Starting off with only 300mg/wk of Sus250 to avoid acne??

[seriousmass]

How's it going boys,

I am currently 20 years old: I am 6'2, and I weigh 169 pounds. I have been training for the past three years, and am interested in trying my first cycle. I was initially going to experiment with cycling when I was 16 years old; however, I decided to wait it out until I was finished growing / get information first.

I have an ectomorph body-type... so needless to say, I am very tall and skinny. My entire life I have been ate to eat whatever I want, and couldn't gain a pound. I have tried numerous supplement cycles (i.e. high-protein diets / "gainers" / creatine) Nevertheless, even while taking up to 8 shakes a day, and loading creatine I never gained more then 5 pounds.

For the past 6 months I have been working on improving my diet... I definitely feel that I am ready to try gear now. Anyways, enough with the life story..

Weeks 1 - 4

- 300mg of Sustanon 250
- 30 mg of D-Bol

Weeks 4 - 8

- 400mg of Sustanon 250

** 21 days after my last injection of Sus 250, I'm going to begin taking Novadex, and Clomid. **

2 Weeks: ( Nolvadex 40mg / day ) & ( Clomid 50mg / day)
next 2 Weeks: ( Nolvadex 20 mg / day) & ( Clomid 50mg / day)
__________________________________________________ ______________

In addition, I'm going to be doing a couple of IMPORTANT things in the cycle:

- “cod-Liver Oil” – everyday - help avoid liver damage
- eat around: 4000 calories / per day
- consume 250 grams of protein / per day
- the dosage of D-bol will be divided out, through out the day and taken every 3-4 hrs, as it has such a short half-life. Will take them with / after a protein-based meal / shake.
- 3 weeks after my last injection I will take: 300mg of Clomid on day 1, and 40mg of Nolvadex; then 50-75mg of Clomid, and 20mg Nolvadex, for the next 10 days; and finally 50 mg, and 20mg of Nolvadex, for the last 10 days.
__________________________________________________ ______________

In case anyone's wondering, I am going to be taking a low dosage of Sus250 @ the beginning and then build up to 400mg a week, because my friends told me that injecting it that way will help avoid severe acne.

I will be posting every week, once I start the cycle, but if anyone has any additional advice before I begin, I'm open for suggestions / modifications to my schedule

Thanks in advance.

[T_Own]

injecting that way might actually be a BETTER way to get acne, because your levels will spike again, so more sides.

you really shouldn't cycle AT ALL. learn to eat. people use metabolism as an excuse but can't eat right. 8 shakes a day?!?! who told you to do that?? thats a terrible excuse for eating right. go to the diet section and read up on a real diet. not mega dosing protein shakes and creatine...

[seriousmass]

Hey thanks for the quick response buddy,

So what're you saying I should look into taking (in terms of Sus250)... Do you think I should take a steady injection schedule (i.e. 400mg a day for the whole cycle)... OR do you think I should start off with 500mg a day, and start taking less..)

Regarding my metabolism.. honestly I don't know how to explain it. I do eat very well, and I do try extremely hard to balance out everything: I always get enough carbs / protein, I eat 5 evenly spaced out meals a day, and I take multi-vitamins / eat olds of fruits and veggies.

(I didn't mean to imply that taking 8 shakes a day is healthy whatsoever, it was just something I tried, in order to gain mass... however, it didn't work AT ALL.) - now I just around 3 shakes a day (just protein, glutamine, and BCAAs)... and I little ZMA at night.

[T_Own]

post your diet and we can start there.

what i mean is you shouldn't cycle at all. 20 is too young to most people, 169 is too small for someone 6" shorter than you. at your height you should get to 190 even 200 with a good diet

[seriousmass]

wow... thats not pretty disheartening to hear. I thought I had waited long enough..

My diet is pretty smooth..

Morning Meal (7:00am)
- 25g of whey protein & 25g of syntha-6 (slow release protein) - in a shake
- a bowl of Vector / Wheatie's with skimmed milk
- 4 muli-vitamins
- a banana

Mid-day (10:00am)
- 4 hard boiled eggs
- whole grain sandwich, turkey breast, veggies
- skimmed milk

Lunch (1:00pm)
- chicken, (some sort of meat)
- 2 servings of fruit
- granola and yogurt
- 25g protein shake

Dinner (5:00pm)
- a stir-fry, or wrap (lots of veggies / carbs / protein)
- unsalted nuts
- beans

Last Meal (9:00pm)
- 50g of protein (in shake) 25g whey, and 25g Syntha-6

Before bed (11:00pm)
- 3 ZMA pills

(I am also constantly eating fruit source bars, and cliff-hanger bars throughout the day)

[seriousmass]

Oh also... I know that I am too small. I goal for the past 3 weeks has been to hit 190 pounds. And I have experimented with "True-Mass" and a couple of other gainers to see if I could get results out of them. Unfortunately, as I said.. the most weight I have been able to sustain is 5 pounds.

Do you think I should just wait.. until my metabolism slows down to begin cycling?

[Big]

I've been doing this a long time, and there seems to be one constant:
my metabolism is too fast to gain weight = I don't eat enough to gain weight

[T_Own]

wow... thats not pretty disheartening to hear. I thought I had waited long enough..

My diet is pretty smooth..

Morning Meal (7:00am)
- 25g of whey protein & 25g of syntha-6 (slow release protein) - in a shake
- a bowl of Vector / Wheatie's with skimmed milk
- 4 muli-vitamins
- a banana
the shakes are ok here but you should add a lot more real food protein, or drink the shakes now and eat an hour later. 6-8 egg whites and maybe 1-3 yolks, maybe plain oatmeal (not the sweetened kind) instead of cereal for more complex carbs
Mid-day (10:00am)
- 4 hard boiled eggs
- whole grain sandwich, turkey breast, veggies
- skimmed milk
thats decent, but one or two more eggs and more turkey (quality kind) to get more protein. bread is an ok choice
Lunch (1:00pm)
- chicken, (some sort of meat)
- 2 servings of fruit
- granola and yogurt
- 25g protein shake
you don't need a shake here, it won't hurt but it would be best at the end of the meal so you don't get full with it. you need a good amount of meat for ~50g protein. the fruit is ok too, yogurt and granola aren't bad but not the best
Dinner (5:00pm)
- a stir-fry, or wrap (lots of veggies / carbs / protein)
- unsalted nuts
- beans
what kind of beans? stir fry isn't that good, they are usually really high in sodium. wrap probably comes with simple carbs. a meal more like lunch would be good. 50g of meat protein (steak chicken whatever) then sweet potato, potato, lentils, for some better carbs. unsalted nuts are ok for a fat source. beans aren't bad
Last Meal (9:00pm)
- 50g of protein (in shake) 25g whey, and 25g Syntha-6
you don't need the whey before bed, if the syntha 6 has casein in it thats better to slowly digest over night. it might also be better to take it close to bed
Before bed (11:00pm)
- 3 ZMA pills
not really a meal, but same as above, the shake might be better here.
it would also be better to add a meal similar to what i listed for your dinner. more protein and complex carbs, squeeze it in sometime in the dad
(I am also constantly eating fruit source bars, and cliff-hanger bars
throughout the day)
you can drop them and eat more at each meal

alright, advice in the quote in bold

shout out to phate, thats pretty much his method of response. he could also help more with the food

[seriousmass]

Woww.. incredibly detailed advice. Thanks a lot.

you definitely pointed out some nutritional downfalls that I had never thought of.

So, do you think if I made those modifications to my diet I would be ready? Or do you think I should take more time to solidify the diet first...? / do you have any advice on the actual cycle I proposed?

Once again, thanks for answering all these questions. I don't want to sound like a newbie, I just want to get all my facts straight now, so that I can have the "cleanest" cycle, with the fewest # of side-effects..!!

[T_Own]

yeah, no problem. but definitely go with the diet for a while. like a year of eating pretty well balanced and clean, and see where it takes you. just try to get ~50g of protein with pretty much every meal, and complex carbs instead of simple carbs. also, for someone like you that just needs to gain weight, eating junk food doesn't really matter either, just try not to make it a habit.

[daem]

I've been doing this a long time, and there seems to be one constant:
my metabolism is too fast to gain weight = I don't eat enough to gain weight

Agreed. After looking at his diet, he clearly eats ENOUGH food but the diet is complete shit.

Garbage in, garbage gains. Take that to the bank.

To the OP: Add up your calories across the day as well as protein intake, carbs, and fat to understand why your diet is shit.

[seriousmass]

alright. Well I'll definitely look into improving my diet. I never considered my diet to be "garbage," but I can see where it needs some improving.

I'm taking a Nutrition course as one of my electives at university next semester, so I'm sure that will help me out. Realistically, I think I just need to improve on differentiating simple vs. complex carbs, and when to eat them (i.e. when they're the most effective for weight gain)... and then also just simply eating more protein, and relying less on shakes for my protein intake.

Thanks for all the suggestions boys. I do appreciate it. Good luck with your training...

More advice is welcome!!

[seriousmass]

injecting that way might actually be a BETTER way to get acne, because your levels will spike again, so more sides.

yooo!! just one more thing. ha.

my buddies are doing this cycle right now. and I don't really understand what you meant by: "test levels will spike again"... do you just mean they'll spike again, because in weeks 4 - 8, the dosage of Sus250 goes up to 400mg?

i told them what you had said.. (about it potentially increasing acne)... but they won't listen whatsoever, and just keep saying "well whose on gear right now.. I think I'd know better"... (realistically, there faces / backs are incredibily clear for some reason.. they've even experimenting with anadrol 50)

[chuckt12345]

yooo!! just one more thing. ha.

my buddies are doing this cycle right now. and I don't really understand what you meant by: "test levels will spike again"... do you just mean they'll spike again, because in weeks 4 - 8, the dosage of Sus250 goes up to 400mg?

i told them what you had said.. (about it potentially increasing acne)... but they won't listen whatsoever, and just keep saying "well whose on gear right now.. I think I'd know better"... (realistically, there faces / backs are incredibily clear for some reason.. they've even experimenting with anadrol 50)

Keep your test doses consistant throughout the cycle. The more you change it the more potential for sides. You shouldnt get acne if you are normally not prone to it but at 20 i guess you will be.

[T_Own]

yooo!! just one more thing. ha.

my buddies are doing this cycle right now. and I don't really understand what you meant by: "test levels will spike again"... do you just mean they'll spike again, because in weeks 4 - 8, the dosage of Sus250 goes up to 400mg?

i told them what you had said.. (about it potentially increasing acne)... but they won't listen whatsoever, and just keep saying "well whose on gear right now.. I think I'd know better"... (realistically, there faces / backs are incredibily clear for some reason.. they've even experimenting with anadrol 50)

well its not a given you will get acne.. if you got it bad before you're more likely to get it again. some kids grow up and never get anything bad, some get it very badly. also, washing your face and back a lot throughout the day helps to avoid it.

spiking like at first you obviously jump a lot from natural levels to level on cycle, then again when you go up in dose, since it takes some time for the total amount in the body to even out again, so yes you were right pretty much.

some people don't listen, there is only so much you can do