar inhibtor with deca will do is increase your blood levels of nandrolone, as if you were taking a higher dose.

Please if anyone has any studies, or medical literature to support idea that deca+propecia=hair loss could you please list them ?

**Mulciber** · 10-31-2008, 06:28 AM

dont know about propecia.. know deca with finasteride has been debated a few times.

**davpet** · 10-31-2008, 07:06 AM

Originally Posted by Mulciber;427***4

dont know about propecia.. know deca with finasteride has been debated a few times.

Propecia is the trade name for 1mg finasteride used to treat androgenetic alopecia.

**Mulciber** · 10-31-2008, 07:10 AM

arg.. i just woke up.. lol

anyway, hang on.. ill post the reasoning and a few studys.. most of them conflicting.

**Mulciber** · 10-31-2008, 07:19 AM

people often make the mistake of equating high androgen receptor (AR) binding affinity with androgenicity, probably because DHT possesses both properties. There is a notion, likely started by this paper (1) that the 5 alpha reduced version of nandrolone is a weaker androgen than the parent compound. The opposite is true with testosterone . Hence the often read admonition not to combine finasteride with Deca , because it would be bad for the hair and prostate. To quote from (1),

"In the accessory sex organs (e.g. the prostate) testosterone is 5 alpha-reduced to dihydrotestosterone (DHT) which, due to its higher affinity for androgen receptors (AR), amplifies the action of testosterone. In contrast, when 19-nortestosterone (NT) is 5 alpha-reduced, its affinity for AR decreases, resulting in a decrease in its androgenic potency."

In other In vivo studies the picture is different (2). Quoting from this paper,

"The results of AR binding studies revealed that 5alpha-reduction of T and ET significantly enhanced their affinities, and that the 5alpha-derivative of 19norT displayed a similar binding affinity to that exhibited by 19norT. In terms of biological activity, the results showed that 5alpha-reduction of T and 19norT significantly increased their androgenic potency..."

Here androgenic potency was determined in part by action on the prostate. So these two papers are completely at odds with one another, and I wouldn't assume that the commonly held belief that 5 alpha reduced nandrolone is a weaker androgen than the parent compound is necessarily true.

If you are worried about your prostate, avoid agents that are subject to 5 alpha reduction, and that have a low anabolic /androgenic ratio.

(1) J Steroid Biochem Mol Biol. 1995 Jun;53(1-6):253-7.
Different patterns of metabolism determine the relative anabolic activity of 19-norandrogens.
Sundaram K, Kumar N, Monder C, Bardin CW.

(2) J Steroid Biochem Mol Biol. 1997 Jan;60(1-2):121-9.
5alpha-reduction of norethisterone enhances its binding affinity for androgen receptors but diminishes its androgenic potency.
Lemus AE, Enriquez J, Garcia GA, Grillasca I, Perez-Palacios G

guess the original issue came down to 5alpha reductase and its action on nandrolone, this quote seems to show what action finasteride/dutasteride would have on deca (although there is some conflicting information):
"The results of AR binding studies revealed that 5alpha-reduction of T and ET significantly enhanced their affinities, and that the 5alpha-derivative of 19norT displayed a similar binding affinity to that exhibited by 19norT. In terms of biological activity, the results showed that 5alpha-reduction of T and 19norT significantly increased their androgenic potency..."

**sitries** · 11-01-2008, 01:22 PM

bump

**MR_T** · 11-01-2008, 01:47 PM

based on a friends experince yes, his hairloss was worse with deca + Propecia was worse than on 400 mg test alone/week.

**richtries** · 11-01-2008, 09:56 PM

si tries . . . hello baldy!

**Dinosaur** · 11-01-2008, 10:13 PM

Originally Posted by MR_T

based on a friends experince yes, his hairloss was worse with deca + Propecia was worse than on 400 mg test alone/week.

what do you mean propecia was worse...?

**sitries** · 11-02-2008, 07:56 AM

kratos is the man when it comes to hairloss info. and i remember him saying before that test, deca and finasteride is better than test and deca alone as far as hair loss goes.

**helium3** · 11-02-2008, 10:50 AM

its a myth as far as im concerned. nandrolone actually reduces 5-alpha in the body.less 5-alpha less dht, less 5-alpha less dhn so everyones a winner!

**peachfuzz** · 11-02-2008, 12:41 PM

It is not a myth. Yes Deca is reduced by the 5AR enzyme but not to DHT. It is reduced to a much milder androgen DHN. Deca is very mild on the hairline anyway.

**helium3** · 11-02-2008, 12:58 PM

Originally Posted by peachfuzz

It is not a myth. Yes Deca is reduced by the 5AR enzyme but not to DHT. It is reduced to a much milder androgen DHN. Deca is very mild on the hairline anyway.

u need to read the question again, u just contradicted yourself dude! lol.

deca doesnt cause more hairloss if used with propecia, so it is a myth! some people are under the impression that 5-alpha somehow magically transforms deca into much more powerful compound than dht, sorry just aint true.

its a pity that deca is such a supressive compound as i love it!

**peachfuzz** · 11-02-2008, 01:02 PM

The OP asked if it was a myth that taking finasteride with Deca increases hairloss. You said it is a myth. I said it is not. What did i miss?

**helium3** · 11-02-2008, 01:14 PM

Originally Posted by peachfuzz

The OP asked if it was a myth that taking finasteride with Deca increases hairloss. You said it is a myth. I said it is not. What did i miss?

Is Deca +Propecia=Hair Loss a Myth?????? its a myth!

**sitries** · 11-02-2008, 01:32 PM

Is Deca +Propecia=Hair Loss a Myth?????? its a myth!

agreed

**peachfuzz** · 11-02-2008, 01:45 PM

Originally Posted by helium3

its a myth as far as im concerned. nandrolone actually reduces 5-alpha in the body.less 5-alpha less dht, less 5-alpha less dhn so everyones a winner!

Originally Posted by helium3

Is Deca+Propecia=Hair Loss a Myth?????? its a myth!

Care to elaborate why it is a myth? Im not understanding your first post.

**peachfuzz** · 11-02-2008, 01:57 PM

By the way im referring to the effects of Finasteride on Nandrolone . Not Test and Nandrolone. And yes im aware they should be run together.

**fitguy** · 11-02-2008, 05:47 PM

its a myth ..

**HURRICANE3500** · 11-02-2008, 11:23 PM

u going to get mixed opinions on this ..

**helium3** · 11-03-2008, 03:43 AM

Originally Posted by peachfuzz

By the way im referring to the effects of Finasteride on Nandrolone. Not Test and Nandrolone. And yes im aware they should be run together.

no problem dude, not tryin to call you out.

well we know that 5-alpha reductase is the enzyme by which nandrolone is reduced to di-hydronandrolone(dhn). this compound is far less androgenic than say dht. on top of that, nandrolone itself is a 5-alpha reductase inhibitor which would give the body much less substrate to work with. another reason why deca is easier on the hairline.

as far as the myth goes, people think finastride run with deca converts its reduced derivative dhn into a highly androgenic compound which effects its binding affinity to the ar receptor. this isnt the case ,hence its a myth.